“Those are brave men knocking at our door. Let’s go kill them.” -Tyrion Lannister
Stannis Baratheon’s fleet arrives at King’s Landing, and the Battle of the Blackwater begins.
Ours is the Fury: It’s finally here, the major onscreen battle everyone’s been waiting for. What are you looking forward to most?
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231 Comments
Its going to be epic!!!!!!!!!!!!
/First?
rib246Quote Reply
SanSan scene !!!!
Littlebird27Quote Reply
All three are epic :P
Check out other two:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WYMZUuNruA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwgOzLG5IGo
DanQuote Reply
Waiting for the House of the Undying, of course! :P
Lorenzo_RQuote Reply
Dan,
Yeah we already have an entire post dedicated to those two. :P
http://winteriscoming.net/2012/05/hbo-releases-two-new-blackwater-promos-and-fan-poster/
Ours is the FuryQuote Reply
Pod to the rescue!!!!!
serumQuote Reply
Interested to see how they handle Tyrion’s role on the battlefield.
Please no cliffhanger, is he dead or alive….and will he have a nose? I suspect it may end during a point of view camera shot and he’ll go down…. fade to black… maybe next episode someone mentions he’s clinging to life or we’ll see him all bandaged up in bed.
rib246Quote Reply
Ours is the Fury,
Ow, right. But anyway, i’m watching them over and over again :D So awesome! And poor Stannis…
DanQuote Reply
Let’s see how the book purists complain about this one considering it’s written by Martin himself, lol .
Claudiu GherganuQuote Reply
rib246,
It already says in the episode guide that tyrion “awakens to a changed situation” in episode 10
serumQuote Reply
Can’t wait.
I really hope the debut Rains of Castemere – Cercei can introduce the story behind it to Sansa while staying at the hall while the battle is going on, and then zoom on each character, with no sound but the song.
It fits perfectly.. beautifully dramatic and haunting – even more epic than LoTR!
oh, and about Tyrion- I think a big ugly scar will be fine. I think it costs a lot of CGI to remove a nose (or annoying to somehow make it disappear). If rorge had a nose, tyrion should have too..
Tomer SegalQuote Reply
OK George! Let’s see what you’ve got!
Claudiu Gherganu,
hehe
raraQuote Reply
[laughs] Any detractors, if there are any left, will only have logistics to blame.
WompWompQuote Reply
oh shut up d&d brownnoser, stop provoking people
Mean25Quote Reply
I am worried by the speculation – kidding, I hope – by some people here that either Bronn or Pod will replace Ser Meryn (or was it Ser Mandan) as the assassin.
Last week’s scenes of Bronn being more than usually disrespectful and Pod exchanging looks with Cersei did not reassure me.
Trust in George. Trust in George. Trust in George ….
Yellow DogQuote Reply
Tyrion with helmet = epic and beyond.
Looking forward to the complains. If the episode is half as good as the trailers there will be no reason to whine. Not ever again!
Gods, these scenes look like “Kingdom of Heavens” times 3.
I’m gonna need some safety belts and probably a horse tranquilizer to watch it without jumping on the couch…
Kael of the LakeQuote Reply
Mean25,
Wow, didn’t take you long attacking me :)
Claudiu GherganuQuote Reply
Mean25,
Claudiu Gherganu,
Settle down, you two.
Winter Is ComingQuote Reply
Yellow Dog,
Uh, I doubt that will happen. More likely Meryn Trant will be the one trying to kill Tyrion.
CarneQuote Reply
I’m just looking forward to the episode in general. I think looking forward to any particular scene is a sure way to be disappointed. I think I’ll enjoy the episode more by keeping an open mind.
fuelpaganQuote Reply
COME WITH ME AND TAKE THE CITY!
Stannis BaratheonQuote Reply
The flash of Lancel in the preview makes me wonder if he somehow becomes the one sent to kill Tyrion.
Ours is the FuryQuote Reply
Ours is the Fury,
I doubt it. Lancel was in the battle in the books too, only reporting back to Cersei every now and then.
Jaime LannisterQuote Reply
Manage your expectations people. Get the image of Helm’s Deep out of your mind lol..
TastesLikeTheSeaQuote Reply
Which do you think people will complain about more, that there is no chain or that Stannis seems to be leading the charge instead of commanding from the rear? And we still haven’t seen any green wildfire in the clips. Whatever the case, this episode is going to be filled with epicness.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Anybody got any idea whether or not the episode is entirely based around Blackwater or if we might be getting any:
1. Jon Snow and the Wildlings
2. Night’s Watch at the Fist of the First Men
3. Daenerys Targaryen in Qarth
4. Robb Stark and his bannermen in the North
5. Arya, Gendry and Hot Pie on the road
6. Brienne and Jaime in the wild
?
I’m suspecting the episode will be entirely focused in King’s Landing.
Michael HarperQuote Reply
Does anyone know, are they sticking the House of the Undying in with the battle in this episode or will it be in the last episode?
The OthersQuote Reply
I really hope this episode delivers. Expectations are so high…
RemaalQuote Reply
Considering how many people have been offed in the series that are still alive in the books , I wouldn’t be surprised if they killed Bronn. I think his storyline has served its function for the most part.What much does he do other than marry Lolly and reject Tyrion’s plea to be his champion in A Storm of Swords?
As for Tyrion’s nose, they could have a metal “mask” for the nose to cut down on the CGI and makeup budget. Entertainment Weekly said in its episode description of the finale that Tyrion wakes up to a changed appearance. I don’t know if they have seen an advance copy or not. I just think it would be really distracting and unnecessary. I hope he gets to keep his nose because I really don’t think its absence adds anything to the story, unlike the maiming of Jamie.
From the episode summary for the finale, it appears that Dany visits the House of the Undying then.
paylorQuote Reply
paylor,
I’m sure they’ll keep it. As you said, it would be expensive and extremely distracting.
CarneQuote Reply
And holiday Monday means I can stay up all night Sunday night commenting here.
Yellow DogQuote Reply
Oh, my God. I cannot wait!
Michelle Yvette PeeplesQuote Reply
Yellow Dog,
Me too :D
CarneQuote Reply
This tv episode will dwarf any other tv episode of any other tv series in tv history. Crystal??!!
BalerionQuote Reply
it will not it’s in EP 10 summary as “Dany visits a strange place” or something like that
KingthlayerQuote Reply
I hope the whole episode is just Kings Landing. Breaking off to any other plot line is just going to defuse the tension and atmosphere. This is what the whole season has been leading up to, it has to be intense and unrelenting. I’m hoping to feel the claustrophobia the fear the chaos the confusion. It’s got to be suffocating. There’s plenty of material to work with from the books what with what’s going on with Cersei and Sansa along with the actual battle. The Hound and fire! Wildfire! Chain (or not :-/ ) Ships burning, sailors burning, everything burning! Renly back from the dead maybe/maybe not, but an unexpected army at the very least. Pod!
Besides, I don’t think they’ve mixed up their episode formats enough – a single location for a whole episode is great to throw in the mix.
JackolQuote Reply
Jackol,
I wonder if the intro will just be two minutes of the map hovering over King’s Landing or if they’ve come up with another way of handling this. That is of course if the entire episode does indeed only show us the action in and around King’s Landing!
