Game of Thrones screeners have been showing up at critics’ doorsteps the past couple days and now the first review for season two is in! Entertainment Weekly’s Ken Tucker gives the show an ‘A-’ and has nothing but positive things to say in his review:
I’ve tried a little experiment: I had read the first volume of George R.R. Martin’s saga A Song of Ice and Fire (the source material for this series) before I watched the first season of GoT so I would be familiar with the vast array of characters and plots that would develop. But I intentionally did not read the epic’s second volume, A Clash of Kings, before watching the start of GoT season 2, because I wanted to see if I’d have trouble following the new intricacies.
And I’m here to report that my lack of homework in no way prevented me from becoming enthralled with this series all over again. That’s a testament to what adapters David Benioff and D.B. Weiss have accomplished in whittling down and reshaping Martin’s novels for weekly TV. It’s difficult enough to hook a viewer like me, who resists sprawling, noncontemporary narratives; it’s another level of pop culture wizardry to make such storytelling seem so vivid, so vital, and just plain fun. A-
Winter is Coming: Good stuff! Many of the tweets from TV critics and journalists have been very positive as well. Sounds like David & Dan have done it again!
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126 Comments
Too bad it is a very generic review. Doesn’t mention any negatives, nor does he say which episodes were seen to give this grade… One episode? Two? Four?
LarsQuote Reply
Woooooo
SandyQuote Reply
Sandy,
This review is from last year…
AndrewQuote Reply
Most critics received screeners with the first 4 episodes.
MrDonnerfaustQuote Reply
The actual S2 review is here:
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20470532_20580368,00.html
MikeQuote Reply
Andrew,
How can you possibly say the review is from last year. Did you even read it?
EDIT: Just realized WiC linked the wrong one. http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20470532_20580368,00.html
RoQuote Reply
One really would expect more detail. This could have been written by anyone without having seen anything of season 2. How were the performances? What was good? What was not so good?
It strikes me as the journalistic equivalent of a “First!” post.
LarsQuote Reply
Ro,
Winter linked the old review of season 1.
MrDonnerfaustQuote Reply
Lars,
Eighth!
Ted furthmanQuote Reply
Jace Lacob (@televisionary) has some neat twitter reactions to the first three episodes:
Episodes 1+2:
https://twitter.com/#!/televisionary/status/182246194465095680
Episode 3:
https://twitter.com/#!/televisionary/status/182345552799875072
https://twitter.com/#!/televisionary/status/182465238115946496
LarsQuote Reply
A-…? HOW DARE HE! DIE YOU PEASANT!
TastesLikeTheSeaQuote Reply
And i wasted all those days not going to work and reading the rest of the series
Nimble DickQuote Reply
Jace Lacob’s tweets are pretty promising…I really enjoyed his reviews last year , so he’s really increasing my anticipation.
ObsidianQuote Reply
Oops! Link is fixed now.
Winter Is ComingQuote Reply
But what do Ginia Belafonte and Troy Patterson have to say about this?
AdrianQuote Reply
Winter Is Coming,
How many critics got advanced reviews? Did they all get the first 3 episodes? The reviews are awesome but knowing people are already watching it is making me see red !!
DrfunkQuote Reply
This is excellent news :)
As an aside, if there are any fans here who are familiar with HBO GO’s SOP, I’d like to know if the episodes are available via that service at the same time they are televised, or if there is a 24 hour delay or something. I might not have an HD cable box by April 1, but I have an Xbox 360 and that’s slated to get HBO GO on the first. I’d like to know ?I won’t have to wait for the episodes lol
ZackQuote Reply
Is there any copyright protection on those discs when they get sent out as to not have them leaked online? I’ve always wondered about that. I always figured that critics were taken to a screening room to watch the episodes – it was only last year that I discovered they sent out discs with the episodes. I’m surprised episodes don’t somehow manage to get leaked that way. It’d be a shame if they did!
Michael HarperQuote Reply
The screener disks are individually watermarked, so it’s pretty difficult to leak them and not get into huge legal troubles.
ShmargenQuote Reply
The DVD’s sent out (or BD?) are burned specifically for the reviewers – and they are marked in such a way that if it is leaked, they can trace it back to the individual journalist.
LarsQuote Reply
Shmargen,
Lars,
Ahh this is good! :)
Michael HarperQuote Reply
Adrian,
Who the hell cares?
