Episode 12 – The Night Lands – New Viewer Recap
By Winter Is Coming on in Recap.

Our newbie recapper, We Do Not Sow, finally got to see more of the house that he adopted as his moniker. He gives his reactions to this and the rest of episode 12, after the break.

Spoiler note: The discussion in this post is for non-book readers ONLY (book fans can discuss the show here). We ask all the series veterans to refrain from posting spoilers in the comments here, veiled or otherwise. This show is best viewed without knowing all the surprises beforehand, so please be respectful of your fellow fans. Thank you!

We Do Not Sow: I’ve been waiting for a while to see the Iron Islands and I finally got a peek of them tonight. So, I guess we will start there with Theon , is it me or is this guy just horny all the time? After last weeks episode and this week when Theon was talking to his “woman friend” (we will keep it PG-13 tonight) on the ship, I could almost guarantee there wasn’t going to be the welcome party that he was expecting. I didn’t think that he would feel up his sister on the way to the castle though, if you’rr counting at home I believe that’s the 3rd incest case in 12 episodes, ewww. We finally meet Balon Greyjoy tonight, he wasn’t really what I had imagined, and I thought he would welcome Theon a little bit but like Balon said he hasn’t seen his son longer than when Theon was growing up on the Iron Islands. Yara seems like a cool character, another strong female role, I guess we will see more of her coming up and I am assuming Theon will be trying to win the honor of his father over Yara. We will see if Theon continues to pursue being the King of the Iron Islands or will just follow Robb and the Starks.

On the road to the North, Arya finds out Gendry knows her secret and every one traveling to the Wall in the group knows the queen is looking for Gendry. There were some clever lines and laughter in these scenes tonight with Arya’s quick wit. It is good to see that Arya isn’t alone trying to get back home. I would guess that the two of them might even become travel companions by themselves at some point this season. With both of them wanted by the queen I hope they can both make it far enough to the north or to Winterfell. I can imagine them both being strong and likable characters down the line.

No matter which family you root for, or which characters are your favorites, Tyrion is great. He speaks his mind and doesn’t care who he offends or what the outcome is. He is also very smart and can probably play the “game” in King’s Landing better than anyone else. I really enjoy Tyrion’s spats no matter who it is with, and happy for Bronn getting a promotion to the commander.

Another cast member I always love seeing is Ghost, we had a Ghost sighting tonight and he’s getting pretty big now. The dire wolves look great so far this season. The Night’s Watch exploration team is still staying at Craster’s Keep. The intrigue of marrying his daughters and having no sons was really driving me nuts and creeping me out all at the same time. After the shadow figure picked up the baby from the ground I could only assume that maybe it was one of the undead characters from the first scene from season one. Maybe Caster is sacrificing his sons to the undead army that might be growing beyond the Wall. Who knows? Well I guess most of you do know, but for new viewers like me I guess we will have to wait and see.

Stannis, Davos and Melisandre are still very interesting and now have made allies with a band of pirates but I still am unsure about where their place is in all of this. I know Stannis still wants more men before he goes to battle with his younger brother Renly and challenge him for the right to the Iron Throne but either brother I think will still fall short if trying to advance on King’s Landing.

Last season I was so excited every time a scene started in the dessert knowing it was a Daenerys and Drogo scene. After the season finale, I was upset they had killed off Drogo but really excited to see the dragons, I figured 3 dragons were better than Drogo. So far the first two episodes nothing has really happened except being deserted with nothing to eat and drink. The previews for next weeks episode looks like we will get to more action but I am not sure if we will see any across the Narrow Sea for a while.

So new viewers like myself, what haven’t you expected so far this season? And have you found yourself liking a character you didn’t last season? New viewers make yourself heard on the comment boards, if you are having any problems following the new characters, the HBO new season 2 viewers guide is my new best friend.


62 Comments

  1. HERP-DERP
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 9:45 am | Permalink

    first for the first time in my life!

  2. Nikst
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:00 am | Permalink

    Just like last week I really enjoyed this episode. Loved the banter between Arya and Gendry. Great to see Yoren stick up for Arya and the others of his group. Awesome to see Ghost, incredibly well done if it was all CGI, allot better then last weeks Grey Wind. Grey Wind was kind of on the edge, between good (looking real) and CGI(that you can see its computer made). Ghost on the other hand was flawless.

    Tyrion is quickly becoming my favorite character, even though he is part of the most wile and disgusting family in Westeros. Just when I was thinking how predictable Cersei is when you give her a order on a piece of paper Tyrion says “You have perfected the art of tearing up papers”.
    And later when he is talking to Janos Slynt and they exchange: “I will not have my honor questioned by an imp!” “I’m not questioning your honor, lord Janos. I’m denying its existence.” I missed the next few seconds of dialogue because I was laughing so hard. Theres never a dull or boring moment with Tyrion that is for sure =) No its official now, Tyrion is my favorite character on this show.
    Granted there’s never a dull moment on this show period.

    And the cliffhanger at the end, just painful that we have to wait until next week to see what happened to Snow!

    On another note, one that I thought of last week and even before the second season started. The opening credits show the house-sigils in every location, to show who is where and who rules there. Shouldnt the stag in Kings Landing be replaced with a lion? The Baratheons are gone and the Lannisters are in charge? Just a thought.

  3. Batres
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:02 am | Permalink

    I noticed something last nite (maybe a little late but…), Dinklage is the first name that shows up in the beginning credits… That gives me a heads up that he’s the main character of the series… hmmm… i wouldn’t imagine that…

    Gilly… who is she and what adventures will come that girl and the Night’s Watch? Can’t wait to see!

    Can anyone refresh my memory and remind me why Greyjoy have lived with the Starks for so many years, specially since his father fought againts them? Don’t seem to recall that part on S-1.

    Last but but not least, my wife thought it was too much sex in yesterday’s episode… I didn’t mind, though… :P

  4. Blet
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:06 am | Permalink

    Nikst:
    The opening credits show the house-sigils in every location, to show who is where and who rules there. Shouldnt the stag in Kings Landing be replaced with a lion? The Baratheons are gone and the Lannisters are in charge? Just a thought.

    He’s still officially King Joffrey Baratheon (first of his name yadda yadda) even if we all know he’s got as much Baratheon in him as Hot Pie does.

  5. The Dragonslayer
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:07 am | Permalink

    A well written review. I appreciate that you’re writing this as a new viewer also, and not already knowing the story. This duality in the reviews is great and as someone reading the books as I watch the series, it is greatly appreciated. I am a writer myself, of science-fiction and fantasy alike, and the story, both in the books and the series, is remarkably well done.

    You have my thanks for a great review! I’m rooting for Arya Stark and her growing skill set right now, and my next favorite character would be Jon Snow, both fantastic reads in the series and remarkably well played by their respective actors in the series.

    Props to everyone working on this series. Your work is fantastic!

  6. Blet
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:10 am | Permalink

    Batres:
    Can anyone refresh my memory and remind me why Greyjoy have lived with the Starks for so many years, specially since his father fought againts them? Don’t seem to recall that part on S-1.

    He was taken as a ward (hostage) by Ned Stark after Balon Greyjoy’s failed rebellion. In history the losing side of a war often had to give up noble hostages to the winner (french had to do it in the hundred years war). The thinking being you’re less likely to start a fight if they can just kill your kids. Theon had a chat with Tyrion about it in season 1.

  7. Suzaku
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:12 am | Permalink

    Nikst: The opening credits show the house-sigils in every location, to show who is where and who rules there. Shouldnt the stag in Kings Landing be replaced with a lion? The Baratheons are gone and the Lannisters are in charge? Just a thought.

    Joffrey is a Baratheon in name, and that’s technically his sole claim to the throne.

    Joffrey’s sigil is a stag and lion combatant, to represent both families. I doubt it’ll be mentioned in the show, but in the book it’s a bit controversial that his sigil elevates the Lannister lion to the same level as the Baratheon stag.

  8. Dogmayor
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:14 am | Permalink

    Batres,

    Theon was ward of the Starks to ensure that his father would not rebel again.

  9. Shawn
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:15 am | Permalink

    Nikst,

    Nikst,

    The Stag sigil remains because even though we as viewers know that Joffrey is the son of incestuous parents, his father is robert, a baratheon

  10. Nikst
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:15 am | Permalink

    Blet,

    Point. I didnt think about that. Although the opening credits is directed toward us so they can drop the bs in front of us =P. But I see what your saying.

  11. Dogmayor
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:17 am | Permalink

    I’d just like to point out in your review, the creature from the opening scene in season one that killed the night’s watchmen was not a wight (the zombies), it was a white walker.

  12. Maxime
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:17 am | Permalink

    Nikst,

    Shouldnt the stag in Kings Landing be replaced with a lion? The Baratheons are gone and the Lannisters are in charge?

    King Joff is a Barratheon!!! ;0) I know we know different!

  13. Earl C
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:17 am | Permalink

    Batres:
    Can anyone refresh my memory and remind me why Greyjoy have lived with the Starks for so many years, specially since his father fought againts them? Don’t seem to recall that part on S-1.

    Ned Stark helped put down the Greyjoy rebellion. As his last surviving son, Theon was taken as a ward/captive to ensure his good behavior.

  14. Shelly
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:19 am | Permalink

    I personally found myself not liking this episode as much as the last one, which absolutely overwhelmed me. For my taste, there was to much of Theon and too little of Sansa + Robb + Catelyn + Dany. Not sure how I feel about the Greyjoys playing a bigger role now, Theon remains my least favourite character, although last season this didn’t really matter as he didn’t appear much. Well, I do not like him, yet I am interested in how this whole Starks-Greyjoy conflict is going to turn out.

    Arya and Gendry were awesome, can’t wait to see more of them! Tyrion was amazing as always, simply his face after Cersei held their mother’s death against him was … can’t come up with the right word to describe it, but all the awards better go to him this season.

    My only fear now is that there will be more episodes in which I won’t get to see more of the people I am really interested in as the cast keeps growing.

    Can’t wait for next week to see how everything evolves. Also, I am questioning my mental health for that, but for some reason I missed Joffrey. That’s not … normal, is it?

  15. Suzaku
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:19 am | Permalink

    Batres:
    I noticed something last nite (maybe a little late but…), Dinklage is the first name that shows up in the beginning credits… That gives me a heads up that he’s the main character of the series… hmmm… i wouldn’t imagine that…

    Not the main character. Dinklage just has top billing now that he’s got some awards under his belt and Sean Bean’s no longer part of the cast.

    To be perfectly clear, the series doesn’t really have any “main character.” Just about all of the POV characters in the books are given a fair share of screen time.

  16. Maxwell James
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:29 am | Permalink
  17. Nikst
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:34 am | Permalink

    I also suspected that the daughter-raper was giving away his male babies to the White walkers. I suspected it from last week after one of the nights watch soldiers said that everybody else in that area was gone and yet he was still there, so he must be doing something right. That got me thinking and that combined with the fact that there were no male children lead me to that conclusion. How else could he get the White walkers to leave him alone?

    And I thought it was a bit obvious that it was Joffrey who ordered the slaughter of the “bastards”. It was totally in his character to do such a thing and I assumed it was him from the start. Although I thought that Cersei was involved to some extent, but she apparently didn’t even know about it until it started happening.

  18. ixy
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 10:50 am | Permalink

    Batres,

    About a decade ago (#105, #201, #202), Theon Greyjoy’s father, Balon, declared himself King of the Iron Isles (#202) and initiated a rebellion against King Robert Baratheon and the realm (#104, #201). Robert called upon his loyal lords, including his friend Eddard (Ned) Stark, to quell the rebellion (#104). Together, they and their armies defeated Balon and, in the process, killed his two eldest sons (#202). As a penalty for rising up against the King, Robert ordered Theon to be made a ward of Ned Stark and taken back to Winterfell. So long as Balon played nice with the kingdom, no harm was to come to Theon (#107).

    Episode references in parens.

  19. Adam
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 11:38 am | Permalink

    Nikst,

    “And I thought it was a bit obvious that it was Joffrey who ordered the slaughter of the “bastards”. It was totally in his character to do such a thing and I assumed it was him from the start. Although I thought that Cersei was involved to some extent, but she apparently didn’t even know about it until it started happening.”

    Actually, in the books it’s suggested pretty firmly that it was Cersei’s doing. The way it was handled on the show is generally considered a departure from the books.

  20. sukeyna
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 12:06 pm | Permalink

    I thought this discussion was for non-book readers?

    I doubt it’ll be mentioned in the show, but in the book it’s a bit controversial that his sigil elevates the Lannister lion to the same level as the Baratheon stag.

    Actually, in the books it’s suggested pretty firmly that it was Cersei’s doing. The way it was handled on the show is generally considered a departure from the books.

  21. Hear Me Roar
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 12:19 pm | Permalink

    Adam,

    Yes, please do not confuse the points. Just series here … after episode one, it could be any of the two ordering it.

  22. Varamyr Fourskins
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 12:24 pm | Permalink

    Perhaps I’m nitpicking, but I thought Grey Wind looked much more realistic than Ghost. Maybe the actor’s interaction had something to do with it, but I wasn’t nearly as impressed as I was with the Jaime/Grey Wind scene in E1.

  23. Elaine
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 12:47 pm | Permalink

    I think Theon/Yara is the fourth case of incest in 12 episodes: don’t forget Viserys forcing Dany to undress in front of him and then fondling her!

    …I guess I am counting at home, lol. All the emphasis in the books on incest has always seemed strange to me, and the show has not downplayed it so far!

  24. Nikst
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 12:54 pm | Permalink

    Varamyr Fourskins,

    Opinions differ it seems. I thought the exact opposite. Ghost was really realistic while Grey Wind was like I said earlier, on the edge of being realistic/fake.

  25. Nymeria
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 1:35 pm | Permalink

    Correction: Theon’s would have been the 4th incest occurence, the previous three being: Jaime-Cersei, Dany-Vicerys and Craster and his daughters.

    My husband, who’s a new viewer, had a bit more to say this week, but it wasn’t very positive.
    He said nothing happened. He’ll still watch next week, but mostly based on last season because so far, he finds this season very slow and uneventful.
    He also found useless that they showed Daenerys waiting in the Red Waste, saying we won’t forget her if they skip one episode.
    Overall I think he wants to see more battle, he says everyone is carrying those great big swords but no one swings them.
    And even he, who likes the nude scenes, found the brothel scene useless. Well, he probably liked the peeping, but was bored by the Ros-Littlefinger exchange.

    And unfortunately he doesn’t understand why I’m so fond of Arya. Well, maybe he’ll change his mind soon. :)

  26. Steven Swanson
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 1:49 pm | Permalink

    Nymeria: Correction: Theon’s would have been the 4th incest occurence, the previous three being: Jaime-Cersei, Dany-Vicerys and Craster and his daughters.My husband, who’s a new viewer, had a bit more to say this week, but it wasn’t very positive.He said nothing happened. He’ll still watch next week, but mostly based on last season because so far, he finds this season very slow and uneventful.He also found useless that they showed Daenerys waiting in the Red Waste, saying we won’t forget her if they skip one episode.Overall I think he wants to see more battle, he says everyone is carrying those great big swords but no one swings them.And even he, who likes the nude scenes, found the brothel scene useless. Well, he probably liked the peeping, but was bored by the Ros-Littlefinger exchange.And unfortunately he doesn’t understand why I’m so fond of Arya. Well, maybe he’ll change his mind soon. :)

    This might just not be the show for him, sounds like he’s looking for an “action” series, whereas GOT is a character-focused drama that utilizes action in service to the story. I’ve seen other people who said “nothing happened” this episode, which kind of boggles my mind, but I suppose the ways the plot moved forward were fairly subtle.

  27. Batres
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 1:55 pm | Permalink

    He also found useless that they showed Daenerys waiting in the Red Waste, saying we won’t forget her if they skip one episode.

    +1

    Overall I think he wants to see more battle, he says everyone is carrying those great big swords but no one swings them..

    +1

  28. Steven Swanson
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 2:08 pm | Permalink

    Batres,

    Pretty sure the main reason they featured Dany was to show they’d lost her most trusted bodyguard, and thus things are getting even more hopeless. Plus it’s that scene that gave the episode its title, oddly enough.

    And there aren’t going to be battles every episode, there weren’t last season and there won’t be this season. Like last season, this one is probably going to ratchet up in intensity as it progresses.

  29. Ted Swedalla
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 2:59 pm | Permalink

    Batres,

    Theon was technically a prisoner with the Starks. He was being held by the Starks to make sure that the Greyjoys didn’t rebel anymore.
    He ended up being more of a ward, than a prisoner.

  30. lasadorian
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/carolpinchefsky/2012/04/06/3-subtle-changes-to-the-game-of-thrones-season-2-intro/

    Not sure if anyone has noticed this but it has bothered me since the debut. I prefer season 1′s opening music more than season 2′s…

    I miss the impact the drums bring. The new version sounds to soft.

  31. Maria
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 3:58 pm | Permalink

    Batres,

    Edited becauseoftheflawless explanation ahead

  32. We Do Not Sow
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    Nymeria,

    Thanks for the correction, so someone else besides me is counting. And i would assume the action will heat up quickly this season, I’m not sure how much more planning they can do before someone attacks

  33. Choukai
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 4:22 pm | Permalink

    Now that you’ve got me thinking of all the incest scenes – thanks for that by the way, there are actually a few more…
    Sweet Robin sucking on his mothers tit at 8 years old.
    Walder Frey explaining that his daughters honey is all his.

  34. SeVv
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 4:27 pm | Permalink

    Choukai,

    that was his wife

  35. Steven Swanson
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 4:33 pm | Permalink

    Choukai: Now that you’ve got me thinking of all the incest scenes – thanks for that by the way, there are actually a few more…Sweet Robin sucking on his mothers tit at 8 years old.Walder Frey explaining that his daughters honey is all his.

    Like was pointed out above, that’s not Frey’s daughter, though I can see how one might make that mistake.

    And Robin breastfeeding at a late age doesn’t qualify as incest, it’s not a sexual act but one that infantilizes him. Noble children breastfeeding until a late age isn’t unprecedented (ever see The Last Emperor?).

  36. Michaelmann
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 4:36 pm | Permalink

    lasadorian,

    I am not a 100% sure but for me it seems that the “season 2 intro” presented in that article is actually taken from the spead up leaked version of episode 2. The article also becomes less trustworthy by naming the episode “the knight lands”, which is a little bit off the actual title :D

  37. Stevieboy
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 4:44 pm | Permalink

    Watching Episode 2 just now in the UK.

    Have to say Gendry …. what a piece a casting genius!! Exactly as i imagined him

    And the first view of Pike … breathtaking!!

    Loving this season big time!!

  38. Ty
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 4:57 pm | Permalink

    Nikst,

    FWIW, I think all the wolves are ‘real’ but they are filmed separately and inserted into the scenes, albiet a little upscaled…

  39. Stevieboy
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 5:01 pm | Permalink

    forgot to add …

    DIREWOLVES …. wowzer much much better than the overgrown Huskeys from season one.

    Ghost looks awesome!

  40. Rutep
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 5:14 pm | Permalink

    ixy,

    About a decade ago (#105, #201, #202), Theon Greyjoy’s father, Balon, declared himself King of the Iron Isles (#202) and initiated a rebellion against King Robert Baratheon and the realm (#104, #201). Robert called upon his loyal lords, including his friend Eddard (Ned) Stark, to quell the rebellion (#104). Together, they and their armies defeated Balon and, in the process, killed his two eldest sons (#202). As a penalty for rising up against the King, Robert ordered Theon to be made a ward of Ned Stark and taken back to Winterfell. So long as Balon played nice with the kingdom, no harm was to come to Theon (#107).

    Episode references in parens.

    Nice, thanks for a detailed comment. Your work inspires me to expand upon it even further:

    #104-5:14
    Theon: Couln’t resist some northern ass? If you like redheads, ask for Ros.
    Tyrion: Come to see me off, Greyjoy? Kind of you. Your master doesn’t seem to like Lannisters.
    Theon: He’s not my master.
    Tyrion: No, of course not. What happened here? Where is Lady Stark? Why didn’t she receive me?
    Theon: She wasn’t feeling well.
    Tyrion: She’s not in Winterfell, is she? Where did she go?
    Theon: My Lady’s whereabouts–
    Tyrion: My Lady? Your loyalty to your captors is touching. Tell me, how do you think Balon Greyjoy would feel if he could see his only surviving son has turned lackey? I still remember seeing my father’s fleet burn in Lannisport. I believe your uncles were responsible?
    Theon: Must have been a pretty sight.
    Tyrion: Nothing prettier than watching sailors burn alive. Yes, a great victory for your people. Shame how it all turned out.
    Theon: We were outnumbered 10 to 1–
    Tyrion: A stupid rebellion then. I suppose your father realized that when your brothers died in battle. Now here you are, your enemy’s squire.
    Theon: Careful, Imp.
    Tyrion: I’ve offended you. Forgive me, it’s been a rough morning. Anyway, don’t despair. I’m a constant disappointment to my own father and I’ve learned to live with it. Your next tumble with Ros is on me. I’ll try not to wear her out.

    #104-32:36
    Jory: This is for the King, from Lord Stark. Should I leave it with–
    Jaime: Shhh. Listen. Do you hear them? How many do you think are in there with him? Huh? Guess.
    Jory: Three? Four.
    Jaime: He likes to do this when I’m on duty. He makes me listen as he insults my sister.
    Jory: Forgive me, My Lord–
    Jaime: Why do I have to forgive you? Have you wronged me?
    Jory: We’ve met before, you know.
    Jaime: Have we? Strange, I’ve forgotten.
    Jory: The siege of Pyke. We fought side by side one afternoon.
    Jaime: Ah. That’s where you got your scar?
    Jory: Aye.
    Jaime: Oh.
    Jory: One of the Greyjoys nearly took my eye.
    Jaime: Vicious sons of whores.
    Jory: They like their bloodshed.
    Jaime: They stopped liking it at the end. That was a proper battle. Do you remember Thoros of Myr charging through the breach?
    Jory: With his burning sword? I’ll remember that till the day I die.
    Jaime: I saw the youngest of the Greyjoy lads at Winterfell. It was like seeing a shark on a mountaintop.
    Jory: Theon? He’s a good lad.
    Jaime: I doubt it.
    Robert: I bet you smell of blackberry jam! Let me smell it. Come here.
    Jory: Can I leave this with you? The message from Lord Stark.
    Jaime: I don’t serve Lord Stark.

    #105-13:45
    Maester Luwin: Bran.
    Bran: The Iron Islands. Sigil: A Kraken. Words: We do not sow.
    Luwin: Lords?
    Bran: The Greyjoys.
    Theon: Famed for their skills at archery, navigation and lovemaking.
    Luwin: And failed rebellions.

    #105-17:10
    Theon: I’m a Greyjoy. We’ve been lords of the Iron Islands for 300 years. There’s not a family in Westeros that can look down on us, not even the Lannisters.
    Ros: And what about the Starks?
    Theon: I’ve been Lord Stark’s ward since I was eight years old.
    Ros: A ward? That’s a nice word for it. Your father rebelled against King Robert and if he does it again–
    Theon: My father fought for the freedom of his people. What did your father do? Fucked a cook and whelped a whore.
    Ros: You’re a very serious boy.
    Theon: I’m not a boy.
    Ros: Oh yes, you are. A serious boy with a serious cock.
    Theon: I don’t want to pay for it.
    Ros: Then get yourself a wife.

    #107-18:30
    Luwin: Theon Greyjoy! The lady is our guest.
    Theon: I thought she was our prisoner.
    Luwin: Are the two mutually exclusive in your experience?

    I won’t bother writing up the relevant scenes from series 2, since that is probably pretty fresh in everyone’s mind anyway.

  41. Ghost
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 6:06 pm | Permalink

    Blet,

    That’s a bit unfair… Hot Pie might have some Baratheon blood in him!

  42. I Know of Fear
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 8:59 pm | Permalink

    This was a truly creepy episode.

    I don’t think it was a white walker that took the baby: I think it was a giant. That makes for 2 confirmed “scary things” beyond the wall, and my jaw truly dropped when I saw that. Now I’m wondering about these other mythical beyond-the-wall creatures that Tyrion and Cersei have name dropped.

    Another eyebrow raising moment was when Gendry learned that Arya was a noble. He had known she was a girl but had no problem pissing in front of her as long as she was a commoner. Eww.

    The incest is in this show continues to make my skin crawl. This is the 4th instance and they keep getting creepier. At first Viserys simply stared at Dany, then Cersei had sex with her brother, and then a man was having children with his daughters and his granddaughters. And now we see Theon’s sister quite enjoying third base while purposely not revealing her identity. Will she continue to enjoy her brother’s company? Will Theon’s sex drive ever die down? Will the show find new ways increase the squick factor?

    I have a question my fellow new viewers about last season. I vaguely recall, sometime after Robert’s death, a scene with Cersei scolding a nude Knight Of Flowers for talking too much. Is my memory playing tricks on me or does anyone know what I’m talking about?

  43. Knurk
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 9:07 pm | Permalink

    I Know of Fear: I vaguely recall, sometime after Robert’s death, a scene with Cersei scolding a nude Knight Of Flowers for talking too much. Is my memory playing tricks on me or does anyone know what I’m talking about?

    I believe that was Lancel (Robert’s wine-pourer), definitely not the Knight of Flowers (though they’re both scrawny looking fellows).

  44. I Know of Fear
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 9:29 pm | Permalink

    Knurk,

    Lancel Lannister, who’s name Robert mocked? Wow, I hope there’s nothing going on there. That would be a 5th incest and rather odd betrayal of Jaime.

  45. Carey Tran
    Posted April 9, 2012 at 11:16 pm | Permalink

    I Know of Fear:
    Knurk,

    Lancel Lannister, who’s name Robert mocked? Wow, I hope there’s nothing going on there. That would be a 5th incest and rather odd betrayal of Jaime.

    I’m pretty sure that scene all but made clear that Cersei fucked Lancel to reward him for getting Robert drunk enough to be gored by the boar.

  46. Nikst
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 4:30 am | Permalink

    Carey Tran,

    Yes, it was pretty clear that they had or at least were going to have sex together.

  47. Nagga's Kin
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 6:56 am | Permalink

    I Know of Fear:
    Knurk,

    Lancel Lannister, who’s name Robert mocked? Wow, I hope there’s nothing going on there. That would be a 5th incest and rather odd betrayal of Jaime.

    Let me try to explain why incest keeps recurring in GoT. The following does not mean I condone it or that anyone else should.

    We just learned that Cersei’s mother died while giving birth to Tyrian. To this day, she quite irrationally blames him for that because in Westeros, dwarves are considered undesirables.

    Also, recall the added scene featuring Robert and Cersei in season one – I forget which episode – in which they discuss what’s holding the realm together. After they both laugh out loud when Robert suggests it is their marriage, Cersei recounts that the two of them once had a son together, a long time ago. He died either during or shortly after childbirth and, Cersei felt that was the true reason why their marriage never succeeded beyond the political level.

    The unresolved trauma of those two traumatic events evidently prompted Cersei to reach the perverse conclusion that she should stick with men from her own family – especially given that Jaime actually loves her. For most of her life, she’s paranoid about anyone finding out, mostly because her children are her ticket to the throne.

    However, she freely admits to her incest when Ned Stark confronts her because his fate is by then already all but sealed. She justifies her actions as “keeping the bloodline clean”, something the Targaryens had done for centuries – which explains why Viserys thought nothing of Danerys’ nudity in Pentos.

    As for Cersei’s implied incest with cousin Lancel, I assume she simply has needs that Jaime cannot address because he’s been taken prisoner. As I explained above, only a relative will do for her.

    Craster’s incest appears equally twisted, especially given that he appears to enjoy it. Apparently, he needs a lot of male babies to sacrifice to whatever has depopulated all the villages around his keep. It’s the only way to keep his “family” safe.

    By contrast, Yara only lets Theon get rather frisky to take him down a peg later on. It’s meant to show her supreme confidence in manipulating the men around her, with the exception of her father Balon. There’s no reason to believe there’s anything more to it than that.

    Ergo, in each case the incest stems directly from the characters’ warped perception of reality.

    Btw, all of the established faiths in Westeros (the old gods, the Seven and the Drowned God) strictly forbid the practice, as does the new religion Melisandre is adding to the mix. It’s just that the highborn tend to disregard laws they find inconvenient.

  48. Kael of the Lake
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 7:52 am | Permalink

    I Know of Fear:
    I don’t think it was a white walker that took the baby: I think it was a giant.

    It was definitely a white walker since his eyes emitted this eerie blue glow. If you compare the size of the baby (when he hold it) with his, he was somewhat taller than Craster (who’s not considered to be tall). I expect giants to be at least thrice a man’s height. Furthermore, Craster informed the commander that giants were converging further north to be a part of the King-beyond-the-wall army.
    Also, a child taken by giants does not make much sense (for the story so far, right?) but taken by White Walkers raises some questions and weaves a nice mystery, doesn’t it?

  49. Nikst
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 9:00 am | Permalink

    Kael of the Lake,

    Agreed, definitely a Whitewalker. Compare him to the Whitewalkers in the pilot and youll see that they are exactly the same.

  50. Rutep
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 9:53 am | Permalink

    Not to mention the sounds they make

  51. Randy
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 10:14 am | Permalink

    Batres,

    I agree with your wife, I thought there was too much sex also

  52. DC
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 11:34 am | Permalink

    One thing I noticed and liked was that the opener showed all of the locations that they were going to in the episode. It wasn’t a cookie cutter beginning like last season. They included Pyke as one of the new locations in the mechanical opener.

  53. I Know of Fear
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 1:40 pm | Permalink

    Kael of the Lake,

    Nagga’s Kin,

    You guys sure are helpful when it comes to clearing up things that the show doesn’t elablorate on. But it kinda takes the fun out of speculating on what’s happening when people who’ve read the books have all the answers already. Considering how little new viewers know about white walkers it doesn’t make sense that they would want babies any more than giants would. And considering Yara hasn’t been shown to manipulate anybody else so it seemed perfectly possible that her situation with Theon could move in other directions. But now at least now we know that my wild guesses were completely wrong.

  54. I Know of Fear
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 1:45 pm | Permalink

    DC: One thing I noticed and liked was that the opener showed all of the locations that they were going to in the episode. It wasn’t a cookie cutter beginning like last season. They included Pyke as one of the new locations in the mechanical opener.

    I thought they did the same last season, including places like Pentos in the first episode and the Eyrie when episodes took place there.

  55. No Raven For You!
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    It was telling (to me, after watching the episode) that Pyke sort of, uhm, “thrust” up from the bottom of the screen – no little gears twirling, no pieces sliding into place, just a series of sorta phallic looking shapes linked by little bridges.

    re: Greyjoys… This is like an entire culture of maniacs! Saltwives? Iron-price? Whatever execution method they have that involves staking the victim by all fours to the beach at low tide? And they called Stannis a “lobster”! Balon just comes across as such a malevolent, inflexible, antagonistic psychopath. If anything, Cat underestimated what a dick this guy is in her talk with Robb.

  56. Grace
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 4:51 pm | Permalink

    Is anyone else here sad that they killed off rakharo??? I want some more dothraki action :(

  57. Nagga's Kin
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 4:59 pm | Permalink

    I Know of Fear:
    Kael of the Lake,

    Nagga’s Kin,

    You guys sure are helpful when it comes to clearing up things that the show doesn’t elablorate on. But it kinda takes the fun out of speculating on what’s happening when people who’ve read the books have all the answers already. Considering how little new viewers know about white walkers it doesn’t make sense that they would want babies any more than giants would.

    [...]

    And considering Yara hasn’t been shown to manipulate anybody else so it seemed perfectly possible that her situation with Theon could move in other directions.

    a) I actually haven’t read the books, either. My analysis was based on what HBO has already shown.

    b) In particular, I don’t know exactly who/what took the male baby Craster abandoned in the woods. I just interpreted the sound effects in the last scene of ep12, the obvious absence of boys at the keep and Mormont’s info regarding the abandoned villages that way.

    c) I’d fully expect Yara to use her feminine whiles on other men if and when that’s useful to her. Based on the preview trailer for ep 13, her relationship with Theon will be tempestuous but not incestuous.

  58. lasadorian
    Posted April 10, 2012 at 10:26 pm | Permalink

    Michaelmann,

    fact of the matter is the song is different for sure. just listened to both on hbo go. I still prefer the louder drum arrangement than the newer version,

  59. Hear Me Roar
    Posted April 11, 2012 at 3:41 am | Permalink

    Morentin1326, I deleted your post. This has no place in the discussion for new viewers. Be careful where you post your comments.

  60. Kael of the Lake
    Posted April 11, 2012 at 4:07 am | Permalink

    I Know of Fear,

    I’m sorry you felt that way but truly, I haven’t spoil anything for you, I’ve just put you in the most logical direction based on what we’ve seen. As Rutep and Nagga’s Kin said after my post, there are also the sounds the White Walkers do (nothing to do with the books, obviously).
    Tbh, I’ve red most of the books and I can’t tell if the following sentence is a spoiler for you, but neither I can recall anything else about the White Walkers. We do know more or less the same things. See, in that matter I couldn’t really spoil anything and as a guess, it wasn’t at all wild. It’s just so intriguing to think that the WW need/use male babies for anything. There should be a good story behind it and I’m as eager to see it as anybody else, reader or not.

    Try not to feel disadvantaged compared to those who’ve red the books. There are spoilers out there and you’ll be spoiled at some point. But any info you might get is absolutely based on plot-twists (like Ned’s ill fate) – which is bad but not disastrous. All the good mysteries that unfold in the books are not revealed nor explained yet. Martin hides them pretty well. So in that matter, either a reader or not, one will have to wait for the last season of HBO to find out, among the rest of the viewers.

  61. Andy
    Posted April 11, 2012 at 4:51 am | Permalink

    DC,

    You weren’t paying attention last season, where they did the same, the places featured on the map change according to where they go in the episode…

  62. Rossinny
    Posted April 13, 2012 at 9:43 am | Permalink

    Randy,

    Complaining about too much sex with a name like that?! :-)


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