PJKQuote Reply
I’m expecting the battle to be appropriately epic in feel. Perhaps foolishly, considering how few other scenes in the show can truly be called epic to this point.
But this has been hyped and hyped. They are going to give us a real, exciting, large-scale conflict here. It won’t have the scale of the book. But compared to anything else we’ve been given from the TV production, it will be a crazy step up. I really really hope the complaints after the battle are minimal. I don’t expect to have any.
I’m not expecting a disfigurement for our hero here, though. We’ve seen that they’ll do whatever’s necessary to avoid that sort of thing. Frankly I think they expect us to feel blessed that the Hound even has burn scars. Tyrion won’t even get scars. I got used to the idea ages ago. I’d love to be surprised.
ZackQuote Reply
I really don’t think they are going to stick with Trant being the one who attacks Tyrion. Think about it from a purely TV writing perspective. It would be much more effective if he was betrayed by someone he knows and trusts (or at least doesn’t explicitly distrust, like Trant). 10 to 1 odds that it’s either Bronn or Lancel. It just makes more sense for this adaptation; and remeber: this show has not shied away from making fairly large deviations from the source material. Why have him be attacked by a character the non-reading audience barely knows at all?
Darth ValyriaQuote Reply
I’m concerned for King Stannis , he’s not even wearing a helmet storming the walls lol
Coltaine777Quote Reply
Oh dear, you may be setting yourself up for a massive disappointment.
Darth ValyriaQuote Reply
Darth Valyria,
But that would be sort of like taking a character everyone loves and turn that character into someone everyone hates instead. I don’t think they’re going to do it.
CarneQuote Reply
I expect they’ll just re-introduce Moore prior to the battle. It wouldn’t make sense to change.
edit: Thanks to WolfDragon. Moore it is. It’s going to be him.
They’ll keep Bronn because his scenes later on are just too good. (I’m thinking of the Stokeworth/baby material in particular)
ZackQuote Reply
Mandon Moore was in the last episode. It won’t be someone else.
WolfDragonQuote Reply
I’m waiting for episode 9 and looking forward to see the battle between House Lannisters and House Baratheon or Tyrion/Bronn and Stannis/Davos; see Dany in House of Undying and see team Arya/Grendy/Hot Pie on the road; Jamie and Brienie scene also.
I think that episode 9 is one of the most amazing one in season 2.
DireWolvesQuote Reply
My prediction – it’s Lancel. There’s the one quick shot of him in the preview, at .45 with the sword strike, followed by a scream which could be Tyrion. It’s a nice twist, given his portrayal as wimp. Bronn will die heroically, in a similar way as Yoren did earlier in the season.
BgapQuote Reply
I would like to see Antler Men being catapulted. I’m sure it may go due to budget, but at least a line of dialogue referencing it. It’s a perfect detail for TV Joffrey.
Felt PeltQuote Reply
“Those are brave men, now let’s go kill them”. I am so glad that GRRM kept my all time favorite Tyrion line in his episode. Super Psyched.
RygarQuote Reply
Bgap,
Ep19 Spoilers:
Bronn doesn’t die. There’s no chain. Mandon Moore is killed by Pod. Tyrion does get hacked in the face but the extent of the damage is unknown.
FlayedManofBKQuote Reply
What an awesome idea!!! SO cool! I would love to see that.
EdQuote Reply
I see this episode ending with the National’s version of “Rains of Castamere” overtop of the sullen morning after the battle (SPOILER) with the smoking ships in the harbor, and the final shot is Joffrey smirking on the Iron Throne.
DavidBCQuote Reply
Tyrion hasn’t threatened any blacksmiths this season, so it’s looking like probably no big chain will appear. Aside from that, I expect this will be a very satisfying episode.
Arristan the OldQuote Reply
Seriously? So I’ll bet $10 it’s not Bronn or Lancel and if I’m right, you’ll give me a hundred? Contact me privately, I’ll take your bet.
EdQuote Reply
I think they’ll use “The Rains of Castamere” during a montage in episode 10.
CarneQuote Reply
I’d be my left nut (well, yours anyway) that they will certainly be showing other scenes/locations. Even with the extended budget, an entire hour of the battle’s just too much.
I’m sure they’ll break away at opportune moments to show at least a couple of the scenes you mentioned below.
EdQuote Reply
I think the chain is in. I think Tyrion will introduce it at the right time with a little comment like “here’s something I’ve been working on, you can thank me later.” or something like that. I have no idea why the writers decided to keep it a secret, they must have their reasons, but I think it will show up.
I’m just hoping this battle is the most epic that a TV battle can be. Better than any “made for TV” battle we’ve ever seen. I’m definitely not expecting it to be movie epic, but I am expecting some epicness.
MetalgoddessAMBQuote Reply
FlayedManofBK,
I knew there wouldn’t be a chain. I don’t know why people expected it. Can you tell me whether the wildfire is actually green, because I have my doubts.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Was that Lancel – actually doing something manly at the end?
KGQuote Reply
MetalgoddessAMB,
I hate to burst your bubble, but there will be no chain. They would have kept the scenes where Tyrion goes to the blacksmiths if they were going to spenf the money to CGI it or actually build it. FlayedManofBK confirmed as much with his spoiler.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
It looked slightly like Loras.
DavidBCQuote Reply
No Chain = No Bridge of Boats.
DavidBCQuote Reply
The actor who plays Lancel said that he is involved in the battle. Doesn’t he get wounded, and that is part of the reason he becomes extremely religious?
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
DavidBC,
The guy who has posted spoilers from his source that has seen the episode says there is no chain. He has been spot on all season with his spoilers. He knew the exact dialogue that Roose used when he mentioned his bastard. And he also called Jaime killing Alton.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
DavidBC,
Hmm could be. Honestly it would be almost as shocking if Loras did anything worthwhile, too. I mean, all that poser does is lose stylishly.
KGQuote Reply
Both Lancel and Bronn have a role to play later in the story. It would be foolish to have either of them killed by Pod.
VirtusQuote Reply
I think it was more like PTSD(shell shock), not physical wounds.
And I totally agree there is no chain, i’m just wondering how they’ll set up the Tyrion/POd/Mandon moore situation. without the brisge of boats.
DavidBCQuote Reply
Last year at this time, contemplating the end of the season, I had the July 1 release of ADWD to look forward to. This year, nothing.
Greedy and ungrateful, I know.
Anything interesting going on IRL the rest of this year? :-)
Yellow DogQuote Reply
It is Lancel at 0:47, but by the look of it, he’s fighting against an enemy, not wielding his sword against a non-suspecting target.
VirtusQuote Reply
C’mon! Loras is the man… and I highly doubt he is actually as critcally wounded as Cersei thinks. I mean, there isn’t even anyone at Dragstone when he attacks it.
DavidBCQuote Reply
I love the preview — Can’t wait for the episode. I’m wondering though, why are HBO’s YouTube videos always so dark? Is it just my screen?? When I watch the exact same preview on TV, I can see things fine, but then on YouTube I can hardly make out who people are. Weird. :/
Grant GouldQuote Reply
Seconded. It’s been set up pretty well. He’s second poodle only to Clegane in terms of serving his Highness.
WompWompQuote Reply
Yellow Dog,
Dark Knight 2
Prometheus
Hobbit
The Master
Django Unchained
Boardwalk Empire Season 3
There are a million things to look forward to this year.
