The Artisans: Michele Clapton
By Winter Is Coming on in News.

The latest in Making Game of Thrones‘ The Artisans video series has been posted, this time featuring costume designer Michele Clapton.

Winter Is Coming: This video was great. Loved looking at the concept art. Jaime’s costume in particular looked cool. And the Kingsguard shield was awesome! They definitely are embracing the Asian-theme with some of the costumes. As long as they keep it slightly medieval I think it should work. Looking forward to seeing some of these costumes worn by the cast!

UPDATE: In order for it not to get lost in the comments, here is a very pertinent piece of information concerning the Kingsguard armour, kindly provided by Ran:

I spoke with Simon Brindle, the head of the costume armor department, about a great deal of the armor. One thing I specifically asked about was the change to the Kingsguard armor. I wondered if perhaps they moved away from the pure white because of how it looked on camera, and in fact he nodded his head and said yes, the gleam from it wasn’t working well in relation to everything else you’d see on screen and so they went in this direction with it instead.

So chalk this up to a point where George’s imagination outpaces reality, or perhaps that in his setting they can get that white looking just so, whereas in RL they can’t.

I got a chance to get a _very_ close up look at the armor, and even saw a few production photos of Nikolaj Coster-Waldau in it. It looks quite fabulous, and not at all like something just “anyone” could have. The “tribal” design is nothing but an orante, scrollwork crown, and I actually very much appreciated that detail to more explicitly link them as the king’s personal guard. GRRM seemed to like it too.

Oh, and yes, they have white cloaks, just as Rimshot reported. Have a picture of one, in fact. Pristine white, just as it should be! Even saw a photo of the cloak as worn draped over the horse’s flank.


102 Comments

  1. OhDanyBoy
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 3:58 pm | Permalink

    So… when someone takes hi-res screencaps, they are going to paste the separate zoomed in clips of Daenerys’ wedding dress together to form a single image, right? I have high expectations of this community ;)

  2. Lex
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 3:59 pm | Permalink

    Fantastic looking stuff. If that’s the “samurai” costume around 0:56, I don’t think we need to worry. It looks beautiful.

    We do have further confirmation, however, that they’re going beyond a strictly medieval look (e.g. Cersei’s “kimono with a medieval cut”). I think it will take some getting used to, but it’s probably a good idea. As long as they maintain basic realism, it should make this show stand out as unique from various other “medieval/fantasy” projects.

    Lastly, it’s strange that HBO is not posting any of these videos on their youtube channel… but there is another user who usually ends up posting them, which is nice because there’s no full screen option available on the MGoT site.

  3. Lex
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:03 pm | Permalink
  4. Lex
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

    It’s also cool to hear that she read the first two books, and that led to her decision to pare down some of the earlier costumes so that she didn’t overdesign everything right from the start.

    Also, I think that must be Callum Wharry (Tommen) at the end, in the sword-practice costume?

  5. Inkasrain
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    Just reposting this in the relevant thread.

    Looks like they’re definitely going whole-hog on the Asian-influence. Again, very different from the way I imagined it, but I’m sure it will be beautiful, even if it takes some time to get used to. I wonder if the logic of this might be partly inspired by the fact that it’s been full summer for so long in southern Westeros, so the dress, armor and decor have evolved somewhat (brighter colors, loser fabric, etc.) to suit the climate. Contrasted with what we’ve seen of the Northmen’s clothing, it could actually send an interesting visual messsage– that the Court, in all its frivolity, is not remotely ready for winter.

  6. OhDanyBoy
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:18 pm | Permalink

    Lex: It’s also cool to hear that she read the first two books, and that led to her decision to pare down some of the earlier costumes so that she didn’t overdesign everything right from the start.Also, I think that must be Callum Wharry (Tommen) at the end, in the sword-practice costume?    

    Isn’t it Bran?

    Oh, and you can see the full-screen by clicking on WiC’s link (right below the video in the post above).

  7. Nymeria
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:29 pm | Permalink

    Lex: And here is the youtube link.    

    Thanks for the link Lex!

    I liked it all, (except maybe for her pronounciation of Daenerys ;P), especially the drawing for Ned’s clothing and the Knisguard shield.

    Perhaps Momoa should just use his Conan costume to play Drogo ;)

  8. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:34 pm | Permalink

    I too am very glad to hear that the costume designer has actually read the first two books. The decision to “pare down” the costumes for season one also makes sense so that there is room for development and evolution in later seasons.

    But I am still hoping for some elaborate and colorful costumes in Season One or for sure by Season Two. There are some pretty vivid descriptions of certain characters gowns. I can understand wanting to visually separate GOT (being a fantasy series with no historical reference) from a show like say, the Tudors, but bring on the Myrish lace, dang it. I’d love to see Daenery’s in her violet silk gown and gold collar at Illyrio’s manse. Or Cersei in emerald, with trimmed with gold Myrish lace. I did like the sketch for Daenery’s wedding dress in the HBO video (“the color of the moon”), very innocent and maidenly.

  9. LivveHult
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

    Inkasrain,

    I for one really love that idea – and adore that they are doing theit own fantasy here. I mean they will be setting the trend for new fantasy all over! Setting the bar much higher! Imagine what’ll happen with the business after this become such a huge uccess we all know it can be!
    Fantasy doesn’t have to be medieval…
    I mean look at Mara, daughter of the empire, by wurts and feist! I remember loving that series, it was my first fantasybook after elenia by eddings which I also loved. Loved it even more re-reading it as a teenager… Asian is hot babe…
    It will be awesome!

    Take some getting used to – agreed. Perhaps.. But isn’t that what any tv-series ambition is? To be the first… To boldly go where no man has gone before…? et ny standards for the entire industry – guys! IMAGINE what type of books, films and tv-series we will see from this day on!!!
    I’m hyper! ;D
    It. will. be. epic.

  10. Wolfheart
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:47 pm | Permalink

    I can understand wanting to visually separate GOT (being a fantasy series with no historical reference)

    Whats funny is that if you have read the books YOU KNOW George uses historical reference. Don’t be silly and naive to books. George does a great job describing the costumes and armor they wear. So you can’t say they have NO reference. When they do.

  11. The Rabbit
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:48 pm | Permalink

    LivveHult,

    I pretty much agreed with your last few sentneces. Yeah, that is quite ambitious, and hopefully it would pay off at the end.
    For Asian influence, to be honest I do not see much of asian influence in all of this.
    At first glance the samurai looking soldier on the still form the Behind the scenes video had that particular japanese vibe, but I was reassured when someone stated that the visors of the helmets were up, and not covering the face of Lannister guard.