Arrogant BastardQuote Reply
Such A Glorious Time! The Season Is Almost Upon Us Again, The Realms Rejoice At The Thought!
Restore The Day!
Restore The DayQuote Reply
He is the daily beast, televisionary guy right?
That guy was a huge got honk
Obsidian,
SuperdeluxeQuote Reply
Zack,
Hmmm. I was thinking the same thing. But it looks like you have to subscribe to HBO through your cable provider in order to have access to HBO GO :(
Edit: see Lars comment below. HBO GO seems to be free w/HBO. There does not appear to be a way to pay for it separately.
HexonxQuote Reply
Episodes are usually up on HBO GO within within an hour or two of the first HBO airing.
BUT… Without a current HBO subscription you will not be able to see it.
LarsQuote Reply
Good news about the review. I hope to see more soon.
In the Jace Lakob twitter he revealed that (slight spoler about the opening sequence location) Dragonstone was a location
No surprise but I’m glad they are still altering the opening as the story locations change.
LanTheCleverQuote Reply
Do I really have to put “/sarcasm” at the end of a post just to avoid situations like this?
And honestly, I care. I would like to see how they try to backpedal from “no one will like this show!” and “there’s no way women will watch this show!” now that it’s a hugely popular, wildly successful program. I would very much like to see them choke on that crow.
AdrianQuote Reply
That was a surprisingly shallow “review.” WTF?
qwertyQuote Reply
Drfunk, many critics tweeted yesterday that they received the first four episodes.
AndrewQuote Reply
Adrian,
I didn’t mean for the “who the hell cares” as a nasty comment towards your post, more of as a disregard for the opinions of those two morons. I’d like to see them eat some crow as well, but they’ll never admit their original opinons were crap. They might not even review season 2, since they obviously hated season one.
Arrogant BastardQuote Reply
That’s just how Ken Tucker rolls. He’s an early reviewer who gives little detail, and grades on a scale of B to A-. I’m glad he liked it enough to put it on his high end, but he’s not a reviewer to consider very seriously IMO.
Maxwell JamesQuote Reply
Lars,
Thanks for your answers guys
I currently do subscribe to HBO, but my Tivo box needs repairing so I don’t have an easy way to watch HD programming at the moment. So if the episodes are available Sunday nights, it should work out perfectly!
Also thanks for posting those tweets. It sounds like they’ve got some great things in store for us.
ZackQuote Reply
Lars,
Ah yes, Varys and Tyrion.
I don’t recall there being much of that in the books, even though Tyrion is a major POV character. But after seeing what they did with Varys and Littlefinger, I can’t wait to see the three of them duking it out.
ChrisQuote Reply
How come James hibbard didn’t do it
SuperdeluxeQuote Reply
Game of Thrones rocks! It is Known!
John WQuote Reply
Clash has a bunch of Varys/Tyrion stuff. I’m assuming the scene in question is probably the riddle.
Delta1212Quote Reply
Just saw a quick TV spot on CNN. Mostly footage from previous trailers, but there was a shot of a wildling turning to look at Jon Snow. It had to be Rattleshirt. You could see the bones around his clothing! He also had on a weird-ass mask around his mouth.
HollyoakQuote Reply
Tyrion and Varys had a ton of conversations in the book.
qwertyQuote Reply
That’s disappointing.. He did not give the show an A+, nor an A, but an A-! That makes the show sounds pretty mediocre to me..
HERP-DERPQuote Reply
That’s'The Dark Knight Rises’. You can tell the difference because GoT actually has an American actor in it.
JackSparrowQuote Reply
Hey – anybody else notice on IMDB that Sean Bean is listed as appearing as Ned in Season 2, Episode 10?
Susan CQuote Reply
Susan C,
IMDB has been waay wrong before. I think the Sean Bean in S2 was mentioned in an earlier thread.
I expect Sean to be in a flashback, but it’s too early for that. We have to wait for Bran to connect with his inner tree.
MimsyQuote Reply
Good to see a positive review, though I agree it was so weak in details that it could have been written by someone who just watched the trailers.
TCQuote Reply
A- is freakin’ great for non-classic genre stuff! What’s with all the doom and gloom?
Pink DragonQuote Reply
Pink Dragon,
Agreed! Honestly, how horrible would it be if they received a D grade instead? A- is fantastic. The show’s obviously setting the bar high!