DavidBCQuote Reply
I was originally thinking Mandon’s betrayal would fall on Trant too…but Cersei mentioned Ser Mandon by name last week… telling him to bring Ros in to see Tyrion.
This made me think Ser Mandon still will be the one.
DavidBCQuote Reply
Yellow Dog,
I don’t think that would happen. Cersei ordered a “Ser Mandan”around in the last episode. Why bother dropping that name if another character is going to attack Tyrion?
KelsQuote Reply
Kels,
The problem with that is we didn’t even get to see his face and he had no lines. Are they going to build up his character during one episode? Makes more sense to use Trant. It would be disappointing if a featured extra showed up from nowhere and did this.
CarneQuote Reply
It’s no insult to say ASOIAF’s human-based drama surpasses that of LOTR by leaps and bounds. GRRM told us himself that Tolkien’s work was more mythology-based and less occupied with the intimate affairs of the people on the ground. That is what I love about this series. We get so much time with the characters and a better sense of who these people are without painting them as saints or demons. I remember loving the battles in The Two Towers but laughing at the montage of generic helpless white extras cowering in Helm’s Deep.
That said, I’m not dissing LOTR. The Fellowship of the Ring is one of my favorite films and one of the best examples of world-building we’ve been graced with on the big screen. But I’m not nearly as excited about The Hobbit as I would be about a proper modern adaptation of Frank Herbert’s DUNE…
WompWompQuote Reply
Is it sad that I am looking forward to non battle stuff more? Particularly Sansa scenes (not necessarily sansan but I am anxious to see what they do there). I hope the battle stuff looks good since there was so much hype.
ChryseeQuote Reply
DavidBC,
Near the end of ADWD, Mace Tyrell clearly states that his sons are going to do something military (can’t recall the exact details) but he definitely says “sons.” Willas is a cripple, so I don’t see him marching off to do battle, which leaves Garlan and … an apparently less-than-doomed Loras. Another Tyrell fake-out!
KGQuote Reply
Chrysee,
I just want to get on with the Jaime/Brienne Roadtrip of Bitching and Moaning, myself.
KGQuote Reply
But remember all the non-battle scenes that take place in KL revolving around Cersei and Sansa, plus the inevitable lead-in scenes and behind-the-scenes strategizing that Tyrion (initially), Varys, and whoever else will be involved with. I think it’ll break up the episode nicely enough such that it won’t be just an hourlong barrage of violence.
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
Chrysee,
I feel the same way. I’m really looking forward to the scenes in Maegor’s Holdfast, and I’m not even a huge Sansa fan. Hopefully we get a drunk Cersei slurring her words.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
That did catch me off-guard, but we don’t get a great look at him when does show up. It would be a missed opportunity not to assign Trant to the task given how much Tyrion v. Trant we’ve been given this season. It’s a better setup for non-readers too as their mutual enmity will definitely register better and the shock of a Kingsguard attacking Tyrion will still be there.
Another thought on how they’ll handle the future: I’m really trying to figure out what the writers are doing with the TV Shae. I’ve accepted this new take on her, but she hasn’t called Tyrion “my giant of Lannister” once so far and doesn’t seem the type to do so since she’s more than happy to operate on a level closer to Tyrion’s than the book Shae ever did. We also don’t see show Shae play with Tyrion the same way book Shae did. This makes me wonder if Shae’s betrayal will be adapted as we know it. Without the “giant” precedent, her murder can’t be set up properly.
Breaking Bad S5 in July. Ooooooh yeeeeeeah.
WompWompQuote Reply
I think this is the 5th time I’ve watched that. I’ve had to change my pants after every viewing.
The Young WolfQuote Reply
What do people mean by “Sansan”?
EDIT: Oh, I get it now. We do need some more of that beyond the Terminator scene.
I’m surprised we haven’t been reintroduced to Ser Dontos the Fool yet. I actually find myself missing the fools from the books. They’d be such droll touches to the show.
WompWompQuote Reply
Am I the only one pumped to see Ser Illyn Payne for the first time this season??? THIS IS THE GUY WHO KILLED NED PEOPLE!!! lol
Jon GloriosoQuote Reply
I hope they cover Jon/Arya/Dany in the first part of the show and then the rest belongs to Blackwater! I don’t want them taking me in and out of the Tyrion/Stannis story.
So excited for this episode!!
Bronn better live. :/
MimsyQuote Reply
WompWomp,
‘SanSan’ is Sansa + Sandor. The strangest ‘shipping I have ever seen.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Mimsy,
I am almost certain that the entire episode will take place in King’s Landing.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
They’re combining Sansa and Sandor “The Hound” Clegane. It’s kind of like a fantasy romance these crazy Throners have come up with (:
Jon GloriosoQuote Reply
“Almost certain” lol.
There is no way the entire episode takes place in King’s Landing. The Battle of Blackwater was rumored to be 19minutes long- it’s probably a little longer then that- but what I would expect is the first part of the episode to be build up and other view points, and then the second half to take place completely in King’s Landing.
Jon GloriosoQuote Reply
The whole season has been too dark in parts for my liking. I feel like shouting at my screen for someone to light more candles or blow a hole in the wall to get more light. I understand castles and what not weren’t well lit, but we’re filming here people!
MimsyQuote Reply
Whoa, how do you know he’s back? He’s only credited on IMDB for S1 episodes so far. I’d love to see him owning some fools.
There aren’t any romantic music videos to go along with that particularly soggy slice of fandom, I trust.
WompWompQuote Reply
I’m a crazy Throner (haha, first time seeing that word… just as good as “Throny” in my book) but I don’t think the show sets up that pairing as much as the books do. We need more Hound scenes in general. :]
WompWompQuote Reply
Jon Glorioso,
We’ll see. The episode is only 57 minutes, and only 54-55 minutes of that is actual footage. All of the other storylines have been set up for the finale.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Re: Lancel (ASOS spoilers for people not there as readers)
His wounds are real and quite severe – when they’re discussing marriage prospects for Sansa from the Lannisters, Kevan says Lancel is still in bad shape. He’d be able to say the word but would not be able to consummate the wedding .
LordStarkingtonQuote Reply
WompWomp,
Ser Illyn Payne is at the :25 mark during Cersei’s Plan B.
MimsyQuote Reply
WompWomp,
Illyn Payne is in the preview for the episode. He is in Maegor’s Holdfast with Cersei and Sansa.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
He’s in one of the preview videos, if not the main one then look at the links Dan posted near the top of this thread.
And as far as Ser Mandon goes, remember that in the books he was pretty much a blank slate which made his attack on Tyrion completely unexpected. The fact that Ser Meryn and Tyrion don’t get along is, to me, a sign that it definitely won’t be Meryn. I’m going with Mandon as well, they don’t do name-drops like that for nothing.
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
Jon Glorioso,
An early report spoke of 16 minutes, but it was then found to be a mixup between the words ‘sixteen’ and ‘sixty’.
VirtusQuote Reply
Mimsy,
omgomgitshimitshimitsHIM! [plop]
No, Ser Ilyn! Go play outside! There will be no ownage of fools indoors! :O
WompWompQuote Reply
Jon Glorioso,
Furthermore, there have been three previews for this episode and none of them has shown anything outside King’s Landing. And the episode’s synopsis says nothing about events happening elsewhere.