  12. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 4:56 pm | Permalink

    Wolfheart,

    Silly and naive, ouch. Yes, yes, War of Roses and all that in terms of GRRM. But HBO is treating it as though there is no historical reference to work off of. That’s pretty much what the costume designer says in the video, other than admitting it has a loose “medieval” theme. Otherwise, how can you justify Asian style Lannister armor, etc?

  13. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:01 pm | Permalink

    I would prefer the costumes to be closer to what GRRM describes in the books because I love the rich European style clothing. But HBO is going to do whatever they want/think is best, so I’m just going to hope it turns out cohesive and visually interesting in the end.

  14. DigDoug
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:05 pm | Permalink

    Wolfheart,

    I think what they are saying is that this is not some historical period piece (Joan of Arc, Henry V) that comes in a specific known time in a known place with known fashion. This is not set in any real world and therefore the dress is quite malleable.

  15. Jéssica de F. Maciel
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:08 pm | Permalink

    the only shame for me is taht i loose so much without subtitles…shame on me

  16. Ingemar Svensson
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:09 pm | Permalink

    Nymeria:
    I liked it all, (except maybe for her pronounciation of Daenerys ;P),

    I was thinking the same thing. I hope that’s not how they all pronounce it. And of course Khal in Khal Drogo was also mispronounced. Kh is pronounced with a [x]-sound as in Loch and not with a [k].

    BTW to anyone who was at the moot and talked to the actors. Did they pronounce names in any weird ways or was most of it as expected?

  17. Johan Sporre
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:09 pm | Permalink

    I like that it looks kind of subdued with not that strong colours. This will be a gritty series :)

  18. Inkasrain
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:15 pm | Permalink

    LivveHult,

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m certainly not opposed to it. It’s true, fantasy as a genre can and should expand both in setting and artistic influence beyond the medieval European model that has become sort of standard. But, maybe because of a lack of imagination on my part, that standard is how I’ve always pictured Westeros, so a bit of mental recalibration is required to adjust to the more visually diverse approach HBO seems to be taking.

    Again, not bad- just something to adjust to.

  19. Greg Fasolino
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:21 pm | Permalink

    Ingemar Svensson:
    And of course Khal in Khal Drogo was also mispronounced. Kh is pronounced with a [x]-sound as in Loch and not with a [k].
        

    What makes you say that it was mispronounced? There’s no canon pronunciations yet other than what GRRM himself has spoken at readings or the half-dozen or so names he confirmed the sound of that are listed on Westeros.com, and I don’t recall Drogo as one of those.
    I always assumed Khal was pronounced the same way as Khan, as in Genghis. Basically, a hard k and silent h.

    I wish there were sound files somewhere with George’s pronunciations, that would clear many of these up.

  20. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:24 pm | Permalink

    Johan Sporre,

    Don’t get me wrong, I like the gritty look we’ve seen thus far too. It adds to the realism of the series, which is something a fantasy show needs. But I’m still hoping for a few rich silk gowns on the queens and princesses, like what GRRM describes in the books. I also don’t think that gritty realistic = no color at all, either. The royalty at least could potentially have some richly colored clothing, like crimsons and violets.

  21. LivveHult
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:24 pm | Permalink

    The Rabbit,

    I was thinking about that, but also the herons (or whatnot) on the wall from red keep. Seems a bit asian influenced.
    Off course, that doesn’t mean that everything will be the same. Just as she has stated, and very logical, there will be mulitple styles here. I mean Martins world is a multidous (if that’s the word?) world. All the characters, storylines, what’s not to say costumes and sets are HBOs way of conveying that sense, Martins special edge to all he’s written, all the POV’s and so forth…
    I mean that would, to me, make sense. That’s how you think creatively when transferring something from one media to another. And HBO is top notch.

    Quite interesting depth to it all once you start to think a bit about it. :)

  22. LivveHult
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:28 pm | Permalink

    The Rabbit,

    :) but yeah. So maybe there isn’t much tangibly asian per se, I’m probably influenced by how that is how it’s been discussed in the comments on here to be honest. With the Lannisters etc.
    Then again he did say “kimono with medieval touch” or something similar in the video ;)
    In either case – it is shaping up to be one interesting ride to follow!

  23. LivveHult
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:35 pm | Permalink

    Inkasrain,

    Me too off course. It’s just the way we’ve mostly been brought up, isn’t it?
    I mean we have Tolkien, Eddings, and so forth. (I know Eddings isn’t real kosher within serious fantasy circles, because he writes mainstream, and kind of gets tiresome repeating the same story with his wife every new series he makes, but just aas example :)….)
    But you know what? I think that is good. Just like you sometimes need a little kick in the behind, or gut or what you will to see a new side or somehow get that revelation that – oh yeah, I don’t HAVE to slice my garlic this way/peel the potato like this….
    Know what I mean? This might be precisely what we all need, and what the genre needs.

  24. LivveHult
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    @Inkasrain
    …pains and all..

    and btw sorry for spamming..

  25. Lex
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:40 pm | Permalink

    OhDanyBoy:
    Isn’t it Bran?Oh, and you can see the full-screen by clicking on WiC’s link (right below the video in the post above).    

    It looks like he has very blond hair.

  26. LivveHult
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:44 pm | Permalink

    Greg Fasolino,

    Well actually, they have been constructing the dothraki language. It’s on youtube if you’ve missed it. They hired some great lingofiles to do the works, and there has been talk about some papers being passed out to actors way back when, about proper pronounciation, coming from Martin via D&D. And I even think I recall him or someone confirming pronounciation of Daenerys and Arya (Are-ya) way back in spring or even a year before then. Time moves so fast it’s hard to keep track of when I first found this. was in january after this site started anyway.

    Now if I remember wrong, someone please correct me.

  27. Viktor Norberg
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:54 pm | Permalink

    Greg Fasolino:
    I always assumed Khal was pronounced the same way as Khan, as in Genghis. Basically, a hard k and silent h.I wish there were sound files somewhere with George’s pronunciations, that would clear many of these up.    

    Actually Khan is a native mongol word and there are no hard k’s in that tongue…
    Khan is pronounced “Haan” (i.e Kublai Khan ~ Hoop-Li Haan)
    Most “realistically” Khal Drogo would be “Haal Drogo”, but of course the pronounciation depends on how the Dothraki language is constructed…

  28. BigRedCat
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 5:56 pm | Permalink

    I look the look for everything. Anyone who wants it to be straight medieval doesn’t have the vision HBO does.

    For medieval, viewers can watch The Tudors(they don’t) or any number of historical dramas. The only way you’re going to get buzz is if the show LOOKS as new and exciting as the storyline reads.