SpryteQuote Reply
Jace Lacob (@televisionary) just tweeted his reaction to episode 204:
https://twitter.com/#!/televisionary/status/182685522869751808
LarsQuote Reply
a dance of shadows…
negarQuote Reply
Found a video on youtube from a guy who went to a season 2 premiere screening and he gives a very detailed recap of what happens in the episode so don’t watch it unless you want to be spoiled.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YJ7PDK-VHY&feature=player_embedded
JamesLQuote Reply
TastesLikeTheSea,
ha ha ha.
Jenish KachhadiaQuote Reply
A- is great….
Ken Tucker gave down town abbey B+, so A- is great i think
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20560596,00.html
Jenish KachhadiaQuote Reply
Jenish Kachhadia,
Ugh considering the PoS DA season 2 was, it’s rather frightening he gave it a B+
ETA: Although from reading the review, it appears that B+ actually means he thought it was kinda crappy! Hello grade inflation…
userjQuote Reply
jace jacob’s new tweet abt game of thrones
https://twitter.com/#!/televisionary/status/182695938412904448
Jenish KachhadiaQuote Reply
Hey guys, there is a great interview with D &D.B. at ign. There are a few VERY precious tidbits in there:
http://tv.ign.com/articles/122/1221315p2.html
When asked about the truthfullness of the adaption they say that they had to shuffle around some plotlines between S3 and S2 and from my understanding that not only means the Tullys but also the ever elusive Reeds/Ramsay stuff.
They also say that while they would have loved to have a movies budget for Blackwater, they are very happy with what the SFX companies could do (and judging by the recent Greywind clips, I am with them).
For all those SanSan shippers: They said that Sophie was more afraid to do a scene where she had to perform a song than about her being stripped in front of the court.
Chris77Quote Reply
We know that the story in book 2 is even better than in book 1, and that HBO have probably thrown more means into D&D’s laps to make it look even better as well (Iceland etc), so I’m basically not interested AT ALL in what the critics say :-)
Btw, with the positive buzz the show has created in season 1 and the award season, I’m sure reviewers will (subconsciously?) look at the show through rose-tinted glasses now. Then again, succes allways attracts the envious and those that per definition have opinions contradicting that of the masses…
Tar KidhoQuote Reply
I got the impression, based on the comment of another critic who got screeners, that they’re embargoed from talking about anything specific from those episodes yet.
mummerQuote Reply
Chris77,
haha, David Benioff mentiones Larry Williams (Otaku Assemble) in that interview :D awesome!
MichaelmannQuote Reply
Well, she sings in front of the women of the court during the battle of blackwater as well, doing her best to keep everyone calm and picking up Cersei’s slack like a BAMF – if I had to guess, I’d say that’s what they are referring to. The interview makes it seem like it was funny/cute that she was more afraid during her singing scene than the beating scene. If it was the Sandor scene, it wouldn’t be odd at all for her to be afraid (SING FOR YOUR LITTLE LIFE, LITTLE BIRD).
userjQuote Reply
Review is not a review
Petter Kristian VikestadQuote Reply
mummer,
Jace Lacob on the other hand said there was nothing in the material that indicated that they were embargoed:
https://twitter.com/#!/televisionary/status/182207757888397312
Johan SporreQuote Reply
LOL Well, that’s not very encouraging given that Season 2 of Downton Abbey barely rises above the level of giggle worthy shlock.
To be honest, the only reviews I take seriously are restaurant reviews, everything else I read for fun or subject info, nothing more. It really doesn’t matter what reviewers say about a show/book/album/play, if I’m interested in a particular thing, I’ll watch/read/listen regardless of consensus opinion.
DeeQuote Reply
Larry Williams got a signed poster from Sean Bean?! That’s awesome.
So looking forward to LW’s reviews for season 2! Hope he still plans on doing them!
0KEN0Quote Reply
HERP-DERP,
That’s the reason for the minus.
dizzy_34Quote Reply
HERP-DERP,
Relax. He gave “Mad Men” an A- as well.
Seriously – I looked at Tucker’s Metacritic file. He’s given exactly one show an A: Sherlock season 1 (Which was a lot of fun, but hardly flawless IMO). Yet he’s also relentlessly positive, with exactly 2 negative reviews out of 101 total. That he liked it is a vaguely good sign, but nothing else.
Maxwell JamesQuote Reply
He actually did an unpacking video of the box with that signed poster.
And yes, he is going to review season 2 and has already announced a livestream for episode 1.
MichaelmannQuote Reply
http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/r898y/mathchomaroon_my_name_is_david_j_peterson_and_im/
maybe this is worth an announcement?
raegenhereQuote Reply
raegenhere,
If it’s real. I can’t look at the link because Reddit is permanently blocked on this computer (shit will suck you in like TVTropes and refuse to let you go) but from my memory there used to be a LOT of fakers over there on IAmA.
Ignore this, though, if it’s clearly legitimate.
Pink DragonQuote Reply
That’s very detailed. Here’s a quick wrap up (spoilers abound): The first scene is Joffrey’s nameday melée. Joffrey humiliates Hollard. Tyrion arrives. The NW arrives at Craster’s Keep already in the first episode. Bran and Osha talk about the comet. Dany sees the comet in the Red Waste as well. Stannis etc. are introduced but the burning of the gods seems to be in episode 2. Robb talks with Jaime and tasks Catelyn to travel to negotiate with Renly. Littlefinger does something quite out of character for him: he reveals to Cersei that he knows of the incest. We found out why Cersei slaps Joffrey. We see Barra and others killed. The last scene is with Arya and Gendry. Apparently we see all major characters except Renly and his entourage, who are probably shown in episode 2.
VirtusQuote Reply
With the burning of the gods pushed to episode 2, they’ll get more time to develop the character of Cressen, so that his death will be a bigger shock. That death would be a good bet for the final scene of episode 2.
VirtusQuote Reply
Virtus,
Or on the other hand I guess it could be in episode 3 as well, since I remember reading that Carice said she wasn’t in ep 2. Could be wrong about that, though.
VirtusQuote Reply
One drawback of the show — they always make us care so much for the book’s minor characters (like Renly, for example, and Cressen) and then BOOM.
Especially because their actors are so great, too. Gonna be tears on my end, that’s for sure.
Pink DragonQuote Reply
virtus ,
didn’t she say she’ll be in episodes 1 , 2 , 4 and 10?
negarQuote Reply
Virtus,
What luck! Could you tell me anything about Lancel and Cersei?
julandroQuote Reply
negar,
Could be, yeah.
julandro,
I’m not the person talking in that Youtube video, I just recapped it. I don’t think he mentioned Lancel, but on the other hand he didn’t mention every detail.
VirtusQuote Reply
JamesL,
His description of the Littlefinger scene has me disappointed. Baelish is much smarter and a better player of the game than that.
Everything else though, sounds amazing. A few changes from the book but I like them.
ConorQuote Reply
Virtus,
ok, is true, sorry
julandroQuote Reply
The final scene sounds very disturbing. I’m looking forward to seeing the transition from an intense and pretty horrific sequence with the murder of children, to seeing Gendry and Arya on the Kingsroad. From the guys description it doesn’t sound like there is much of Jon Snow and Daenerys Targaryen in the episode. But, it was a pretty brief description to be fair and he did talk a deal about particular scenes, so there could be more of them.
Whatever the case, the episode sounds awesome! :D
Michael HarperQuote Reply
Yeah, that is straight stupid. Bullshit.
AndrewQuote Reply
Please spoiler tag ALL discussion of what happens in the first episode. Lots of people (including me) don’t want a detailed breakdown of the episode before viewing it. Thanks!
Winter Is ComingQuote Reply
I’m pretty sure he said that “the situation gets flipped” on Cressen… or something along those lines. I took that to mean when he tries to poison Melisandre, and ends up having to drink the poison himself. I’m pretty sure he’s going down in the first episode.
0KEN0Quote Reply
0KEN0,
From the trailers we see that Cressen is present at the burning of the Seven. If Cressen dies in the first episode, then the burning would be in the first episode as well. One would think that the video’s poster would have mentioned the burning. I guess it’s possible he didn’t realize, how important that scene is.
VirtusQuote Reply
Conor,
Depends on the exact words in the scene. It could be a subtle hint, one that Cersei could interpret several ways, but would make her a bit anxious. But I agree that if it a blunt monologue it would be out of character for Baelish.
BlaatQuote Reply
Wow, that tells you something… What a useless reviewer if practically everything is a B+ or A-. Apparently he is afraid to take a stand.
LarsQuote Reply
Winter Is Coming,
WHAT!?! what are you talking about! The first episode hasn’t aired yet right…?!! How would people know what happened in the first episode????
HERP-DERPQuote Reply
Look up in the thread… Someone posted a youtube link to a detailed review of episode 201.
LarsQuote Reply
I’m really looking forward to Sady Doyle’s review.
Tom HiltonQuote Reply
If he only had good things to say, why rate a A ‘MINUS’? I mean, I’m not bitching but I read the whole review and the guy didn’t type one bad word about the show. If someone grades a A- at a review its because they’re unsatisfied with SOMEthing in the show… of what, he doesn’t say. This should be at least a pure A right?
DekarQuote Reply
Lol, we’re already coming close to the “He didn’t gave any reason to not make it A+, why the fuck is this dude fucking up our Metacritic-score??!! What’s his problem!!”-territories we entered with last year’s reviews.
KnurkQuote Reply
You miss the point. I don’t think people mind the A- review, there just should be *something* in there to indicate what was not good. A proper review should mirror the grade. That is just basic writing 101.
LarsQuote Reply
Lol. Wait a minute.
Maybe Ned warged into Baelish at the last second or something, because there must be a reason why Littlefinger would do something as stupid as that of his own accord. Surely.
King JoffreyQuote Reply
Lars,
I saw the point, but my point is that we just have to accept that there are a lot of hack-writers on the internet giving ‘official’ reviews. We’ll be getting a lot of these reviews where the reviewer’s grade doesn’t correspond with the grade we extract from the review itself, I remember the endless debate over the Mo Ryan reviews last year and why she didn’t gave it a higher grade. Most reviews are just not worth the fuss, so is this one. I also want to say that the reactions have been pretty mild and nobody’s making any drama, I just thought it was fun to remember how batshit crazy some people got last year.
KnurkQuote Reply
Blaat,
I was thinking the same thing…
Littlefinger likes to jest and hint at things to get responses and keep himself entertained. Maybe he was commenting on the incest “rumors” Stannis is spreading and he got a little too playful for his own good and Cersei felt the need to remind him of his position.
I have a hard time believing that D&D would have Littlefinger saying something outright to taunt Cersei. I would be surprised and a bit diappointed if it turns out that way…..
darquemodeQuote Reply
Tom Hilton,
I don’t think she will bother, she read all of the books afterwards and trashed the entire series. She probably doesn’t need to say anymore on the subject. Then again she could review season 2 now that it’s in the spotlight and be a bitch for bitch’s sake.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
niiiice *_*
Thiago SlashQuote Reply
I’m surprised they haven’t sent screeners to you or have they? They did last year.
dizzy_34Quote Reply
I just got them today. Although I don’t think I’m going to watch. I really liked the anticipation of a new episode each week that I experienced at the end of last season.
Winter Is ComingQuote Reply
Joshua Taylor,
Tom Hilton,
lol I hope she does, she’s hilarious (I’m one of those ASoIaF fans who liked the piece she did on the books).
DeeQuote Reply
Joshua Taylor,
Sorry, I should have added the /sarcasm tag.
Tom HiltonQuote Reply
Winter Is Coming,
holy crap, how can you manage? Maybe just burn them or else you’ll give in one of these days!
KnurkQuote Reply
That’s more will power than I have for sure. You get an HD TV yet? This series deserves to be watched in HD (unlike the Eagles).
dizzy_34Quote Reply
The balls on them to give Game Of Thrones a minus, that critic should be introduced to Mord.
The KingslayerQuote Reply
I applaud you, sir!
LexQuote Reply
I’d at least watch the first episode and give a report. The reason they send those out is to generate buzz. They sent them out because they want to generate publicity either in the form of reviews or hype. If you ignore them, they probably won’t send you any marketing material next year.
mikeintexasQuote Reply
mikeintexas,
Agreed. I’d at least offer the goods to one of the other admins; some feedback from the site staff could prove very interesting.
And useful, considering we’re all more inclined to take your opinions to heart than some randomers on the net.
King JoffreyQuote Reply
Why would anyone read about what happens in the episodes (even if you know the story)? That my friends, is a spoiler to far – stop reading, enjoy the show!
RossinnyQuote Reply
I disagree. To say nothing but good things and then give something a 90/100 seems fair to me for the simple reason that I consider a lot of things to be “great” but very few things to be “masterpieces.” An A- doesn’t have to mean the reviewer saw something that “wasn’t good.” It could just mean everything was good, or great even, but in his opinion, wasn’t a revelation. And sometimes the reasons why it couldn’t take that final step to perfection for a person are hard to put into words. I’d not be shocked to see an A- in a review that said a lot of good things. I’d expect an A+ in a review that did nothing but gushed about it. It’s a subtle distinction.
As an example of what I mean, film critic Roger Ebert will often give movies 3.5/4 stars and then only seem to focus on why a person should see that movie. You get the sense that it’s something he really enjoyed…and maybe the thought is, you know, this is really awesome and what little problems there are seem overshadowed by what’s good, so nitpicking isn’t really worth it.
ZackQuote Reply
Dee,
If by hilarious, do you mean pathetically hilarious at how angry she was with the books and couldn’t even be objective about it? That kind of hilarious? Or do you think she was being tongue in cheek?
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
A- is fair enough. It’s never going to be as good as The Wire because of the ‘style’ they’ve chosen to portray the series in. I got excited before season 1 because I they said that The Wire was one of the shows they drew from and to me the books are sort of like a Medieval/Fantasy The Wire.
They could have done it, but I don’t know if it would have been as popular.
Jordan HealeyQuote Reply
I’m not sure i like the direction of ep 1, based on what that youtube guy had to say. Most of the ep sounds fine, really good acually, but a couple of points sounds incredibly dissapointing and not just to book purists.
-Littlefinger actually tells Cersei he knows the truth about the incest and goes as far as threatening her with ‘knowledge is power’, and then Cersei almost has the goldcloacks (or redcloacks) kill baelish but she lets it go at the end. I don’t know who the hell wrote that but i could have 10,000 ways to give Aiden Gillen more screentime than to completely massacre his character as he’s written in the books.
-He also said that instead of killing just Bara, they make a show of killing a massive ammount of black hair children. I’m not sure if they make it clear these are bastards, but the youtube guy made it sound like they go randonly killing black hair children in the streets. He called it ‘moses like’. This again sounds like a serious deviation. Not as bothersome as the LF one, but still pretty crap.
I just hope david and dan don’t get the ‘i want to build my own legacy’ disease and start changing stuff that doesn’t need to be changed just because they feel like making their mark. They had plenty of great non-book scenes last season that weren’t out of character, no reason to fuck that up now.
charlesQuote Reply
charles,
I guess they are trying to humanize Littlefinger? I will wait to see it for myself before buying into “You Tube Guy” sez so camp because they are always paragons of reliability aren’t they?
Yeah it’s hearing news like this and posts like these ie: “completely massacre the character” that is making me seriously consider waiting until the season is over before I comment on this site again. I respect everyone’s opinion on here , but sometimes the negativity really hits hard and ends up effecting how you see the series each week.
I will probably post anyways but I am not looking forward to the reactions of the “changes”. If they are done well I will support them just as I will admonish them if they are not. Ido feel real sorry for the Westeros.Org types though. They are going to be calling bloody murder at the slightest deviation.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
Joshua Taylor,
slightest deviation? Sounds much more than that to me. Be honest with yourself, would the character in question EVER do what it’s said he’s doing? If you want to join the school of “we get what we get and we should shut up and be thankfull’ be my guest, but it isn’t something i’m interested in subscribing to.
CharlesQuote Reply
Charles,
Oh no I am not like that at all. If I don’t like something I will say it. Granted I find I have a greater tolerance for adaptation than most people I know if the artistry and formal structure is there to back it up, but deviations like that don’t really bother me. That said I am not above being unpleasantly surprised and repulsed if something goes off the rails completely. Everyone has their limits. I just am not going to let “Youtube guy’s” report of the series effect my judgement of the show itself until I see the final product.
As for slightest deviation I was more inferring to Westeros.Org type posters and how the skin colour of Sallador Saan sends them into hysterics or how they are lamenting the look of Stannis in the series. Regarding Littlefinger even if that were the case I don’t see how it destroys his character, if anything it show’s him slipping up, proving that he is human and not the perfect schemer. He’s cocky after bringing down Ned Stark and he tried to play a game to get one man upmanship on Cersei, that nearly backfires if the report is accurate.
It also gives him more motivation to strike a deal with Highgarden later on in the season to win back her favour. Who knows he could be pulling a double feint by attempting to leverage the incest knowledge with Cersei which somehow makes him the best candidate to go to the Tyrells since the Queen believes him to be acting contrite ie: “You better get me what I want Lord Baelish or…”
My point is we have to see how it plays out.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
I dunno – Littlefinger brazenly laying out what he has on Cersei does seem anti-littlefinger.. However, the constant appeal of the character is not the mystery of his motivation which seemed pretty obvious – at least to me – in the books – albeit implicitly. The show spells it out in THAT scene in season 1: Ros: What do you want, my lord? Littlefinger: Oh, everything, my dear; everything there is. In my opinion, the devil is in the how and not the why – that is what makes him compelling. I always thought that setting off the Starks against the Lannisters was a deliberate attempt at weakening the realm – for what?? Invasion?. Feel free to dismiss.
JamesQuote Reply
I strongly disagree. They could have done what? What “style” do you think would have made the series better?
I don’t know if making the series “The Wire Style” (whatever that means, I’d like you to explain further, if possible) would have made it less popular, but I’m pretty sure it would have made it worse ;)
Pau SorianoQuote Reply
Winter Is Coming,
I agree wit Winter. Don’t agree with the people who say you have to watch it to create a buzz. You and your team have created enough with all the build up so far.
I’m quitting wicnet till they air the final episode. I have been spoiled enough with all the post above.
Everyone enjoy the new season. It promises to be a thriling ride. 9 days to countdown!!
Dont forget:
Always support the bottem!!!
kindly manQuote Reply
Pau Soriano,
Sure I’ll try, I won’t try to write for two hours about it though (and I could).
I suppose what I mean is it could have been A LOT deeper than it is.
I suppose this is largely due to the fact that the budget they were given best suits a ten episode series. They’re sort of focusing on it being a ‘blockbuster’ show like True Blood with lots of shock, gratituous nudity and violence/gore and that’s fair enough because then it will be more popular.
It would have been nice to get some more depth and some more themes from the literature that were in my opinion, paramount to the entire series, and it’s a shame some of these things are lost in translation.
I’ll use the example of the thing that Ran of Westeros dubbed as the ‘tragic romanticism’ of the series, where several of the older characters are always reminiscing about how things used to be better in the past (or were they?), the only person that does this in the show is Robert, and it’s a very meagre attempt in my opinion (perhaps it’s intended to be almost comical?).
It’s a shame that they decided to axe the very prominent connection to the past in the show because that’s one of the best things about the books, it’s like the real story happened 15 years ago.
And yes that relates to The Wire because in The Wire, you have several characters for example – Bunny Colvin, Wee Bey, Prop Joe, Bodie referring to this fact every now and again.
If you read the thread where everyone was discussing what TV shows people should watch before the series aired, one of the most common shows referred to was The Wire because everyone who’d seen it and read the books agreed that the books were like a medieval The Wire and could relate the two, because the Wire is kind of live a TV novel, and the books were written by George who’d worked in TV and worked some of that structure into his chapters.
However after seeing Game of Thrones Season 1, it feels nothing like The Wire.
I think that’s a bad thing, because The Wire is the best show in the history of television.
I’m not saying I don’t like the show, I’m pleased that it’s a good adaption of the series, but I still think it could have been better.
Jordan HealeyQuote Reply
Jordan,
Thanks for trying to explain :)
I will try myself now (in my poor english). Ok, I also love The Wire, and I was familiar to what Ran refered as Tragic Romanticism. I still disagree, nevertheless
I think if they tried to convey that tragic romanticism into the series, they would have failed. Not once, but twice; the would not have been able to convey that feeling, because that is a feeling that, how you say it, “belongs” to the books. It can’t be conveyed in a series like this. And they would have ruined the show altoguether.
Is like I was saying in another thread, the figure of Jojen. That Shakespearean-like figure will not work in the series, it belongs to the books. And I really hope they don’t try to adapt it. I hope they leave Jojen out. And that also gives the followers of the books a reason to mmm “feel proud”? about reading them.
Finally, yes, GoT is not like The Wire, but I still don’t get the comparison. It doesn’t have to be like the Wire, and not being like the Wire doesn’t make it worse, per-se. What people referred to in this or that thread is of no consequence altoguether. They are oversimplifications to reach a given target. Most like “The Sopranos in Middle-Earth”.
Also, you say:
“And yes that relates to The Wire because in The Wire, you have several characters referring to this fact every now and again.”
the fact being, I think, that
“they are always reminiscing about how things used to be better in the past (or were they?)”
That theme is older than humankind, and I don’t think that defines neither ASOIAF or The Wire, so I still can’t see the connection there. But that is just my opinion :)
I do aknowledge what you said at the beginning though, that “It would have been nice to get some more depth”, we could agree, nothing is perfect, but I don’t think that they are “sort of focusing on it being a ‘blockbuster’ show like True Blood with lots of shock, gratituous nudity and violence/gore”.
In that, I couldn’t disagree more…Game of Thrones is nothing like True Blood ;)
Pau SorianoQuote Reply
The 22 min “You Win or You Die” featurette is up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dku_Uya8Ygc
James WuQuote Reply
off topic – GoT is losing current round of Hulu’s best in show:
http://www.hulu.com/bestinshow
ClobQuote Reply
other review: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304724404577297420237664392.html
Restore The DayQuote Reply
Restore The Day,
I wouldn’t put much stock in this review either. She gave season 1 a 40. Yes, that’s right! A 40/100, as in 40%. And she gave “Camelot” a 70 and “The Walking Dead” a 100. Need I say more to dispute her credibility?
And I think fans have every right to be disappointed in an A- or 90. I want 100s accross the board. I have exceedingly high expectations for this show. I feel it has “best ever” potential (even surpassing BB, “The Wire”, etc). The story is as complex as “The Wire”, yet more exciting. If we are hoping for this show to be a masterpiece, why are we unrealistic for demanding the critics recognize it as such?
GoTTranscendsFantasyQuote Reply
GoTTranscendsFantasy,
Not even The Wire of which I put on a saintly pedestal at every opportunity was given an ‘A’ by critics in the first season. Most of the reviews dismissed it as an HBO version of a procedural. Plus the critic isn’t even a fan of the series, he said so himself. If your looking for A’s across the board when your dealing with a popular yet realistic ‘fantasy’ series you are not going to have the traditional media elite throw more down to earth series like Mad Men, Downton Abbey, Breaking Bad, Homeland etc under a bus so easily.
Your only building false expectations for the series with such hyperbole. There are rare moments when critics give a TV series As across the board.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
I wasn’t talking about the first season. I was referring to people being putoff by a season 2 review. There have only been 2 reviews so it’s way too early to tell the critical reception. All I’m saying is, based on a superb Season 1, the fact that the story only improves from here, and the expecation that the writers and directors will improve as the show goes on, I don’t see anything wrong with setting the bar extremely high for this season and those to follow.
Season 4 of “The Wire” received a 98 metascore rating. Season 4 of BB got a 96. That’s what I mean by “A’s accross the board”. Of course this is rare but that’s the point.
Btw, Homeland is good but I consider it a tad overrated. It’s funny that you say a show never gets raved about in its first season. “Homeland” may be the only show that actually did. And, while it’s good, it is not on the same level of GoT, BB, or The Wire.
Have you ever tried “Boss”? It started out slow and overly cryptic but ended up being fascinating in the end. One of the best premiere seasons in my book. Up there with GoT.
GoTTranscendsFantasyQuote Reply
I don’t put stock in reviews for my own opinion, I just relay the info and am glad that the press is good so far (and that review is pretty stellar at first read). But au contraire the fact that she gave it a 40 last year (where? i can’t see any grade in there) makes it even more relevant news: a quite negative reviewer of the first half of S1 completely changed her tune after seeing the rest of S1 and a few episodes of S2? That’s amazing!
Restore The DayQuote Reply
Restore The Day,
You all take those critics and reviews far too serious… metacritic made a 90 out of the WSJ review.
No matter what… i’ll build up my own opinion.
MrDonnerfaustQuote Reply
MrDonnerfaust,
Not sure I’m seeing your point about metacritic? 90 this year, 40 last year, it’s all clear now.
I don’t think I’m serious about them, just eagerly curious. True, I wouldn’t really need to be, and excited enough about S2 as it is. But again, for you to be coming here and reading the 120th comment on this page, I suppose you’re curious too?
Restore The DayQuote Reply