VirtusQuote Reply
That’s a promising sign. It is known that it took them a full month to shoot this episode. In light of that, I’m sure it’s more than a mere 20 minutes, build-up and all.
I wish they’d humor us with smaller clashes in the field with Robb and the Lannisters. Maybe have the camera follow a few scouts or something. Just something more to make the conflict even more convincing. I’m always impressed by their after-battles and camp sites, though.
WompWompQuote Reply
I understand why some of you have this theory, I just personally don’t believe that it’s a decision D&D will go with. I do expect MOST of the episode to be in King’s Landing, just not all of it, particularly in the beginning. But like Tyrion Pimpslap said, we’ll see!
Jon GloriosoQuote Reply
They did describe the episode as a short feature film of sorts, which leads me to believe it’ll be unified by its setting.
I watched Centurion on Netflix just to get a sense of the director’s action chops, and the movie confirmed it: he produces good work on a tight budget. And as a bonus, Ser Davos was in it. :>
WompWompQuote Reply
Remember than when interviewed, Dan and Dave stated that they were initially resigned to doing the battle entirely by hearsay as Cersei’s party in the Red Keep gets word of individual events. Then they went to HBO and begged for more money and they were able to expand the episode and get a decent battle. However, D&D have also stated that it will be more on the lines of the battle as viewed through the eyes of individual participants rather than some epic things like Helm’s Deep in The Two Towers. So be prepared for something between the two extremes.
I expect awesome scenes with Tyrion, Sandor, Varys, Davos, Stannis, Sansa and Cersei and hopefully even some Podrick. Possibly Ser Mandon. Possibly Loras. I don’t expect an epic scale battle. Looks like no chain as well; hopefully, we’ll at least get some wildfire. But it’s the performances from the actors in the above roles which will be the true beauty in this coming episode.
LangkardQuote Reply
Glad to see Ilyn Payne back for an episode. I was also happy to see Kevan Lannister last episode. I guess I just like the continuity of seeing them again, even if a general audience doesn’t know or care.
Pastor_of_MuppetsQuote Reply
Pastor_of_Muppets,
Yeah I loved how they did that with Kevan. It’s like they are saying
remember this character, because he becomes important later on
Ice&FireQuote Reply
WompWomp,
IT IS NOT TRANT!!! Get that out of your brain.
WolfDragonQuote Reply
Tim Surette writes reviews for TV.com and he’s seen this episode.says it’s the best episode of season 2.
negarQuote Reply
It’s hard to tell with only a few frames of footage, but it appears that at the end of the stroke, he’s slightly bent over, and the sword, off screen, is at his waist, just where Tyrion’s head would be. Also, the scene a few episodes back when Tyrion is totally playing him is the perfect setup for this, making Lancel a great example of a passive-aggressive character.
BgapQuote Reply
Mimsy,
This is usually because you have a bad TV. If you watch Thrones on a newer LED TV with true black it looks amazing.
DavidBCQuote Reply
Also feel like it’s too dark on my first watch when it’s light outside. Then when I re-watch later after dark with no lights on, it’s all visible and very atmospheric.
BgapQuote Reply
Lancel doesn’t have the guts to do something like this, you are reading too much into it. He’s also not a Kinsalyer.
DavidBCQuote Reply
WolfDragon,
Strictly speaking, you don’t know that. Nobody knows that, and it’s not that big a deal. It’s just what I walked away with from watching the show. Mandon’s name drop last episode seems indicative, but it’s not conclusive. I’ll let the episode answer that question.
Without you yelling over the internet, realizing Trant is Joffrey’s and Moore is Cersei’s reset my position. You might try making a case for your assertions if you really want to be convincing and not come off as tragically rage-challenged. :P
I wonder how he got to see it so early. I thought screeners were only released for the first six episodes.
WompWompQuote Reply
Aw crap Tyrion’s helmet is all wrong! This episode is gonna suck balls! I bet the writer of this one didn’t even read the book!!!!
*don’t seriously respond to this post. It’s meant as comic relief*
WinterdarkQuote Reply
Totally random anecdote, but I always hear this phrase in Varys’ voice now.
“Strictly speaking, such a thing is not in accordance with the king’s laws.”
“Strictly speaking.”
Winter Is ComingQuote Reply
Hmm, I’ll have to look into this true black issue. The shows normally look crystal clear and like it’s jumping out at you cuz it’s so vivid, but a few of those GOT scenes seem kind of muted.
MimsyQuote Reply
I do the same thing. It looks better when my house is dark. I just can’t wait and watch the east coast airing. Perhaps for this Sunday’s episode, I’ll turn my family room into a batcave so I can experience the theater version. lol
MimsyQuote Reply
You made a man laugh. XD
Winter Is Coming,
Haha, looking back, I heart him too. I was initially disappointed that Hill’s Varys didn’t giggle, but I’ve really grown fond of his interpretation of the character. So many little contagious bits of dialogue…
EDIT: I meant to say “heard,” but “heart” works just fine there.
Mimsy,
I could be totally wrong, but in the slightly older Plasma vs. Everything Else TV debates, I think Plasma had the plus of handling true blacks better. If black looks grayish on your screen that could be the issue. I’ve found the shadows fitting whenever I’ve seen them.
WompWompQuote Reply
What I’m looking for is a new level of series badassery, particularly from Tyrion. I want to see the half-man fight! They may not give him a battle-ax, but that would be awesome. I just don’t want them to half-ass it like the first season. That was sort of cute, but it’s not impossible for Tyrion, while on horseback to do some damage. Let the half-man fight!
I have faith that Neil Marshall, director of one of the best low budget horror flicks in recent memory, The Descent, will absolutely deliver, GRRM is writing the episode, he should deliver. “Blackwater” should set the bar for TV battle…as I said, a new level of badassery.
MichaelQuote Reply
The chain is in, D&D said in a recent interview that the sound team had managed to come up with this sound they needed, of something very big and very loud, that they couldn’t say what it was because it would be a spoiler, but book readers would know what they meant.
ValyrianQuote Reply
You mean like a wildfire explosion?
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
WompWomp,
I have a brand new LED and the blacks look phenomenal. It really does make all the difference in the world.
Also, I am changing my bold prediction about who tries to kill Tyrion! I am now declaring 10 to 1 odds that it will be Jean Ralphio from Parks and Rec in an unexpected cross-network, cross-genre twist. ;)
Darth ValyriaQuote Reply
Michael,
Doubt there’s going to be much horseback, too expensive and too much trouble. And all the combat in the previews looks to be on foot.
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
I took that to mean the wildfire explosion. Plus, another poster who has seen the ep has said that there is no chain.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
WompWomp
i can't wait for a Dune re-adaptation. I'm even a fan of the 80's David Lynch version. I'm at Heretics of Dune in the series of books.
Ah, The Hobbit…!!!
magsQuote Reply
I’m guessing this has been discussed prior, but I finally just saw the last episode.
With Arya escaping Harrenhal, was episode 8 the last time we see Jaqen? And he doesn’t give Arya the “Valar Morghulis” coin? Interesting choice…
WillQuote Reply
I keep staring at the photo at the top of this page–(the still at the beginning of the preview). Don’t those look like WWII helmets on the two guys whose backs are facing us? I keep expecting Gen. McArthur at the top of the stairs to yell ‘I shall return!’
iheartseverusQuote Reply
sorry, i think i bolded the wrong part of the post, Gods!
magsQuote Reply
Tyrion Pimpslap,
I had heard that screeners weren’t being sent out for the last two episodes, so I am highly skeptical of that poster’s claims. Frankly though, at this point, the chain better be out. The reason it’s awesome in the book is because of all the setup leading up to it. There has been no setup at all, so it would just fall flat. You could say it wouldn’t be linked to anything. Eh? Ehhh??