  29. Dennis Brennan
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:00 pm | Permalink

    There is a strong TV logic to the evident strategy of drawing inspiration from a different culture for each separate house’s costuming. It’s one of the ways to help the audience distinguish the characters from each other.

    The house sigils will help a little, but some viewers who are not familiar with the books may be confused for a while until they figure out: “Hey, all of those guys with a wolf picture on their clothes are either members of Ned’s family, or his employees.”

  30. Jim
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:01 pm | Permalink

    I REFUSE to believe that I’m still the only person who can’t understand why the Kingsguard has literally NO white components of what is apparently their armor.

  31. paulgude
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:10 pm | Permalink

    GRRM made a point back when people were asking him if they were going to use the designs by Valyrian Steel that HBO was going to use their own designers:

    “Unfortunately, the HBO swords will use different designs. The show has its own armorers, who will do their own original designs on the weapons and armor as seen in the series.

    As to why you might want to buy these… well, for the same reason you might want to buy a Valyrian resin of Ned that does not look like Sean Bean, or a Dark Sword mini of Jon Snow that does not look like Kit Harington. Do you want a keepsake of the books, or of the TV show? If the show goes forward, you will have your choice.”

    He goes on here:

    http://grrm.livejournal.com/127086.html?thread=8334190#t8334190

    So it’s been known early own that at least some of the designs from HBO wouldn’t just probably not match descriptions from the book, but specifically not match descriptions from the book.

    GRRM understands it’s going to be its own thing. I’m sure his TV experiences have given him a healthy attitude about all of this.

    As known, I love HBO’s dramas, and I’m bummed that I’m missing Boardwalk Empire right now. I’ve got my fingers crossed that my last job interview went well so I can afford HBO by the Spring.

    Every one of these production videos makes me even more excited.

  32. Dennis Brennan
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:12 pm | Permalink

    By “strong TV logic”, I am emphasizing that a TV show has different challenges than a book. In the book, the reader can know that a given character is, say, Jory Cassel because the text says so. But on a TV show, unless a character explicitly refers to a character by name (“Hey, Jory”, or “That’s Jory over there”), the audience may be confused as to the character’s identity, particularly when it’s a minor character whose appearance resembles another character.

    Unless the costumers used more obvious ways to distinguish the characters (which is exactly what they appear to be doing), one tall, bearded, athletic-looking white guy in armor and with an English accent is going to look like another. With a cast this big, the show producers need to use tricks like this to make sure that the casual viewer doesn’t confuse, say, Jory Cassel for Rast or Bronn or Meryn Trant.

  33. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:13 pm | Permalink

    It will be cool to see what they do with the Dornishmen when they appear in later seasons. Though I think their style of clothing is already very distinctly described in the book as having a Bedouin look since Dorne is mostly in a desert. Though I could imagine HBO using an Indian influence for some of the clothing too, saris and the like.

  34. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:16 pm | Permalink

    Jim,

    I’m still holding onto a shred of hope since I haven’t seen an episode or even a full trailer, but yeah, I don’t know either why the Kingsguard would NOT have even white cloaks when white is their trademark color in the books.

  35. Critical Geek
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:37 pm | Permalink

    I always figured Spanish or Mexican influence for Dorne.

  36. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:44 pm | Permalink

    Critical Geek,

    How so? I could definitely see the spicy food in Dorne invoking Mexico. The veils, loose gauzy clothing, and the sandsteeds (which are clearly based off Arabian horses) say Middle East to me.

  37. Rob O Sevens
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:51 pm | Permalink

    Jim,

    I think since the look of the series seems to be grittier and more subdued they are going away from the pure white armor but I believe that an extra or someone reported that the kingsguards have white cloaks with distinctive armor.

    Sure Id prefer them to be dressed as paragons of virtue (especially since its a great contract between hero on outside evil/corrupt inside) but Id suggest not getting too flustered over any changes of this nature until we see the finished product.

  38. Grimtuesday
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 6:53 pm | Permalink

    Actually if you look at the Lannister armor it looks more like lobstered steel then samurai armor. I think that the helmet is what made us all think samurai but I’m kind of hoping that it will end up being the have a visor or facemask that opens out wards instead of upwards and is in the design of a lion’s face.

  39. Mormegil
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 7:09 pm | Permalink

    Half Myrish: Jim, I’m still holding onto a shred of hope since I haven’t seen an episode or even a full trailer, but yeah, I don’t know either why the Kingsguard would NOT have even white cloaks when white is their trademark color in the books.  Quote  Reply

    Pretty sure Rimshot or one of the other Extras did say the Kingsguard have White cloaks in at least some of their scenes.

    I like the fact that the Crown on the Kingsguard armour and Shield is three pronged representing no doubt the three headed Targ Dragon (presuming their amour design dates back to Targ rule).

    The same could be true for their three ridged helmets as well.

  40. Ingemar Svensson
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 7:20 pm | Permalink

    Greg Fasolino:
    What makes you say that it was mispronounced? There’s no canon pronunciations yet other than what GRRM himself has spoken at readings or the half-dozen or so names he confirmed the sound of that are listed on Westeros.com, and I don’t recall Drogo as one of those.
    I always assumed Khal was pronounced the same way as Khan, as in Genghis. Basically, a hard k and silent h.I wish there were sound files somewhere with George’s pronunciations, that would clear many of these up.    

    It’s from David J Peterson the creator of the Dothraki language. There are several phrases already known and the phonology is pretty much all known.

  41. AbstractPlain
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 7:23 pm | Permalink

    Well they definitely made it perfectly clear that it won’t be strictly medieval inspired.
    My fear is that they could go too far with the asian theme, especially when you start including kimonos into the mix. I’m bracing myself for worst Jaime with a samurai sword, and tywin in full samurai armour :p

    Though in all seriousness I’m ok if they have their own vision of what things should look like. Just quite different from how its described in the books and from what I’ve been expecting.

  42. Ingemar Svensson
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 7:28 pm | Permalink

    LivveHult: Greg Fasolino,
    Well actually, they have been constructing the dothraki language. It’s on youtube if you’ve missed it. They hired some great lingofiles to do the works, and there has been talk about some papers being passed out to actors way back when, about proper pronounciation, coming from Martin via D&D. And I even think I recall him or someone confirming pronounciation of Daenerys and Arya (Are-ya) way back in spring or even a year before then. Time moves so fast it’s hard to keep track of when I first found this. was in january after this site started anyway.Now if I remember wrong, someone please correct me.    

    The actors have actually gotten more than that. They have gotten recordings of Peterson reading all the dialogue in Dothraki so that they can learn the exact pronounciation and they also have a great dialect coach on set that can make sure the mistakes are minimal.