Darth ValyriaQuote Reply
Will,
Well, episode 10 is called “Valar Morghulis,” so… :)
Darth ValyriaQuote Reply
Darth Valyria,
A writer for TV.com has said that he has seen the episode. The poster ‘FlayedManofBK’ has been correct on every piece of info he has spoiled. I am inclined to believe him. I agree that I hope the chain isn’t in now. They would have flimed a scene where Tyrion commissions the blacksmiths to build it earlier in the season if it was.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Yes, and Tom Wlaschiha said in an interview earlier this year that they shot a scene where he changes his face.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Yeah I read that interview too and assumed they were referring to the chain. Direct quote:
“For “Blackwater,” he had to orchestrate a major naval battle and a land battle. And he had to come up with something very big and very loud, which would be a spoiler to explain but book readers will understand.”
http://insidetv.ew.com/2012/05/20/game-of-thrones-blackwater/2/
Could be a wildfire explosion but it would be strange that they would have mentioned talking about finding that distinctive sound for it to just be a variation of an explosion. I just get the impression from the way they’re speaking about it that they’re talking about a single distinctive sound and that seems more likely to be the chain sound to me than something else.
The thing that makes me hesitate are the spoilers above from the guy who people are saying has been accurate all season claiming no chain so who knows.
JCQuote Reply
JC,
Spoiler tags, good sir.
Darth ValyriaQuote Reply
I tought a goldcloak was already cast. It was not named who he would be, but maybe this is the guy who tries to kill Tyrion? http://winteriscoming.net/2011/10/hbo-provides-some-casting-confirmations/ Cant remember him from any off the last episodes. And also Cersei mentioned Ser Mandon in the last episode.
KalleQuote Reply
Oops apologies, didn’t even think about it.
Unfortunately, I can no longer go back and edit that post so hopefully a moderator will do it for me.
Again, sorry!!
JCQuote Reply
Kalle,
I thought that was just the goldcloak who threatens Yoren in episode 2.
VirtusQuote Reply
Excited for this! I don’t mind if they leave out the Chain, I just hope they have at least one Joffrey Catapult.
Can’t wait to see The Hound this episode.
ConorQuote Reply
That was the Goldcloak who was asking Yoren about Gendry, plus Goldcloaks are City Watch not Kingsguards who are sometimes called Whitecloaks.
MormegilQuote Reply
Maybe, but that’s why it will make a great Holy Sh*t! moment. Again, it’s a total pay off from the two scenes of them together, one in the room, the other inside the palanquin. Also, he’ll do whatever Cersei commands, even kinslaying. This follows from the last episode, when Tyrion seriously threatened her with the classic ‘joy to ashes’ line
Either way, we’ll know in 2 1/2 days!
BgapQuote Reply
It’s a compression issue. Many compression algorithms since the dawn of compression made the mistake of additively combining the brightness values of neighboring pixels instead of exponentially combining them because the writer of the first compression algorithm didn’t know exactly how optics worked. That is, something that should be “half” as bright should have .707 (1 over the square root of 2) of the brightness value to look right, while the compression algorithm just gives it half of the brightness value.
This has the effect of making darks darker in compressed feeds.
Alternatively, it’s been compressed in one algorithm, then uncompressed in a different algorithm. This happens a lot with FRAPS.
Critical GeekQuote Reply
Yes! I thought it was just me. :-)
Yellow DogQuote Reply
If they were going to spend the money to CGI or build the chain they would have filmed a scene forshadowing it instead of having it pop up out of nowhere. Just like the one they filmed with Tyrion,Hallyne, and Bronn revealing the large supply of wildfire.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
hahaha I bet they’ll find a way to blame something else.
well, the early trailers of the second season indicated that there would be wildfire, yes. and Tyrion found that gigantic amount of wildfire kept by the Alchemists, so I’m pretty sure we’ll have the green substance ^^
unless this teaser is a fake one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9RbYhCfAZc
Valyrian,
I think that’s the wildfire explosion, as stated above
Thiago SlashQuote Reply
Anyone know who Jamie was referring to in the last episode when he said “there are 3 men in the kingdoms who might have a chance against me”? The Mountain? Who else?
KingslayinQuote Reply
My guess would be the Brothers Clegane and Barristan Selmy. I’ve seen some people suggest Loras but I don’t think there’s any way Jaime would acknowledge that twerp’s ability to beat him in a real fight.
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
Seriously doubt it, because they’re not going to kill of Lancel (at least I hope not), because he has an obvious role going forward, and one of the key things about the attack against Tyrion is the fact that he has no idea why it happened or who put him up to it. (My money’s always been on Littlefinger getting some revenge for Tyrion making a fool of him with the marrying-off-Myrcella gambit).
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
OOOOoooo-EEErrrr?
I have a terrible feeling Lancel’s about to take a certain man of the white cloths scene…!!!
Did you notice when Tyrion is rallying the troops (“Let’s go kill them”) Lancel’s in the crowd, not joining in with the cheers, and looking directly at Tyrion with Hatred????
Adam AustinQuote Reply
http://on.wsj.com/JJq6fs they show Lancel as the one attempting to assassinate tyrion here. it makes alot of sense!!
Hassan MadkourQuote Reply
Nobody’s mentioned pigsh*t yet? Tyrion mentioned that in the last episode, and my guess is that he loads boats with pigshit and sends them out to surround the Stannis fleet, them sets them on fire, which combined with wildfire would probably make huge explosions, and would serve a similar purpose to the chain by preventing Stannis’s boats from escaping, hemming them in. So pigshit instead of a chain is my guess.Doubt we’ll see the boat bridge though, too dangerous. So probably no chain, but no big deal, there are other ways to defeat an opponent, like a million ways…and D&D have to work within the limits of the location, time, and budget. This one is looking forward to the whole thing, however it plays out.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Darth Valyria,
they could show tyrion in bed having dreams and flasbacks about how he orchestrated it when he’s between ife and death. just to emphasize that he’s still iin a batlle
Hassan MadkourQuote Reply
I’m not seeing that, just a Kit Harrington interview.
I’m really hoping it’s not true, why would Tyrion not just have him whacked once he’s back in the saddle?
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
I can understand why they kept Tyrion’s chain out of the show. It’s more of a technical thing that plays well in the books when you read about it, but not so much on TV when you actually see it.
Firstly, and most importantly, we haven’t even seen Blackwater Bay on the show. Viewers have no concept what it even looks like. We don’t know its topography, or its dimensions, or its position in relation to the Red Keep, or which river drains into it, or where the winch towers are located, etc. Book readers know all that, because it’s described in the books, but TV viewers do not.
Secondly, GRRM’s books are each roughly 1,000 pages long, and he’s only limited by his imagination. He has the ability to establish intricate details, whereas D&D, who are working with a limited amount of time per episode and per season, and a different medium through which to tell the story, do not.
So, as much I as I would’ve liked to see the chain (and the bay itself, even more so), the story can make do without it.