  43. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 7:33 pm | Permalink

    Mormegil,

    Yay, well that’s a relief. I was worried.

  44. the goat
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 7:41 pm | Permalink

    Y’know, I was really expecting more cynicism and derision from this Costumegate thread. You people are getting soft.

    “Nitpickers of summer,” indeed.

  45. DH87
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 8:38 pm | Permalink

    the goat,

    Relax, Goatie,
    We still have shoes, horse tack, hair styles, facial hair, and intimate personal grooming to come.

  46. OldGran
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 8:39 pm | Permalink

    I really like the idea of moving out on the cutting edge with the costumes. It wont be confused with the Tudors that’s for sure. the costumes still look medieval-ish enough and keeping the overall look toned down adds to the “grittyness”. This series will be breaking new ground for a TV production, and how often do we ever see something totally new and fresh. Whenever a genre is successful everyone jumps on the bandwagon and we get a plethora of similar shows. GOT will set the trend and I expect we will see many more fantasy programs.
    As for the pronunciation of the names, I will be interested to see what happens. I think I heard GRRM pronounce Tyrion and Tear-rion, and someone said that Arya is pronounced R-ya, so the names may be pronounced differently than we were thinking in our head.

  47. Murf
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 9:13 pm | Permalink

    As for the pronunciation of the names, I will be interested to see what happens.I think I heard GRRM pronounce Tyrion and Tear-rion, and someone said that Arya is pronounced R-ya, so the names may be pronounced differently than we were thinking in our head.    

    That’s how I pronounce then :P I guess you could get “Ty-ree-on” for Tyrion because of Tywin, but it doesn’t seem right to me. Also interesting to note they pronounced Jaime “Jay-mee”, I always thought of it the Spanish way.

    And Asian influence and no white armour still doesn’t sit well with me :( I guess Valyria is supposed to be eastern, but I always thought of it as Greek/Macedonian/Roman-esque.

  48. Steve Westenra
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 9:16 pm | Permalink

    I like the idea of some Asian influence, especially as I believe there genuinely is some in the books, but I don’t really like the idea of taking something wholly from East Asia and sticking a Lannister in it. It’s not that I have a rigid view of fantasy that needs to be enlightened by HBO, but rather, the fact that I just don’t think it’s cohesive. If something has subtle East Asian elements I think that could be worked in very well, making you go (while watching it), “Oh hey, nice costumes…but wait! There’s a little twist there that actually makes it very exciting! Cool!” I just find that, because of the nature of the story and the series (as someone has already said), having Jamie or Tywin or whoever running around in full Samurai armour would seem very…mismatched, and kind of hilarious (which, I suspect, is not the reaction they would be looking for).
    I mean, I’m sure it will all look good and well-made, but to be honest I question how fantasy she has read to make a rather sweeping generalization about it’s “look.” When you visit a bookstore (and especially a secondhand one) and take a look at the covers, you don’t see medieval constantly. You see medieval elements for sure, but there’s also a lot of playfulness there and exaggeration and a mixing of cultures. This is all really awesome, but a part of the reason that ASoIaF felt so different for me was that it DID have this groundedness about it. I mean, GRRM was definitely inventive with the cultures and costumes, but there was this thread of realism and a history/look that’s just enough like our own that it reads differently than other genre pieces.
    Anyway, I hope that didn’t sound too ranty or mean, because it wasn’t meant to, but I do kind of question the reasoning behind going the route that they seem to be. I’m interested to see the final product, and will keep an open mind for sure, but right now I’m not feeling it. :/
    That said, I really liked some of the sketches that I saw that seemed more in keeping with the books but still creative (I think one of them was probably Caitlyn’s dress?). For some reason the neckline really appealed to me.

  49. Tysnow
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 9:46 pm | Permalink

    Great video, can now see their thinking on costuming, which many of us already figured out weeks ago the direction they were taking. I wonder if that silk violet dress hanging behind her is Dany’s from Illyrio’s party.
    Like others I love the shield and sketches, I guess that rack with all the earthtone outfits are for Northmen.

  50. Half Myrish
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 10:23 pm | Permalink

    Tysnow,

    I wondered that too about the purple thing behind her, but when I paused the video and looked more closely, I think it’s a purple scarf or shawl hung over a white dress on the mannequin. Unless it is a really flimsy dress with not much material.

  51. hound
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 11:32 pm | Permalink

    I may be able to adjust to some of the clothes, but I really cannot stomach this armour (there’s a bloody tribal design on the shield too!!!). I need Kingsguard white. That’s just the way it is. How can she rob us of the Kingsguard white…

  52. Phantomwriter05
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 11:39 pm | Permalink

    1:41

    It’s Lunchbox!! (aka Tommen)

    I’m really looking foward to how Lena pulls off these amazing costumes … from her facebook entries she seems tight with Mrs. Clapton.

    I think that the creative team arn’t trying to base things off a historical cultures, but more of sort of making them up House for House, Region for Region, sort of like they had done with Lord of the Rings …

    rather than take insperation from europe I think they’re trying to create something new and fresh.

  53. Sleeky
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 11:46 pm | Permalink

    AbstractPlain: Well they definitely made it perfectly clear that it won’t be strictly medieval inspired.
    My fear is that they could go too far with the asian theme, especially when you start including kimonos into the mix. I’m bracing myself for worst Jaime with a samurai sword, and tywin in full samurai armour :p

    This seems like as good a spot as any to raise a point that has me wondering.

    In general I’m ok with having an general asian influence regarding costumes and kings guard armor. Any guy in armor can look good enough….but what about Dinklage? The guy only stands 4’5″. Put in him anything heaver than leather or chain armor would he even be able to stand in such a get-up? In fact I seem to recall during one part in GoT Tyrion was in the Vanguard with some of his *ahem* “new found friends” and Tyrion remarking to himself how ridiculous he felt wearing armor. And to be honest with myself, with the image I have in my head, I think I’ll have to agree with Tyrion. :/

    For television would they just stick him in leather armor exclusively? Or maybe leather with just a bit of chain?

  54. Rory
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 11:53 pm | Permalink

    I hope they translate better on screen than they do in the sketches. I’m not really impressed with the Kimonoesque/Japanese look of a lot of the design. There is so much in the books that screams western European. It may be a cliche of the fantasy genre to work from that period, but why tinker with it.

  55. Jim
    Posted October 29, 2010 at 11:57 pm | Permalink

    hound,

    Seriously, thank you. The Kingsguard are, at various times, referred to as White Cloaks, White Swords, and White Shields…from what we’ve seen, this Kingsguard has exactly NONE of those things. It’s going to sound pretty silly when Jaime has to go write history in “The Kingsguard Book” because calling it “The White Book” will make no sense since they have no white. And I’m really not a fan of the tribal tattoo design either, or those three ridged helmets. I have literally no complaints about what I’ve seen so far with the sole exception of what seems to be every aspect of the Kingsguard’s appearance, which is disappointing because I was pretty excited to see how they’d handle that particularly.

  56. Hodor
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 2:03 am | Permalink

    Jim,

    Maybe, they don’t want …
    ‘errr are those stormtroopers?’

  57. pualo
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 2:30 am | Permalink

    Sleeky,

    Tyrion has an excellent suit of custom plate armor, back at home. He was feeling awkward because it wasn’t with him and he had to wear mismatched armor that didn’t fit right. I’m sure he’d feel fine in his own armor. He’s just short, not weak.

  58. LivveHult
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 3:10 am | Permalink

    The only thing I fear is that somehow something somewhere – will look as tacky, plastic and cliché as the clothes they wear in Legend of the seeker.

  59. Fire And Blood
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 3:23 am | Permalink

    Hodor,

    “Aren’t you a little short for a Kingsguard?”

    I like the Kingsguard armor, and the crown motif they have etched onto the breastplate especially. Still not 100% sold on the funky helmets, but so long as they have white cloaks (and Rimshot says they do), then they’ll be whitecloaks.

    Really intrigued by the vaguely Japanese influence on the Lannisters. Is it something that hearkens back to Lann himself, or are the Lannisters adopting something from the Targs? Either way I have every confidence in this uber-professional team of designers. The things they churn out may not look or feel like the history we know, but I bet you dollars to donuts they will have some sort of historical explanation within the story context. It will very likely all make sense once we see the finish product and are able to do some digging.

    Every little bit just makes me want to see the finished product more and more. Winter needs to come and get gone so that spring 2011 can get here!

    With regard to teasers and behind-the-scenes vignettes, I truly think, right now, HBO is aiming this stuff squarely at us—the people who already know the series and appreciate these seemingly mundane details. Once the HBO marketing machine begins to really rumble, I think we’ll finally get a good glimpse of how they will entice everybody else.

  60. mary
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 3:49 am | Permalink

    Oh, I do love these videos. They thrill me every time we get to see some more details. And the costumes are such an important piece. So I gathered the ones that are shown in this clip here –
    http://westeros.ru/?p=5926

  61. Rinoa De la Pica
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 4:41 am | Permalink

    Critical Geek,

    In fact, Spain is so different to Mexico that I don’t understand your statement.

  62. Nemo
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 8:31 am | Permalink

    For those complaining about the colors of the Kingsguard armor, this is admittedly a guess on my part, but I’d be willing to bet they TRIED an all white look, and found it just didn’t work. Somethings can seem great on paper, either written or even as a concept sketch, and end up looking like crap when realized.

    My guess is this is what happened here. Whether it looked fake/plastic, “stormtroopery,” or whatever, I’m thinking this new design of gold with white scrollwork is their way of paying homage to the description in the books while still making a believable set of armor. For some fans of the books, it may end up as an irritating discrepancy. For anyone who hasn’t read the books, it is a change that will have no effect on the viewing experience, as it has zero impact on the overall story.

  63. ieiazel
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 9:32 am | Permalink

    After watching this video I have to say that I’m still disappointed in the look of the Lannisters in general.
    The costumes are important because they are meaningful to any story: in Lord of the Rings you could see that the Rohirrim and the Gondorians dressed quite differently, but those differences had a purpose, both in the story and in the films. The Rohirrim were a viking-like culture, and so their costumes in the film reflect that influence. Those differences in the costumes enhanced the cultural differences between them and the Gondorians. And the Hobbits, of course, dressed completely differently, more like 18th c English people, but still it felt natural as it reflected their character. The design of the outfits was subtle but meaningful in most cases.

    That is my problem with the choice of a pseudo-japanese style for the Lannisters: I don’t see why the Lannisters would wear different clothes than the rest of the westerosi, having the same culture and living in the same country. I guess that this was a decision taken on the basis of visual pleasantness more than to add some detail to the story, because it doesn’t complement the history of House Lannister in any way that I can see.
    That sketch of Cersei’s gown seems a bit random and “garbled”, and, though of course it’s only a sketch and it will surely improve, I cannot but wonder why they did not stick with the description of Cersei’s garments in the books. If well done, it should add depth to the character. Of course you can say that people who haven’t read the books will not mind, but most people can see this lack of coherence and resent it.

    However, I’m very pleased with mostly any other design, and even King Robert’s infamous outfit didn’t bother me that much.

  64. Kevin Kenney
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 9:41 am | Permalink

    I bet she doesn’t ware those ugly rings when she isn’t being interviewed on camera. Those things were uuuuuuuggggglllyyyy.

  65. Steve Westenra
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 9:45 am | Permalink

    ieiazel,

    Exactly.
    I feel it also veers way too close to a well-made cheesiness, which would work well with some fantasies, but not so much this one.

  66. Shinyteapot
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 10:32 am | Permalink

    I like what we’ve seen of the costumes so far. The sketch of Dany’s wedding dress is particularly perfect, and I hope that lilac dress in the background is one of hers too- it’s very light and floaty, so seems more suited to essos than westeros, and the colour is good for a Targaryen.

    I’m not worried about the kingsguard at all- it’s entirely possible all white armour just wouldn’t work on screen. So they have white cloaks, and a white crown design (which will show up nicely on a darker background)- that keeps the theme, they’ll still have far more white on their armour than any other knights.

    Likewise the asian influence for Lannister costumes- not an issue. Much has been made of westeros being aking to europe, but this isn’t Earth- there is no rule to say styles we associate with asia wouldn’t have been favoured in westeros. It makes sense to give each family their own look, and I doubt it will be too strong an influence, just enough that it’s easy to tell the major houses apart. There’s probably an equally individual look for, say, the Tyrells, we just haven’t seen it yet.

  67. Peter van Stralen
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 10:49 am | Permalink

    Really don’t like the Asian look and feel it gives. Should’ve stuck to European to be honest, the way GRRM actually described it. Disappointing.

  68. Jenny
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 11:22 am | Permalink

    Had Cersei been able to, she’d have subscribed to Vogue… ;D

    About the language – why are people always getting worked up about pronounciation of names?
    Why should somebody from Winterfell for example, pronounce a name from the Dothraki language correctly?
    I am German and I always hear English speaking people refer to Goethe as “goatee” or Bach as “beck”.
    Do any of you say “Pawree” and actually mean Paris?
    Do you say “Venezia” or “Venice”?