Varamyr FourskinsQuote Reply
Mrs. H’ghar,
Pigshit is what Bronn called wildfire when they were talking to Hallyne. Don’t you remember when Hallyne said “My order does not deal in pigshit’?
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
All they show is the clip from the ep19 trailer where you see Lancel swinging a sword in battle, Doesn’t mean it’s Tyrion.
ConorQuote Reply
Thinking from a photography viewpoint, how much visual impact would a black chain have seen against black water at night? IMO, it would have little impact because it would not be seen well, maybe only in flashes of the fire bursts. So, with that in mind, would it be wise to spend a good chunk of budget filming something that might not be visually effective in the context of a night fight? Probably not. But explosions and fire against a black background will have impact. IMO, the personal stories of how they deal with their own roles and the outcomes are more important than having every detail in the books be present for the battle. It will still be way cool.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
I did not recall that. Still confirms that the emphasis in this version of the battle will be on the fire and the individuals’ experiences rather than large architectural things IMO.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Sigh… Once again Mrs. H’Ghar you are completely wro…. oh, wait – no, you’re right! :-)
I concur 100%. People are getting too wrapped up in the whole chain thing.
Let it go, people – Enjoy the ride!
EdQuote Reply
Actually, in the Recap thread, I had stated that something was up with the “pigshit” comment and while I didn’t have a clue what it was, I figured it was key.
Look’s like Tyrion Pimpslap has it figured pretty accurately.
EdQuote Reply
Does anybody else have conflicted feelings on who to route for tonight? Shouldn’t we be talking about that? A woman likes Tyrion, but he IS a Lannister, so should we route for him really? And Stannis, well he’s a tool but he DOES have a point about his rights to the throne, so should we route for him? Yes, I’ve read the books, but we know things have changed here and there so…who do we really wish would win in “a perfect Westeros?” Not counting King Robb, who is probably not involved in this battle tonight.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Mrs. H’ghar,
While reading the book, I was rooting for Stannis. Not out of love for the character, on the contrary, I dislike Stannis and adore Tyrion, but out of love for the Starks, and pure hate for Cersie, Joeff and Tywin. I wanted to see them pay for Killing Ned. I wanted them to suffer. I wanted Sansa, Arya & Robb to have the satisfaction of seeing the Lannisters brought down. I wanted the Starks safe.
Tomorrow I’ll be watching like an omniscient god, placid in the knowledge of a foregone outcome. It is written, therefor it is known. :)
RemaalQuote Reply
Tyrion Pimpslap,
EP 19 Spoiler:
The Wildfire is Green as Lannister eyes. Pretty much like I imagined while reading..
FlayedManOfBKQuote Reply
FlayedManOfBK,
A man is very pleased to hear this!
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Book readers knows all that? Sry I read the books and do not know all of that nonsense
TurncloakQuote Reply
Remaal,
I was not a fan of Stannis at that point in the books, so I was rooting for Tyrion.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
FlayedManOfBK,
Can you say whether or not you liked the episode? And if it cuts away from King’s Landing?
These are important things that I seem to devote a significant portion of my days to wondering about.
Felt PeltQuote Reply
They describe it fairly well but there’s a map of King’s Landing at the beginning (or the end?) of the book that really makes it clear.
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
I don’t think they’ll use Ser Meryn, Pod or Bronn to do the attempted murder of Tyrion. They have introduced Ser Mandon for a reason. Instead of having some nameless goldcloak, Lannister man-at-arms or extra and call him “Osney” or “Osfryd.
Ren SnowQuote Reply
DavidBC,
Yet u name just 6?
AshQuote Reply
Winterdark,
Don’t you know anything!!!!!!! The writer of this episode wrote the damn books!
*dont seriously respond to this post it’s meant as comic relief!*
AshQuote Reply
Just wanna say thank you, thank you, thank you to D&D or HBO or whoever it was that decided to schedule THIS episode on Memorial Day Weekend so that me and my Gang of Thromies can get King-Robert-level shitfaced and enjoy it properly!!
Only thing that sucks is that this week is gonna be the worst wait (except maybe the 1st ep of this season) for 9:00 PST. (Damn you, Comcast Bay Area, we get east coast HBO Latino in HD, but not the regular east coast feed! Damn you to seven hells!) Although that will give us more time for pre-battle partying.
“There’s such a dearth of good sacking songs.”
- Cersei Lannister, Twincest Queen of my heart
the goatQuote Reply
One of my favorite quotes!
EdQuote Reply
JC,
That’s what gives me pause too, but I’ll hold tight to my hopes of getting the chain lol
ValyrianQuote Reply
This one shares your views for the most part, but have some sympathy for Davos and his devotion to his king. And though he is of the evil Lannisters, how can you not wish for Tyrion to prevail? Though we know what the book story is and that GRRM wrote this episode, I would not be surprised if there are are few twists anyway…he DID write for tv for a long time.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Valyrian,
The chain wasn’t the deciding factor in the battle. It was a clever move by Tyrion, but if Tywin didn’t show up with the combined forces of Highgarden and Casterly Rock then Stannis and his forces would have been victorious. This is why I don’t have a problem with them excluding it. That, and I know how much more it would cost, and frankly I’d gladly sacrifice the chain for better wildfire CGI and battle scenes.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Indeed, we are of a mind on this.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Ba-doop doop doobie doo-bahhhh~
D&D’s big Blackwater interview with EW.com mentioned them cutting some particularly beloved bits of the battle. Tyrion’s chain would fit the bill. My last sliver of hope for rationalizing the unlikely inclusion of the chain is the as-yet-unmentioned dragon pit in King’s Landing as a potential source. Other than that, I’m ready to accept there is no chain and no Antler Men. I’d just like to see the true essence of the ordeal reflected on-screen. It’s the culmination of the season, after all.
WompWompQuote Reply
WompWomp,
I haven’t noticed my black as gray. I do have a newer tv to compare, but I’d have to stream HBO GO to do a comparison. All so very complicated just to feel like I’m living in Westeros. NOT that I’d want to live there for real!!
MimsyQuote Reply
For every reason I’d want to be in Westeros, there are a thousand reasons I wouldn’t. But a man can dream. I have to accept the closest I’ll ever get to visiting Westeros is the retrofitted smell-o-vision peripheral HBO will implement in twenty years to attract even more people to HBO Go. That way we can all smell whatever attracts Shae to King’s Landing for ourselves. :]
WompWompQuote Reply
In honor of The National performing Rains of Castamere, I’ve decided to begin this glorious weekend by watching the vid of their Coachella show last year.
(In fact, this is what I was doing last year instead of watching the very 1st episode of Game of Thrones. And this year I was watching Flo+the Machine instead of ep. 4. Weird.)
As it seems there are quite a few National fans in these parts, here’s the link if anyone wants to watch/dl:
http://theaudioperv.com/2011/04/18/the-national-2011-coachella-performance-video/
Good shit.
the goatQuote Reply
FlayedManOfBK,
You saw the episode?! How was it? Will it live up to the hype?
JamesLQuote Reply
Ive read some monthes ago that the battle of blackwater was lasting 16 minutes.
Kit has mentioned over and over how important this episode will be for Jon Snow and book readers know what he means. Hope to see House of the Undying in this ep too, and i guess itll be it, perhaps no Winterfell.
Fist of the first Men for season finale :-)
lonasQuote Reply
Well, if I ever go to Westeros, I’m packing my lunch.
TyrionFan57Quote Reply
That was a mis-translation. They confused 16 for 60.
the goatQuote Reply
Call me mad but due to our sad lack of Pod could it be that it’s Lancel who surprisingly comes to Tyrion’s rescue? I hope it’s not the case but it could fit with his redemption arc?
OT: Peter is on the cover of the latest issue of American Cinematographer magazine with an interesting article on the new DP’s for this season http://www.theasc.com/ac_magazine/May2012/current.php
Ser Lemon CakesQuote Reply
TyrionFan57,
Not a fan of Lamprey Pie ?
aceQuote Reply
Ser Lemon Cakes,
Nice, thankth!
I dithagree about Pod tho
the goatQuote Reply
lonas,
House of the Undying is in the season finale.
JamesLQuote Reply
I hope we also only get king’s landing in this episode as well.. and I can’t wait any longer!! Particularly my nerves are killing me from anticipating the san/san scene!!! <3
caro herreraQuote Reply
IIRC, D&D indicated that even with the increase in the budget, there was no way to do Blackwater as GRRM originally wrote it. They had to reduce the number of full scale ship sets from 9 or so to just 1, but hey, it’s pretty amazing we’re getting a medieval naval battle in TV show at all! They’ve also said they chose to focus on the fog of war experienced by individual soldiers and sailors.
So, I do not expect:
– 52 minutes of battlefield action
– a chain
– bird-eye overviews of battle scenes
– schmaltzy conventional heroism, complete with sweeping background music
On the other hand, I do expect:
– the opening credits will show a fleet
– a hasty last-minute departure by selected characters
– camera switches between recurring but “expendable” nameless soldiers during battle
– short “poor bloody infantry” sequences shot with basic helmet cams
– shouting, cursing and visceral sounds reflecting soldier’s physical exertion
– soldiers advancing in formation past their own screaming wounded
– occasional protagonist sightings
– orders to hold fire until the enemy is at close range
– intense fear, desertion (attempts)
– wildfire flames are plain old yellow-orange
– wildfire effective but terrifying for both sides
– imperfect battlefield communications, confusion, decisions based on false intel
– the best laid battle plans will (partially) unravel
– nimble improvisation by small groups will create turning points
– unexpected players will produce surprise twists, either in battle or behind the scenes
– each side will have the advantage more than once
– victory will come at a very high price for some of the protagonists
Nagga’s KinQuote Reply
Any else think the opening will be unique this episode?
Augie HattonQuote Reply
I’m not nitpicking, I’d also sacrifice the chain for better wildfire (and more ships), it’s just something I’d really like to see =D
ValyrianQuote Reply
No doubt, the chain would be awesome, but being realistic we know they could not do everything in the books so please keep an open mind and enjoy what IS rather than bemoaning what could have been when it’s all over. The previews are pretty intense, it shall be a great hour of TV.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Barristan Selmy, Oberyn Martell, and Victarion Greyjoy.
Jon GloriosoQuote Reply
LOL I’m not bemoaning anything dear, I just made a comment. I absolutely love the show for what it IS and couldn’t care less about the changes they’ve made so long as the general outline is the same as in the books. Please don’t mistake me for one of these silly book purists.
ValyrianQuote Reply
No offense intended! We’re all here to enjoy talking about the show…and in DRAGON NEWS… did anybody notice there’s a DRAGON In SPACE?
http://www.thedailybeast.com/cheat-sheets/2012/05/25/cheat-sheet.html#4
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Mrs. H’ghar,
None taken =D
ValyrianQuote Reply
Jon Glorioso,
Jaime would destroy Victarion. And he wouldn’t have any respect for a pirate who is untested by the greatest knights in the realm. My guess is it would be 3 of Barristan Selmy,Gregor Clegane,Sandor Clegane,Oberynn Martell, and Loras Tyrell(the show has likely scrapped Garlan and given his skill with a sword to Loras).
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Well in ASOS Jaime says that amongst the dead Robert, Ser Gerold Hightower and Arthur Dayne had been stronger than him, and amongst the living Greatjon Umber, the Strongboar of Crakehall, and both Cleganes were. And he realizes Brienne is stronger than him as well. But perhaps the writers might not be referring exactly to these characters, especially since in the show he seems to be speaking of skill rather than strength in that scene.
ValyrianQuote Reply
Carne,
Ser Mandon Moore was in the last episode (an extra), and Cersei cited his name.
Bit of a cheap way to do it (in both senses), but whatever.
Jordan HealeyQuote Reply
Jon Glorioso,
Selmy, Martell, Gregor Clegane.
I doubt Jaime has much knowledge of Victarion.
Jordan HealeyQuote Reply
Jordan Healey,
I think they’ve never even met (minor ADWD spoiler), if I remember correctly Victarion says he’d like to face Jaime in the field.
ValyrianQuote Reply
I considered Martell too, but I doubt Jaime would include a guy who resorts to poisoning his blades. And he’s not really a swordsman anyway, that we know of.
I’m still sticking with Sandor for the third.
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
The word “epic” is being thrown around quite a lot.
You gotta remember Game of thrones doesn’t have the budget of Lord of the rings, So people who are hoping for a huge, widely shot battle filled with hundreds of thousands of men on the screen with dragons flying around while bombs go off everywhere have rather ridiculously high expectations.
I’m hoping for a well thought out battle scene, I have full confidence in Neil Marshell, look at what he did in doomsday in the scene where they are at the castle, or in centurion, and with the man himself penning the episode I think fans of both book and the show will be in for a treat.
christmas is comingQuote Reply
Valyrian,
“Stronger” does not mean equal or better. I think he had the realization while fighting Brienne in chains, where his speed and skill was diminished, that there were other knights that had more sheer strength than him. In a fair fight I think Jaime would like his chances against anyone. For the purposes of the show, I think he would be referring to one of the 5 guys I mentioned. I doubt we’ll ever find out.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
I just like the word epic.
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
One of my biggest problems with this show has been that Martin wrote larger than life, and the show is somewhat unable to portray that on this budget. I find myself constantly disappointed in just about every storyline for this reason. So I’ve decided to really lower my expectations for scale. I haven’t watched the preview videos or read any spoilery hype, and I’m expecting it to be small and well done but not ‘spectacular’ or ‘epic’. This way I can get excited when I see Tyrion leading a charge and not worry so much that there aren’t that many men to charge. If you think of the show as more like theater and less like film, it succeeds a lot more.
I think I’ve just had too big/unreachable expectations. When this show has small scale stuff to show, it sometimes does better (Syrio’s last stand was great, Jon Snow and the Other, etc). You get so used to HBO being as good as film you forget it’s still relatively small time. I never really considered that tv would entail this, and that was my mistake, which has really hurt my enjoyment so far. Looking back, there is a trade off between losing a lot of material to make films and losing a lot of spectacle to make tv. Now that I’ve finally realized this, I think I’ll enjoy the show more.
MattL86Quote Reply
People overuse “epic” so much they don’t even know what it really means. It doesn’t just mean cool or even awesome. Most people wouldn’t know an epic if a bard showed up in their living room and chanted one at them all night long.