  69. Jim
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 12:06 pm | Permalink

    Ok, so let’s assume they tried the white armor and decided it didn’t work. Why, then, do the Kingsguard have armor that looks like it’s something anybody could buy/have? Since that first picture came out I’ve been holding out hope that those were actually Goldcloaks, since…you know, they were wearing gold, and that armor didn’t seem to have anything distinctive or special that you would expect from the people who are at least supposed to be the finest knights in the kingdom. It looks like some sort of standard issue/cheap and easy to manufacture armor that they would want to supply to thousands of city watchmen, as opposed to something that suggests “These SEVEN guys have special armor because they’re SPECIAL.” The Kingsguard’s appearance is SO vividly and explicitly described, it would be literally the same thing as leaving Jaime with brown hair “because the blonde dye didn’t really look right.” Hell, I’m not even suggesting that they would need white enameled plate armor. Just something that looks like it’s not something thousands of dudes would have since it appears to offer precious little protection, particularly around the forearms. I’ve said it before…stand one of those guys next to what appears to be Ser Hugh from the behind the scenes video and ask me to pick out the Kingsguard, I’d pick Ser Hugh every time and be baffled when you told me “No, that’s actually just some no-name who doesn’t even speak a word in the books.”

    Also, for the record, Stormtrooper armor is BADASS. Tribal designs/tattoos have never and will never be badass.

  70. Half Myrish
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 1:17 pm | Permalink

    Jim,

    At least we’ve been told we have white cloaks. I would be really sad if the Kingsguard had no white at all. But yeah, I’m with you on the rest. Armor aside, even doing the blank white shields that are so trademark would make me happier. Or at least a shield that is mostly white instead of mostly dark. I am curious as to why HBO seems to have chosen a darker color scheme with touches of white for the Kingsguard, rather than say white and gold, which would look fancier. Maybe they’re trying to go for that “gritty realistic look” everyone is so enamored of?

  71. Skyweir
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 2:30 pm | Permalink

    This is the first time the GoT team has disappointed me.
    Not screams cheap fantasy like a mishmash of different cultures, nearly all the “bad” fantasy shows on TV does this and fill their sets with absurd and anachronistic costumes and props.

    They point isn’t that it need to look like the readers imagined it, but clashing cultural inspiration looks fake on screen. It doesn’t matter that the viewer knows that it is all fantasy and not based on real events or cultures. It still looks fake, which is really what matters.

    Seeing what is clearly a medival english society, but then suddenly introducing a lot of asian themes, reinforces the fact that this is fantasy, and should not be taken seriously. That is, after all, the prevelant thoughts about the genre in television. Keeping to a single medival style in imagery and costumes would have helped to anchor the series in a more “belivable” world.

    Not only that, but Martin is meticolous in his armor and clothes description. It’s sad that we will loose those so completely in the translation to screen. Much grandour will be lost, as well as the feeling of the world that Martin has created.

  72. Ingemar Svensson
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 3:32 pm | Permalink

    Jenny: Had Cersei been able to, she’d have subscribed to Vogue… ;DAbout the language – why are people always getting worked up about pronounciation of names?
    Why should somebody from Winterfell for example, pronounce a name from the Dothraki language correctly?
    I am German and I always hear English speaking people refer to Goethe as “goatee” or Bach as “beck”.
    Do any of you say “Pawree” and actually mean Paris?
    Do you say “Venezia” or “Venice”?    

    Personally, I don’t think it’s that important. I pointed out the pronounciation of Khal as a way of promoting the created dothraki language rather than simply being nitpicky.

    There is a diffrence between placenames and propoer names though in my opinion. When referring to someones proper name I think it’s respectful to try and pronounce it the way they do but I also realize that using the phonology of a different language can be very hard for people so it’s hard to be very strict about it.

  73. Ikertzeke
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 3:54 pm | Permalink

    Critical Geek,

    I am completely lost, Spain is in Europe, Mexico in North America…
    Spain discovered America in 1492… do your maths!!!
    No middle ages for Mexico, as we know, only aztecs until Hernan Cortes in 1521…

  74. reedgirl
    Posted October 30, 2010 at 10:06 pm | Permalink

    I can’t say I 100% ‘get’ the reasoning for the asian influence in the costumes, but it still looks fantastic. Sexy. Dramatic. Angular and different from what we’ve seen before – it reminds us that we are in another historical ‘world’, that this is NOT King Arthur’s ‘Camelot’. Unusual clothes, strange languages, foreign customs, even bizarre eating rituals… it all becomes part of the fantasy until you ‘believe’ the world and it is familiar to you. Or to me at least.

    Can’t wait.

  75. Roger
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 5:01 am | Permalink

    The goddamn weeaboos are ruining this TV show.

  76. Roger
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 5:11 am | Permalink

    Fire And Blood,

    No it won’t. It’s utterly absurd. What reasons would the Lannisters have for emulating Targaryen styles?

    The problem with all these ridiculous Asian-themed costumes is that they completely muck up the visual themes of the series. GRRM drew heavy inspiration from the Wars of the Roses, and that is what people expect to see. They don’t want a bloody samurai popping up in there just because some Wapanese fellow got to be the costume designer, and they don’t want the bloody costume designer from Dragon Age to work on the armour either. The radical changes in styles for Houses that don’t need it only cheapen the visual feel of the series.

  77. Grimtuesday
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 7:38 am | Permalink

    Roger,

    Wow, man chill the fuck out. These really don’t look too bad and considering that Lansport is a trading city it is logical that they would inter mingle with people from other lands. And lets not dump on the Weaboos no matter how annoying they can be, a bit of fantastical costuming is nothing to get your panties in a bunch over.

  78. Roger
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 8:36 am | Permalink

    Grimtuesday,

    Yeah, the sketches and ‘civilian’ clothing aren’t too bad, but my rage at the armour is spilling over into everything else.

    None of it’s historically authentic, as HBO put it. Heck, none of it is even plausible. Clegane’s wearing a bunch of scrap metal and a bucket, Loras has too more wire on jousting armour (the whole point of the armour is to get the blunted lance to glance off, not to catch the damned thing), and Jaime looks like a bloody Deep One in his stupid helmet with the ridges that are designed to catch hits. And that’s not even including the samurai-esque guardsmen. I don’t know, maybe my expectations were a tad high, but HBO certainly had a good track record in this department, and they weren’t exactly lacking in quality reference material.

    And yes, they have a major port. So what? The Italian city-states were pretty much the centres of culture in Europe, and you don’t see them nicking bits from the Mongols or the Chinese. Their costume decisions really aren’t justifiable in-universe, and that’s what I’m ticked off about. It smacks of a highly-placed weeaboo introducing their wank into a fantasy world with that drew very specific influences from real-world history, and it makes for a bloody clusterfuck in the aesthetic department.

    /rant

  79. Tysnow
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 8:59 am | Permalink

    Roger,

    I like Clegane’s armor, it gives him the appearance of a medieval Darth Vader. Concerning the Lannister armor we still haven’t had a really full look with helmet visor down, shield, etc. so just be patient. I like the Kingsguard armor, they are creating a unique non-Westerosean feeling, after all HBO has decided that the Targ Kings wanted their bodyguard to maintain a Valyrian presence so that is the direction the designers took and I personally find it cool, you may not, but sounds like a personal problem to me. You should take a look at late medieval Europe jousting armor and Eastern European armor before ranting about the look being to fantastical. I prefer each House having a unique look than all the same armor with different surcoats as the later to me is cheap, I mean look at the old Hollywood movies where they used the later method, makes everything look lazy, like they didn’t want to spend the time and money.

  80. Half Myrish
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:04 am | Permalink

    Look at this from the moot thread, apparently this is why the Kingsguard doesn’t have white armor. Apparently other posters speculation was correct, that white armor doesn’t look good on camera. Still wish they had all white shields.

  81. LivveHult
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:06 am | Permalink

    Skyweir,

    Wow, that is an interesting thought. I maight have to meditate a bit on that one.. Because I kind of see your point there. Quite a bit. Hmm

  82. Half Myrish
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:08 am | Permalink

    Oops, epic link fail. Well, there IS an interesting insider comment over on the moot thread about the Kingsguard armor. Hopefully it will be posted over here.

  83. LivveHult
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:11 am | Permalink

    On another note. Were have you guys seen the armor. I must have missed them all. Anyone have a link or direction?

  84. Elio & Linda
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:14 am | Permalink

    Apologies about posting in the wrong area, it’s a plugin of mine that ends up moving on to the second, third, etc. of a page … but it messes up on occasion and sometimes moves you onto a completely separate post!

    Here’s what I wrote:

    I spoke with Simon Brindle, the head of the costume armor department, about a great deal of the armor. One thing I specifically asked about was the change to the Kingsguard armor. I wondered if perhaps they moved away from the pure white because of how it looked on camera, and in fact he nodded his head and said yes, the gleam from it wasn’t working well in relation to everything else you’d see on screen and so they went in this direction with it instead.

    So chalk this up to a point where George’s imagination outpaces reality, or perhaps that in his setting they can get that white looking just so, whereas in RL they can’t.

    I got a chance to get a _very_ close up look at the armor, and even saw a few production photos of Nikolaj Coster-Waldau in it. It looks quite fabulous, and not at all like something just “anyone” could have. The “tribal” design is nothing but an orante, scrollwork crown, and I actually very much appreciated that detail to more explicitly link them as the king’s personal guard. GRRM seemed to like it too.

    Oh, and yes, they have white cloaks, just as Rimshot reported. Have a picture of one, in fact. Pristine white, just as it should be! Even saw a photo of the cloak as worn draped over the horse’s flank.

  85. Tysnow
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:43 am | Permalink

    I have a fairly extensive library on military history and grabbed my two volumes on medieval Japan and funny thing is that the Lannister armor looks nothing like Samurai armor, for those who don’t have books, just google it. Japanese armor whereas the Lannister armor with its layer molded cuirass, shoulder guards, looks closer to what Roman segmented armor would’ve looked had it progressed into the medieval ages and not been supplanted by chainmail.

  86. Tysnow
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:53 am | Permalink

    Elio & Linda,

    Good post and to further point out how white armor can appear on film, take a look at Taylor’s Cleopatra, George Harrison is wearing white armor in a couple of scenes and it just doesn’t look right.

  87. Tysnow
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 9:56 am | Permalink

    Tysnow,

    Oops, I meant the other Beatle Rex Harrison.

  88. Tusuri
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 10:16 am | Permalink

    Long time lurker here (now that is a comment I’ve always found a bit iffy) first time poster, and hoping to not make an ass of myself :P After reading the comments I was somewhat worried, but after having seen the video, the changes don’t seem that big a deal (though I hope they don’t go too overboard with it).

    Having said that, to me Martin’s Seven Kingdoms is clearly medieval, and because it has come across as a place that seems a bit reluctant to change in whatever form, having Asian-themed armour or whatnot in it is jarring to my eye (in the case of the Lannisters, just because Lannisport is a trading port -with all that it entails of cultural polinisation- it doesn’t mean they’d be so influenced by it that they’d be so different look-wise from the other westerosi as to look like an unwelcome party).

    For all of it being grounded in “gritty reality”, there seems to be a rather big grade of leniency when they add tribal designs or some other element that do not belong to a medieval (even though it is fantasy) setting, which, I insist, Martin’s world distills.

    Of course, I may be blowing this thing out of proportion and may well end up looking like a dumbass once the series airs XD

  89. Roger
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 10:18 am | Permalink

    Tysnow: Roger,
    I like Clegane’s armor, it gives him the appearance of a medieval Darth Vader. Concerning the Lannister armor we still haven’t had a really full look with helmet visor down, shield, etc. so just be patient. I like the Kingsguard armor, they are creating a unique non-Westerosean feeling, after all HBO has decided that the Targ Kings wanted their bodyguard to maintain a Valyrian presence so that is the direction the designers took and I personally find it cool, you may not, but sounds like a personal problem to me. You should take a look at late medieval Europe jousting armor and Eastern European armor before ranting about the look being to fantastical. I prefer each House having a unique look than all the same armor with different surcoats as the later to me is cheap, I mean look at the old Hollywood movies where they used the later method, makes everything look lazy, like they didn’t want to spend the time and money.    

    He’s eight bloody feet tall, he doesn’t need the help, does he?

    I’ve seen the harnesses in question, and no, they aren’t nearly as impractical as Loras’. Bear in mind that these suits were actually used as intended by their owners and weren’t merely props. Loras’ suit isn’t just ugly, it’s downright dangerous for him. The decoration has effectively removed every smooth surface for strikes to glance off his armour.

    The problem with each House having a unique look is that it doesn’t make sense for the vast majority of them. There’s minimal cultural or geographical isolation for most of the houses in the bottom half of Westeros, and this really should be reflected in the costuming. There might be specific fashions in certain courts, but throwing something so radically different into the mix is completely unwarranted. To give you an example, armour from different houses might look like the different harnesses these chaps are wearing (http://www.orderofthecrescent.com/). They look the part while having touches of personalization and reflecting the fashion of the time and place.

    And no, it doesn’t look lazy, it looks authentic. I don’t know about you, but I really don’t want Belty McLeatherstrap the Rogue from D&D making an appearance just for the sale of visual differentiation.

    Tysnow: I have a fairly extensive library on military history and grabbed my two volumes on medieval Japan and funny thing is that the Lannister armor looks nothing like Samurai armor, for those who don’t have books, just google it.Japanese armor whereas the Lannister armor with its layer molded cuirass, shoulder guards, looks closer to what Roman segmented armor would’ve looked had it progressed into the medieval ages and not been supplanted by chainmail.    

    Nobody here stated that they pinched Japanese armour wholesale, but it’s pretty obvious that they drew heavy influences from Asiatic and Japanese styles of armour. Let’s not even go into the ridiculous idea about katanas that they had earlier in the production.

    I disagree quite strongly. Roman segmented armour is visually very distinct from what HBO has used.

  90. Tusuri
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 10:20 am | Permalink

    Tusuri: >Of course, I may be blowing this thing out of proportion and may well end up looking like a dumbass once the series airs XD  Quote  Reply

    Hmmm, seems I’m quite the seer (after reading some of the explanations after Roger’s)

  91. Roger
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 10:34 am | Permalink

    Tusuri,

    It’s more of a question of your tolerance for that sort of thing, really. :P

  92. HerrFick
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 10:43 am | Permalink

    Elio & Linda,

    Thanks for the information, Ran! Can’t wait for the other parts of your report. :)
    I’m pretty confident that the crown scrollwork and white cloaks will let the Kingsguard knights stand out sufficiently as a special group of characters on screen.
    Can you also dismiss some concerns about those Lannister armours? Did you get a look at them with the helm visors down?

  93. Hear Me Roar
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 3:27 pm | Permalink

    Elio & Linda,

    Thank you for asking about that issue and posting it, a very welcome clarification!

  94. Dan
    Posted October 31, 2010 at 11:25 pm | Permalink

    Jim,

    Agreed. Although she may have read the books she clearly paid no attention to GRRM’s descriptions of the costumes. I hate how she flippently acts like she has to invent everything when GRRM has painstakingly described the armor, etc.

  95. The Winter Rose
    Posted November 1, 2010 at 9:09 am | Permalink

    I’m so happy that they have all these little behind the scene videos! I love seeing all the tech work that goes into the production, especially when it comes to costuming.

    It’s interesting to here her thought process on the creation of the style, though I admit I never really pictured Westeros fashion being as Asian inspired as it is. Guess I will just reserve judgement to see what the finished product looks like. Though I did like the simple, flowy design for Dany’s wedding dress.

  96. Brad
    Posted November 1, 2010 at 10:13 am | Permalink

    Elio & Linda,

    Thanks for your report about the kingsguard armor. I think the design they are using will serve the purpose of distinguishing the kingsguard from others.

    AND at the same time, I have a theory:
    This artisan video introduces the concept of “pacing” the richness of costumes over the coarse of the series.. maybe in later scenes, such as in the throne room, or in TOJ flashbacks we will see the full white enamel armor.

    I like the concept of the various characters and groups having costumes that change — while keeping a unified look — depending on the situation.

    I was very impressed with this artisan video. While I personally never imagined the asian influence, Ms. Clapton has me sold on her ability & concepts.

  97. userj
    Posted November 1, 2010 at 1:31 pm | Permalink

    Roger,

    It seems like there are plenty of examples of tourney armor that is ridiculously impractical yet was actually worn for jousting. e.g.

    http://theartblog.org/2009/10/power-dressing-treasures-of-the-spanish-royal-armory-at-the-national-gallery-of-art/
    http://www7b.biglobe.ne.jp/~bprince/hr/foxdavies/img/310-2c.gif

    Practically EVERY description of the Tyrells/Southerners (Loras and Renly in particular) emphasizes that they are all about the over-the-top heraldry with little thought for practical concerns. Thus, impractical yet beautiful helms like Loras is wearing make a lot of sense. The rest of his armor looks reasonably practical. I assume that in real combat Loras would not be wearing this helm – it’s tourney armor.

  98. Roger
    Posted November 1, 2010 at 6:35 pm | Permalink

    userj,

    ‘There is no more splendid example of European dress as high political propaganda than the ceremonial armor made for the Hapsburg Holy Roman Emperors Maximilian I and Charles V and for Charles’ son, Philip II of Spain….Such armor was rarely intended as practical protection during battle; rather it had a starring role in parades, jousting tournaments and court rituals and was favored attire for official portraits. ‘

    No, impractical yet beautiful helms like Loras’ do not make sense in the context of a tourney. They make sense in a victory parade, but the last I checked people tended not to hit you when you were participating in one of those.

    And honestly, while the southerners may like copious amounts of ornamentation, it’s ridiculous to believe that they’d sacrifice any significant amount of protection to do it. Beneath the enamel and filigree the armour is probably as good as anything else in the realm.

  99. GaR
    Posted November 1, 2010 at 10:21 pm | Permalink

    Tusuri,

    I agree with all you say, except for the idea of the diversity of Lannisport. It’s on the Sunset Sea, and must surely see almost exclusively traffic from the Seven Kingdoms and practically none from the Free Cities or farther abroad.

    The video doesn’t really frighten me too badly, but as someone else mentioned, it is a bit off the way she pretends GRRM has given her nothing to work with in the text :S

  100. userj
    Posted November 2, 2010 at 10:54 am | Permalink

    Roger,

    rather it had a starring role in parades, jousting tournaments and court rituals and was favored attire for official portraits.

    See bolded!
    So, yeah! People wore ornate helmets in JOUSTING TOURNAMENTS.

  101. Roger
    Posted November 3, 2010 at 12:51 pm | Permalink

    userj,

    From what I can see, only the helm in the woodcut would be usable for jousting. The first is quite clearly ceremonial, the second needs a visor, and the third and fourth are burgonets. Quite clearly, these weren’t the helms they were referring to with that line.

    Also, consider the rulesets of the time. In ASOIAF, their jousts are what modern re-enactors and jousters would consider to be a full contact, rough-and-tumble style. The later forms of tourney eliminated certain areas as targets and designated others, etc. You can have a pimp helmet when your pauldron is reinforced with crossbraces and your opponent is using a lance designed to disintegrate on hard impact. A similar hit on Loras’ vine helm is going to catch the thing and rip it off or break his pretty neck.

  1. [...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Blackfish Blues, Winter Is Coming. Winter Is Coming said: Kingsguard armor is not white in the show because there was too much glare per @westerosorg http://bit.ly/djPnsO #GameofThrones [...]


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