An epic is a kind of poem, originally just Homer’s Iliad and Odyssey, but later extended to such works as the Aeneid, the Lusiadas, the Nibelungenlied, the Mabinogion, the Norse Eddas, &c&c&c.
Citing from the OED, the word epic means “Pertaining to that species of poetical composition, represented typically by the Iliad and Odyssey, which celebrates in the form of a continuous narrative the achievements of one or more heroic personages of history or tradition.” It can also describe a tale worthy to form the subject of an epic.
EpicureanQuote Reply
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5PhNTVLbJ4
Tyrion PimpslapQuote Reply
Ed,
The pigsh*t remark is being explained wrong.
Bronn repeatedly referred to the wildfire as pigsh*t. So when Tyrion says to Bronn that’s his plan, it’s obvious the two of them know what he means. I wouldn’t read anymore into it than that.
MattL86Quote Reply
See, the thing is language evolves. Epic can mean something different now than it did 1200 years ago. The fact that you used cool in the very same sentence to mean something other than chilly really just proves the point.
My MS Word dictionary has multiple meanings for the word, one of which is “impressive by virtue of greatness of size, scope, or heroism”.
MattL86Quote Reply
What kind of world is it that believes Bill Gates takes precedence over the Oxford English Dictionary?
EpicureanQuote Reply
MattL86,
My MS Word dictionary has multiple meanings for the term “douchebag”, but all 17 either link directly to you, or feature you prominently, or ask me for my credit card before I can learn more about you.
good luck douchebag
the goatQuote Reply
Ran reveals inside information at Westeros.org: he confirms that the cain is out, and adds some background:
D&D have said they started building the chain, did their best to keep it, but ultimately they had to make a choice as to where to spend the budget for the episode, and they felt they’d find more useful places to put the money. So, fair enough. I’m glad they tried.
KateQuote Reply
Steven Swanson,
split it frame by frame, youll see it in the previews
Hassan MadkourQuote Reply
Balerion,
Crystal :) :) :)
UdiQuote Reply
If people can’t understand the difference between a TV and film budget, and gripe about this, I hope nobody takes them seriously.
That’s how I would’ve approached the battle too. I think we have nothing to fear. It’ll be fun.
ZackQuote Reply
I agree with Tyrion Pimpslap, Virtus and Lord Starkington regarding Lancel.
Books 3-4 Spoilers …
Lancel not only gets seriously injured in the Battle of the Blackwater, but doesn’t he also gain a tremendous amount of respect for Tyrion, once he starts leading sorties to defend the Red Keep? Later in the books, he is sickly and becomes a fanatically devout follower of religion, which I thought might have a greater purpose later in the story, other than just being the reason why he is willing to give up his inheritance. Doesn’t he also confess about his relationship with Cersei, adding to the convictions against her?
Regarding Bronn, he stays pretty loyal to Tyrion, as long as he is not risking harm to himself. He accepts honors/knighthood after the battle (who wouldn’t) and takes on the fiery chain as his sigil. He won’t fight The Mountain because he doesn’t think he can win, but later has fun taunting Cersei, marries into a high status family and names his first child after Tyrion.
I would be genuinely surprised if Tyrion did not come up with a fantastic strategy that will be disclosed this episode. They would not be showing all his research about sieges, just to lead us into a dead end. Besides, GRRM wrote this episode. One can only hope it will still be the chain, since that is still what makes the most sense. Just because they aren’t showing him talking to blacksmiths or catapult soldiers practicing with empty pots for wild fire, does not mean that those things are not happening in the background.
BerndlmeisterQuote Reply
IMHO, it would be easy enough to shoot a scene at one of the anchorages on shore. The links of the wet chain would vibrate and reflect the moonlight as it was raised to block the waterway. Alternatively, they could show the chain winch being activated inside the city walls, where there would be torches and other controlled fires nearby.
By contrast, Stannis’ navy would be surprised by the device. In the middle of the waterway, the chain would remain submerged close to the surface for just that purpose. When a ship’s bow runs up against the chain, it would fairly quickly come to a full stop, rendering it a sitting duck. Small row boats used for landing the assault troops on board the ships might be able to cross under the chain, but probably only close to the city walls where they would be especially vulnerable to the defenders’ arms.
Bottom line: The strategic value of the chain would become evident indirectly, via its effect on how the battle unfolds. Only a small, relatively inexpensive section of the chain would ever need to be shown at all. If they decided against even that, it might be that they wanted the battle to progress differently than in the books, precisely to keep book readers on the edge of their seats. As you said, there are other ways to achieve the same outcome.
Nagga’s KinQuote Reply
Berndlmeister,
i agree, as i said before : they could show all the planning as some sort of dream/flashback when he’s asleep fighting between life and death in episode 10. this could show how much he contributed to the battle even wee don’t know if he’ll make it
Hassan MadkourQuote Reply
Showing the planning is highly unnessary. We will see the results of the planning by how well Tyrion defends Kings Landing
TurncloakQuote Reply
MattL86,
Actually this is an excellent point. Reminds me of people griping over grammar mistakes while making those same mistakes during their banter
TurncloakQuote Reply
It’s interesting that so many are almost obsessing about the chain, but there has been little mention of the 2 new towers that were built to house the winches to raise and lower the chain, which Davos saw coming into Blackwater Bay but saw too late to warn those ahead of him in the book. If the location/time/budget wouldn’t allow for the building of the winch towers, then a chain popping up out of nowhere wouldn’t make sense. Unless there were already towers in the location where holes could be made for the chain to emerge from, unlikely if they’re shooting in a historical location. So, we should all calm down about what we will see, it will be dramatic and beautifully filmed and will give us the essence of what’s in the book, the experiences of the major characters and some minor ones, and the overall feel of a terrifying medieval battle. It would be great if we could all be civil and not resort to name-calling here.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
Scintillating as that sounds, I think I’ll just wait for the actual show.
Steven SwansonQuote Reply
“We have been working, tirelessly, ever since your royal sister commanded us to do so. Our present count stands at 7,811. Enough to burn Stannis’s fleet and armies both.”
“This is a shit idea.”
THAT is how you throw a fucking party.
“Burn them all.”
the goatQuote Reply
Steven Swanson,
All they show is Lancel fighting. Tyrion isn’t in the shot with him there.
DanQuote Reply
What’s the run time of this episode?
The DarkStarQuote Reply
Can we get an open chat at the top of the page up in here?
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
A reason I think it’s very, very important for Tyrion to be badly and visibly scarred is Sansa.
She always knew she might have to try hard to be attracted to her husband – vide her remembrance of Septa Mordane telling her that every man has his beauty. If it’s only Tyrion’s dwarfism that makes her say “And if I never want to?” then the fandom will never, ever forgive her.
Already he’s not ugly like he was in the books. Which is fine. But if he isn’t scarred after Blackwater Sansa’s rationale will be lightyears away from what it was.
EleanorQuote Reply
It’s not just Tyrion’s attractiveness that effects Sansa’s feelings for him.He’s a Lannister, the family that killed her father, killed her direwolf, betrayed her trust (the inside info she gave Cersei that tipped Cersei off to Ned’s intentions to flee), abused her physically and emotionally, and she will never forgive any of them. If Tyrion weren’t a Lannister, there would be a snowball’s chance she might soften her heart to him, but since that’s not the case, she can’t bear the thought. I don’t think that would change if Tyrion looked like Ser Loras…well maybe in time.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply