HBO pulls episode in wake of Bush head flap
By Winter Is Coming on in News.

HBO has pulled the finale to Game of Thrones season one from On Demand and HBO Go, as well as ceased production on season one DVDs and Blu-rays in the wake of the George W. Bush-head-on-a-spike “scandal”. So if you are planning on catching up with the series right now, best to wait until the episode re-appears with the offending noggin removed.

UPDATE: The episode is now back online and On Demand, with the head still there, but digitally modified to look less like the former President.

Earlier, HBO apologized for the incident, saying, “We were deeply dismayed to see this and find it unacceptable, disrespectful and in very bad taste. We made this clear to the executive producers of the series who apologized immediately for this inadvertent careless mistake. We are sorry this happened and will have it removed from any future DVD production.”

Showrunners David Benioff and D.B. Weiss, who pointed out the head in the commentary to episode 10, “Fire and Blood”, said this in a statement, “We use a lot of prosthetic body parts on the show: heads, arms, etc. We can’t afford to have these all made from scratch, especially in scenes where we need a lot of them, so we rent them in bulk. After the scene was already shot, someone pointed out that one of the heads looked like George W. Bush.

In the DVD commentary, we mentioned this, though we should not have. We meant no disrespect to the former President and apologize if anything we said or did suggested otherwise.”

Winter Is Coming: I had hoped to avoid having to make a post about this, since a) it is old news and b) it is a silly controversy, but I’ve decided to reverse course. For one, the episode being pulled directly affects Thrones fans and also I want to keep discussion about this incident contained in one thread. A word of warning though, I don’t feel like having to moderate a political discussion on a freaking Game of Thrones site, so I’m not even going to bother. This thread will be unmoderated! If you can’t handle the heat, then stay away.


450 Comments

  1. Superdeluxe
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 3:05 pm | Permalink

    I’m reading HBO has pulled all the digital locations of Episode 10 season 1, where the George Bush head is at. And they are halting all shipments of DVD sets with this image.

    True?

  2. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    Superdeluxe: I’m reading HBO has pulled all the digital locations of Episode 10 season 1, where the George Bush head is at. And they are halting all shipments of DVD sets with this image.True?

    God, I hope not, what a stupid bunch of crap. And all because D&D couldn’t keep their mouths shut in the commentary. I guess they underestimated the sensitivity and stupidity of a large segment of our population (and no, this isn’t a dig against Republicans/Bush fans, just against anybody who could possibly find something so obviously innocuous and unintentional as offensive).

  3. Vanderhook
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 4:13 pm | Permalink

    I know this has nothing to do with the thread but here’s some breaking news: HBO has pulled Season 1 Episode 10 from all it’s scheduled programming, HBO, OnDemand, HBO GO and halted all production of Season 1 DVDs due to the Bush’s head incident.

    http://www.deadline.com/2012/06/game-of-thrones-episode-with-george-bushs-severed-head-pulled-from-rotation/

    Overreaction of the century.

  4. sjwenings
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 4:17 pm | Permalink

    Vanderhook: I know this has nothing to do with the thread but here’s some breaking news: HBO has pulled Season 1 Episode 10 from all it’s scheduled programming, HBO, OnDemand, HBO GO and halted all production of Season 1 DVDs due to the Bush’s head incident.

    http://www.deadline.com/2012/06/game-of-thrones-episode-with-george-bushs-severed-head-pulled-from-rotation/

    Overreaction of the century.

    Perhaps, but I guess it really doesn’t cost them much, and might help avoid a worst case scenario reaction to TGWBI.

  5. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 4:23 pm | Permalink

    Vanderhook:
    I know this has nothing to do with the thread but here’s some breaking news: HBO has pulled Season 1 Episode 10 from all it’s scheduled programming, HBO, OnDemand, HBO GO and halted all production of Season 1 DVDs due to the Bush’s head incident.

    http://www.deadline.com/2012/06/game-of-thrones-episode-with-george-bushs-severed-head-pulled-from-rotation/

    Overreaction of the century.

    Yup, just checked HBO On Demand and S1 Ep10 is gone. Bummer. Hope they edit and get it back up quickly, newbies just getting HBO ON Demand and wanting to watch GoT from the beginning will miss a lot of the plot points if they miss that one! On the positive, there are still DVD sets in the pipeline that have the episode in them as originally released for purchase online at other outlets.

    A woman has said many times that the effects of GWB’s terms will be felt for decades to come, little did I know…

  6. Arthur
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 4:48 pm | Permalink

    Vanderhook,

    I guess the season 1 bluray/DVD sets we all already own from this day forward will be known as “The GWB Beheaded Scenes” collector item sets…

  7. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:01 pm | Permalink

    Arthur:
    Vanderhook,

    I guess the season 1 bluray/DVD sets we all already own from this day forward will be known as “The GWB Beheaded Scenes” collector item sets…

    So weird, such a small, petty thing IMO. This will cost HBO some bucks.

  8. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:07 pm | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar,

    Toldja.

    This story is the kind of simplistic fodder that US conservative radio talking heads live on and it continues to bedevil HBO. The pull had to be done to control the bleeding. Even more may be required. Not good. D&D have a lot to learn.

  9. Pablo Jainaga
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:22 pm | Permalink

    I just read about the GWB prop head and all the fuss about it. Seriously, USA? Seriously???

  10. spacechampion
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    Bush-head-gate is basically just one histrionic politician, right? No one else is complaining?

  11. jkb
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    Pablo Jainaga:
    I just read about the GWB prop head and all the fuss about it. Seriously, USA? Seriously???

    pretty sad no? some people are in serious need of a hobby. funny thing is, i’m pretty sure most of us here would LOVE to see their head on a spike on the show. I know I would anyway ;p

  12. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:39 pm | Permalink

    Pablo Jainaga: I just read about the GWB prop head and all the fuss about it. Seriously, USA? Seriously???

    I don’t know what the political atmosphere is like elsewhere, but to depict the head of the 9/ll commander in chief on a pike—yeah, there’s going to be a problem with that.

  13. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:40 pm | Permalink

    spacechampion: Bush-head-gate is basically just one histrionic politician, right? No one else is complaining

    Wow. Read the comments section of every US-based entertainment and political website.

  14. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:49 pm | Permalink

    DH87: I don’t know what the political atmosphere is like elsewhere, but to depict the head of the 9/ll commander in chief on a pike—yeah, there’s going to be a problem with that.

    Only if the people with a problem are freaking stupid and never heard the identifying quote in context, it’s completely obvious nothing was meant by it. But I’m not surprised in the least, this country has an overabundance of morons waiting to jump all over the political opposition for any imagined slight.

  15. darquemode
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:50 pm | Permalink

    spacechampion,

    It made it to every entertainment news site and most national news sites as well. so it is not jsut an isolated fit.

    I do no think D&D meant anything by it, and I don’t think their commentary on the DVD was political whatsoever, but I thought their first attempt to explain it was lazy and too casual to be taken seriously. I think any person would realize it could spin out of control if not handled properly despite being a “non-issue” according to most fans.

    As soon as I saw the image I knew it was not going to spiral and explode in the news. I can’t see how others are so dismissive honestly. (And I’m generally a Bush-hater anti-conservative). At least HBO saw it for what it was and took appropriate steps to handle the situation. Too bad D&D did not do so when they realized Dubya’s head made it onto the series.

  16. Andrew
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:57 pm | Permalink

    DH87,

    I especially enjoyed one comment that suggested they use a painted cantalope in a wig, instead of an actual prosthetic head, haha. I also like how FOX added that HBO and CNN are owned by the same company at the end of their article. The American media makes me chuckle, especially the 24 hour stations. Certainly more entertaining than the 6 oclock news were used to here.

  17. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 5:59 pm | Permalink

    darquemode: Too bad D&D did not do so when they realized Dubya’s head made it onto the series.

    As usual, I agree with you. What we are seeing, combined with the Neil Marshall “perv” quote, is two very naive, even immature, guys who have a lot of growing up to do. No other way to explain it. What is surprising is that one of them is married to a seasoned actress, with a long career in Hollywood. He should have known better.

  18. Pablo Jainaga
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:02 pm | Permalink

    DH87: I don’t know what the political atmosphere is like elsewhere, but to depict the head of the 9/ll commander in chief on a pike—yeah, there’s going to be a problem with that.

    To begin with, it’s just a prop head that resembles him, wears a wig and stands in the background. No jokes, mentions or criticisms are made. You go too far with PC.

    Then again, I live in Spain and the majority of us would love to see the REAL heads of our corrupt politicians on pikes, so I may be biased. But thak’s god humor and mockery are allowed here and you don’t get sued or have shows cut for it.

  19. darquemode
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:04 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson,

    I disagree.

    Even if it was obvious to most people that nothing was meant by it (a point I agree with 100%), it was an ex-President’s head on a spike! It is something that is not done casually by anyone with common sense. Period.

    It’s the political equivalent of going to an airport and making jokes about bombs. Even if you don’t mean anything by the jokes, it was stupid to do in the first place and you need to take it seriously when someone else hears the joke and reports it. To just dismiss it as casual after-the-fact is impossible.D&D should have taken it seriously from the onset – more seriously than it deserves on merit because the topic is a so explosive during a political season. It’s just common sense.

    Do I think that being thrown in jail with a felony for making an ill-timed joke at the airport is over-reactionary? Absolutely. However because I am sane and have common sense I would never make jokes on the topic in that situation.

  20. Andrew
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:07 pm | Permalink

    darquemode,

    I don’t think that’s a fair comparison; a bomb joke can incite panic and represents an immediate possible threat. A prop head doesnt effect anything except perhaps Bushs feelings.

  21. Pablo Jainaga
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:10 pm | Permalink

    darquemode,

    So, what, you get thrown in jail for showing a head that resembles an ex-president atop a spike? Is there a law against it? I agree it’s dumb because you will get a lot of hate, and totally out of place in a show like GOT, but really, what harm it does and to whom?

  22. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:12 pm | Permalink

    Pablo Jainaga: But thak’s god humor and mockery are allowed here and you don’t get sued or have shows cut for it.

    With all respect, if Spain had been fighting two decade-long wars after a major attack, I suspect some Spaniards might not like to see a cavalier and entirely unnecessary depiction (in a completely political show) of the most polarizing politician in many people’s lifetimes. Thousands of lives lost on this man’s orders, the treasure worth a hundred countries’ resources expended on this man’s orders, the country utterly polarized……He is someone who is going to go down in US history as polarizing as—well, I won’t compare him to a Spanish figure of fifty years ago so as not to be accused of invoking Godwin’s law once again. (Remember, even Shakespeare’s plays were about English kings, especially those set in “Denmark” and “Italy.”)

    Literary allusions aren’t literal. The guys’ protestations made things worse, and they are going to be the ones to pay the price. Defending them is depleting HBO’s reservoir of good will towards them. They can recover but there can’t be any more of these missteps.

  23. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:13 pm | Permalink

    DH87: Wow. Read the comments section of every US-based entertainment and political website.

    Honestly, you seem to be the only one who’s really freaking out about it around here. I like to think that most of us are rational and intelligent enough to not give a shit. It was news 3 months ago, it was old news yesterday, it’s even older news today.

    I could be wrong, but I also seem to recall you freaking out about Neil Marhsall’s slip-up (about the nudity scenes). Enough with the doom and gloom. These things are really only a big deal when people choose to make them a big deal.

    I suggest we stop freaking out, and get back to the topic at hand: Season 2 recap.

  24. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:14 pm | Permalink

    darquemode: Steven Swanson, I disagree.Even if it was obvious to most people that nothing was meant by it (a point I agree with 100%), it was an ex-President’s head on a spike! It is something that is not done casually by anyone with common sense. Period.It’s the political equivalent of going to an airport and making jokes about bombs. Even if you don’t mean anything by the jokes, it was stupid to do in the first place and you need to take it seriously when someone else hears the joke and reports it. To just dismiss it as casual after-the-fact is impossible.D&D should have taken it seriously from the onset – more seriously than it deserves on merit because the topic is a so explosive during a political season. It’s just common sense.Do I think that being thrown in jail with a felony for making an ill-timed joke at the airport is over-reactionary? Absolutely. However because I am sane and have common sense I would never make jokes on the topic in that situation.

    Wait, so using a head resembling a former president that nobody noticed on broadcast, and that nobody ever would have noticed had one of the showrunners not mentioned it as a funny background tidbit on the DVD’s and still was not paid any attention to for months, is somehow equivalent to joking about a bomb while going through airport security? Absolutely no way in hell.

    And I agree that they were a little naive to mention that, or at least they way underestimated the sensitivity and stupidity of a large chunk of the American populace. Personally I didn’t even think twice when I heard it other than to think it was funny, and not in a political sense, but just because it’s funny that they happened to have an ex-president’s head lying around and used it.

  25. Andrew
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:17 pm | Permalink

    Lex,

    Well, she wasnt lying. The comments on both FOX and CNN are freaking out about this. Perhaps Winter will make a post about HBOs reaction in the next few days, where we can discuss our oppinions on it further.

  26. vanderhook
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:18 pm | Permalink

    So the ultra-right can handle the incest, violence, baby killing, gratuitous sex, torture, rape, child rape, and children committing murder, but when a prop sort of looks like a past president ITS AN OUTRAGE.

    Makes sense.

  27. Pablo Jainaga
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:20 pm | Permalink

    DH87: With all respect, if Spain had been fighting two decade-long wars after a major attack, I suspect some Spaniards might not like to see a cavalier and entirely unnecessary depiction (in a completely political show) of the most polarizing politician in many people’s lifetimes. Thousands of lives lost on this man’s orders, the treasure worth a hundred countries’ resources expended on this man’s orders, the country utterly polarized……He is someone who is going to go down in US history as—well, let me not compare him to a Spanish figure of fifty years ago so as not to be accused of invoking Godwin’s law once again.

    Ok, maybe it’s difficult for us outside the US to fully understand the implications, but honestly it just sounds silly to be making a case about it. Does Godwin law aply to Franco too? Lol

  28. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:21 pm | Permalink

    vanderhook: So the ultra-right can handle the incest, violence, baby killing, gratuitous sex, torture, rape, child rape, and children committing murder, but when a prop sort of looks like a past president ITS AN OUTRAGE.Makes sense.

    I’m guessing most of the people complaining have never seen the show.

    And on a positive note, any publicity is good publicity, and even if the show loses a few viewers over this (very few I’d guess, since the IQ level required to follow this show isn’t really compatible with this kind of irrational freakout) it’s getting it a lot more attention that it never would’ve had otherwise.

  29. darquemode
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:24 pm | Permalink

    Andrew,

    You’re right on some level…
    However my point has nothing to do with potential for damage etc…
    Some things are improper and disrespectful, and just do not need to be joked about. It was obviously not a threat towards Dubya and I may have even used the mask if I was the propmaster. I may have disguised it more than a bad wig and a little dirt though! XD

    Once it broke into the media what it started as and what it “is” are now two different things. Any person who has worked in entertainment or news or anything in the public eye should understand that and know when to not make jokes.

    If I were Dubya I would give a quote rquesting royalties from HBO and demanding to be nominated for Best ‘Supported’ Actor.

    Thankfully I’m not Dubya……

  30. vanderhook
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:25 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: I’m guessing most of the people complaining have never seen the show.

    And on a positive note, any publicity is good publicity, and even if the show loses a few viewers over this (very few I’d guess, since the IQ level required to follow this show isn’t really compatible with this kind of irrational freakout) it’s getting it a lot more attention that it never would’ve had otherwise.

    It won’t lose any viewers at all over this. Maybe a small, small SMALL segment. I’m talking like .0000002%. If you are the type to get offended over a president’s likeness in a prop, I doubt they’d have made it this far considering the incest, nudity, violence etc etc etc.

    Really baffles me how HBO is bending over backwards for a minority of right-wing nutjobs who don’t even watch HBO to begin with.

  31. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:29 pm | Permalink

    Andrew,

    CNN and FOX freak out about everything, every day, no matter how ridiculous. It’s just what they do. As I said yesterday multiple times, I fail to see how WiC making a thread about it would contribute anything positive or productive to the situation in any way.

    As DH87 pointed out, there are MANY other sites were you can talk about this. I don’t know about you, but the last thing I want to read about on here is a ridiculous political debate (over something as stupid as a prop halloween mask).

    It’s already ruining this Season 2 recap thread.

  32. Pablo Jainaga
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:32 pm | Permalink

    vanderhook,

    Yeah, that’s my point. HBO should have said FY! If they apologize they reckon to be guilty of something, which they obviously aren’t.

  33. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:44 pm | Permalink

    vanderhook: Really baffles me how HBO is bending over backwards for a minority of right-wing nutjobs who don’t even watch HBO to begin with.

    HBO is owned by Time Warner, as is CNN, which is trying hard to be seen as a politically balanced news provider, whose primary competition is Fox News. Fox would like nothing more than to paint CNN as left/Democrat-leaning so will do anything it can to prove it is anti-Republication/anti-conservative in its viewpoint. Time Warner doesn’t want to add fuel to that controversy. As the world’s second largest media company, TW also goes before the US Congress on occasion to ask for consideration of issues such as private property/copyright infringement and the internet carriage agreements that are often brought up on this site. The US Congress is often controlled by the Republican Party. It’s all connected.

    No need to belabor this further, but I hope one can see how some small gaff can reverberate through a corporate structure in the United States. (Disclaimer: I once worked for a wholly owned subsidiary of Time Warner’s predecessor, Time-Life.)

  34. darquemode
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:53 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson,

    I made the point to say it was the politcal equivalent…. not that it was the same thing. I stand by that. One does not joke about killing a president or putting his head on a spike just like one does not make bomb jokes at the airport.

    Secondly, the act of the head being used in filming is not the issue to me whatsoever. How D&D handled it so poorly is the issue. That’s why HBO reacted as they did as quick as they did.

    Lastly, I’m not going to go on about this. Too much time has been spent on it already since I don’t particularly care about it and think it’s more sad that D&D did not have enough sense to realize they should handle the situation in a serious manner, and mostly because this topic is about Season 2 recaps and feelings.

    I guess some people will just see it as a non-issue that was handled appropriately by D&D and some will see it a non-issue that became an issue because of how it was handled inappropriately by D&D. Agree to disagree in the end..

  35. spacechampion
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:55 pm | Permalink

    DH87: Wow. Read the comments section of every US-based entertainment and political website.

    I rather stick my head in a pike.

    I was simply asking a question, but by removing my punctuation you made it seem like i was making a statement. Nice, thanks for that.

    Just because the idiot media is reporting on something doesn’t mean anyone cares. And just because someone says they are outraged at something doesn’t mean they are. Hell, I’m quite convinced most of those republicans who insist that Obama is a muslim don’t really believe it, merely repeat it in some delusional logic that somehow they are scoring some points. Partisan nonsense with the quite common manufactured outrage.

  36. Mormegil
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 6:56 pm | Permalink

    So is this not a good time to point out that one of the guys cut in half during the Battle of the Blackwater looks a little like Bill Clinton?

    This reminds me of the time the producers of Doctor Who hired a Tony Blair lookalike to play the Prime Minister who had been killed by aliens. Only trouble was he wasn’t a very good lookalike and it wasn’t till the DVD commentary that most people realised it was meant to be Blair.

    Can’t recall the UK Press going apeshit over the attempted portrayal of Tony Blairs death though.

  37. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:04 pm | Permalink

    spacechampion,

    I may have selected your comment for “quote” and inadvertently left off the ending question mark. I did not mean to misrepresent your comment and assumed it was meant rhetorically as one not to be answered.

  38. Clabog
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:04 pm | Permalink

    Guess we won’t be seeing a Bush variation of the Ned Stark’s head on a spike poster anytime soon.

  39. João Amaral
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:06 pm | Permalink

    ridiculous.

  40. Arthur
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:07 pm | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar,

    I pray HBO doesn’t hold a grudge with D&D for this commentary brain-fart that is causing some right wing outrage.

  41. Lonestarr
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:08 pm | Permalink

    So, could this have possible repercussions on the future of Game of Thrones? I would hate to see this show canceled because of such a stupid ordeal.

  42. Nymeria
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:09 pm | Permalink

    This is crazy!! Of all things to get your knickers in a twist over – a head that may or may not LOOK like a former president… in a wig… from the side… half covered by hair… can I be more upset by the fact that Ned’s head didn’t really look like Sean Bean?!

  43. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:09 pm | Permalink

    darquemode: Lastly, I’m not going to go on about this. Too much time has been spent on it already since I don’t particularly care about it and think it’s more sad that D&D did not have enough sense to realize they should handle the situation in a serious manner, and mostly because this topic is about Season 2 recaps and feelings.
    I guess some people will just see it as a non-issue that was handled appropriately by D&D and some will see it a non-issue that became an issue because of how it was handled inappropriately by D&D. Agree to disagree in the end..

    They didn’t mishandle it by not taking it seriously, they mishandled it by mentioning it at all, otherwise nobody would have noticed. Ever.

  44. nimble dick
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:12 pm | Permalink

    Hey everybody lets over react over a stpid mask. There only becasues of budget reasons. This gives more support that bush spports are backwards goat/sister fuckers.

  45. Aegon the Conqueror
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:13 pm | Permalink

    Arthur,

    Heard that for Joffrey’s head they are planning to use a replica of Justine Bieber.

  46. Katie
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:14 pm | Permalink

    I do sort of wish D&D had never drawn attention to it. It’s pulling politics into a place where it really doesn’t need to be, even if that wasn’t the original intent.

    That said, the reaction to it seems really disproportionate. I can understand being somewhat turned off by the whole thing if you are/were a supporter of Bush and his policies, but the righteous indignation going on over what amounts to a frame in an episode of television seems silly. There are much bigger issues to be worrying about.

  47. Mirax
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:14 pm | Permalink

    On the one hand, it is completely ridiculous. On the other, with the current political atmosphere the other side would probably cry foul as well. It isn’t a Republican thing, it’s just a an easy political soundbite to try to sway the vaguely interested.

  48. Ser WARZ
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:16 pm | Permalink

    Is this a joke? Who gives a flying fugg if George Bush’s head has appeared in effigy.

  49. msd
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:25 pm | Permalink

    I’ve worked a bit in publicity, TV publicity no less, and make no mistake, HBO knows exactly what they’re doing.

    They’re totally egging the media on with this one. They’re not trying to douse the flames, they’re fanning them. Deliberately. And media outlets are totally taking the bait. The end result is the kind of publicity you can’t buy in outlets that would never usually give you the time of day.

  50. LordEddardStark
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:29 pm | Permalink

    So just because one guy complained about it all Conservatives are being bashed for it? Some don’t even really give a shit. I’m a Republican and support Bush, but this head fiasco didn’t bug me when it was announced, like, 3 months ago. And hey, don’t bash GWB for it. I’m pretty sure he doesn’t give two shits anyway. As with most other Republicans. Imagine if that was Obama’s fake head on a spike. Liberals would be doing the same exact thing.

  51. Mean25
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:30 pm | Permalink

    D&D are green boys, not just in writing. How could they not see this coming. Just don’t mention anything about politics.

  52. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:32 pm | Permalink

    msd: I’ve worked a bit in publicity, TV publicity no less, and make no mistake, HBO knows exactly what they’re doing. They’re totally egging the media on with this one. They’re not trying to douse the flames, they’re fanning them. Deliberately. And media outlets are totally taking the bait. The end result is the kind of publicity you can’t buy in outlets that would never usually give you the time of day.

    Wouldn’t be surprised at all.

  53. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:34 pm | Permalink

    msd: They’re totally egging the media on with this one.

    If you are correct, what do you think their next move is?

  54. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:35 pm | Permalink

    I would be laughing at loud if former president Menem´s head (and so many others) would be on a spike…or the actual heads. And we also had bloody terrorist attacks (twice). And a war and state terrorism.
    It´s just so silly. D&D can´t have political humor? In Game of Thrones? lol

    msd,
    That makes sense. Everyone will be looking famous heads in season 3.

    Lex: It was not a political statement

    I agree with you, it is stupid but if it was a political statement? Is that so wrong? I know, you´re gone now.

  55. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:36 pm | Permalink

    I have three things to say, then I’m out.

    A) This is one of the stupidest controversies I’ve EVER heard in my life. It was not a political statement, it was a fucking halloween mask prop they had lying around.

    B) Anyone offended by this Bush head is, IMO, certifiably insane.

    C) I feel confident that this will only serve to BOOST ratings next year.

    Anyways, congrats on forcing WiC to post this ridiculous, overblown, outdated “news” story. Enjoy the handwringing doom and gloom.

  56. spacechampion
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:36 pm | Permalink

    msd:
    I’ve worked a bit in publicity, TV publicity no less, and make no mistake, HBO knows exactly what they’re doing.

    They’re totally egging the media on with this one. They’re not trying to douse the flames, they’re fanning them. Deliberately. And media outlets are totally taking the bait. The end result is the kind of publicity you can’t buy in outlets that would never usually give you the time of day.

    Heh. I’ve been wondering if the torrented copies downloaded would top 100 million after this week.

  57. Claidheamh
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:37 pm | Permalink

    Aren’t these the same people that criticised muslims who were offended by the Danish cartoon of Mohammed? Jesus, hypocrisy runs deep.

    Even if something was meant by it (which it obviously wasn’t), it’s the equivalent of a political cartoon. And the US claim to be champions of liberty? If only their founding fathers knew it would turn out like this, they probably would have prefered to remain British.

  58. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:45 pm | Permalink

    Lex: Enjoy the handwringing doom and gloom.

    It won’t be the same without you, Lex. :)

  59. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:45 pm | Permalink

    Claidheamh:
    Aren’t these the same people that criticised muslims who were offended by the Danish cartoon of Mohammed? Jesus, hypocrisy runs deep.

    EXACTLY what it reminded me of. This “controversy” reeks of censorship and infringement of free speech. FOX News and other right wing groups are so reactionary, they don’t even realize the sheer hypocrisy of their reactions. Do they want freedom of speech or not?

    Okay, now I’m really done with this thread, I promise.

  60. paylor
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:47 pm | Permalink

    I hate George W. Bush. I find him repulsive. I think he did a lot of damage to this country and to this world during his term in office. I think the media has completely overreacted, as usual, with their bias towards sensationalism shining through once again. However, it was really stupid for D&D to point out that it was Bush’s head on a spike. And I don’t like seeing any real person desecrated in effigy.

  61. Staeven Vallak
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:48 pm | Permalink

    DH87,

    9/11 Commander in chief? Are you referring the guy reading a book upside down with a vacant expression? Pity they didn’t put Rumsfeld’s and Cheney’s heads on spikes next to monkey boy.

    What do they say about publicity? ;-)

  62. vntrlqst
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:49 pm | Permalink

    If anything, his head being next to Ned Stark’s head is a statement regarding Jr.’s undue crucifixion by the liberal media. I mean, really, Ned was an honorable, upstanding guy, only trying to do the right thing, much like our 43rd president. That they are both deemed treasonous enemies of the realm by the same sociopath king is only logical.

  63. Damryn of Dorne
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:50 pm | Permalink

    I’m glad there is finally a post on this, and despite what Lex mentioned in the other thread, this is a news site. Says so right at the top of the page.

    I too think it’s a ridiculous controversy, and pretty much encapsulates everything that is wrong with the ole U.S. of A. i.e. Ok with gratuitous violence, rape et al, but not ok with a toy head of a former head of state being used. That being said, I’m happy we have somewhere people can vent without poisoning all the other threads.

    My 2 cents.

  64. Staeven Vallak
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:50 pm | Permalink

    DH87: I don’t know what the political atmosphere is like elsewhere, but to depict the head of the 9/ll commander in chief on a pike—yeah, there’s going to be a problem with that.

    9/11 Commander in chief? Are you referring the guy reading a book upside down with a vacant expression? Pity they didn’t put Rumsfeld’s and Cheney’s heads on spikes next to monkey boy.

    What do they say about “any publicity”? ;-)

  65. The Dragon Demands
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:54 pm | Permalink

    This is a textbook definition of the Streisand Effect; calling so much attention to this is blowing it up into a bigger controversy than it actually is.

    They should have just quietly digitally altered it in the next naturally ocurring print run.

  66. Blood
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:55 pm | Permalink

    Bush is a war criminal, so it makes sense to see his head on a spike.

  67. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:55 pm | Permalink

    Lex: Okay, now I’m really done with this thread, I promise.

    Don’t tease us, Lex. Every thread needs its resident curmudgeon. Come back, you know you want to.

  68. msd
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:56 pm | Permalink

    DH87,

    Well, they’ve made their move. They don’t really need to do anything else. Media cycles are short (nowadays really, really short) and the rest of the media will play the “scandal” out for them. Then it will die down as everyone moves onto the next thing.

    The key thing here is that HBO doesn’t have nervous nelly advertisers to worry about. They thrive on controversy and they love being part of the cultural conversation. (How long until a GoT and GWB head joke makes its way onto a talk show or becomes a viral video?) They know that people who like the show won’t stop watching it. There’s no risk of that. They also know that a bunch of people who have probably never heard of GoT now know the name and are probably curious. It’s a win for the publicity department.

  69. LordStarkington
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:57 pm | Permalink

    LOUD ANGRY OUTRAGE GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

  70. Aegon the Conqueror
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:58 pm | Permalink

    Superdeluxe,

    Yes HBO released a statement earlier today. All shipments are indeed being stopped.

  71. Meg
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    msd: They’re totally egging the media on with this one.

    Yup, just like banned books, the authors can only benefit from the publicity.

    As for me, I’m chuckling at the satire and the headlines.

  72. Chris
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    If it was done on purpose, it seems juvenile. If it was done accidentally, it seems amateurish.

    I think a bit of the problem is HBO is seen as being a creature of the left. Rightly or wrongly, the home of Bill Maher and many a left leaning documentary, this makes the right predisposed to think it was done on purpose.

    I do think it is inappropriate to label those upset as stupid, or to belittle them, that is the kind of thing that keeps these arguments going. The person above who said if it was Obama people would be upset is absolutely right, you’d have demonstrations outside of HBO’s headquarters already. This type of overreaction is not indicative of either side, but the nature of both of them.

    I personally think it would be inappropriate to use a fake severed head of any real public figure in a fantasy world show. Bush, Obama, Lady Gaga, etc, who isn’t in on the gag. Whomever chose the prop should have known this, and D&D probably should have realized it too.

  73. Ser Eld
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:01 pm | Permalink

    Claidheamh:
    Aren’t these the same people that criticised muslims who were offended by the Danish cartoon of Mohammed? Jesus, hypocrisy runs deep.

    I ditto that! The most true thing said in this thread.

  74. Aegon the Conqueror
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:01 pm | Permalink

    Aegon the Conqueror,

    Ps so glad I still have a copy of the original episode mwahahaha! On weekends my buddy Maegor the cruel and I like to laugh about it!

  75. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:05 pm | Permalink

    msd:
    DH87,

    Well, they’ve made their move. They don’t really need to do anything else. Media cycles are short (nowadays really, really short) and the rest of the media will play the “scandal” out for them. Then it will die down as everyone moves onto the next thing.

    So your view is that they planned each step: the “surprised” indignation after the 109 “reveal”; the disapproving “apology”; the withdrawing of the episode and its $$ consequences?

    Seems the next step would be to announce the “scrubbed” new version of the DVD/extras with another “heart-felt” apology for causing distress and writing off the cost of the pulled DVDs as a publicity cost. D&D are fine, and perhaps in better shape than they were?

    Viable theory.

  76. Blood
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:08 pm | Permalink

    I think a bit of the problem is HBO is seen as being a creature of the left. Rightly or wrongly, the home of Bill Maher and many a left leaning documentary, this makes the right predisposed to think it was done on purpose.

    HBO is a “creature of the left”, just as all companies or other avenues that allow for freedom of expression and creativity are. Conservatism is inherently stifling and repressive.

  77. TMWNN
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:09 pm | Permalink

    darquemode:

    I do no think D&D meant anything by it, and I don’t think their commentary on the DVD was political whatsoever, but I thought their first attempt to explain it was lazy and too casual to be taken seriously … Too bad D&D did not do so when they realized Dubya’s head made it onto the series.

    darquemode,

    Right. There’s a Hollywood echo-chamber mentality that prevents even smart men like Benioff and Weiss from thinking that their action might be seen as tasteless. Good article from *TIME*’s TV critic (and big fan of *GoT*/ASoIaF) on how the Bush head incident demonstrates the industry’s tin ear. He explains why it was a dumb thing to do (and talk about) very well.

  78. Blood
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:14 pm | Permalink

    Still, the whole incident is not likely to win HBO much more love from conservatives, who already see the network as enemy territory because of projects like the recent Sarah Palin movie Game Change

    HBO will never get love from the conservatives. They should not try to do so.

  79. Dan
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:15 pm | Permalink

    DH87,

    I disagree. I think what this shows is how lame a lot of people are and how their priorities over what they take offense to is out of wack.

  80. Varamyr Fourskins
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    Glad I got a Blu-Ray copy before they pulled it.

    Surprised FoxNews™ didn’t catch on to this earlier (actually, I’m not).

    You’d think Republicans would be happy about it. Dubya was one of good guys up there with Ned. It would’ve been more realistic if they’d made him one of Joffrey’s buddies, but this is a fantasy show, after all.

  81. furrever
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    Thoughts from a conservative (yet pragmatic) Republican….

    To me the question is around whether or not the offending prop was truly intended to be in the image of the former US president, or if it just coincidentally matched his resemblance.

    If the prior, this is in fact in extremely poor taste on the part of HBO; and all of the conservative outrage is completely merited. (Imagine if it were President Obama’s head on the spike, or ANY publicly-recognizable person’s visage for that matter.)

    If the latter, however (which appears to be the case from what I’ve read), then this is an over-reaction of epic proportions. And it’s very despicable if conservative talk show hosts are in fact taking advantage of a coincidental resemblance to stir up vitriol among the party base.

    I suspect we’ll never know the truth though. Certainly if the prop head was meant to look like George W. Bush, no one from HBO in their right mind will admit to it now. I for one am willing to give the show’s production crew the benefit of the doubt and say this was all an unfortunate coincidence.

  82. Alex Dubrovsky
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:19 pm | Permalink

    Mormegil:
    So is this not a good time to point out that one of the guys cut in half during the Battle of the Blackwater looks a little like Bill Clinton?

    This reminds me of the time the producers of Doctor Who hired a Tony Blair lookalike to play the Prime Minister who had been killed by aliens. Only trouble was he wasn’t a very good lookalike and it wasn’t till the DVD commentary that most people realised it was meant to be Blair.

    Can’t recall the UK Press going apeshit over the attempted portrayal of Tony Blairs death though.

    AFAIR, in S3 finale of DW, the American president was killed by aliens. I don’t remember any outrage …

    This is one of the stupidest non-stories I’ve ever seen. Only the nonsense with a “sex scene” in Mass Effect 1 can be compared to it.

  83. john
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:24 pm | Permalink

    Blood:
    Bush is a war criminal, so it makes sense to see his head on a spike.

  84. Varamyr Fourskins
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:25 pm | Permalink

    If HBO had been trying to hide the severed Dubya head, Benioff wouldn’t have pointed it out on the DVD commentary (which was released a couple months ago). It’s not like it was a secret (which I now see was pointed out in the post after going back and actually reading it).

    Oh well, it is election time. Politicians need something to piss and moan about. But HBO shouldn’t have caved. Conservatives will never support a station that is any way associated with Bill Maher, so might as well forget about it. The Dubya head is small fries in comparison.

  85. Dan
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:28 pm | Permalink

    darquemode,

    I made the point to say it was the politcal equivalent…. not that it was the same thing. I stand by that. One does not joke about killing a president or putting his head on a spike just like one does not make bomb jokes at the airport.

    Nobody made a joke about killing a president or putting his head on a spike. They used a plastic head that resembles a jerk off politician because they had it on hand. The only reason anybody is making anything out of this is because people think that the politicians, who are the most corrupt and untruthful people on the planet, must be respected.

  86. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:29 pm | Permalink

    furrever: To me the question is around whether or not the offending prop was truly intended to be in the image of the former US president, or if it just coincidentally matched his resemblance.

    If I understand your question, the prosthetic head began life as the head of GWB. The wig was added, obviously, I would assume, to more closely match the other period heads on the pikes. That would have disguised the head adequately if not for the identification on the DVD of the head as that of GWB. That comment seems to point to the fact that D&D knew what they were using and simply used it. They didn’t use as an excuse that they thought the wig would disguise the head and haven’t since then. It just doesn’t ever seemed to them to have been any big deal, just something to point out as though they were making a comment on a location. For whatever reason, they seemed to have been completely tone-deaf to any implications and now the discussion is whether HBO is exploiting the consequences or tempting to defusethem.

  87. msd
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:33 pm | Permalink

    DH87: So your view is that they planned each step: the “surprised” indignation after the 109 “reveal”; the disapproving “apology”; the withdrawing of the episode and its $$ consequences?

    Seems the next step would be to announce the “scrubbed” new version of the DVD/extras with another “heart-felt” apology for causing distress and writing off the cost of the pulled DVDs as a publicity cost? D&D are fine, and perhaps in better shape than they were?

    Viable theory.

    I don’t think the whole timeline was planned like that, step by step. It’s hard to do something like that in a totally orchestrated way. The reaction to the story breaking is the part that’s deliberate. That is, it’s a deliberate overreaction that gives the story legs in the press, rather than a naive or knee jerk response. They’re allowing it to blow up a bit in the press because it’s actually good for the show and HBO.

    Also, if Season 1 is close to the end of its first run, it’s not a huge deal to pull the last shipments, especially if what’s left is guaranteed to go flying out of shops this week thanks to people who want to see the fake head.

  88. Oranje
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:39 pm | Permalink

    Blood: Bush is a war criminal, so it makes sense to see his head on a spike.

    Apparently it is OK if you issue orders that managed to get hundreds of thousands killed. But since the person responsible for that is beyond reproach because if you put that person’s fake head on a stick people get upset… Hypocrisy thy name is well known. The Hague seems to be missing a “guest”…

  89. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:40 pm | Permalink

    The liberals on this thread would have gone apeshit if it had been the head of a Dem President on the pike. Remember all the hand wringing and pearl clutching over Palin’s bullseye signs in the wake of the Giffords shooting? It was all “wahhh, violent rhetoric and imagery from conservatives!” Talk about hypocritical.

  90. Susan
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:41 pm | Permalink

    I’ll tell you what would have been really hilarious, Obama’s head on that spike.

  91. Trumpet
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:48 pm | Permalink

    This is just a media generated controversy designed to whip morons into a frenzy in order to sell advertising to more eyeballs.

    I heartily endorse the use of “cameo appearance” heads in future episodes. It could be turned into a drinking game!

  92. John-Michael Lelievre
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:49 pm | Permalink

    Ridiculous, that is all.

  93. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:50 pm | Permalink

    I don´t understand: art/enterteinment has to be apolitical? I thought that this lie was nothing but an old trick of Hollywood. Culture is never an apolitical thing (nothing is). The more apolitical it seems the more political truly is. Don´t see the issue.

  94. Queensmoot
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:52 pm | Permalink

    I really don’t get what the fuss is about. I’m a liberal, but if they had made the same comments in the commentary and it had been Obama’s head, or Clinton’s, or the Pope’s, or my mother’s I wouldn’t have cared. Deep breath people.

    The outrage game is getting embarrassing, but at least my Blu-ray is worth more now!

  95. Darren Mason
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:52 pm | Permalink

    lmao:
    The liberals on this thread would have gone apeshit if it had been the head of a Dem President on the pike. Remember all the hand wringing and pearl clutching over Palin’s bullseye signs in the wake of the Giffords shooting? It was all “wahhh, violent rhetoric and imagery from conservatives!” Talk about hypocritical.

    I’m not a liberal or conservative and I don’t care if they put Obama’s head on a pike, they even said it wasn’t anything political. If they were trying to make some political statement then they did a bad job because I couldn’t even tell it was him.

    This whole thing is silly and HBO is just making it worse by overreacting. Anyone who got upset over it has the emotional sensitivity of a child and should grow up.

  96. Graskell
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:55 pm | Permalink

    I thought this was some kind of joke at first, like an off-season April fools prank, but then I read the article. God, my country can be so retarded sometimes.

  97. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:56 pm | Permalink

    Oranje,

    The Allies issued order that got millions killed in WWII. Should they all have been tried at Nuremberg? That’s the problem with liberals, imagining that something they disagree with must be ipso facto a crime (a sentiment they routinely accuse conservatives of harboring). Hypocrisy indeed. “Oranje” would be speaking German today and his beloved Den Haag would be Judenrein, not housing the ICJ, if it were the Allies instead of the Nazis trussed up at Nuremberg.

  98. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 8:58 pm | Permalink

    msd: The reaction to the story breaking is the part that’s deliberate.

    Interestingly, of the sixty comments on DeadlineHollywood’s thread on the topic, not one calls HBO out as purposely fanning the flames, which is unusual given the insiders who typically make up the posters over there.

  99. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:01 pm | Permalink

    Darren Mason,

    Tell that to the crybaby liberals who started the whole “civility” drive after getting in high dudgeon over supposedly ‘violent’ conservative rhetoric. They didn’t find it acceptable then did they? The papers and broadcast media were filled with aggrieved liberals and Democrats musing about how conservatives have coarsened public discourse and provoked political violence. LOL.

  100. daniel
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:03 pm | Permalink

    Really disappointing to see this decision by hbo. Just silly. Should have just ignored it….

  101. William Aaron Grandy
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:04 pm | Permalink

    Janet Jackson nipple slip anybody? Over reaction of the century version 2.

    Top comment in the youtube video:

    “At least Joffrey did one thing right….”

  102. Dreamlife
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:07 pm | Permalink

    Look, I hate GBW, but I agree, it was in bad taste to use the prop. It was even dumber for them to call attention to it. If it was Obama’s head, the fall out would be much worse. David and Dan just learned a hard lesson that just because you’re on HBO doesn’t mean you can pull this off. I think HBO did the right thing issuing an apology. However, pulling that episode and halting production on the DVDs is going a bit far. Hopefully they can digitally remove that scene quickly and get it right back into the schedule so new viewers can watch that awesome episode.

  103. Solar
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:08 pm | Permalink

    doesn’t really look like bush to me. well, as theon said, “if i told them they were goats people would have saw horns”

  104. The DarkStar
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:09 pm | Permalink

    HBO is doing the right thing. They have to take the ultimate high ground here.
    I would be offended if it were Obama’s head on a spike, therefore I can understand if someone is offended by Bush’s head. Art should definitely not be Apolitical, but it’s too direct, and certainly disrespectful, It’s supposed to be handled……artfully.
    Makes jokes about W all you want, he’s a retard.
    But a HUGE show like Game of Thrones can’t go putting a likeness of him bloody and dead.
    Just like I can say Bush is a bum, but Obama can’t.

  105. Fire And Blood
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:10 pm | Permalink

    I just read this with the most disbelieving look on my face. This is probably the stupidest of all stupid overreactions. Shame on you, HBO, you spineless wanks.

    My irritation has nothing to do with politics. Ask yourself if you’d have made a stink about it if it had been Obama’s head on that spike instead of Dubya’s. And if so, fuck you, hypocrites.

    Oh, and while I’m at it, a big FaB middle finger to anyone who has ever been “offended” by anything not said directly to them or to someone they care about. You’re weaker in my eyes.

    Yeah, I know that’s a lot of you. But overreactive tendencies to go all kneejerk and pull the “offended” card gives us shit like this.

    Irked.

  106. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:13 pm | Permalink

    Fire And Blood,

    Yup. The only thing I’m “offended” by is HBO’s over-the-top, overblown reaction. IMO, it looks really bad that they didn’t stand by their producers and their product. They still could have apologized without sounding like they were reprimanding D & D.

    Weak, HBO… Really weak.

    And I said it before, but I’ll say it again… anyone “offended” by the Bush head is, IMO, either insane or just incredibly immature and reactionary. Believe it or not, there is no such thing as a “right” to not be offended. Politics, religion, whatever… it’s all fair game for ridicule and satire. That’s what freedom is. Don’t like it? Move to Iran or North Korea.

    Sorry, couldn’t resist another post. This whole “scandal” makes me want to puke all over the internet.

  107. Katie
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:15 pm | Permalink

    andrea:
    I don´t understand:art/enterteinment has to be apolitical? I thought that this lie was nothing but an old trick of Hollywood. Culture is never an apolitical thing (nothing is). The more apolitical it seems the more political truly is. Don´t see the issue.

    I don’t think that’s really the issue here. I think the bigger problem is that putting someone’s head on a spike in the background contributes absolutely nothing helpful to the political discussion. It doesn’t raise helpful question, or offer helpful solutions. It doesn’t contribute anything to the show. It’s just a cheap shot joke in the background. It’s not the end of the world that some people are making it out to be, but if it was done on purpose, it’s kind of ugly.

    I didn’t like Bush. I thought his presidency was damaging to the country on the whole and that he made poor decisions compounded by a lack of flexibility. But I don’t see how putting his head on a spike in the background of a fantasy television show (or, if it was accidental/circumstantial, drawing attention to it in a commentary) does anything besides stir up unnecessary rancor when politics are nasty enough already.

  108. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:16 pm | Permalink

    The DarkStar,

    but art has nothing to do with good taste or common sense, fortunately. I don´t mean this particular political joke, but in general, you know.

  109. Ser Pounce
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:16 pm | Permalink

    Arthur,

    that’s a good point, that’s going to be a valuable blueray in the future lol

  110. William Aaron Grandy
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:17 pm | Permalink

    The DarkStar:
    HBO is doing the right thing. They have to take the ultimate high ground here.
    I would be offended if it were Obama’s head on a spike, therefore I can understand if someone is offended by Bush’s head. Art should definitely not be Apolitical, but it’s too direct, and certainly disrespectful, It’s supposed to be handled……artfully.
    Makes jokes about W all you want, he’s a retard.
    But a HUGE show like Game of Thrones can’t go putting a likeness of him bloody and dead.
    Just like I can say Bush is a bum, but Obama can’t.

    Are you the same people who are baffled over muslims reactions to the depictions of Muhammad in the media?? Southpark can lampoon JC and Muhammad all they like but this is too far? Americans are ridiculous… land of the free my ass. love it when sadam huseyin is a dog in Hot Shots Part Deux. Pretty funny…. Wonder how Iraqi’s felt tho??

  111. sukeyna
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:19 pm | Permalink

    DH87: Interestingly, of the sixty comments on DeadlineHollywood’s thread on the topic, not one calls HBO out as purposely fanning the flames, which is unusual given the insiders who typically make up the posters over there.

    It could be that a lot of “insiders” take it for granted that there’s no such thing as bad publicity in show business and feel no need to comment on that aspect. There’s no doubt in my mind that curiosity will bring some new eyeballs to GOT and that a large number of those people will like what they see.

    Nobody at HBO is losing sleep over this stupid faux controversy.

  112. John
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:24 pm | Permalink

    Claidheamh: Aren’t these the same people that criticised muslims who were offended by the Danish cartoon of Mohammed? Jesus, hypocrisy runs deep.

    Even if something was meant by it (which it obviously wasn’t), it’s the equivalent of a political cartoon. And the US claim to be champions of liberty? If only their founding fathers knew it would turn out like this, they probably would have prefered to remain British.

    Not the same thing at all. The Danish cartoonist has had to deal with multiple assassination plots and/or attempts. Nobody seriously thinks that Benioff or Weiss might be in any danger over this.

    For the record, I think this is overblown, and I voted for Bush. The reason I think it’s overblown is because I buy their explanation. That said, they should have edited it out as soon as they realized it, and they sure as hell shouldn’t have alerted everyone by pointing it out in their commentary. And now that it’s our there, I think HBO is probably doing the right thing by trying to get out in front of it. There’s just some things, intentional or not, that should be avoided, if for no other reason as to avoid stoking outrage. And this is one of them. It’s disappointing that people catching up on the series for the first time can’t watch it on demand, though. I would have hoped that HBO would just do a quick edit and replace it without interrupting anyone’s ability to watch it. But I guess they decided that they don’t want it available at all anymore, and I get that. I just hope that they have the edited version up quickly.

  113. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:24 pm | Permalink

    Ser Pounce:
    Arthur,

    that’s a good point, that’s going to be a valuable blueray in the future lol

    I never planned on buying the Blu-Rays (I own the DVDs), but now I’m thinking about it.

    If nothing else, just so I can see Bush’s head in all it’s hi-res glory. ;)

  114. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:26 pm | Permalink

    John: Not the same thing at all. The Danish cartoonist has had to deal with multiple assassination plots and/or attempts.Nobody seriously thinks that Benioff or Weiss might be in any danger over this.

    Disagree completely. It IS the same thing. Just because the “offended” reaction is not as extreme (i.e. no death threats), doesn’t mean it’s different. The essential principle is the same: some people claim to be offended by a satirical/comical/disrespectful likeness of a political/religious leader. Same thing.

    Personally, blasphemy/ridicule/satire are some of my favourite things, and I try to commit some sort of blasphemy at least once a day.

  115. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:27 pm | Permalink

    Fire And Blood: Shame on you, HBO, you spineless wanks.

    this. It´s a strange thing as Varamyr F. said (they have Bill Maher, after all).

    Katie,
    Katie, see my comment above (of my own politicians). I don´t really care which head is, it´s a joke. I don´t mean this particular joke, but humor is a great weapon in politics too. This was a silly joke, ok but that´s what makes HBO looks like spineless wanks as F&B said. (or good publicists)

  116. john
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:29 pm | Permalink

    lmao:
    Darren Mason,

    Tell that to the crybaby liberals who started the whole “civility” drive after getting in high dudgeon over supposedly ‘violent’ conservative rhetoric. They didn’t find it acceptable then did they? The papers and broadcast media were filled with aggrieved liberals and Democrats musing about how conservatives have coarsened public discourse and provoked political violence. LOL.

    Don’t fucking compare WW II to the fucking travesty that was the Iraq war. Scumbag.

  117. Alex Dubrovsky
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:29 pm | Permalink

    I suggest changing the subject into discussing how completely and utterly retarded was Prometheus.

  118. WildSeed
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:30 pm | Permalink

    George W? I was thinking Perry Cuomo getting his head slapped off by Nancy Sinatra!
    What a non issue, It made for good publicity though. I only bothered to look while
    reviewing an excellent post at . There I was reminded of a 3 y/o
    poster of Geo W depicted as a Vampire sucking on lady Liberty’s neck. No controversy
    and quite popular online store item. It originally appeared as part of TrueBlood prop
    at Fantasia. We all knew he was one of them.

  119. NJ
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:34 pm | Permalink

    Call me unobservant, but I’ve watched that episode a number of times and I never noticed the bloody offending head.

    It would seem a lot of the vitriol has been fuellled by people who haven’t actually seen the scene, just ‘heard’ about it.

    GoT is not a political statement on past presidencies. It’s FANTASY!! Next they’ll be saying Holy Books were used to make Wildfire in Blackwater!!

    The big question is what show was the Bush head originally used on?? Now that would be interesting!

    OK.. venting over, time to move on.. So, any casting news??

  120. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:35 pm | Permalink

    William Aaron Grandy: Are you the same people who are baffled over muslims reactions to the depictions of Muhammad in the media?? Southpark can lampoon JC and Muhammad all they like but this is too far? Americans are ridiculous… land of the free my ass

    Give over. I missed the part where Americans attacked HBO offices, set fire to embassies, and threatened violence because of someone’s head on a pike? And Bush was lampooned on South Park numerous times. Literally shat on. No one razed Comedy Central.

    To equate the “reactions” when they are as different as night and day is fundamentally unserious.

    When it comes to speech, America is indeed the land of the free. Lax libel laws, virtually no criminalization of speech on grounds of political correctness (unlike most of Europe), and robust free speech protections under the First Amendment, even for noxious speech. Try insulting Islam in Holland a la Geert Wilders or proselytizing against homosexuality in England and watch yourself get done for hate speech.

  121. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:37 pm | Permalink

    NJ:
    Call me unobservant, but I’ve watched that episode a number of times and I never noticed the bloody offending head.

    No one did. It’s barely noticeable, and was never meant to be noticeable.

    It would seem a lot of the vitriol has been fuellled by people who haven’t actually seen the scene, just ‘heard’ about it.

    Yup. It’s just ignorance. All the offended comments I saw admitted that they’ve never seen the show. They didn’t even seem to understand what it was. The FOX News headline I saw said something like “HBO Parades Bush’s Head On A Spike”. Right… “parades”…

    I need to stop reading this thread, before I lose my last dwindling faith in humanity…

  122. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:39 pm | Permalink

    lmao,

    The reaction is only less extreme, not fundamentally different.

  123. Jose
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:39 pm | Permalink

    Fire And Blood:
    My irritation has nothing to do with politics. Ask yourself if you’d have made a stink about it if it had been Obama’s head on that spike instead of Dubya’s. And if so, fuck you, hypocrites.

    I’m sure it was unintentional, but if it was an Obama head the scene would have been cut in editing and never seen the light of day (or more likely would never have been considered at all). This is the network of Bill Maher, Game Change, Recount, By The People, etc. The entire executive team at HBO are Obama donors (not to mention big time HBO collaborators like Tom Hanks).

    Was it ever explained why they had a GWB head lying around to begin with?

  124. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:40 pm | Permalink

    john: Don’t fucking compare WW II to the fucking travesty that was the Iraq war. Scumbag.

    I will compare it to whatever I like. The Kurds of Iraq are delighted to be free of a genocidal maniac. Sympathizers of the Baath party (likely the same people who now sympathize with Assad of Syria) weren’t pleased, but you can’t please everyone.

  125. msd
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:41 pm | Permalink

    DH87,

    Urgh, Deadline. Everytime the Drudge Report links to a post, the comments section gets taken over by internet loonies and they don’t moderate because they want the extra clicks. I think it’s safe to say the care factor for industry insiders about this particular issue is zero.

  126. Katie
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:43 pm | Permalink

    Katie,
    Katie, see my comment above (of my own politicians). I don´t really care which head is, it´s a joke. I don´t mean this particular joke, but humor is a great weapon in politics too. This was a silly joke,ok but that´s what makes HBO looks like spineless wanks as F&B said. (or good publicists)

    I do get what you’re saying. And I agree with everyone who’s saying that free speech ought to be protected, and that satire can be a really great tool. I think people are getting a bit too worked up about the whole thing, and I honestly don’t think HBO should feel the need to pull the DVDs or the episodes from HBO Go.

    But as a joke or as satire, this doesn’t really offer anything. The statement, if there is one, is pretty much “Haha! Decapitated Bush!” It’s not any kind of meaningful political satire and didn’t contribute to the discussion or the episode in any way. I just wish they hadn’t done it, or at least hadn’t brought it up in the commentary. It just seems unproductive.

  127. William Aaron Grandy
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:49 pm | Permalink

    Lex:
    lmao,

    The reaction is only less extreme, not fundamentally different.

    Thanks. This was my point as well.

  128. the goat
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:51 pm | Permalink

    When I am king, you will be first against the wall,
    with your opinion, which is of no consequence, at all

  129. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:51 pm | Permalink

    Meg: Yup, just like banned books, the authors can only benefit from the publicity.

    As for me, I’m chuckling at the satire and the headlines.

    Don’t you mean HEADlines???? LOLZ : – 0

  130. William Aaron Grandy
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:53 pm | Permalink

    Joffery for the next president of the USA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  131. John
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:57 pm | Permalink

    Lex: John: Not the same thing at all. The Danish cartoonist has had to deal with multiple assassination plots and/or attempts.Nobody seriously thinks that Benioff or Weiss might be in any danger over this.

    Disagree completely. It IS the same thing. Just because the “offended” reaction is not as extreme (i.e. no death threats), doesn’t mean it’s different. The essential principle is the same: some people claim to be offended by a satirical/comical/disrespectful likeness of a political/religious leader. Same thing.

    In one case, people are angry and making some noise. In the other case, people are potentially getting killed. If you really think it’s the same thing, then you need to work on your critical thinking. It’s not even worth trying to explain it to you because it’s so obvious, and I don’t feel like wasting my time on someone so stupid.

  132. corbob10
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 9:58 pm | Permalink

    I remember watching the commentary on that episode and realizing how hilarious D&D were. Too bad their joke was taken so far out of context.

    Glad I got the uncensored Season 1 Blu-Ray!

  133. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:00 pm | Permalink

    Katie,

    I don´t think there was an intention to make a serious political statement (I wish), but it must have been a great temptation not to refer to contemporary politics in a series where political intrigue abounds. It was a harmless and private joke imo. People have the right to make silly jokes or silly statements or mistakes if you want to call it like that (while working their ass of). Nothing serious will happen.

  134. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:01 pm | Permalink

    Also, don’t forget the head-on-a-spike posters they were making (at comicon or some other convention). People were lining up for a chance to get their own head on a spike. HBO posted hundreds of them on Facebook. The whole head on a spike thing was treated as a joke, even by HBO.

    As such, I can hardly blame D & D for pointing out Bush’s head. When I heard it on the commentary, I honestly just chuckled and thought “Hey, that’s a neat piece of trivia.” Never in a million years would it have occurred to me that anyone would be offended.

    Once again, I guess I underestimated the stupidity of the human race.

  135. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:02 pm | Permalink

    William Aaron Grandy: Thanks. This was my point as well.

    Your point however, is inane. Eliding the difference between violent and non-violent reactions is silly. It makes a world of difference. You can’t tell (or rather, dictate by force to) people what to feel (that’s as totalitarian as telling people what they can or cannot say). They have a right to feel offended. They even have a right to excoriate HBO or Mohamed cartoonists because they are offended. Free speech, right? What they don’t have is a right to do is act on it in a violent way — that’s physical intimidation, not speech.

    It’s really not the same thing.

  136. George Bush's head
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:03 pm | Permalink

    Ah now my DVD box set will always be the superior anti-republican and uncensored one! But seriously this better not have major repercussions or I’ll be really mad, it’s a pity they mentioned it in the commentary as he wasn’t recognizable with the wig and his head turned to the side. This better blow over fast!

  137. carcin
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:09 pm | Permalink

    lmao,

    Try insulting Islam in Holland a la Geert Wilders or proselytizing against homosexuality in England and watch yourself get done for hate speech.

    Man, it must kill you not to be able to hate on the gays….boo fucking hoo.

  138. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:09 pm | Permalink

    John: In one case, people are angry and making some noise. In the other case, people are potentially getting killed. If you really think it’s the same thing, then you need to work on your critical thinking. It’s not even worth trying to explain it to you because it’s so obvious, and I don’t feel like wasting my time on someone so stupid.

    LOL! Actually, you didn’t understand my point (which is actually a pretty simple and understandable one). So it seems to me that YOU are the one who needs to work on your critical thinking skills (instead of just resorting to calling me stupid… which is pretty much the equivalent of forfeiting/losing any debate).

    But I’ll try one more time to explain this to you.

    It IS the same reaction in principle. It boils down to people getting angry and offended by some perceived offense, over a disrespectful likeness of a political or religious leader. Whether this results in angry letters, death threats, or actual assassination, the core principle is the same. The outrage is over the same type of thing. The only difference here is the severity or extremity of the reaction (and how that reaction is expressed), which itself is due to the centuries of difference between Western and Islamic culture. A difference in the severity of the reaction does NOT equal a fundamentally different reaction.

    But hey, go ahead and call me stupid again. It’s a lot easier than using your brain.

  139. infidel
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:10 pm | Permalink

    Once again, I guess I underestimated the stupidity of the human race.

    You are clearly unfamiliar with the modern Republican party.

  140. John W
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:11 pm | Permalink

    I’m upset for many reasons not the least of which is the show does not need this kind of publicity.

  141. infidel
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:13 pm | Permalink

    It IS the same reaction in principle. It boils down to people getting angry and offended by some perceived offense, over a disrespectful likeness of a political or religious leader.

    Too right.

    How quickly they forget that the perceived slights you outline resulted in plenty of American blacks getting lynched by the spiritual forefathers of conservatism….

  142. infidel
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:14 pm | Permalink

    I’m upset for many reasons not the least of which is the show does not need this kind of publicity.

    Because…..?

  143. the goat
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:16 pm | Permalink

    msd:
    I’ve worked a bit in publicity, TV publicity no less, and make no mistake, HBO knows exactly what they’re doing.

    They’re totally egging the media on with this one. They’re not trying to douse the flames, they’re fanning them. Deliberately. And media outlets are totally taking the bait. The end result is the kind of publicity you can’t buy in outlets that would never usually give you the time of day.

    qft

  144. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:17 pm | Permalink

    carcin: Man, it must kill you not to be able to hate on the gays….boo fucking hoo.

    You missed the point entirely. Read slowly this time: “robust free speech protections . . . even for noxious speech.” Those were examples of speech you may find noxious. I could have used the example of racist speech to illustrate the same point, does it mean I’m a racist?

    Free speech means especially the protection of unpopular speech (e.g., “hate on gays”), popular speech doesn’t need as much protection, duh.

  145. William Aaron Grandy
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:17 pm | Permalink

    Lex: LOL! Actually, you didn’t understand my point (which is actually a pretty simple and understandable one). So it seems to me that YOU are the one who needs to work on your critical thinking skills (instead of just resorting to calling me stupid… which is pretty much the equivalent of forfeiting/losing any debate).

    But I’ll try one more time to explain this to you.

    It IS the same reaction in principle. It boils down to people getting angry and offended by some perceived offense, over a disrespectful likeness of a political or religious leader. Whether this results in angry letters, death threats, or actual assassination, the core principle is the same. The outrage is over the same type of thing. The only difference here is the severity or extremity of the reaction (and how that reaction is expressed), which itself is due to the centuries of difference between Western and Islamic culture. A difference in the severity of the reaction does NOT equal a fundamentally different reaction.

    But hey, go ahead and call me stupid again. It’s a lot easier than using your brain.

    ie. its a simple cause and effect relationship. Cause is the same (someone making fun of a political/religious figure). Effect is not the same which is a result of the society in which it is seen.

  146. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:19 pm | Permalink

    talking about HBO, why broadcast “Real Time with Bill Maher” at this crazy hours in Argentina? ha! you hypocrites! Waiting till 1:30 a.m. here ;)

  147. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:20 pm | Permalink

    infidel: How quickly they forget that the perceived slights you outline resulted in plenty of American blacks getting lynched by the spiritual forefathers of conservatism….

    Except Democrats were the party of slavery and opposition to the Civil Rights Act.

    Republicans were on the right side of history.

  148. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:21 pm | Permalink

    infidel: You are clearly unfamiliar with the modern Republican party.

    Or liberals.

  149. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:22 pm | Permalink

    I’m just pulling these figures out of the air, but…

    My guess is that this “scandal” might cause (at most) several thousand subscribers to cancel their subscriptions…

    But I guarantee that several TENS or HUNDREDS of thousands of people who never heard about GOT have heard about it now. And of those hundreds of thousands, a significant portion will be tuning in out of curiousity, to see what all the fuss is about. In fact, thousands will tune in simply because they think putting a fake Bush head on a spike is hilarious. And before they know it, they’ll be as hooked as the rest of us… :)

    In other words, a major ratings boost.

  150. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:27 pm | Permalink

    Lex: a major ratings boost.

    sure thing, maybe msd was right all along.

  151. Ren Snow
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:31 pm | Permalink

    This is ridiculous, is HBO worried the Tea Party will stop watching?

  152. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:32 pm | Permalink

    Lex: LOL! Actually, you didn’t understand my point (which is actually a pretty simple and understandable one).

    I think he did, and your point is simplistic to the point of inanity. A violent reaction is fundamentally different to a non-violent one. People “react” angrily or are offended all the time by trifles. Not everyone acts on it in a violent way. To suggest that it is “ridiculous” (as Grandy did) to make a distinction between violent and non-violent reactions is silly.

    People can feel what they like, they have a right to. It’s Orwellian to go from “you don’t have a right to a violent reaction” to “you don’t have a right to feel what you feel!” That’s just the opposite side of the totalitarian coin.

  153. XenkanMonk
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:40 pm | Permalink

    I’m in favour of putting more fake presidential heads on spikes. Maybe they could do a democrat in season 3 to even it out. I would even submit several of our prime ministers.

  154. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:41 pm | Permalink

    lmao: The liberals on this thread would have gone apeshit if it had been the head of a Dem President on the pike.

    Bullshit, complete bullshit, bullshit that’s being repeated left and right in response to this issue, but alas, total bullshit.

    Liberals, at least the intelligent ones (which of course includes all who frequent this site) understand context, and, hearing the fact that the way this information was revealed was in such an offhand manner and not likely to have been noticed otherwise it would become obvious that absolutely nothing was meant by it, they just happened to have the severed head of a former president on hand.

    Although I admit I would have been upset at seeing an Obama head up there, but only because it would’ve been a continuity area, there were no half-Summer Islander men in the Stark crew. Clinton? No prob.

  155. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:45 pm | Permalink

    lmao:
    Oranje,

    The Allies issued order that got millions killed in WWII. Should they all have been tried at Nuremberg? That’s the problem with liberals, imagining that something they disagree with must be ipso facto a crime (a sentiment they routinely accuse conservatives of harboring). Hypocrisy indeed. “Oranje” would be speaking German today and his beloved Den Haag would be Judenrein, not housing the ICJ, if it were the Allies instead of the Nazis trussed up at Nuremberg.

    So stopping the Nazi juggernaut and the Holocaust is comparable to preemptively invading a sovereign nation over trumped-up evidence using the political clout gained from an unrelated terrorist attack on our nation? Thanks Herr Godwin, but your reasoning is shit.

  156. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:46 pm | Permalink

    lmao,

    I still disagree, but at least you explained yourself (and made me re-think my own opinion) rather than just calling me stupid. I still doubt “john” really understands much of anything, although it’s pretty impressive that he can use big words like “critical thinking”.

  157. vntrlqst
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:48 pm | Permalink

    You know, if Walder Frey had apologized for what he did to Robb Stark’s corpse just because a few Northmen were offended, we’d be crying foul that GRRM robbed us of an accurate representation of humanity. HBO is delegitimizing GoT’s relevancy as a true-to-life portrayal of the follies of the human character. People create effigies of their enemies, in Westeros and in the USoA. No need to apologize for exercising the right to freedom of speech.

  158. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:48 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: Bullshit, complete bullshit, bullshit that’s being repeated left and right in response to this issue, but alas, total bullshit.

    You libs aren’t fooling anyone given your prior crybaby reactions to supposedly ‘violent’ conservative imagery and incivility. You have previous. What’s bullshit is your excuse that you would have reacted differently.

  159. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:48 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: Bullshit, complete bullshit, bullshit that’s being repeated left and right in response to this issue, but alas, total bullshit.

    Liberals, at least the intelligent ones (which of course includes all who frequent this site) understand context, and, hearing the fact that the way this information was revealed was in such an offhand manner and not likely to have been noticed otherwise it would become obvious that absolutely nothing was meant by it, they just happened to have the severed head of a former president on hand.

    Although I admit I would have been upset at seeing an Obama head up there, but only because it would’ve been a continuity area, there were no half-Summer Islander men in the Stark crew. Clinton? No prob.

    I’m not American, but I’m still what you might call a liberal… and I wouldn’t give a shit if it was Obama’s head up there, Jesus’s head, or (as someone else said) my own mother’s head. It’s a fake head in a TV show.

    Anyways, forget Bush… I think we’re losing sight of the really offensive thing: the fact that NED FUCKING STARK’S head is up there! RIP Ned. :(

  160. Chump Force 1
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:49 pm | Permalink

    I heard that DB&DW are going to digitally remove all the weapons form season 1 episodes and replace them with wallow-talkies

  161. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:51 pm | Permalink

    Lex: As such, I can hardly blame D & D for pointing out Bush’s head. When I heard it on the commentary, I honestly just chuckled and thought “Hey, that’s a neat piece of trivia.” Never in a million years would it have occurred to me that anyone would be offended.

    Once again, I guess I underestimated the stupidity of the human race.

    That was exactly my reaction.

  162. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:51 pm | Permalink

    Chump Force 1:
    I heard that DB&DW are going to digitally remove all the weapons form season 1 episodes and replace them with wallow-talkies

    LOL, nice E.T. reference!

  163. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:54 pm | Permalink

    John W:
    I’m upset for many reasons not the least of which is the show does not need this kind of publicity.

    Nah, the publicity’s great. Just wait until all these mouth-breathers discover what a den of infamy actually exists within the content of the show: incest, homosexuality, infidelity, it’ll be a hoot. They’ll be just fine with the graphic violence, of course, but can’t win ‘em all.

  164. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:56 pm | Permalink

    lmao: Except Democrats were the party of slavery and opposition to the Civil Rights Act.

    Republicans were on the right side of history.

    Southerners were predominantly Democrats back in the day, the political landscape has done a complete 180. Which you probably know, unless you’re actually as stupid as you’re pretending to be.

  165. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:59 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: So stopping the Nazi juggernaut and the Holocaust is comparable to preemptively invading a sovereign nation over trumped-up evidence using the political clout gained from an unrelated terrorist attack on our nation?

    Read history. FDR “trumped up” a confrontation with the Nazis by targeting German U-Boats and shipping in the Atlantic even though Nazi Germany did not directly attack the United States. Hitler was anxious not to draw the Americans into the war. Roosevelt was keen to create an ‘incident’ to justify entry to a skeptical and isolationist American public — one the British tried to lobby by means overt and covert to enter the war.

    Stopping the Holocaust is also comparable to stopping the genocidal Saddam from terrorizing and exterminating the Kurds. While the scale is different, stopping one genocidal tyrant is generally comparable to stopping another one.

    So, not so different.

  166. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 10:59 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: Nah, the publicity’s great. Just wait until all these mouth-breathers discover what a den of infamy actually exists within the content of the show: incest, homosexuality, infidelity, it’ll be a hoot.

    LOL, can’t wait! And don’t forget references to necrophilia, pedophilia, amputee sex, and beastiality (of the goat AND horse variety).

  167. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:00 pm | Permalink

    Maybe the Game of Thrones creators should try to use a different president’s head in every season. That would be fun to try to watch for it and which one it is. Maybe then no one will get offended (equal opportunity offenders!) BTW that was just me being sarcastic (although it would be funny!)

  168. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:01 pm | Permalink

    lmao: You libs aren’t fooling anyone given your prior crybaby reactions to supposedly ‘violent’ conservative imagery and incivility. You have previous. What’s bullshit is your excuse that you would have reacted differently.

    Don’t include me in this “you libs” crap you simple-minded twat. I don’t think any less of you because you’re a part of the group “conservative”, it’s all about you as an individual and the fact that you’re either a) a troll, or b) a hateful dumbshit who treats politics like team sports.

  169. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:02 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: Southerners were predominantly Democrats back in the day

    Which means infidel was wrong to imply that Republicans were responsible for anti-black animus when the main culprits were Democrats. Which you’d know. Unless you’re as stupid as you’re pretending to be.

  170. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:02 pm | Permalink

    lmao: Read history. FDR “trumped up” a confrontation with the Nazis by targeting German U-Boats and shipping in the Atlantic even though Nazi Germany did not directly attack the United States. Hitler was anxious not to draw the Americans into the war. Roosevelt was keen to create an ‘incident’ to justify entry to a skeptical and isolationist American public — one the British tried to lobby by means overt and covert to enter the war.

    Oh, I get it, so pretty much like 9/11?

  171. Kate Bussell
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:02 pm | Permalink

    In my own personal opinion this shouldn’t be a big deal. GWB will likely go down as one of the most mocked presidents in the history of our country—justifiably so. Does this mean he deserves to have his head on a spike? No. But do I think it’s it funny that on a TELEVISION SHOW his face appear as a plastic-mounted head on a spike in the background? Yes.

    The producers probably should have kept the joke to themselves, but I know our household finds this pretty hilarious. It’s a plastic head on a spike. Not a real one! There are lots of other things to spend time fretting over.

  172. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:04 pm | Permalink

    lmao: Which you’d know. Unless you’re as stupid as you’re pretending to be.

    Oh, now you’ve resorted to calling people stupid too, like “john” earlier.

    Whatever merits your argument had… you’ve lost now, dude.

    P.S. Stupid poo poo head! (How’s that for an argument?)

  173. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:07 pm | Permalink

    I know you call GWB “Dubya” but can I ask what Dubya means? something to do with the accent?

    Bonnie Blue,
    everyone will be looking for heads in season 3, if anyone remembers all this

  174. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:07 pm | Permalink

    andrea:
    I know you call GWB“Dubya” but can I askwhat Dubya means? something to do with the accent?

    It means the letter “W”. I’d say “double u”, but in a texas accent, it sounds kind of like “dubya”.

  175. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:09 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: Don’t include me in this “you libs” crap you simple-minded twat. I don’t think any less of you because you’re a part of the group “conservative”, it’s all about you as an individual

    Funny, because you claimed that liberals would have reacted differently (that they wouldn’t is “bullshit” according to you). This was based on your assertion that “liberals” as a group “understood context.” Now you repudiate yourself and it’s all about individuals? You contradict yourself. Only simpletons contradict themselves.

  176. Ashavan
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:09 pm | Permalink

    Whatever happened to, “The opinions on this commentary track are solely those of the individuals expressing them and not those of HBO, Inc.”, etc.? I thought the whole point of making everyone sit through such disclaimers was to insulate HBO from political controversies like this. If the disclaimers don’t actually perform that function, can you stop wasting our time with them, please?

    On the plus side, I guess this means my DVD set is now a sought-after collector’s edition.

  177. Katie
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:09 pm | Permalink

    andrea:
    I don´t think there was an intention to make a seriouspolitical statement (I wish), but it must have been a great temptation not to refer to contemporary politics in a series where political intrigue abounds. It was a harmless and private joke imo. People have the right to make silly jokes or silly statementsor mistakes if you want to call it like that (while working their ass of). Nothing serious will happen.

    Totally agree. I don’t think anyone had bad intentions. Just wish they hadn’t made the whole thing public on the commentary.

    And can we tone down the accusations a bit, guys? It’s getting kind of ugly in here. You can disagree with people’s reactions, but accusing people of being worthless human beings for being offended about a joke is kind of overkill.

  178. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:13 pm | Permalink

    andrea,

    Everyone will be looking for heads on season 3

    I hope so! That would be fun :)

  179. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:14 pm | Permalink

    Lex: Oh, now you’ve resorted to calling people stupid too, like “john” earlier.

    Not really. (Those were Steven Swanson’s words, not mine.) I was merely repeating them to Steven — gentle mockery. Since those were his words, I guess he’s “lost.”

  180. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:16 pm | Permalink

    andrea: everyone will be looking for heads in season 3, if anyone remembers all this

    That would be kind of fun :)

  181. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:19 pm | Permalink

    Lex,

    thanks.

    Katie: And can we tone down the accusations a bit, guys?

    Yes, I understand why Winter didn´t want to moderate this thread.

    Bonnie Blue,
    I have a huge list of heads I want to see! but I´m dreaming because I’m a foreigner :(

  182. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:19 pm | Permalink

    Katie
    And can we tone down the accusations a bit, guys? It’s getting kind of ugly in here.

    Of course it’s ugly in here. That’s why WiC resisted publishing a post about this. But people wanted it, so here it is.

    Meanwhile, if anyone has anything worthwhile to say about the actual show, please go post in the Season 2 recap thread. As of this moment, the Bush thread has twice as many comments as the Season 2 thread… which is sad.

  183. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:22 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: Oh, I get it, so pretty much like 9/11?

    Not quite. Pretty sure the U.S. government didn’t encourage a terrorist strike against the Twin Towers.

    Roosevelt, on the other hand, sought to provoke war in the Atlantic. Churchill is quoted as saying that FDR “would wage war, but not declare it,” that the American President had assured him that he “would become more and more provocative” in order to “force an ‘incident’ . . . which would justify him in opening hostilities.” See Robert Dallek, Franklin D. Roosevelt and American Foreign Policy, 1932-1945 285 (1995).

    So the WWII comparison is not inapposite.

  184. Pastor_of_Muppets
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:22 pm | Permalink

    You guys all need to relax. This will literally mean nothing to any of you in a few days time. Grab a drink or a smoke, take a deep breath, and just relax.

  185. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:26 pm | Permalink

    andrea: I have a huge list of heads I want to see! but I´m dreaming because I’m a foreigner :(
    andrea

    Ha ha! Me too, but just because your a “foreigner” doesn’t mean you should be excluded…. They can have some foreign heads too :) I wouldn’t mind if they put a replica of my head on there, how cool would that be?? My teenage boys would love it!

  186. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:28 pm | Permalink

    Pastor_of_Muppets,

    Thanks, Master of Puppets that is exactly what I am doing now! (a drink and a smoke, that is) That’s why I’m trying to make the joke of putting different heads in every season, then viewers would have to try to find them and identify them :) Seriously, this will all go away soon, just trying to make light of it!

  187. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:28 pm | Permalink

    lmao: Funny, because you claimed that liberals would have reacted differently (that they wouldn’t is “bullshit” according to you). This was based on your assertion that “liberals” as a group “understood context.” Now you repudiate yourself and it’s all about individuals? You contradict yourself. Only simpletons contradict themselves.

    I am large, I contain multitudes.

  188. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:29 pm | Permalink

    lmao: Not really. (Those were Steven Swanson’s words, not mine.) I was merely repeating them to Steven — gentle mockery. Since those were his words, I guess he’s “lost.”

    Guilty as charged, I have no problem with calling stupid people stupid.;-)

  189. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:30 pm | Permalink

    Pastor_of_Muppets:
    You guys all need to relax. This will literally mean nothing to any of you in a few days time. Grab a drink or a smoke, take a deep breath, and just relax.

    Heh, my problem was drinking before I started responding to this thread….

  190. WildSeed
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:32 pm | Permalink

    lmao,

    And winter tree decorating we later got Santa Claus, then springtime Easter Bunny.
    There’s a reason why history teaches societal evolution/ politics.We grow or remain
    stunted. As for Republicans…………………………………………………………….#%*~!

  191. andrea
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:34 pm | Permalink

    Bonnie Blue,

    don´t worry, we have a political magazine here that satisfies all my dark and cruel desires and it´s damn funny too.

    Seems that at this hour we all do the same no matter where you live.

  192. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:37 pm | Permalink

    Alright well …

    I think that HBO did the right thing here.

    No matter where they film, or the fact that there’s only one American in the show. It’s still an American show, thus it adheres to American law and statures. Believe it or not, there’s actually laws against things such as depicting a living president past or present, dead. I don’t think people realize that the reason that it’s being heavily covered by the media is because it’s a FEDERAL OFFENSE to show what they had.

    Now yes you couldn’t tell it was GWB but he was still there, and D&D being idiots pointed out the ILLEGAL thing on their set.

    So everyone else is like “Why are they editing it? Why are those dumb dip shits taking it off the DVDs Republicans are evil!”

    Simply put, the show could be SHUT DOWN if they didn’t. Ladies, Gentlemen … it is deeply illegal to depict what they did.

    Ignorance of the law is not a defense in the American Justice System.

    Now I don’t like that they’ve pulled the GOT stuff, but law is law.

    So David and Dan don’t sit there and laugh about it, you done fucked up and HBO saved your asses and GOT. Be men, admit it was a fuck up, and you’ll use those lumps three feet above your asses and move on.

    So be mad all you want, but three months of no 1×10 vs. No GOT ever again …

    I’ll take it.

  193. NJ
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:39 pm | Permalink

    I just re-watched the offending episode.. and i must have blinked and missed it.

    Can someone tell me which head was supposed to be GWB? Buggered if I could tell.

    Maybe D&D were taking the piss when they said it was Bush’s head recycled. Perhaps they ARE masters of spin….

    Just saying…

  194. Katie
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:42 pm | Permalink

    Lex: Of course it’s ugly in here. That’s why WiC resisted publishing a post about this. But people wanted it, so here it is.

    Sure, I’m just not sure why it has to be ugly.

    I’m with Pastor of Muppets! Drinks all around!

  195. the goat
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:44 pm | Permalink

    Katie: I do get what you’re saying. And I agree with everyone who’s saying that free speech ought to be protected, and that satire can be a really great tool. I think people are getting a bit too worked up about the whole thing, and I honestly don’t think HBO should feel the need to pull the DVDs or the episodes from HBO Go.

    But as a joke or as satire, this doesn’t really offer anything.The statement, if there is one, is pretty much “Haha! Decapitated Bush!” It’s not any kind of meaningful political satire and didn’t contribute to the discussion or the episode in any way. I just wish they hadn’t done it, or at least hadn’t brought it up in the commentary. It just seems unproductive.

    Assuming arguendo that this was, in fact, an intentional political statement, its not the statement itself (Bush’s head on a spike), but the right to make such a statement that is truly important.

    We can debate how clever or insightful the statement was (personally, I think its pretty good. Lots of people hate Bush, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen his head on a spike before), but the one thing you can’t argue, at this point, is that its meaningless or hasn’t contributed to the discussion. Not with this many people talking about it.

  196. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:46 pm | Permalink

    Katie

    I’m with Pastor of Muppets! Drinks all around!

    Yup, I’m heading out for some Friday night drinks now. I only hope I have the strength to resist re-visiting this thread when I get home… :)

  197. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:48 pm | Permalink

    NJ,

    The screen grab is all over the internet, including DeadlineHollywood, i09, etc.:

    http://io9.com/game-of-thrones/

  198. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:48 pm | Permalink

    NJ:
    I just re-watched the offending episode.. and i must have blinked and missed it.

    Can someone tell me which head was supposed to be GWB? Buggered if I could tell.

    It’s the one next to Septa Mordane… and it gets funnier every time I look at it.

    href=”http://images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2012513//reg_1024.bush.cm.61312.jpg” target=”_blank”>http://images.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/2012513//reg_1024.bush.cm.61312.jpg

  199. Pastor_of_Muppets
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:49 pm | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05,

    Speaking of ignorance of the law, you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. At all. You literally made that up, or heard someone else make it up and repeated it.

  200. Lex
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:49 pm | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05:
    Simply put, the show could be SHUT DOWN if they didn’t. Ladies, Gentlemen … it is deeply illegal to depict what they did.

    LOLOL!!!

    I take it back.. I’m glad this thread exists. It’s becoming pretty entertaining.

    FBI agents showing up at HBO’s front door, and “shutting down” Game of Thrones? Because it’s “deeply” illegal? I’m laughing so hard I’m nearly crying right now… XD

  201. the goat
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:50 pm | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05,

    You’re nuts, homey. The satire laws protect HBO and everyone involved absolutely. There was 0% chance of criminal, or even civil, liability in this case.

  202. Katie
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:53 pm | Permalink

    the goat: Assuming arguendo that this was, in fact, an intentional political statement, its not the statement itself (Bush’s head on a spike), but the right to make such a statement that is truly important.

    We can debate how clever or insightful the statement was (personally, I think its pretty good. Lots of people hate Bush, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen his head on a spike before), but the one thing you can’t argue, at this point, is that its meaningless or hasn’t contributed to the discussion.Not with this many people talking about it.

    I can see that, there’s certainly been a lot of discussion. I think what I was trying to say is that I don’t think it contributes to discussion in a productive way. It’s led to a lot of yelling and name calling by both sides, and not all that much else. From what they’ve said, it wasn’t supposed to be any kind of statement for free speech. Even if it were, I’m not sure that this would have been an effective way to do it.

    I absolutely think that they should be allowed to do what they did. I just don’t think it’s something that they should have done.

    And enjoy, Lex!

  203. lmao
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:54 pm | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05: I don’t think people realize that the reason that it’s being heavily covered by the media is because it’s a FEDERAL OFFENSE to show what they had.

    Not true. Otherwise the movie ‘Death of a President’ would be illegal. Mere depiction, without more, is not enough. U.S. federal law states that willfully threatening a sitting President (or others in the line of succession) is a crime, but Benioff and Weiss depicted a former one, and did not state a threat, willfully or otherwise.

  204. DH87
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:54 pm | Permalink

    the goat: The satire laws protect HBO and everyone involved absolutely.

    Otherwise known as the First Amendment, but “the satire laws” sound much more fun to break. I assume they would be state laws that forbid you from being amusing in, say, Michigan or Virginia, which would say alot about what’s been going on in those necks of the woods.

  205. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:56 pm | Permalink

    Pastor_of_Muppets,

    Look it up!

  206. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:56 pm | Permalink

    lmao: Except Democrats were the party of slavery and opposition to the Civil Rights Act.

    Republicans were on the right side of history.

    Sorry, but a woman cannot let this historical inaccuracy pass. Democrats may not have been the party of Abe Lincoln, and I am not privy to the numbers on how many Dem’s circa 1860s were or were not pro emancipation. However, it is known fact that the Civil Rights Act was formulated by John F. Kennedy, Democrat, and finally got passed under and signed by Lyndon B. Johnson, Democrat who also passed and signed the Voting Rights Act a few years later. It was the 1960s Southern and conservative politicians of both parties that were opposed to the civil rights laws that constitute much of the modern Republican party.

  207. the goat
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:57 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson: Although I admit I would have been upset at seeing an Obama head up there, but only because it would’ve been a continuity area, there were no half-Summer Islander men in the Stark crew. Clinton? No prob.

    I agree with this comment. I woulda been all, “WTF, the only time Jalabhar Xho gets any screentime is when his head’s mounted on the wall!?!”

    In terms of significance, this entire situation pales in comparison to Robb/Talisa having a septon at their wedding and swearing vows to the Seven.

  208. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 15, 2012 at 11:58 pm | Permalink

    lmao,

    Except that Satire law only applies when it’s a Satire … if so, then all HBO legal had to do was claim it as Satire, which they have in the past with Billiam Maher’s show.

    Come on …

  209. MRR
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:00 am | Permalink

    All I care to say is that, as a fan, I appreciate being informed about the episode being pulled from HBO Go and the DVD/Blu-Ray not being produced. So thanks, WiC!

  210. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:02 am | Permalink

    DH87: Otherwise known as the First Amendment, but “the satire laws” sound much more fun to break. I assume they would be state laws that forbid you from being amusing in, say, Michigan or Virginia, which would say alot about what’s been going on in those necks of the woods.

    Well, technically, I was referring to common laws, which are comprised of the various decisions of the U.S. Circuit Courts of Appeal, state Supreme Courts, and the U.S. Supreme Court, which protect political speech. I just didn’t wanna type all that out, but thanks for making me.

  211. SillyMammo
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:03 am | Permalink

    It’s interesting how 99% of the people commenting on this article are being level-headed and rationale and 1% are throwing a tantrum and really trying to push some sort of political agenda.

  212. andrea
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:03 am | Permalink

    this thread is is becoming more and more fun and creative. I want the “satire laws” in my country, right now ;)

    I’m not making fun of you (the goat), I think it was a great name!

  213. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:04 am | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar: I am not privy to the numbers on how many Dem’s circa 1860s were or were not pro emancipation.

    Almost no one other than abolitionists was in favor of emancipation before the Civil War, although most abolitionists seemed to choose the Republication party as the lesser of two evils, as I recall. Preservation of the Union was the main reason for the war and as Lincoln famously declared, “If I could preserve the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that.”

    Only after the terrible bloodbaths of the first three years, when Democrat Copperheads and other Northern folks were saying, “Let the Confederate states go, it’s not worth the price our boys are paying,” did Lincoln evolve to the point where he was able to make the case for an enobling purpose, the elimination of slavery, in a political context.

  214. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:04 am | Permalink

    Oranje,

    No kidding.

  215. MW
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:07 am | Permalink

    It is in really poor taste to put the likeness of any real person’s severed head on a spike. It’s a bit more extreme than putting his face on a dartboard. Even if it a joke, it is something that very can easily be misinterpreted in a bad way.

    And since this is unmoderated, anyone who disagrees with me can eat a big bag of dicks.

  216. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:11 am | Permalink

    Bonnie Blue:
    Maybe the Game of Thrones creators should try to use a different president’s head in every season.That would be fun to try to watch for it and which one it is.Maybe then no one will get offended (equal opportunity offenders!)BTW that was just me being sarcastic (although it would be funny!)

    A woman likes this idea Bonnie! HBO can make it a contest too, if you see the President’s head and correctly tweet the answer to @GameOfThrones #GuessThePrezOnThePike, you MAY win a prize! One entry per episode please.

  217. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:13 am | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05:
    lmao,

    Except that Satire law only applies when it’s a Satire … if so, then all HBO legal had to do was claim it as Satire, which they have in the past with Billiam Maher’s show.

    Come on …

    What the hell are you talking about!?! If there was any liability (criminal or civil), pulling the ep and stopping the DVDs wouldn’t mean anything, because the image was already broadcast and millions of DVDs already sold. Its just a business/political decision to “do the respectful thing,” even though any HBO exec with half a brain is laughing his ass off because of all the free publicity they just GOT (pun intended).

  218. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:16 am | Permalink

    the goat: Well, technically, I was referring to common laws, which are comprised of the various decisions of the U.S. Circuit Courts of Appeal, state Supreme Courts, and the U.S. Supreme Court, which protect political speech.I just didn’t wanna type all that out, but thanks for making me.

    Sorry—my weak attempt at lightening up the thread’s atmosphere. I am aware of case law, but I appreciate the even-tempered response.

  219. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:17 am | Permalink

    Just to put a period on my involvement in thread, before the trolls take over.

    I don’t think it was a political statement, I think that it was a goof. Knuckle head move done by a DP at the last second, due to budget restrictions.

    But for “Satire Law” to be applied thus protecting the show from mass edit. You have to get your paper work done before hand by Legal. You need to go to the network, Studio, ect, ect, and tell them what the satire is, then Legal tells them if that’ll fly. If it does then they go through the motions of paperwork

    It’s obvious from this, that Legal was not notified before airing the GWB head, and it was made public by D&D during the commentaries.

    Ps. the “Dead President” movie was aired in Brittian, not released in the US, for obvious reasons.

    Checked facts have been double checked, continue with the thread, I have nothing more to say on the matter, except maybe on Tumblr.

  220. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:19 am | Permalink

    Pastor_of_Muppets:
    You guys all need to relax. This will literally mean nothing to any of you in a few days time. Grab a drink or a smoke, take a deep breath, and just relax.

    Come on over, Jaqen’s at work! ; – )

  221. Joshua Taylor
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:19 am | Permalink

    the goat: When I am king, you will be first against the wall,
    with your opinion, which is of no consequence, at all

    Coldplay? ;-)

  222. DavosFTW!
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:24 am | Permalink

    In Australia we used to call our Prime Ministers dumb cunts all the time. Now our Prime Minister is a girl and everyone shuts the fuck up because if you said something bad that would be sexist :O

    Its a crazy world. If it had happened to other politicians it might not be so bad but this is George Bush. The fact that he is so hated make people on his side more fanatical in defending him. Its like the Chinese and/or the Russians with Mao and Stalin. Polarising figures who people defended beyond reason to match the hate from the other side. I believe this fuels the outrage.

    Personally I believe if you can’t take the piss out of the people in charge then your nation/group/whatever is in a lot of trouble.

  223. NJ
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:24 am | Permalink

    Really?? That’s it? Really?

    So for that nano-second, everyone is going ape shit? There is something seriously wrong here..

  224. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:24 am | Permalink

    Wow! This is the most painful thread to read ever. I love talking political philosophy but this thread is all political without the philosophy. This is like watching people debate political issues when the entire basis for the beliefs of the people debating have been developed by watching CNN, FOX, and NBC. Not everyone is like that, of course, I’ve said before how I respect a lot of people who comment here, but I didn’t see one argument where both people were at least willing to engage in an honest debate.

    On a positive note, if you have kids you can use this thread to show your kids how ignorant you can sound if you don’t study logic, philosophy, economics, and history.

  225. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:25 am | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar: A woman likes this idea Bonnie! HBO can make it a contest too, if you see the President’s head and correctly tweet the answer to @GameOfThrones #GuessThePrezOnThePike, you MAY win a prize! One entry per episode please

    That’s what I was thinking, too! How much fun would that be :) haha We need to find a way to get this idea to D&D

  226. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:26 am | Permalink

    DH87: Sorry—my weak attempt at lightening up the thread’s atmosphere. I am aware of case law, but I appreciate the even-tempered response.

    No worries, my response was tongue in cheek, as well. Just didn’t want you guys to think I pulled that outta my ass.

  227. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:26 am | Permalink

    the goat,

    Yeah … except no one knew about it till the DVD Commentaries … That’s why it’s happening now.

    Someone F-ed up, they sat on their hands till the hounds (Pun intended) came for them. If they had wanted to be honorible (Bamm! another one) they would’ve edited the minute they learned of it.

    We can talk about intentions till the cows come home. Doesn’t change that it was illegal.

    Come on …

  228. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:27 am | Permalink

    MW: And since this is unmoderated, anyone who disagrees with me can eat a big bag of dicks.

    LMFAO… Please, please, please, do I have your permission to use this phrase???

  229. andrea
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:27 am | Permalink

    talking about heads… Joseph Stiglitz is at “Real Time with Bill Maher”. That´s a great head! and I think he´d laugh like crazy if his fake head were on a spike on GOT.

  230. Lex
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:28 am | Permalink

    Joshua Taylor: Coldplay? ;-)

    Blasphemy! It’s Radiohead.

  231. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:32 am | Permalink

    I realize in my long-winded response above that anyone who favored emancipation pre-Civil War was de facto an abolitionist. I should have clarified that abolitionists could ostensibly have been found in either political party at the time, but abolition was not a plank in either the Democrats’ or the Republicans’ platform, I don’t believe. (The by then-defunct Liberty Party had been founded as a single-issue political party for the abolitionists in the 1840s.)

    Abolitionist precepts were held by a number of religious denominations, primarily as a result of the “Second Great Awakening” of the 1830s.

  232. LordStarkington
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:33 am | Permalink

    Fat Pink Mast

    Myrish Swamp

    That is all

  233. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:33 am | Permalink

    the goat: Just didn’t want you guys to think I pulled that outta my ass.

    Even if you had, you would not have been alone on this thread.

  234. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:34 am | Permalink

    Dan,

    Then why did you read it?

    Dude come on, the minute WIC said it would be unmoderated it was like allowing firearms inside a Saloon were the alcohol was free …

    It was only a matter of time.

    All you can do is make your point, and take the trolling like a man.

  235. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:35 am | Permalink

    Dan: On a positive note, if you have kids you can use this thread to show your kids how ignorant you can sound if you don’t study logic, philosophy, economics, and history.

    Thank god I got in my correction to my own lively post on Civil War politics, then.

  236. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:36 am | Permalink
  237. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:41 am | Permalink

    Joshua Taylor: Coldplay? ;-)

    Hail to the Thief would probably be most appropriate

    Genie let out of the bottle
    It is now the witching hour
    Genie let out of the bottle
    It is now the witching hour
    Murderers, you’re murderers
    We are not the same as you
    Genie let out of the bottle

    Your alarm bells, your alarm bells
    They should be ringing

    (In case its in any way unclear, pretty sure Thom & co. were very much in favor of GW’s head on a spike)

  238. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:46 am | Permalink

    DH87:
    I realize in my long-winded response above that anyone who favored emancipation pre-Civil War was de facto an abolitionist. I should have clarified that abolitionists could ostensibly have been found in either political party at the time, but abolition was not a plank in either the Democrats’ or the Republicans’ platform, I don’t believe. (The by then-defunct Liberty Party had been founded as a single-issue political party for the abolitionists in the 1840s.)

    Abolitionist precepts were held by a number of religious denominations, primarily as a result of the “Second Great Awakening” of the 1830s.

    ‘Nuff said, let’s drop that topic before things get even more heated up in here. It’s WAAAAAY off on a tangent anyway.

  239. lmao
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:46 am | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar: Sorry, but a woman cannot let this historical inaccuracy pass.

    What historical inaccuracy?

    “Congressional Republicans enacted civil rights acts in 1866, 1870, 1871, and 1875.” Robert Kaczorowski, The Politics of Judicial Interpretation: The Federal Courts, Department of Justice, and Civil Rights, 1866-1876, p. xiv (2005).

    Southern Democrats were the main bloc of obstructionists in 1964. The South remained majority-Democratic long after. It was only in 1994 that Republicans “gained a majority of House seats in the region . . . for the first time since Reconstruction.” Curtis Gans, “1994 Congressional Elections: An Analysis,” in The Center for Voting and Democracy, Voting and Democracy Report: 1995 (1995).

    That’s a century of uninterrupted dominance in the South — the core anti-civil rights constituency — until 1994, long after the passage of the civil rights act. So it’s fair to say that Democrats were the party of slavery and institutional racism, despite LBJ, who was President, not legislator.

  240. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:47 am | Permalink

    Bonnie Blue: That’s what I was thinking, too!How much fun would that be :)hahaWe need to find a way to get this idea to D&D

    Maaaaaaybe we keep this one to ourselves up in here…they might be a touch sensitive about the topic for a while.

  241. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:50 am | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05: Yeah … except no one knew about it till the DVD Commentaries … That’s why it’s happening now.

    The DVDs came out 3 months ago. If they were worried about criminal/civil liability, why wait til now to edit? You are honestly certifiable.

  242. Bonnie Blue
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:52 am | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar,

    Haha yes I hear you! Just thought it would be more fun than reading a bunch of posts reciting historical facts/inaccuracies… What the heck is going on in here? I’ve had a few too many sangrias to try to read the history of political science. Thought we were supposed to discuss Game of Thrones! “)

  243. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:53 am | Permalink

    lmao: What historical inaccuracy?

    “Congressional Republicans enacted civil rights acts in 1866, 1870, 1871, and 1875.” Robert Kaczorowski, The Politics of Judicial Interpretation: The Federal Courts, Department of Justice, and Civil Rights, 1866-1876, p. xiv (2005).

    Southern Democrats were the main bloc of obstructionists in 1964. The South remained majority-Democratic long after. It was only in 1994 that Republicans “gained a majority of House seats in the region . . . for the first time since Reconstruction.” Curtis Gans, “1994 Congressional Elections: An Analysis,” in The Center for Voting and Democracy, Voting and Democracy Report: 1995 (1995).

    That’s a century of uninterrupted dominance in the South — the core anti-civil rights constituency — until 1994, long after the passage of the civil rights act. So it’s fair to say that Democrats were the party of slavery and institutional racism, despite LBJ, who was President, not legislator.

    Whatevs, we’re way off topic and it’s getting tedious.

  244. NJ
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:54 am | Permalink

    DavosFTW,

    That’s true: but remember the red neck rally outside parliament where they had the ‘ditch the bitch/witch’ signs?

    I was offended, but can still laugh at the dumb fucks on both sides in Canberra!!! Bring back The Chaser’s War on Everything!!!

    Written, spoken and authorized on behalf of Nj!!

  245. Wes
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:55 am | Permalink

    I saw this in the Blu-ray commentary. It struck me as completely nonpolitical, though I did wonder at the potential for a blow up.

    lmao,

    Yes and no. There were really two major factions within the democratic coalition on this issue. Still, one faction was as you say.

  246. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:56 am | Permalink

    the goat,

    Have you ever broke something? Like a Household item when you were a kid. You’re mom told you not to do something, you did it, and now woops her lamp is broken.

    Did you rush to tell her? Did you try to hide a million pieces and make her suspecious? or Did you just go somewhere else and get your story straight, reherse the plan for when she finally finds it?

    Words to think about from the certifible.

  247. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:57 am | Permalink

    DH87,

    I actually think that post is pretty good. I would argue the reasons why Lincoln shifted, but I’m glad to see you don’t make the case that the war was fought to free the slaves. I mean, most people don’t even realize Lincoln was in favor of colonization up until the day he died. One of the quotes they don’t teach you in school from Lincoln from the debate with Douglas is pretty telling though. He said,

    “I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races — that I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race.”

    You might find the book The Real Lincoln by Thomas Dilorenzo interesting.
    http://mises.org/misesreview_detail.aspx?control=207

    and this one that recently came out that shed a lot more light on his views of colonization.
    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0826219098?ie=UTF8&tag=lewrockwell&linkCode=xm2&camp=1789&creativeASIN=0826219098

  248. lmao
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:58 am | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05: Except that Satire law only applies when it’s a Satire

    No idea what you’re talking about. The relevant federal statute is 18 U.S.C. 871, which criminalizes “knowingly and willfully . . . threat[ening] . . . the President, President-elect, Vice President or other officer next in the order of succession.”

    The elements “knowingly,” “willfully,” and “threat” are missing. (Benioff and Weiss explained that the prop was used inadvertently.)

    [Edit: Correction -- 18 U.S.C. 879 covers former Presidents. So it's not just threats against sitting Presidents that are covered.]

  249. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:58 am | Permalink

    DH87,

    How did the civil war even get brought up? Not that I’m complaining, I love that topic.

  250. Omar Brown
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:01 am | Permalink

    Holy crap I leave for one day and it looks like someone birthed a Shadowbaby all over the place.

    This is so crazy stupid, it’s funny..and sad….but mostly funny.

  251. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:03 am | Permalink

    lmao,

    Exactly. That’s why I posted that video from The Whitest Kids You Know talking about that statute. It’s pretty hilarious if you’ve never seen it.

  252. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:03 am | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05: Words to think about from the certifible.

    Also, I can’t believe you’re misspelling words that I just used in the post you’re responding to.

  253. Wes
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:03 am | Permalink

    Dan,

    Yet when Lincoln was elected for some reason there was massive hysteria over him being an abolitionist in the South (despite the fact that he wasn’t). Crazy people, I tell you.

  254. NJ
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:06 am | Permalink

    Omar,

    I’ve missed your posts too….waiting for someone to say the shadow baby looked like Cheney!! Then I’d be wetting myself laughing!!

  255. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:06 am | Permalink

    Dan,

    For the listeners at home.

    Republicans are evil!

    Yeah, well Republicans were Anti-Slavery during the civil War! Dems were pro slavery!

    Three thousand posts later

    Dan: How did the civil war come up

    Phantomwriter: I’m glad you asked!

    Dan: ah thank you very much.

    Phantomwriter: No problem

  256. Violentos
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:06 am | Permalink

    Did Bush make a statement about this? I guarantee he wouldn’t be mad, he would most likely be honored to be included in a fantastic show of this magnitude! It wasn’t so long ago that HBO was promoting GoT at Comic Con (?) by giving out images of your own head on a spike as a poster.

  257. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:07 am | Permalink

    Dan, the greatness of Lincoln has been plumbed by many historians. The Douglas quote you provide does reflect his views pre-War, and a number of subsequent statements he made can be criticized in terms of modern acceptance and understanding but he evolved in his thinking perhaps more than any politician in US history at the national level in circumstances that would have tried the most brilliant political minds of the last three hundred years.

    In the Greeley letter I quoted above, Lincoln made clear that “some/all/none” statement that was his political opinion but that his personal opinion was that all men should be free; and it was his statement in favor of (limited) voting rights for former slaves that indirectly caused his death. John Wilkes Boothe heard Lincoln’s speech upon news of Appomattox and said, “That means n— citizenship.”

  258. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:09 am | Permalink

    the goat,

    It’s worst than I thought!

    I’m misspelling words on top of discussing legal matters with a person who can’t find a sense of worth to find a more serious screen name. On a thread that’s more about the Civil War now, then about the topic.

    Lock me up Boys!

    I’ve seen too much!

  259. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:11 am | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05: On a thread that’s more about the Civil War now, then about the topic.

    Hey, when a thread goes all “No Moderation,” the Civil War is sure to follow!

  260. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:16 am | Permalink

    DH87,

    I don’t disagree on any of your points, sir.

    It’s actually a far more interesting topic then discussing basic law with a surely mountin billy.

  261. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:17 am | Permalink

    DH87,

    I understand that there are many historians that think Lincoln was great but I would challenge that premise. I see him as a tyrant.

    He was a consummate politician who spoke out of both sides of his mouth, saying one thing to one audience and the opposite to another.
    He was adamantly opposed to racial equality, actually using the words “superior and inferior” to describe the “appropriate” relation between the white and black races.
    He opposed giving blacks the right to vote, to serve on juries, or to intermarry with whites.
    He supported the legal rights of slave owners and pledged his support of a constitutional amendment that would have prohibited the federal government from ever interfering with Southern slavery.
    He was a mercantilist and a political tool of corrupt Northern business interests.
    He was a railroad industry lobbyist who championed corporate welfare.
    He once represented a slave owner in a case in which he sought to recover his runaway slaves. Lincoln lost the case and the slaves gained their freedom.
    He advocated sending all blacks back to Africa, Central America, or Haiti — anywhere but the U.S.
    He proposed strengthening the Fugitive Slave Law.
    He opposed the extension of slavery into the territories so that “free white people” would not have to associate with blacks or compete with them for jobs.
    He opposed black citizenship in Illinois and supported the state’s constitution which prohibited the emigration of black people into the state.
    He was the head of the Illinois Colonization Society, which advocated the use of state tax dollars to deport the small number of free blacks that resided within the state.
    He nullified the early emancipation of slaves in Missouri and Georgia early in the war.
    He sent troops to New York City to put down a draft riot by shooting hundreds of them in the streets.
    He was an enemy of free-market capitalism.
    He started a war over tax collection that ended up killing 620,000 Americans and wounding and maiming even more.
    He conjured up the spectacular lie that no such thing as state sovereignty ever existed to “justify” his invasion and conquest of the Southern states.
    He refused to meet with Confederate peace commissioners before the war to work out a peaceful compromise.
    He provoked the upper South — Virginia, North Carolina, Arkansas and Tennessee — to secede by launching a military invasion of their sister states.
    He supported economic interventionism through protectionist tariffs, corporate welfare, and central banking that would plunder one section of the country (the South) for the benefit of his Northern political supporters.
    He started a war without the consent of Congress; illegally declared martial law; illegally blockaded Southern ports; illegally suspended habeas corpus and arrested tens of thousands of political opponents; illegally orchestrated the secession of West Virginia; shut down hundreds of opposition newspapers and imprisoned their editors and owners; deported the most outspoken member of the Democratic Party opposition, Congressman Clement L. Vallandigham of Ohio; confiscated private property, including firearms; ignored the Ninth and Tenth Amendments; tolerated the arrest of ministers who refused to publicly pray for him; arrested duly elected members of the Maryland legislature as well as Congressman Henry May of Baltimore; and supported a law that indemnified federal officials from all of these illegal acts.
    He orchestrated the rigging of Northern elections.
    Introduced the slavery of conscription and income taxation.
    Censored all telegraph communication.
    Waged war on civilians by having his armies bomb Southern cities and destroy or steal crops, livestock and private property throughout the South.
    Created an enormous political patronage system that survives today.
    Allowed the unjust mass execution of Sioux Indians in Minnesota.
    Destroyed the system of federalism and states’ rights that was created by the founding fathers, thereby destroying the voluntary union.
    Promoted generals for their willingness to use troops as cannon fodder.
    Created an internal revenue bureaucracy that has never diminished in size and power.

  262. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:20 am | Permalink

    DH87,

    Not only that but it is much more entertaining to discuss differences of opinions on these kind of topics than to exclude them because someone might feel uncomfortable talking about these things.

  263. Langkard
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:22 am | Permalink

    Dan:
    DH87,

    He was an enemy of free-market capitalism.

    I’d put that in the positive column.

    (stirs the pot some more)

  264. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:25 am | Permalink

    Dan,

    In summery he was a politcian.

    No matter how people say Abe was a good guy, he was a snake, and had an extensively corrupt adminstration. If he was as honest as people want us to believe then he was more inept than old dead Ned about the people around him.

    Acts justify the means in this PC climate, sadly. Because the south was “Pro-Slave” any means he used are justified for equality that he himself didn’t believe.

  265. andrea
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:30 am | Permalink

    Langkard: I’d put that in the positive column.

    +1, like I said I love Joseph Stiglitz. And now the pot boils but I must go to sleep.

    Very interesting history lesson, though.

  266. Blood
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:32 am | Permalink

    The Iraq war was a way for Halliburton and other assorted interests to legally loot the US treasury through the war itself and the reconstruction deals after. Dick Cheney and co. did the most harm to the US out of anyone in a 100 years, and he had the GOPs blessing. Bush was never anything but a convenient idiot figurehead.

    Not to say Obama is much better, he may talk the talk but all his term he has proved to be a right leaning centrist at best. Don’t bite the hand that feeds you. What happened to UHC Obama? What happened? Your corporatist masters told you no dice son, that’s what happened.

  267. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:35 am | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05: It’s worst than I thought!

    I’m misspelling words on top of discussing legal matters with a person who can’t find a sense of worth to find a more serious screen name.

    http://i46.tinypic.com/59rok.gif

  268. DH87
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:36 am | Permalink

    Dan,

    You have an interesting contrarian perspective but one I’m not up to arguing point by point at this time of night, I’m afraid. The one I will comment on is “Destroyed the system of federalism and states’ rights that was created by the founding fathers, thereby destroying the voluntary union.”

    It is true that R. E. Lee was not tried for treason after the end of the War, despite the strong desire for revenge upon the General personally, due to legal scholars’ worry that a guilty verdict would be challenged and taken to the US Supreme Court. There was a strong feeling that the Court would overturn such a verdict since there was no legal basis for prohibiting secession in law or in any document of the Founding Fathers, thus throwing the outcome of the war, won by means of arms, into doubt.

    Edit to add: And now I must bid adieu, leaving the War in good hands, no doubt.

  269. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:38 am | Permalink

    A woman has 1 last question regarding the prop head…where did it come from? Where there no other more generic face masks/heads that could have been used? Where is the prop person who decided to use that head? Not that it matters, as what’s done is done, but just curious as to the decision process that went into this prop use. It’s a tempest in a teapot, but we can’t just pretend it didn’t happen. It appears to have been an inadvertent issue, the person who put the head on the spike may not have even seen the resemblance. This will probably all be forgotten in a few weeks when there’s something more interesting to complain about.

  270. Phantomwriter05
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:40 am | Permalink

    the goat,

    Exactly …

    Ladies, Gentlemen … Dan.

    I find myself in need elsewhere and I bid you a good evening.

  271. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:40 am | Permalink

    Langkard,

    Oh, I totally understand that I’m in the minority on a site leaning far left on economic matters. I actually would of agreed with you 10 years ago. I was very liberal in my beliefs for most of my life. What changed my thinking was when someone introduced me to Austrian economics (it has nothing to do with the country Austria, the founders of that school of thought just happened to be from there) and specifically Ludwig von Mises and Murray Rothbard.

    I wouldn’t expect to change a persons views on this commenting on a thread but if you are at all interested in the topic I can recommend a few books that you can read and they are all free.

    http://mises.org/document/5706/Lessons-for-the-Young-Economist
    http://mises.org/document/2031/Economics-for-Real-People
    http://mises.org/document/3490/Defending-the-Undefendable
    http://mises.org/document/1010/For-a-New-Liberty-The-Libertarian-Manifesto
    http://mises.org/document/860/Economics-and-Ethics-of-Private-Property-Studies-in-Political-Economy-and-Philosophy-The

  272. Joshua Taylor
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:42 am | Permalink

    the goat,

    A choice choice! Hail is my favourite Radiohead album. “Little man being erased” makes me think of the Stranger.

  273. Jon Snow Carter
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:47 am | Permalink

    Ha! Talking heads talking about… a head? Love it. I’m sure the episode will be back soon with the head removed from the footage. Just a footnote in the show’s history…

  274. Joshua Taylor
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:51 am | Permalink

    Lex,

    You missed the wink in my emoticon. You saw ” :-)” when you actually saw “;-)” Newsflash the Goat loves Radiohead/Coachella/GoT/pro show Trolling whilst I love The Wire/Lena Headey/Gillian Anderson/ Sian Philips/ Stephen Dillane and polite discourse! And puppies too!

    This thread is infecting me with douchebag-itis.

    To quote a certain red-haired witch “I have my own fun.”

  275. Chump Force 1
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:51 am | Permalink

    The morons at my local Target store haven’t pulled GOT DVD/Blue Rays off the shelf. Got me a few sets on sale. Hello eBay!

  276. Ismael Isak
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:55 am | Permalink

    DH87,

    It was pretty dumb of D&D to mention it on the commentary. But this is what i hate about the media, when they have a slow news day they go digging around for any controversy. And the worst part is that the DVD came out in march, and no one said a thing. Also its not even a clear shot of GWBs head, no one would have noticed if they didn’t point it out. Lets hope this is the last time Game of Thrones gets political.

  277. Joshua Taylor
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:03 am | Permalink

    Because of my utter contempt for the topic at hand, I present to you this distraction:

    Has anyone seen the now available but admittedly not great quality slew of lost X-files dailies footage now available on Youtube? Especially these gems from “Quagmire” ?

    http://youtu.be/hEs3tnxFZU8

    http://youtu.be/5zzsViH6ycI

    Even when he’s not in character David Duchovny should have been a Spartan…because he is so ‘laconic’! Get it? Laconic, Spartan?

    Oh wells. Here’s an awesome mash up of Bear McCreary’s cover of “All Along the Watchtower” (BSG) and Game of Thrones! http://youtu.be/2NOzS-L_1PU

  278. Thiago Waldhelm
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:08 am | Permalink

    Pablo Jainaga:
    I just read about the GWB prop head and all the fuss about it. Seriously, USA? Seriously???

    my thoughts exactly.
    if I were GWB (and thank God I’m not) I’d have a laugh and order a replica of the Iron Throne to the White House!

  279. Saadcrates
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:11 am | Permalink

    Glad I got my blu ray copy. I wonder if having multiple blu ray copies with the ‘original heads’ will have much added value to geek fans down the line.

  280. Tar Kidho
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:19 am | Permalink

    I was a bit afraid to start reading this thread, but it was actually really entertaining. One of the best Saturday’s GoT Laughs thread ever!

    And for those of you who feel offended by this, you should try to watch some episodes of the BBC show ‘Mock the Week‘ with Danny Boyle still on the show. It might help you to start taking life in general and humour in particular less overly-serious. Although I should warn, some of you might not be able to take the shock, but hey, that’s natural selection for ya…

  281. negar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:22 am | Permalink

    Guys , just thank god you’re living in the US.
    If this had happened in Iran , they would’ve hanged D&D and canceled the show.

  282. Pastor_of_Muppets
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:24 am | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05,

    I nominate you for the annual WiC awards in the category of Worst Troll. Competition is sure to he heated this year, but even so, I think you stand a good chance at taking it all. That is an award, right?

  283. The End
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:35 am | Permalink

    I love how people are so upset at the opinions of others. People were offended, doesn’t matter if you were offended or not. HBO is being responsible by correcting the scenes that were ‘crossing the line’ for many people. Did I have an issue with it? No. Did I think it was funny when they said it on the commentary? No. Do I think George W. Bush would give a shit? No. Do I think people would be more upset if it was Obama? Yes. (Because someone would claim they were doing it because he was a Black President – Don’t believe me? MSNBC made that jump about the ‘heckler’ today at his speech asking would they have ‘heckled’ Obama if he was white) Do I think it’s in poor taste to do this with any president? Yes. DOES MY OPPINION MATTER? NO! Fucking deal with it. HBO made the call. Go back to what you are doing and accept what was done no matter if you agree or not. Shut the fuck up and go on with your life.

  284. StormOf*S*Words
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:43 am | Permalink

    My family got me GoT on DVDs instead of BluRay by mistake (it was a gift). So I returned the DVDs and went over to the shelf to get the BluRays but they had NO copies of GoT on ANY format in the store. It was very strange. Now I know why. And now I’m stuck without season 1.

  285. loco73
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:08 am | Permalink

    This whole episode is really silly and stupid and epitomizes the phrase “much ado about nothing”. I am more pissed-off that HBO reacted the way it did, caving in so quickly and giving credence to what should have been a non-issue.

    What is even more mind-numbing is the fact that they went to such lengths to avoid any controversy, as to actually censor themselves, thus directly taking aim at their audiences and fans of “Game Of Thrones”. If HBO is accountable to anyone it is to their subscribers and viewers. I pay my fucking subscription because of the creative freedom that shows enjoy on the network. But if this is the norm going forward, that HBO will grovel and apologize to every asshole and douchebag with too much time on their hands, who decide to make something out of nothing, then perhaps I’ll have to revisit that whole idea of paying for HBO…

    It is as if the motherfucker who started this whole idiocy and has nothing to do with the show, is more important than the fans which have made GoT into the success it has become, and HBO seems to pay more attention to that asshole than to us!

    HBO, grow some damn balls and stop pissing yourselves everytime something like this happens! You know now that I think about it, I am not even sure what the deal with that whole controversy surrounding their now defunct show “Luck”, really was about…

    Has anybody read the venom and vitriol one can find on a lot of these political blogs? Or the nonsense and stupidity that flow in abundance on networks like MSNBC, FOX and CNN? Nobody apologizes for that stuff!

    Even discussing this whole stupid episode is only making it more relevant than it should have ever become…but here we go…

    PS I don’t really give a shit whose damn head it was on the spike, whether it was Obama. Bush, Santa Clause or the Fairie Godmother…and HBO doesn’t look responsible at all…they look like a bunch of pussies rolling over for whatever cretin or cretins made this in such a clusterfuck! This is not a life or death issue…are you offended? Though shit…these days everybody gets their panties twisted over every godamn irrelevant thing and everybody is offended by something somewhere, and they make damns sure we know about it and are affected by their outrage!

    Guess what? lLfe is like that…and unfortunately you’ll be offended multiple times thoughout the course of your life…you don’t wanna be offended, take up basket weaving or knitting!

  286. Ice&Fire
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:14 am | Permalink

    God who cares. Sometimes I really consider myself lucky to live in another country where you can make fun of someone/something without hypocrites breathing down ones neck. Who gives a shit about George Bush anyway, he probably thought it was funny.

  287. Ruckus
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:16 am | Permalink

    Classic example of how the right-wing talking heads use feigned outrage to control their base, keep them in a constant state of manufactured fear and anger.

  288. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:17 am | Permalink

    So sell your suit and tie and come and live with me
    Leukemia schizophrenia polyethylene
    There is no significant risk to your health
    She used to be beautiful once as well

    Plastic bag, middle class, polyethylene
    Decaffeinate, unleaded, keep all surfaces clean
    If you don’t believe this, sell your soul
    If you don’t get into it, no one will

  289. Augmentedreality
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:18 am | Permalink

    All they said was that it looked like someone – I think this just reflects the disturbing reality that freedom of speech is a mere myth. Surely their disclaimer covers them?

  290. Ldcftoos
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:21 am | Permalink

    Dan: He was a consummate politician who spoke out of both sides of his mouth, saying one thing to one audience and the opposite to another.
    He was adamantly opposed to racial equality, actually using the words “superior and inferior” to describe the “appropriate” relation between the white and black races.
    He opposed giving blacks the right to vote, to serve on juries, or to intermarry with whites.
    He supported the legal rights of slave owners and pledged his support of a constitutional amendment that would have prohibited the federal government from ever interfering with Southern slavery.
    He was a mercantilist and a political tool of corrupt Northern business interests.
    He was a railroad industry lobbyist who championed corporate welfare.
    He once represented a slave owner in a case in which he sought to recover his runaway slaves. Lincoln lost the case and the slaves gained their freedom.
    He advocated sending all blacks back to Africa, Central America, or Haiti — anywhere but the U.S.
    He proposed strengthening the Fugitive Slave Law.
    He opposed the extension of slavery into the territories so that “free white people” would not have to associate with blacks or compete with them for jobs.
    He opposed black citizenship in Illinois and supported the state’s constitution which prohibited the emigration of black people into the state.
    He was the head of the Illinois Colonization Society, which advocated the use of state tax dollars to deport the small number of free blacks that resided within the state.
    He nullified the early emancipation of slaves in Missouri and Georgia early in the war.

    by Thomas J. DiLorenzo
    Quote your sources
    The Constitution at the time protected slavery in the states that already existed. To be in support of the constitution meant protecting slavery in states that already existed. The issue at the time is Slavery Extension into the territories and Interstate Commerce. The commerce including real live human beings.
    Lincoln Racial view were in line with country at the time. Many great Americans though better and they should be honored. For at the time, they were a great threat to the Founding principles of this country.

    Dan: He was an enemy of free-market capitalism.
    He started a war over tax collection that ended up killing 620,000 Americans and wounding and maiming even more.
    He conjured up the spectacular lie that no such thing as state sovereignty ever existed to “justify” his invasion and conquest of the Southern states.
    He refused to meet with Confederate peace commissioners before the war to work out a peaceful compromise.
    He provoked the upper South — Virginia, North Carolina, Arkansas and Tennessee — to secede by launching a military invasion of their sister states.
    He supported economic interventionism through protectionist tariffs, corporate welfare, and central banking that would plunder one section of the country (the South) for the benefit of his Northern political supporters.
    He started a war without the consent of Congress; illegally declared martial law; illegally blockaded Southern ports; illegally suspended habeas corpus and arrested tens of thousands of political opponents; illegally orchestrated the secession of West Virginia; shut down hundreds of opposition newspapers and imprisoned their editors and owners; deported the most outspoken member of the Democratic Party opposition, Congressman Clement L. Vallandigham of Ohio; confiscated private property, including firearms; ignored the Ninth and Tenth Amendments; tolerated the arrest of ministers who refused to publicly pray for him; arrested duly elected members of the Maryland legislature as well as Congressman Henry May of Baltimore; and supported a law that indemnified federal officials from all of these illegal acts.
    He orchestrated the rigging of Northern elections.
    Introduced the slavery of conscription and income taxation.
    Censored all telegraph communication.
    Waged war on civilians by having his armies bomb Southern cities and destroy or steal crops, livestock and private property throughout the South.
    Created an enormous political patronage system that survives today.
    Allowed the unjust mass execution of Sioux Indians in Minnesota.
    Destroyed the system of federalism and states’ rights that was created by the founding fathers, thereby destroying the voluntary union.
    Promoted generals for their willingness to use troops as cannon fodder.
    Created an internal revenue bureaucracy that has never diminished in size and power.

    To avoid war, slavery would need to be allowed into the territories. Ensuring slavery continue for at least two more generations.
    Yes Lincoln played all out war when it got to it. He is guilty of many accusation. He also won the war. He kept the Union together. The 13th Amendment was ratified on 12/18/1965 Constitutionally ending slavery. When would of it ended following our Great Founding Principles of State’s Right?

  291. JA
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:23 am | Permalink

    HBO is a business. GoT fans are lucky they supported the project and should be the last people complaining about how the company handles brand matters. This situation doesn’t really involve people being actually offended, but it does reflect poorly on D&D’s professionalism and common sense.

    If it had been Obama, well, heads would have (figuratively) rolled.

  292. nicknick
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:26 am | Permalink

    One must agree with A Woman and ask the question again: where did the head come from originally?

  293. damphair13
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:47 am | Permalink

    Bush should be honored to have his head on a spike with Ned Stark!

  294. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:31 am | Permalink

    Ldcftoos,

    by Thomas J. DiLorenzo
    Quote your sources

    Sure, no problem. Here is a link to the article I copy and pasted that list from.
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo56.html
    I also linked to his book The Real Lincoln in a previous comment and the book discusses all these points in detail.

    The Constitution at the time protected slavery in the states that already existed. To be in support of the constitution meant protecting slavery in states that already existed.

    Yes, if you believed the Constitution was perfect and needed no changes then you would have been in favor of protecting slavery. I personally find that to be a scum bag position to take and would not respect someone who supported such a monstrous institution. Still, Lincoln was far from a constitutionalist as he ran rough shod over it the entire time he was president. Refer to that list to see how strictly Lincoln obeyed the constitution.

    The issue at the time is Slavery Extension into the territories and Interstate Commerce. The commerce including real live human beings.

    What issue? If you are saying that the war was fought over this then I disagree. I don’t think it is correct to say that slavery had nothing to do with the civil war but it didn’t cause the war itself.
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/rothbard/rothbard175.html

    Lincoln Racial view were in line with country at the time. Many great Americans though better and they should be honored. For at the time, they were a great threat to the Founding principles of this country.

    Yes, we had a very racist country at the time. I find their opinions on race despicable and will not sugar coat that because of the idiotic sentiment of the time. Slavery was just as wrong then as it is today and those who fought this terrible institution, like Lysander Spooner, should be applauded, and those who supported it should not get a pass because it was majority opinion. But my biggest problem with Lincoln isn’t that he just defended slavery, it was he held extremely racists views of black people and he favored colonization until the day he died. If that wasn’t bad enough, refer back to the list for all the other tyrannical things he did.

    To avoid war, slavery would need to be allowed into the territories. Ensuring slavery continue for at least two more generations.
    Yes Lincoln played all out war when it got to it. He is guilty of many accusation. He also won the war. He kept the Union together. The 13th Amendment was ratified on 12/18/1965 Constitutionally ending slavery. When would of it ended following our Great Founding Principles of State’s Right?

    That is a great question. First, let me just point out that the United States is the only Western country that needed a bloody civil war to end slavery. Every other country did it with little to no violence. Many of our states were able to end slavery peacefully. Here is a link to a great book on this very topic. http://www.amazon.com/Greatest-Emancipations-West-Abolished-Slavery/dp/0230605923

    Also see this article discussing the matter and that book I just linked.
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo146.html

    Anyways, if the government wanted to end slavery peacefully it could have been done right away. There is absolutely no reason that 600,000 people needed to die and over 1 million being seriously wounded. Still, I am glad that slavery ended. It’s the only positive things that came out of that God awful war. Regardless though, Lincoln was a tyrant, in my opinion, and I can’t look past all the terrible things he was responsible for because slavery ended under his watch. One good thing, even a really good thing like the end of slavery, doesn’t come close to washing away the despicable things he was responsible for.

  295. Shawn Edward Cantu
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:38 am | Permalink

    Highest rated quote from the related EW article:

    “At least somebody’s using dubya’s head, he sure as hell never did.”

  296. JBJB
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:52 am | Permalink

    Only in America!

  297. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:17 am | Permalink

    Never realized there was a Dr Who reference in this song, but I did spend almost 4 hours in line next to a Doctor & companion last year at Comicon. Smashing great couple, they were just starting the books, reading them in line even (as I was Dance):

    I’m stuck in the tardis
    trapped in hyperspace
    one minute snake charming
    the next in a motorcade

    all the right moves and
    earn the right percent
    watch me dance like a puppet
    you can almost see the strings

    give me an answer
    give me a sign
    i’ve been climbing up this ladder
    i’ve been wasting my time

    so long, so long
    so long, so long

    up on the ladder
    no time to escape
    up on the ladder
    away for fucking sake

    up on the ladder
    try to call out your name
    up on the ladder
    you’re all the fucking same

    oh, you let the people down
    you let the people down
    you let the people down

  298. Erik
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:18 am | Permalink

    To be fair, imagine the extreme uproar that would ensue if a TV-series featured Barack Obama’s decapitated head on a stick.

  299. jarnomiedema
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:26 am | Permalink

    Right, I hadn’t bought the DVD-set yet, thinking I’d get around to it, but now I just HAVE to! I want one with Bush’s head in it, damnit!

  300. Mormegil
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:40 am | Permalink

    Alex Dubrovsky: AFAIR, in S3 finale of DW, the American president was killed by aliens. I don’t remember any outrage …This is one of the stupidest non-stories I’ve ever seen. Only the nonsense with a “sex scene” in Mass Effect 1 can be compared to it.

    That was a fictional President though and it would hardly be the first time one of those was killed on TV. In the Blair case it was meant to be a real Prime Minister (who was still in power).

    They did turn Obama into an alien in a later series though.

  301. Oi!
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:47 am | Permalink

    Well its HBOs fault, one would think that they went through the DVD commentary and heard the mention of GWB head on a spike and would have the sense to pull that. Better yet why even use it, I mean a lot of the people involved ain’t American but the ones that are should have at least a tiny amount of common sense needed to say, hey maybe we shouldn’t use the severed head of a former president on a spike.

    Imagine the outrage if it were Obamas head on a spike, not that HBO would allow that mistake.

  302. sjwenings
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:55 am | Permalink

    Erik: To be fair, imagine the extreme uproar that would ensue if a TV-series featured Barack Obama’s decapitated head on a stick.

    Thats not fair, since he’s the current president. A more apt comparison would be Clinton.

  303. SeVv
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:16 am | Permalink

    I don’t remember any outrage when the guy at the set of Halloween used a William Shatner mask for that crazy serial killer, you know Michael Myers. Why did they do it? Did they hate William Shatner? Oh, apparently it was the cheapest mask available. So what did they say again on the DVD commentary? They needed some cheap head because making them is freaking expensive; they had a GWB mask and used it. Was it clearly visible? Nope. They turned it sideface and put a ridiculous wig on it. They talked about this in the commentary because it is funny trivia (like the Halloween thing a talked about earlier), nothing more. Gods you ‘mericans make it really hard to not think you are that stupid cliché, I want to believe you aren’t but things like this…

  304. Mormegil
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:20 am | Permalink

    It’s all actually GRRM’s fault.

    The idea was to put GRRMs head on the spikes (making him the third head after Ned and Septa Mordane I guess ie GWB’s head) but it was deemed to expensive to create a GRRM head unless GRRM provided his own.

    He declined and so GWB’s head was used instead.

    Matty B says: Would you ever consider making a cameo in the TV show? If so, what sort of role would you play?

    Actually, I made a cameo in the original pilot, which was filmed in Morocco. I was a Pentoshi nobleman, and one of the guests at Dany’s wedding to Khal Drogo. however, subsequently we recast the part of Dany, so the entire Morocco wedding sequence was cut, and my brilliant cameo was left on the cutting room floor. I also had investigated the idea of being a head on a spike, and David and Dan were going to put my severed head on a spike at one point, but then they got the quote for what that would cost. Those severed heads are expensive and our budget is tight! So unless I provide my own I don’t get to be a severed head! But one of my fans who does that sort of thing has offered me the chance to make one next time I go out to LA. How could I resist? I could have my own severed head and carry it around in a bowling bag.

  305. KaitarBesh
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:44 am | Permalink

    Hell, I think they should have all the politicians’ heads on spikes. What do you think of that? Buncha crooks and liars.

    Seriously though, people are way too sensitive. No one even -noticed- whose rubber mask replica head it was. It wasn’t him, it wasn’t meant to be him, he isn’t some damned religious martyr they defaced.

    But of course you have the silly ” ‘MERICA!” blind sheep flag wavers that ruin something for everyone because it offends their unpatriotic (a true patriot questions their government and wouldn’t be offended by something so stupid) wee feelings.

  306. SillyMammo
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:52 am | Permalink

    Regardless though, Lincoln was a tyrant, in my opinion, and I can’t look past all the terrible things he was responsible for because slavery ended under his watch. One good thing, even a really good thing like the end of slavery, doesn’t come close to washing away the despicable things he was responsible for.

    Yes, but Lincoln was also a vampire hunter and a zombie hunter to a lesser extent. If some sources can be believe. So that makes him the greatest POTUS ever!!

  307. Macha
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:02 am | Permalink

    Dan: One good thing, even a really good thing like the end of slavery, doesn’t come close to washing away the despicable things he was responsible for.

    Stannis approves +1.

  308. Theultralisk
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:03 am | Permalink

    Superdeluxe,

    After the riots in the Arab world following the Muhammad caricatures in European newspapers everyone should know not to make fun of holy men!!

    Oh… wait. Different culture, different religion…. or is it? sorry about that!! :)

    LOL at everbody demanding freedom of expression and speech and then freaking out about a prop that MIGHT look like the most unworthy of america’s presidents…

  309. Macha
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:16 am | Permalink

    Mormegil: It’s all actually GRRM’s fault.

    The idea was to put GRRMs head on the spikes (making him the third head after Ned and Septa Mordane I guess ie GWB’s head) but it was deemed to expensive to create a GRRM head unless GRRM provided his own.
    He declined and so GWB’s head was used instead.

    ROFL. I didn’t know that!
    Still, I think we should blame Bioware. If they hadn’t stirred up all that rage with their Mass Effect 3 ending in March, people would have picked this up sooner and HBO might have prevented the apocalypse. Yup, I’m sticking to that. But mostly because I seem to have this inexplicable urge to derail this topic.

  310. G_Lee
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:17 am | Permalink

    US – United States of the most retarded people on the planet. That’s all I am going to add to this “discussion”. What else to expect from a nation where 50% of the people believe that evolution doesn’t exist and the world was created by “god” in 7 days some 3000 years ago…

  311. goober
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:18 am | Permalink

    woah.even when listening to the commentry on ep 10 my eyes were only drawn to sean beans bonce.short of pausing frames and activlely looking for the head its blink and miss.been better to just blank the commentry on that bit.

  312. Langkard
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:21 am | Permalink

    Dan:
    Langkard,

    Oh, I totally understand that I’m in the minority on a site leaning far left on economic matters. I actually would of agreed with you 10 years ago. I was very liberal in my beliefs for most of my life. What changed my thinking was when someone introduced me to Austrian economics (it has nothing to do with the country Austria, the founders of that school of thought just happened to be from there) and specifically Ludwig von Mises and Murray Rothbard.

    I wouldn’t expect to change a persons views on this commenting on a thread but if you are at all interested in the topic I can recommend a few books that you can read and they are all free.

    http://mises.org/document/5706/Lessons-for-the-Young-Economist
    http://mises.org/document/2031/Economics-for-Real-People
    http://mises.org/document/3490/Defending-the-Undefendable
    http://mises.org/document/1010/For-a-New-Liberty-The-Libertarian-Manifesto
    http://mises.org/document/860/Economics-and-Ethics-of-Private-Property-Studies-in-Political-Economy-and-Philosophy-The

    Trust me when I say that I’ve read them all. If you’d like I can point you to some very interesting opposing critiques of von Mises own critique of socialism, as well as many rebuttals to Rothbard. I’d also recommend reading works by Bakunin and Kropotkin as well as Murray Bookchin, especially his The Ecology of Freedom: The Emergence and Dissolution of Hierarchy and Post-Scarcity Anarchism. Look them up. :)

    I should also point out that libertarianism as a political concept was a left philosophy long before an Ayn Rand idolater named Dean Russell misappropriated the term and added a capital letter in 1955.

  313. Virtus
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:58 am | Permalink

    They noticed this only now? Hasn’t this already been known for like six months or more?

  314. gotgotgot
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 8:19 am | Permalink

    More overreaction.
    I am surprised HBO caved in to any so called”pressure” to change the episode.
    Amazing that if a few people complain about hurt feelings or being “offended” that this happens.

    Yes it was a stupid move to use the head because any one should of known better.” GEE maybe we shouldn’t rent all these ex presidents heads for the headroll scenes..”
    It isnt like they used the head to portray the president. And it was barely visible. So now know one can ever use 10% of a head that appears to look like someone else?
    WTF

  315. Rygar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 8:34 am | Permalink

    Is it possible that the head in question was actually only Will Ferrell?

    All this hoopla over a cowbell.

  316. Richard Weetabix
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 8:44 am | Permalink

    lmao,

    And after the Civil Rights Act was passed, all those racist Democrats promptly became Republicans, opting for the wrong side of history. Where they’ve happily stayed ever since.

  317. Kaeth
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 9:21 am | Permalink

    Well they just made the original dvds with the head in them worth more now. :D

  318. Jorge
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 10:20 am | Permalink

    What a complete non-story. David and Dan even said they only used the head because it was available, not as any kind of political ploy. I believe them; nobody could recognize that brief shot of the head as Bush, and no one did.

    I have no idea why HBO is acting so stupidly in regards to this. I’m shocked they even acknowledged this bogus controversy, let alone pulling episodes and drawing even more attention to it. Bottom line though, this will not affect the show at all. Any viewers who would quit over this probably wouldn’t have stayed around this long.

  319. Jose
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 10:26 am | Permalink

    HBO is a left wing network (as is their right) and therefore doesn’t get the benefit of the doubt with stuff like this. It’s disrespectful to put any president’s head on a spike. There’s no getting around that. It’s no different than burning him in effigy.

    It’s unfortunate because it was probably an inside joke amongst the showmakers (who are of course lefties) and wasn’t meant to be any kind of statement to the viewer. D&D just threw it in as a bit of silly trivia.

  320. House Snow
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:02 am | Permalink

    I don’t know, I think

  321. The Kingshaver
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:02 am | Permalink

    Anyone who is genuinely offended by this piffle is a fucking moron. This is exactly the type of immature asinine antics that makes those of us who live in Europe roll our eyes at just how pathetic US politics has become. Grow up America, especially the US Right. Just grow the fuck up. There are important issues out there. Anyone who thinks that this childish crap is worth our attention needs to retire from politics, retire from public life and never speak again. Simple.

  322. House Snow
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:06 am | Permalink

    I don’t know , I think this falls under “bad” publicity that is good publicity. I suspect this is much more calculated on HBOs part than people realize. I doubt many people would stop watching the show over this, but I suspect more people will check in just to see what the hubub is about.

  323. Michelle
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:13 am | Permalink

    HBO, stop being pussies. You finally get a decent show, and you act like this over something that was not at all political? Seriously, grow a pair.

  324. The Kingshaver
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:20 am | Permalink

    To Jose;

    So it’s “disrespectful”. So what? There is no requirement that anyone respect former presidents. You may respect the cretinous warmongering oaf, as is your right, but many of the rest of us regard him as the worst US leader since Nixon. He deserves no respect, but even if he had been the greatest president ever, people would still be free to dislike him, criticise him, mock him and otherwise disrespect him.

    D%D and HBO are not encouraging people to actually behead George Bush. Short of that, they can be as disrespectful as they like; it’s called freedom of speech. You seem to understand that, so think it through. It is HBO’s right to be a “leftie network” (whatever that means) and it’s their right to disrespect whomsoever they wish. That includes Bush. It includes Obama. It includes me and you. That’s what free speech means.

    By the way, The Simpsons did this years ago, check it out; http://deadhomersociety.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/lisathebeautyqueen6_thumb.png?w=512&h=384

    Gonna get pissy at Fox now?

  325. Trumpet
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:30 am | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar: A woman likes this idea Bonnie! HBO can make it a contest too, if you see the President’s head and correctly tweet the answer to @GameOfThrones #GuessThePrezOnThePike, you MAY win a prize! One entry per episode please.

    So you want everyone looking for head each episode?

  326. PatD
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:31 am | Permalink

    Just once. Just once in my lifetime, I’d like to see a corporation, any corporation, show some courage and say, “Fuck you if you can’t take a joke. We’re standing by our artists.”

    But, nooooo… Republican blowhards continue to run this country.

    Don’t fool yourselves. This has nothing to do with respect for the office.

  327. Joffers
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:35 am | Permalink

    Ser Ilyn…Bring me his head! No not Bush’s head you dimwit!

  328. Val
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:51 am | Permalink

    Are they kidding? Even if it wasn’t a ridiculous overreaction (which it is) the episode aired a year ago, the sets were released three months ago, and NOW they decide to start complaining? THEY DIDN’T EVEN NOTICE! I get why HBO did what they did, they could get into a whole lot of unworthy trouble, but really, sometimes I think there’s people who make it their life’s mission to find stuff to complain about.

  329. Laura
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 11:56 am | Permalink

    Joffers,

    Win!

  330. Ldcftoos
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:09 pm | Permalink

    In the end, this whole episode is still “soft” news.

    The episode aired over a year ago with the DVD/BR out for over three. The producer in a commentary had to point it out to you as “trivia”. The primary source is that commentary for any reaction.
    I think HBO reaction is nonsensical. Really, on whose behalf they are doing this for? If it really does make sense than many people assumption and beliefs of who the HBO audience “is” is wrong.

  331. Ldcftoos
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:19 pm | Permalink

    Dan: Ldcftoos,

    by Thomas J. DiLorenzo
    Quote your sources

    Sure, no problem. Here is a link to the article I copy and pasted that list from.
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo56.html
    I also linked to his book The Real Lincoln in a previous comment and the book discusses all these points in detail.

    The Constitution at the time protected slavery in the states that already existed. To be in support of the constitution meant protecting slavery in states that already existed.

    Yes, if you believed the Constitution was perfect and needed no changes then you would have been in favor of protecting slavery. I personally find that to be a scum bag position to take and would not respect someone who supported such a monstrous institution. Still, Lincoln was far from a constitutionalist as he ran rough shod over it the entire time he was president. Refer to that list to see how strictly Lincoln obeyed the constitution.

    The issue at the time is Slavery Extension into the territories and Interstate Commerce. The commerce including real live human beings.

    What issue? If you are saying that the war was fought over this then I disagree. I don’t think it is correct to say that slavery had nothing to do with the civil war but it didn’t cause the war itself.
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/rothbard/rothbard175.html

    Lincoln Racial view were in line with country at the time. Many great Americans though better and they should be honored. For at the time, they were a great threat to the Founding principles of this country.

    Yes, we had a very racist country at the time. I find their opinions on race despicable and will not sugar coat that because of the idiotic sentiment of the time. Slavery was just as wrong then as it is today and those who fought this terrible institution, like Lysander Spooner, should be applauded, and those who supported it should not get a pass because it was majority opinion. But my biggest problem with Lincoln isn’t that he just defended slavery, it was he held extremely racists views of black people and he favored colonization until the day he died. If that wasn’t bad enough, refer back to the list for all the other tyrannical things he did.

    Yes, the people who hold Slavery are scumbags. They were also the Congressman, Senators, Presidents, and Judges of the time within the context of the Constitution of the time. So, be so very angry and mad, that is the Constitution 1789-1865.

  332. Jun
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:25 pm | Permalink

    God, what stupid people they are. I’m talking about David Benioff and D.B. Weiss.

  333. Meg
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:26 pm | Permalink

    Erik: To be fair, imagine the extreme uproar that would ensue if a TV-series featured Barack Obama’s decapitated head on a stick.

    These Obama comments, which occur every three posts in this thread, make me want to gouge out my eyes. Are they supposed to be some kind of cover for your own obsequiousness to power? Are you trying to say that liberals blindly follow their leader and conservatives don’t, or something? Or maybe that liberals are more politically correct about Obama, and thus easier to whip into a frenzy? None of this makes sense because liberals, just like conservatives, come in all shapes in sizes, and Obama isn’t their zombiemaster. Some are blindly devoted to the prez, other liberals call him a war criminal. What’s the point again?

    Moreover, the head wasn’t “featured,” for christ sake, it was an easter egg. And a head on a pike doesn’t have any racial overtones whatsoever–if an Obama effigy was lynched or hung from a tree, then you might see a higher quantity of people upset about Obama being “disrespected” (and rightly so…cuz its hella racist).

  334. patchy face
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:35 pm | Permalink

    Jun,

    glad you won’t be watching the show next year. Bye-bye

  335. auroraschildren
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:37 pm | Permalink

    Seriously, if people can get this upset over a stupid prop head of a president then why cant people get upset over things that matter like education, unemployment, gay rights? It’s dumb, the whole situation is dumb.

    And btw, the head looks NOTHING like GWB unless you really stare at it, most of it is covered with LONG BROWN HAIR anyway. Its not like GWB’s head is staring the viewer down like “I KNOW YOU SEE ME AND I AM JUDGING YOU FOR IT”.

    dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb – the end.

  336. Tar Kidho
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:45 pm | Permalink

    The Kingshaver,

    Futurama featured the floating head of Nixon… Probably the reason why it got axed prematurely on Fox :-)

    Btw, I just went to my local shop in France and (finally!) bought the first season DVDs without any problem. I also see it listed and ‘in stock’ on Amazon UK, so I assume it’s only been recalled in the US? What about Canada?
    [edit: also still 'in stock' on Amazon.com btw]

  337. Varamyr Fourskins
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:53 pm | Permalink

    Ldcftoos,

    I find it sad that we still list many of the Founding Fathers as “planters”, even though they didn’t actually do any of the planting. A more appropriate title would be “overseer”.

    But, you’ll find that throughout history, “job creators” always exploited the “wealth creators”. Slavery was so engrained in human history, up until modern times, that it’s even written into the Bible and other such holy books (i.e. to set limits upon its practice). And in eras when slavery wasn’t institutionalized, indentured servitude was (which is basically a more formal and less harsh version of slavery). So, basically, a good part of this world was built upon the backs of slaves and bound servants.

    Technically, slavery is the ultimate ends of no-rules, unbridled capitalism. Before concepts such as humans rights, ethics and compassion came into fashion, slavery was the way to advance yourself in the world and get rich (that is, if you were born into the aristocracy). If paying employees less is advantageous to a capitalist, then paying them nothing is even better.

    However, slavery was always a risky proposition. Slave rebellions were common in ancient Rome, for example (as were proletariat riots), so the rich were quick to discover that their positions were much more secure when the peons were well-treated (i.e. bread and circuses). And, consider, when the English abolished slavery, it came only 8 years after the French Revolution. The English aristocrats had just witnessed the poor and downtrodden rise up in epic fashion and violently attack the nobility. So, at least they weren’t too daft to take a hint.

  338. uno0
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 12:58 pm | Permalink

    In my view, it’s all good because it means more people are watching Game of Thrones, and even the commentary.

  339. Assunta
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:02 pm | Permalink

    Phantomwriter05:

    Believe it or not, there’s actually laws against things such as depicting a living president past or present, dead. I don’t think people realize that the reason that it’s being heavily covered by the media is because it’s a FEDERAL OFFENSE to show what they had.

    Citation, please?

  340. PatD
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:04 pm | Permalink

    It wouldn’t have reached this level of hysteria had HBO not overreacted. They are the ones causing all this hoopla. Kinda’ makes me wonder if it’s calculated.

  341. Ldcftoos
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:19 pm | Permalink

    Dan: The issue at the time is Slavery Extension into the territories and Interstate Commerce. The commerce including real live human beings.

    What issue? If you are saying that the war was fought over this then I disagree. I don’t think it is correct to say that slavery had nothing to do with the civil war but it didn’t cause the war itself.
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/rothbard/rothbard175.html

    Lincoln Racial view were in line with country at the time. Many great Americans though better and they should be honored. For at the time, they were a great threat to the Founding principles of this country.

    Yes, we had a very racist country at the time. I find their opinions on race despicable and will not sugar coat that because of the idiotic sentiment of the time. Slavery was just as wrong then as it is today and those who fought this terrible institution, like Lysander Spooner, should be applauded, and those who supported it should not get a pass because it was majority opinion. But my biggest problem with Lincoln isn’t that he just defended slavery, it was he held extremely racists views of black people and he favored colonization until the day he died. If that wasn’t bad enough, refer back to the list for all the other tyrannical things he did.

    To avoid war, slavery would need to be allowed into the territories. Ensuring slavery continue for at least two more generations.
    Yes Lincoln played all out war when it got to it. He is guilty of many accusation. He also won the war. He kept the Union together. The 13th Amendment was ratified on 12/18/1965 Constitutionally ending slavery. When would of it ended following our Great Founding Principles of State’s Right?

    That is a great question. First, let me just point out that the United States is the only Western country that needed a bloody civil war to end slavery. Every other country did it with little to no violence. Many of our states were able to end slavery peacefully. Here is a link to a great book on this very topic. http://www.amazon.com/Greatest-Emancipations-West-Abolished-Slavery/dp/0230605923

    Also see this article discussing the matter and that book I just linked.
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo146.html

    Anyways, if the government wanted to end slavery peacefully it could have been done right away. There is absolutely no reason that 600,000 people needed to die and over 1 million being seriously wounded. Still, I am glad that slavery ended. It’s the only positive things that came out of that God awful war. Regardless though, Lincoln was a tyrant, in my opinion, and I can’t look past all the terrible things he was responsible for because slavery ended under his watch. One good thing, even a really good thing like the end of slavery, doesn’t come close to washing away the despicable things he was responsible for.

    Well, I care more for your view than some guy. Want to quote and source fine but I want your views.
    I do believe the Founding Fathers attempted a scheme for a gradual elimination of the institution and at the time the inter-continental slave trade was for them the main source of the problem. They agree upon a plan that for them will see its end within a couple of generations. There is great success in the upper part of the United States. Micahel H Hoffman has done some good work on this subject and his more repugnant works has to be section off somewhat. In the end though, for a myriad of reasons, slavery survived and it affected a whole specific segment of America.
    For me in a pure historical sense, serfdom and the medieval system Western Europe created was similar in effect as slavery in the U.S. They had their shares of very bloody affairs to end it.
    It is all very well that you are upset that things were just not done right. However, your opinion is of no consequence. All you and I can do is read what events. What I read as compromise and proposals favor the status of slavery where it exists. The slaveholders wanted their property rights and they wanted to bring them to the territories. That is the position of the Slaveholders and the state that support them. No matter how dumb you think it is, that is the position dealt with. Maybe having such care, awe, and respect for idea and principle means knowing when you need to change, adapt, and/or evolve so it does not get destroyed.

    Lincoln is a President during a time of Civil War, internal strife. The Constitution effectively failed. He did want he believed to win. If they were tyrannical well it work and the “new” constitution has peacefully last for 147 years. He never had the opportunity to serve as president in a time of internal peace, John Wilkes Booth made sure of that.

  342. Dolph Lundgren
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:23 pm | Permalink

    It’s been over a year since it aired, so obviously people didn’t even notice it. D&D should’ve known better than to talk about it. Of course people are going to overreact. I doubt this will have any major consequences, though. If HBO couldn’t afford to react this way, they simply wouldn’t have.
    And let the boycotts come. This is a network whose most popular shows have been about prison rape, vapid and promiscuous women, the mafia, sex-crazed vampires, and medieval fantasy laced with child-killing and incest. The conservative right is hardly keeping HBO afloat.

  343. Two Feathers
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 1:27 pm | Permalink

    Ruckus:
    Classic example of how the right-wing talking heads use feigned outrage to control their base, keep them in a constant state of manufactured fear and anger.

    Lex: Once again, I guess I underestimated the stupidity of the human race.

    What an entertaining , informative thread. Although the initial subject matter is completely inane, I feel I known certain regular posters a little better now. As expected most are well read, intelligent. But I have also observed a little unexpected niavety from others.
    I don`t think wic.net or the web in general is the place to discuss my views on the shit that went down during GWB`s term in office, as I don`t want to wake up from unconciousness with a bag on my head and water dripping on my face.Hence the two comments I have quoted above, which kinda covers it in a nutshell.
    Call me paranoid if you like, but as the saying goes, just because your paranoid doesn`t mean they are not out to get you.
    Jeez its been a quiet spell for proper Thrones news. Roll on July.

  344. feyrband
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:10 pm | Permalink

    they should have a fan contest where the winner or winners get their likeness recreated as a head-on-a-spike prop. i’d be totally down for this, just like how the walking dead had the zombie extra contest.

    it’s also crap like this why i don’t flaunt the fact that i’m republican.

  345. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:12 pm | Permalink

    StormOf*S*Words:
    My family got me GoT on DVDs instead of BluRay by mistake (it was a gift).So I returned the DVDs and went over to the shelf to get the BluRays but they had NO copies of GoT on ANY format in the store.It was very strange.Now I know why.And now I’m stuck without season 1.

    First run BRs are still available online…try Target, etc…

  346. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:17 pm | Permalink

    Varamyr Fourskins,

    Technically, slavery is the ultimate ends of no-rules, unbridled capitalism.

    What? Wow, that is a very confused statement. http://mises.org/document/1006/Capitalism-A-Treatise-on-Economics

  347. Claudia
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

    I don’t feel like having to moderate a political discussion on a freaking Game of Thrones site

    In the Game of Thrones, you win or you die. There is no middle ground.

  348. 3eyes
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:35 pm | Permalink

    Tempest in a teapot. GWB would probably laugh.

  349. Tereeza777
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:48 pm | Permalink

    Brighthouse (Tampa, FL) is still showing Episode 10 – “Fire and Blood” on On Demand – in fact, they’re showing two versions. The “head in question” seems to be turned further away in the new version so you can hardly see the face at all. What’s really important is that I just noticed that Lommy Greenhands, Rorge and Biter all appear to be played by different actors in Season 1 than in Season 2. Hard to tell about Jaqen H’ghar – those beautiful eyes and lips are concealed under a hoodie. (much more fun to think about Jaqen than George!)

  350. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:51 pm | Permalink

    Ldcftoos,

    Well, I care more for your view than some guy. Want to quote and source fine but I want your views.

    I share the views of the people I linked to. Otherwise, I wouldn’t have linked to them. Also I’m some guy, the people I linked to are PhD economists and historians. Their views should carry a little more weight than some anonymous person online.

    It is all very well that you are upset that things were just not done right. However, your opinion is of no consequence. All you and I can do is read what events.

    Huh? If you mean that my opinions of the past don’t change anything, I agree, but who believes their opinions of the past change the past. But if you mean that there is no reason to have opinions on what happened in the past then I disagree.

    Maybe having such care, awe, and respect for idea and principle means knowing when you need to change, adapt, and/or evolve so it does not get destroyed.

    If you change your principles then you no longer hold those principles. Your sentence makes no sense. I believe slavery is wrong, but I also believe the civil war was wrong. There was absolutely no need to have a civil war to end slavery. It could’ve been ended sooner and without the blood shed. See the book I recommended above called Greatest Emancipations: How the West Abolished Slavery

    Lincoln is a President during a time of Civil War, internal strife. The Constitution effectively failed. He did want he believed to win. If they were tyrannical well it work and the “new” constitution has peacefully last for 147 years. He never had the opportunity to serve as president in a time of internal peace, John Wilkes Booth made sure of that.

    Lincoln was president during a time of civil war because he started the civil war. It’s not like he came in during the middle of it. His tyrannical policies didn’t work. They set terrible precedents and put us on a path of empire instead of the republic we were supposed to be. Every time a president does something heinous they turn and point to Lincoln and say he did the same thing. His policies resulted in hundreds of thousands of deaths, they didn’t work.

  351. arglebargle
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 2:54 pm | Permalink

    I’d like to know what George Bush thinks about it.

  352. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:02 pm | Permalink

    Ldcftoos,

    Yes, the people who hold Slavery are scumbags. They were also the Congressman, Senators, Presidents, and Judges of the time within the context of the Constitution of the time. So, be so very angry and mad, that is the Constitution 1789-1865.

    I’m not a fan of the Constitution. I believe there were and are many huge flaws with it. Still, the Constitution is a piece of paper, so I don’t see value in directing anger at it. It has no magic power over people. I judge the actions of people, not pieces of paper. Besides the Constitution didn’t require you to own slaves or to be in favor of slavery. I blame the people who favored slavery, owned slaves, or sat silent while slavery existed for slavery. I commend all those who spoke out against this evil institution. Lysander Spooner was living at a time with that same Constitution that allowed slavery but that didn’t stop him from being a decent man and opposing it.

  353. The Kingslayer
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:10 pm | Permalink

    There goes any chance of a budget increase.

  354. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:12 pm | Permalink

    Langkard,

    I’d also recommend reading works by Bakunin and Kropotkin as well as Murray Bookchin, especially his The Ecology of Freedom: The Emergence and Dissolution of Hierarchy and Post-Scarcity Anarchism. Look them up. :)

    Ah, yes, we couldn’t be further apart in our beliefs. http://mises.org/daily/2096

  355. The Kingslayer
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:17 pm | Permalink

    Tywin Lannister has some thoughts on this incident.

    Madness…madness and stupidity.

  356. Lex
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:25 pm | Permalink

    Tereeza777,

    The head was always turned away and hard to see. As far as I know, that’s the only version.

    No, Lommy Greenhands is played by the same kid in Season 1 and Season 2 (Eros Vlahos). But yes, Rorge and Biter are different. And, as you said, Jaqen was hidden under a hood.l

  357. Blackfish
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:35 pm | Permalink

    G_Lee:
    US – United States of the most retarded people on the planet. That’s all I am going to add to this “discussion”. What else to expect from a nation where 50% of the people believe that evolution doesn’t exist and the world was created by “god” in 7 days some 3000 years ago…

    LOL awww shit, you just brought religion into a political discussion. The 2 most hotly debated and controversial subjects. Only way to get more polarizing is the debate of Star Wars vs Star Trek!!!! Nerd rage on!

    Its nothing funnier than ignorant and uninformed people arguing about subjects they dont fully understand. You can be a politican for 20 years and still not know everything that goes on behind the scene.

    “Hey my mama said this political party is bad regardless of all the good they do, so I will blindly support the other political party regardless of all the bad they have done, and *hic* my daddy/uncle Billybob said to watch this TV channel cuz everything they say is 100% true while that other TV channel is 100% lies!”

  358. Griffinsroost
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 3:47 pm | Permalink

    His fucking head belongs on a fucking spike anyway. Everyone needs to move the fuck on.

  359. Abe Lincoln
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:07 pm | Permalink

    Dont forget ” Abe Lincoln Vampire Hunter ”
    Dan,

    LordEddardStark,

  360. Pastor_of_Muppets
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    Now would be the perfect time to announce some casting news for season three (other than Shireen).

  361. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:21 pm | Permalink

    Tereeza777:
    Brighthouse (Tampa, FL) isstill showing Episode 10 –“Fire and Blood”on On Demand – in fact, they’re showing two versions…Hard to tell about Jaqen H’ghar – those beautiful eyes and lips are concealed under a hoodie. (much more fun to think about Jaqen than George!)

    A woman agrees!!!! : -)

  362. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:25 pm | Permalink

    Abe Lincoln:
    Dont forget ” Abe Lincoln Vampire Hunter ”
    Dan,

    LordEddardStark,

    A woman thinks that looks like badass movie. Just my speed.

  363. spacechampion
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 4:43 pm | Permalink

    In honour of HBO caving in to stupidity Wic.net needs a photoshop contest for fan edits of the past two seasons. The idea being we take this controversy and turn it into a marketing campaign. You can’t keep us fans down! We support the bottom, including when those bottoms are decapitated heads!

    I suggest several categories:

    1. Inserting famous heads into scenes in every episode.
    2. Bronn shot first. Etc. Funniest/best photoshopping of still images from the series.
    3. Re-editing video so the story is more consistent with the books.
    4. Re-editing audio so the story is more consistent with the books.

  364. Joe
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:00 pm | Permalink

    HBO recently aired a documentary on George H.W. Bush called 41, and from what I saw it painted him in a very personal and positive light. Do I think HBO is a left-leaning network? Yes (don’t get me started on Bill “I’m only a libertarian in regards to prostitution and gambling, but centralized government? HELLZ YEA” Maher). This is something that meant nothing then, and should mean nothing now. That said, it was stupid for D and D to mention it.

  365. Mark
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:48 pm | Permalink

    I think that most of the people that get offended by this sort of thing are offended because they are ‘supposed’ to be offended. It’s part of our culture, now, to freak out and take offense to every and any little thing because that’s what we are expected to do. I really think it has less to do with sensitivity and more to do with giving someone else an opportunity — usually a financial one.

    How many people who open lawsuits because of something ‘offensive’ are in fact actually offended? I doubt not that many.

    This is a ridiculous reaction, but not an unsurprising one. The sad thing is is that everyone has to be so incredibly careful about what they do — inasmuch as I love D&D and respect their decisions, I do have to admit that they are smart enough to have seen this coming — the reaction to it was completely inevitable. I don’t fault them for doing it (I couldn’t care less either way), but no one should be surprised by the outcome of this.

    Really, though … what is the implication of GWB head on a spike in context of the show? All of the heads up there were good people who were persecuted for no good reason; I’m certainly not trying to make any political statements and I doubt D&D were, either … I’m simply pointing out that our over-sensitive culture is driven by ignorance and you can’t compete against that.

    What a shame — what a waste of time, money and energy. Ah well … this is what we have become.

  366. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:52 pm | Permalink

    Joe,

    Yes (don’t get me started on Bill “I’m only a libertarian in regards to prostitution and gambling, but centralized government? HELLZ YEA” Maher).

    Ahh, a kindred spirit.

  367. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 5:56 pm | Permalink

    Mark,

    I agree. Someone like Mark Twain would be demonized for the things he wrote if he were writing them today.

  368. Vince
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:02 pm | Permalink

    All I can say is any publicity is good publicity… some non viewers might wonder what the fuss is about over nothing and may be check out the show. Especially seeing as I gather a sizeable sample of the population of the United States don’t have anything particularly great to think about him (George Dubya).

  369. Remaal
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:06 pm | Permalink

    Pulling the ep and halting DVD/BR production is a bit of an overreaction, HBO. On the bright side, my Blueray set just became a collectors edition. lol

  370. PeterD
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:14 pm | Permalink

    What the hell are HBO and D&D worried about? There is such a thing as the First Amendment in this country. Everybody is so worried about self-censorship these days. Fuck it. The President of the United States is just another citizen of this country who happens to have the job of being its leader. He’s not selected by the church, blessed by the Seven, the old gods, the drowned god or R’Hllor. Freedom of speech includes the freedom to depict the president disrespectfully if that’s the intention of the content producers.

    What could the government even DO about it if they had the inkling to do? What could Fox or Chicken Noodle News do about it? Let the conservatives tune out; more liberals would rush in to fill the void.

    It’s time to stop pandering to the political whingers. Let the artists create and speak their minds. If someone is offended tough shit. Go watch Bambi or read your bible. There is no law saying we must show respect to the president, congress or the supreme court. Respect is earned, and if I don’t respect the same people you do, too damned bad.

    I have no doubt that D&D thought it was a great little tweak, and personally so do I. AND I’M A FIRE-BREATHING CONSERVATIVE at that. Put Barrack’s noggin’ up along the road to Meereen and I’d be equally happy.

  371. sunspear
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 6:53 pm | Permalink

    Does this mean George Bush can’t play Oberyn Martell this season?

  372. Dogmayor
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:00 pm | Permalink

    Remaal:
    Pulling the ep and halting DVD/BR production is a bit of an overreaction, HBO. On the bright side, my Blueray set just became a collectors edition. lol

    Seriously, this baby will be worth something in a few years.

  373. Eric De Bruin
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:04 pm | Permalink

    Seriously now? They have to edit everything because the head vaguely looks like GWB? I say in protest, they sneak a decapitated Bush in every episode. That’s ridiculous.

  374. The Onion Knight
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:34 pm | Permalink

    DH87: Almost no one other than abolitionists was in favor of emancipation before the Civil War, although most abolitionists seemed to choose the Republication party as the lesser of two evils, as I recall. Preservation of the Union was the main reason for the war and as Lincoln famously declared, “If I could preserve the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that.”

    Only after the terrible bloodbaths of the first three years, when Democrat Copperheads and other Northern folks were saying, “Let the Confederate states go, it’s not worth the price our boys are paying,” did Lincoln evolve to the point where he was able to make the case for an enobling purpose, the elimination of slavery, in a political context.

    I stopped reading after “Almost no one other than abolitionists was in favor” What a way to butcher the English language.

  375. Big Lob
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:46 pm | Permalink

    HBO is doing the right thing cleaning up D&D’s mess. They need to be more professional in the future.

    Game of Thrones is an excellent show that is not well served by this sad chapter in its young life.

    This amateur hour on the part of D&D. They should know better. At least respect the Presidency if you aren’t going to respect the man.

    … and no president with a D after his name would ever find his head on a spike. Lets be real here. The entertainment industry is an echo chamber that would never allow like that.

  376. Ian
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:55 pm | Permalink

    Gah, this is so stupid. Shows re-use old props all the time–it’s expensive to make new ones, especially for a shot that only lasts a few seconds. They intentionally positioned the head to obscure the identity of the face while still making it obvious that it WAS a face. I doubt anyone would have ever recognized the head if they hadn’t pointed it out, and I very much doubt that they intended any disrespect or political message.

    If they’d used the likeness of someone I like or respect, I’d have probably just found it more amusing.

  377. Cat of the Cannals
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 7:55 pm | Permalink

    Weese, Dunsen, Polliver, Bush the Sweetling

  378. Ldcftoos
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 8:09 pm | Permalink

    Dan: I’m not a fan of the Constitution. I believe there were and are many huge flaws with it. Still, the Constitution is a piece of paper, so I don’t see value in directing anger at it. It has no magic power over people. I judge the actions of people, not pieces of paper. Besides the Constitution didn’t require you to own slaves or to be in favor of slavery. I blame the people who favored slavery, owned slaves, or sat silent while slavery existed for slavery. I commend all those who spoke out against this evil institution. Lysander Spooner was living at a time with that same Constitution that allowed slavery but that didn’t stop him from being a decent man and opposing it.

    I have no anger to the constitution. I am all for judging a person actions. It also right to show the time that they are truly in. As great and wonderful abolition is, its a very extreme movement. Being its supporter is being very forward thinking. Its also consider a danger to many.
    Lysander Spooner arguments basically lost with Dread Scott. He also supported John Brown. I will gladly high five you over this. It is also very extreme for the period.

  379. Jon Forrest
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 8:32 pm | Permalink

    I just cancelled my HBO after 15 years; this stuff isn’t funny, you think these inside digs are innocuous, and that people are just over reacting? You think that way because you are the component of the pervasive contempt, that’s why you don’t get it. I’m a Pro-Choice, Pro-Gay Marriage, Pro-Amnesty Conservative…THAT’S WHAT I AM. I’m not a Conservative defined by MSNBC, CNN, or Sean Hannity. But you, who are you? JKF, Los Angeles
    Steven Swanson,

  380. NJ
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 8:59 pm | Permalink

    Yey!! Best

  381. Jeff
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 9:16 pm | Permalink

    So…will this be fixed so that the episode / DVD and blu-rays will go back into circulation?? We need to know!

  382. Dan
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 10:15 pm | Permalink

    Jon Forrest,

    I’m Dan, nice to meet you.

  383. the goat
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 10:31 pm | Permalink

    Dan: I’m not a fan of the Constitution. I believe there were and are many huge flaws with it. Still, the Constitution is a piece of paper, so I don’t see value in directing anger at it.

    YES, THE CONSTITUTION HAS FLAWS, THAT’S WHY IT HAS A BUILT-IN INTERPRETATION CLAUSE. IF ANYONE HAS A BETTER IDEA, I’M PRETTY SURE THEY WOULD BE DOING SOMETHING MORE CONSTRUCTIVE THAN POSTING ON THE GAME OF THRONES MESSAGE BOARD.

  384. DrNick
    Posted June 16, 2012 at 10:35 pm | Permalink

    I can understand you americans getting pissed if he was at least a decent president, but I’m fairly certain the global consensus was he sucked massive balls. The fact that this is some sort of ‘issue’ shows the childish over reaction and ridiculousness of the us conservative mindset. To paraphrase the eloquent scottish poet Jamie McDonald (The Thick of It)
    “You mention this shite again and I will remove your iPod from its tiny nano-sheath and push it up your cock! Then I’ll put some speakers up your arse and put it on shuffle with my fucking fist. And every time I hear something that I don’t like, which will be every time that something comes on, I will skip to the next track by crushing your balls! “

  385. DH87
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 12:36 am | Permalink

    The Onion Knight: I stopped reading after “Almost no one other than abolitionists was in favor” What a way to butcher the English language.

    Perhaps we’d both be happier if we put each other on “virtual ignore.” I’m game if you are.

  386. Dan
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 12:48 am | Permalink

    the goat,

    YES, THE CONSTITUTION HAS FLAWS, THAT’S WHY IT HAS A BUILT-IN INTERPRETATION CLAUSE. IF ANYONE HAS A BETTER IDEA, I’M PRETTY SURE THEY WOULD BE DOING SOMETHING MORE CONSTRUCTIVE THAN POSTING ON THE GAME OF THRONES MESSAGE BOARD.

    What is this built-in interpretation clause? I would love to hear you explain that.

    Plenty of people have better ideas than the Constitution. There is voluminous work on this topic. It is not like these kind of things haven’t been discussed before and I need to stay off WiC so I can fill this void in the literature. I’m sorry if my views upset you so much, but I was enjoying myself having a discussion with other people on a matter I have an interest in. If you don’t like my opinions then you’re free to ignore them.

  387. Jose
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 1:17 am | Permalink
  388. Theon Rules!
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 1:47 am | Permalink

    Went and bought season 1 at Wal Mart today before they did whatever they’re gonna do to it. Was gonna wait for the Black Friday sales like I usually do, but what the hey?

    The guy at checkout said “That’s a really good show. Have you seen it?”. I said of course “Yes” and went on to explain to him about the head thing. He looked at me like he wanted to take it back because he thought his store was going to get in trouble for selling them. It was priceless.

  389. SergioCQH
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 1:49 am | Permalink

    All this brouhaha has done is make more people aware of Game of Thrones. The sales of the DVDs and Blurays have spiked on Amazon (the fact that current versions have become somewhat collectible may have some effect). Game of Thrones is beating True Blood on Google Trends despite the fact that True Blood just had its season premiere. Bush’s head may have added another tenth of a point to GoT’s ratings next season.

  390. Theon Rules!
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 1:52 am | Permalink

    Also, I love how this is getting all this criticism, yet the fact that they’re portraying Abe Lincoln as a “Vampire Slayer” is just hunky dory.

  391. Theon Rules!
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 2:01 am | Permalink

    Finally, wouldn’t you think someone from HBO would have watched the DVD before it was released to ensure it’s quality was of proper standards and guidelines?

    The fact that this (even though I agree with 99% of you who say it is stupid) slipped by and was not detected and cleaned up by HBO kind’ve funny.

  392. Horst
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 3:24 am | Permalink

    I don’t get it. Whats wrong with the United States… Cannot imagine that they would make an affair about such a shitty thing here in Europe. And you complain about censorship in China? Go on^^

    But you score by making me laugh. Do you think anyone would have noticed that GWB-head without it beeing mentioned on DVD-commentary? Well, I don’t. So they had to put that comment there. Such funny details make me love the show even more. I hope it brings up new viewers.

    btw: Nobody complains about the “Sarah Palin” from the movie Iron Sky – because she wears her head on the right place? Try to understand … but I just don’t get what is going on over the sea.

  393. DavosFTW!
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 5:02 am | Permalink

    that fox panel was actually pretty funny and kinda good for the show.
    Jose,

  394. Eric De Bruin
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 5:15 am | Permalink

    Horst,

    Conservatives being conservative.

    If the sight of a fake head that vaguely resembles Bush makes you weep, maybe Game of Thrones isn’t the best series for you to be watching . . .

    Just a thought.

  395. sjwenings
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 5:30 am | Permalink

    SergioCQH: All this brouhaha has done is make more people aware of Game of Thrones. The sales of the DVDs and Blurays have spiked on Amazon (the fact that current versions have become somewhat collectible may have some effect).

    http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=amb_link_356758702_2?ie=UTF8&node=2649513011&field-format_browse-bin=2650305011&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-1&pf_rd_r=2DCE55C877AB4A208C71&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=1310396602&pf_rd_i=2649513011

    ROFL! GoT at the top of the tv-series blue ray sales again! Fantastic!

  396. Susan C
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 6:44 am | Permalink

    I think I see an opportunity here. I should buy up all the offending dvds I can afford and resell them at a nice profit at the Dem National Convention coming to Charlotte.

  397. Lex
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 7:08 am | Permalink

    Apparently this is the new edited version on HBO Go?

    http://i.imgur.com/iJumD.jpg

    If this is real… Hahaha, that looks so messed up!

  398. Lex
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 7:12 am | Permalink

    Jose:
    Fox News panel discusses Headgate

    Weird… that was actually kind of funny.

  399. freoduwebbe
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 7:17 am | Permalink

    sunspear: Does this mean George Bush can’t play Oberyn Martell this season?

    I surely hope not… Isnt he too short or something…
    I’ve been waiting to see Oberyn – without a shirt…. I’m sorry, but GWB never struck me as someone I’d watch… however considering he works on a ranch.. maybe its a lack of imagination…

  400. sjwenings
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 7:27 am | Permalink

    Jose: Fox News panel discusses Headgate

    That was okay. Anyone know if Fox ever did a “normal” news report on this?

  401. NJ
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 7:34 am | Permalink

    Lex:
    Apparently this is the new edited version on HBO Go?

    http://i.imgur.com/iJumD.jpg

    If this is real… Hahaha, that looks so messed up!

    Thank you Lex,

    You just made my night.. Now it looks like some pouty, petulant child

    NJ

  402. K
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 10:04 am | Permalink

    Meg,

    Hello? IF an Obama likeness was hung as a mock lynching? That happened LAST WEEK in Florida at the church with the wacko pastor who tried to get publicity by burning the Koran last year and there has not been even one tenth the outcry over that than over this absolutely ridiculous issue with GoT. No one even seems to bat an eye when a life size full body likeness of the current president is hung as if he is being lynched, but we need to discuss legal minutia regarding the turned to the side, covered with a wig, not even recognizable when you show the image magnified commercially available mask of a former president? This whole thing simply MUST be a sign of the coming Apocalypse, is there any other explanation?

  403. sunspear
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 11:17 am | Permalink

    freoduwebbe,

    That was supposed to be sarcasm.

  404. Cat of the Cannals
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 11:20 am | Permalink

    This story is almost as stupid as last years bark gate. Almost

  405. Joe
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 11:34 am | Permalink

    Lex,

    Always enjoyed Red Eye, very tongue-in-cheek show.

    Regardless of political affiliation, can most of us simply agree that it was beyond stupid of D&D to even MENTION this? Their naive belief that people wouldn’t be offended was probably meant to be harmless, but it turned into a shitstorm with HBO acting as damage control. Unless this turns out to be nothing in the long run (and who knows? this might in fact bring in new viewers), the immediate to short-term effects of this are pretty embarrasing IMO

  406. Imnus
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 12:05 pm | Permalink

    I say put Obama’s head on a spike in Season 3 and be done with it. Seriously it makes me chuckle when I read comments about how the ‘right’ overreacts to everything, come on if it was Obama’s head it would have been the same thing, both wings are filled with overzealous picks.

  407. House Snow
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 1:45 pm | Permalink

    Hey on the bright side, I think this controversy really increases the chances on the show winning an emmy for best show. I’ll take it.

  408. Lex
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 2:10 pm | Permalink

    Joe,

    It was funny when the one guy insulted the other guy, for thinking the show is boring. And then even the guy who didn’t like the show still had to admit that Dinklage is awesome.

  409. The Kingshaver
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 2:14 pm | Permalink

    If you don’t admit that Dinklage is awesome, the terrorists win.

  410. sjwenings
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 2:37 pm | Permalink

    House Snow: I think this controversy really increases the chances on the show winning an emmy for best show.

    How do you figure?

  411. PatD
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 3:18 pm | Permalink

    come on if it was Obama’s head it would have been the same thing, both wings are filled with overzealous picks.

    Oh buruther. As one of my make-believe friends replied to this weak and lazy argument:

    If it had been Obama’s head, we would have said, “Hey look! A Lyseni!”

  412. Richard Weetabix
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 5:28 pm | Permalink

    sjwenings,

    FAUX doesn’t do any real reporting.

  413. WildSeed
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 6:16 pm | Permalink

    Dan,

    I’ve just read your posts and exchanges with DH87, WELL STRUCK !
    I realize that we’re off topic with this discourse, but I find it enlightening
    to find people discussing A. Lincoln an the American Civil War era. I
    agree with your references and would urge you to read opinions of
    Supreme Court Judge Thurgood Marshall on the issue of the American
    Constitution as well as Civic/ Capitalist perspectives. Also for fun, read
    Gore Vidal’s ” Lincoln”, an epic if you consider the drama it created then.

  414. Imnus
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 7:40 pm | Permalink

    PatD,

    So are you an overzealous prick?

  415. Dan
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 8:28 pm | Permalink

    WildSeed,

    I’m familiar with Gore Vidal’s American Chronicle series although I haven’t gotten around to reading it yet. That’s one that I’ve heard a lot of good things about and I always have it on my list of things to read but never get around to it. Too much to read and too little time. When I read Why American History is Not What They Say: An Introduction to Revisionism by Jeff Riggenbach he talked about that entire series. Here is a link that shows some of what that book covers on it. http://lewrockwell.com/riggenbach/riggenbach3-2.html

    I’ll eventually get around to reading that but I haven’t been studying much history of late. I’ve been more on an economic theory kick. I usually bounce around quit a bit between different subjects and when I get back to history I’ll have to start that series. I actually hadn’t thought about it in a while so you bringing it up is a good reminder.

    Here’s a pretty classic clip of Pat Buchanan interviewing Vidal about that book.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLyvszhFAC4&feature=youtube_gdata_player

    I’m not a fan at all of Thurgood Marshall though.

  416. corbob10
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 8:54 pm | Permalink

    The funniest part is that its not even meant to be Bush’s head, it just happens to sort of look like it from the side.

    Time for a revolution.

  417. Lord Thappers
    Posted June 17, 2012 at 9:00 pm | Permalink

    I wouldn’t care if it was a likeness of Bush’s head, Obama’s head, the Queen of Merrie Englande’s head, Osama bin Laden’s head, Bill Maher’s head, Max Headroom’s head, the head of HBO’s head, Lena Heady’s head, or Hedwig’s head.

    Those who do care merely confirm my arrogant and superior British assumption that Americans are overly-patriotic, simpering right-wing cretins unable to cope with anything that even hints at criticism whilst all the while happy to mindlessly support a government that invades other countries and murders innocents purely so its citizens can feel better about their own fragile self-esteem.

    I thang yew, America.

  418. the goat
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 3:10 am | Permalink

    Dan: What is this built-in interpretation clause? I would love to hear you explain tha

    Article. V.

    The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

    And, or course, there’s this:

    During the debates on the adoption of the Constitution, its opponents repeatedly charged that the Constitution as drafted would open the way to tyranny by the central government. Fresh in their minds was the memory of the British violation of civil rights before and during the Revolution. They demanded a “bill of rights” that would spell out the immunities of individual citizens. Several state conventions in their formal ratification of the Constitution asked for such amendments; others ratified the Constitution with the understanding that the amendments would be offered.

    On September 25, 1789, the First Congress of the United States therefore proposed to the state legislatures 12 amendments to the Constitution that met arguments most frequently advanced against it. The first two proposed amendments, which concerned the number of constituents for each Representative and the compensation of Congressmen, were not ratified. Articles 3 to 12, however, ratified by three-fourths of the state legislatures, constitute the first 10 amendments of the Constitution, known as the Bill of Rights.

    This was also kinda important, (from socialstudiesforkids.com)

    Definition: First decision by the Supreme Court to declare a law unconstitutional (1803).

    Here is a summary:

    – At the very end of his term, President John Adams had made many federal appointments, including William Marbury as justice of the peace in the District of Columbia.
    - Thomas Jefferson, the new president, refused to recognize the appointment of Marbury.
    - The normal practice of making such appointments was to deliver a “commission,” or notice, of appointment. This was normally done by the Secretary of State. Jefferson’s Secretary of State at the time was James Madison.
    - At the direction of Jefferson, Madison refused to deliver Marbury’s commission. Marbury sued Madison, and the Supreme Court took the case.
    - Chief Justice John Marshall wrote that the Judiciary Act of 1789, which spelled out the practice of delivering such commissions for judges and justices of the peace, was unconstitutional because it the gave the Supreme Court authority that was denied it by Article III of the Constitution. Thus, the Supreme Court said, the Judiciary Act of 1789 was illegal and not to be followed.

    This was the first time the Supreme Court struck down a law because it was unconstitutional. It was the beginning of the practice of “judicial review.”

    Since the U.S. Constitution was ratified in 1788, Americans have invented:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_United_States_inventions_%28before_1890%29
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_United_States_inventions_%281946%E2%80%931991%29
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_United_States_inventions_%28after_1991%29

    Even ignoring inventions prior to the Revloution, that’s quite a fucking list. Yet despite all the genius engineers this country (or any other country, for that matter) has produced, none of them could ever create a better system of government.

    On this website you can view the national constitutions of various other countries:
    http://confinder.richmond.edu/

    Trust me, no one hates politicians or politics more than I. But abandoning the IDEAS of justice, and accountability, only leads to madness. (Socialism will always devolve to totalitarianism.)

    Even if we never achieve them, we must continue striving for

  419. the goat
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 6:11 am | Permalink

    Also, not that anyone cares at this point (R’hllor I hope not, anyway), but it was Alan Taylor, the episode’s director, who points out the GWB head, not Dave or Dan.

    If he gets fired from Thor cuz of this, there is no hold that can keep you fast enough, Iger, Bird, and Braverman

  420. Chris
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 8:42 am | Permalink

    This is pretty silly.
    I’m reminded of the classic play “Arsenic and old Lace.” Quick summary: we learn the two sweet old ladies have been murdering a dozen or so people and stashing the bodies in the basement. At the curtain call of the travelling production of the show, it’s customary for a dozen or so locally recruited “extras” to march out the basement door on the stage and take a bow as if they’d been in the basement playing the dead bodies all along. Always good for a laugh. But a better laugh if the production can lure in a few recognizable local celebrities like… politicians!
    A truly clever and artful way of handling this little “prop malfunction” would be for the folks at HBO, or even at the higher levels at Time Warner, to at least try to contact the former president and ask if he was cool with his unexpected cameo.
    Of course, it’s possible they did and found his office to be regrettably humor-impaired. But if they didn’t, it was a missed opportunity for some fun in an obviously unpleasant environment of rancorous public discourse.

  421. Buddy
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 8:55 am | Permalink

    The Kingshaver:
    If you don’t admit that Dinklage is awesome, the terrorists win.

    +1 FTW

    Also, as a conservative, I absolutely could not care less about this. He is not a sitting President so who cares. Politically Bush is/was the same as Obama so who cares. For Americans, if you’re still fighting the (R) vs. (D) war, you’ve taken the bait, you’re the fool, and you lose. There’s a host of people like me that complained and cursed all the BS Bush II pulled, and then when Obama came in and did the exact same things, all we can do now is chuckle.

  422. Christopher Broadbent
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 9:01 am | Permalink

    Not fan any flames, but my key ideas are:

    - Americans love to go on about free speech,
    So Dan and Dave should be able to make a joke/say what they think.

    -If it was a video of an actor playing G W Bush be beheaded, i should still not be censored.

    -This whole thing smacks of the Muslim reaction to drawings of Mohamed.

  423. Turner K
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 9:04 am | Permalink

    What you are forgetting was the violent reaction of these said muslims. A complaint is all that has been heard from anyone about this issue, and nothing more. Jihadist calling for D&D’s head would be comparable, thus room for hypocrisy and judgement.

    If it had been Oblamo’s head, there would be all numbers of ACLU,Black Panther, NAACP, and hundreds of other left wing toutist crying and calling for cancellation of the show. You morons that don’t realize this are as dumb as these organizations. So go ahead with “incestial, backwoods hill billys” becoming upset… because in reality I highly doubt they give two shits about this, or you.

  424. Turner K
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 9:09 am | Permalink

    Oh and to Lord Thappers;

    Please stow your crooked yellow mouth and stumped gene pool for someone (like your fellow crooked ugly teeth friends) who gives a fuck what you say. Pretty sure your country has been on our heels like a good little dog for the last half century ( saving your ass a few times as well I might add)

  425. RedHelm
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 9:27 am | Permalink

    Hey HBO… EAT A PEACH!

  426. Lord-Lex
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 12:21 pm | Permalink

    I am not Lex..a different one.

    I see this as the final slap to conservatives by HBO…I cancelled my HBO because I am sick of being pissed on by them. Nothing political?? Bull. Obama’s head could have been used, but that would be an insult. This is an insult, too…and the explanation is even more insulting.

    HBO can cater to liberals all they want..they can treat conservatives like crap and they can have political shows that insult conservatives..fine, their choice, I do not have to watch them..but to slip insults in just because they want to, then lie about it means they get no more money from me.

    If they do not notice..I don’t care…I have been insulted wnough by those people, and I exercize my right to not accept that treatment.

  427. Lord-Lex
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 12:27 pm | Permalink

    Recall that HBO killed the race track show because a few PETA morons screamed about it.

  428. sjwenings
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 12:33 pm | Permalink

    Lord-Lex: I see this as the final slap to conservatives by HBO…I cancelled my HBO because I am sick of being pissed on by them. Nothing political?? Bull.

    You don’t see the difference between D&D and HBO? HBO are the ones that stopped production on the DVDs and pulled the eps from HBO go and so forth. And that was before all the media-hoopla.

  429. Lord-Lex
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 12:41 pm | Permalink

    sjwenings,

    No, I really do not. Like as was said above, this isn’t the first insult by far. I think HBO put this show on and knew those people put that one in there on purpose. I see some drinking suits laughing as they signed off on it.

    To excuse them after the idiotic lie D&D put forth..No. They pulled and changed because they were caught, nothing more..

    like many said before, this was aired months ago, yet only now getting publicity. I saw the episode and I did not see Bush’s head there.

    I just see no value in pretending HBO is somehow *sorry* for it..they are only sorry they will lose money..just as they lost mine.

  430. Richard Valenzuela
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 12:42 pm | Permalink

    DH87,

    Well said. I am conservative and though I strongly believe it was not meant as an intentional insult or message, it was still wrong. It has been addressed now. Lets move on.

  431. Richard Valenzuela
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 12:43 pm | Permalink

    I am a conservative. I love the books and the series. but lets be honest here. It was a wrong thing to do. It has been addressed. Lets move on.

  432. Lord-Lex
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 12:46 pm | Permalink

    Richard Valenzuela,

    Agreed..I am moving on without being a subscriber to HBO or it’s children.

  433. Joshua Taylor
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 1:39 pm | Permalink

    How is it an insult that George W Bush’s head is on a pike? If anything it venerates Bush, to be seen there with a great, honourable man like Ned Stark, who did what he knew was right despite the consequences? Good men die when evil takes over, even Presidents. I assume those who watch the series that are Republicans know this? If it was Bush’s head next to Joffrey’s than the bullshit that is going on would be merited.

    Also if HBO was going to make a political statement about Bush why wouldn’t they show his whole face, why even put a wig on it? All of the crybabies are grasping at straws. It’s like the scenario of a man accused of murdering someone’s child, rotting away in jail until evidence later reveals he is innocent. The victim’s family will still hate the man, he will be stigmatised his entire life. Okay, extreme example but it is true people will believe what they want to believe alas. Even if the prop man himself swears and testifies before a grand jury that it was just another prop that they utilized from the show from a country that is not America and does not give a damn about making severed heads of President’s for Halloween or some anti-American rally and occasionally dumps these prop heads into a gross shipment to be sent off to the Paint Hall, he will not be believed. I guess it’s HBO and D & D’s fault for not keeping an eye on their non-American staff. Oh well, this crew works hard on what they do. We can forgive them for not giving a flying f***K about a plastic effigy of an over privileged Daddy’s Boy warmonger of a POTUS’ head being shoved on a spike. (That’s my view not HBO’s by the way).

    The hard truth is we will never know the truth of what really happened here because it has been so blown out of proportion that both sides of the issue have become distorted and everyone seeks the answer they want.

  434. A Bear_A Bear
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 1:56 pm | Permalink

    lmao: Not quite. Pretty sure the U.S. government didn’t encourage a terrorist strike against the Twin Towers.Roosevelt, on the other hand, sought to provoke war in the Atlantic. Churchill is quoted as saying that FDR “would wage war, but not declare it,” that the American President had assured him that he “would become more and more provocative” in order to “force an ‘incident’ . . . which would justify him in opening hostilities.” See Robert Dallek, Franklin D. Roosevelt and American Foreign Policy, 1932-1945 285 (1995).So the WWII comparison is not inapposite.

    So, you’re one of those right-wingers who think the US should have stayed out of WW2 and let the Nazis take down the Soviets (as if they could!), also that FDR was the greatest enemy of American freedom since etc etc. Pull the other one, pal. You’ll be coming out with that pathetic crap about “Hitler was really left wing because he was a National SOCIALIST” next…

  435. John Hauser
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    Steven Swanson,

    I think it is HBO not GOT that is pissing people off. I just read this.
    http://www.hollywoodrepublican.net/2012/06/hbo-devolves/

  436. Dan
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 9:08 pm | Permalink

    the goat,

    Article. V.

    Ok, I didn’t realize by a built-in interpretation clause you meant that the Constitution allows amendments. Obviously, I am aware of the ability to have amendments but I’ve never heard anybody refer to that as a built-in interpretation clause. Still, even the amendment process is never used anymore. Most of what our government does today is unconstitutional based on the original intent of the Constitution. Back when they passed prohibition of alcohol they at least had the decency to amend it but now we have an entire war on drugs without a single thought to amending the Constitution. The Constitution is essentially a dead letter at this point.

    This was the first time the Supreme Court struck down a law because it was unconstitutional. It was the beginning of the practice of “judicial review.”

    http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig8/gutzman3.html
    Kevin Gutzman explained some of the problems with judicial review in this article. Not everyone sees judicial review as a restraint on the federal government. Considering we have the biggest government in the history of the world, the Constitution and judicial review over what is constitutional has failed miserably in keeping the small and limited government the founding fathers had given us. We have a president today who believes it is within his power to assassinate American citizens anywhere in the world without charge or trial. Clearly, the Constitution is ignored by those in Washington D.C.

    Even ignoring inventions prior to the Revloution, that’s quite a fucking list. Yet despite all the genius engineers this country (or any other country, for that matter) has produced, none of them could ever create a better system of government.

    I disagree. Our founders designed a small limited government and today we have the biggest government in the history of the world. The system of government they created has utterly failed at restraining government power. Most of the rest of the world hates our government and, rightly, views it as an out of control empire.
    http://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Monarchy-Natural/dp/0765808684

    Trust me, no one hates politicians or politics more than I. But abandoning the IDEAS of justice, and accountability, only leads to madness. (Socialism will always devolve to totalitarianism.)

    I would never advocate abandoning the ideas of justice and accountability. I especially would never advocate socialism. Socialism is the antithesis of my beliefs.

  437. Pyrrhus
    Posted June 18, 2012 at 10:38 pm | Permalink

    I wish I could compare people’s comments here with those in the alternate universe where it had been an Obama head.

  438. WildSeed
    Posted June 19, 2012 at 4:21 am | Permalink

    Dan,

    Thanks for the link Dan, it was interesting. I urge you read the prose for yourself, gain
    insight that way and compare it to highly historic fact. I read Gore Vidal’s “Burr”,
    “Lincoln” and ” 1812″, and attended his interview appearance here in Berkeley
    California . It was akin to listening to your grandfather speak of incredulous atrocities and personal experiences from the perspective of a once noble lordship of prominent House
    Gore. The research was constantly undermined by institutions and families determined to
    keep certain facts secret ( nothing new ). History has always been my best subject and passion, like medicine which I practice, there remains the need to unravel the etiological
    clues exposing the science or historical fact. Everything is connected History/Science/
    Nature.Wow, sorry I lost track of my point. Find some quality time to read GV hist series
    and forget everyone else’s POV, start fresh. GRRM’s next book is due in 5 to 8 years ):

  439. Liam
    Posted June 20, 2012 at 1:51 am | Permalink

    I would love to have had my head put up on the spike. A fake one of course.

  440. Ned Stark Dies
    Posted June 20, 2012 at 1:52 am | Permalink

    My name is a spoiler…

  441. MUGger
    Posted June 20, 2012 at 2:00 pm | Permalink

    If we’re going to be all political about GoT, let’s go all the way – like Mother Jones did. The “Joffrey Baratheon – Where’s the Birth Certificate?” political ad is my favorite. http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/06/game-of-thrones-attack-ads

  442. Ser Lyonel the Laughing Storm
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 11:18 am | Permalink

    *Runs into topic strips clothes shits in palm begins throwing it at everyone then proceeds to jackoff* “George Bush weiner leather!!!111!”

    Never should have left shit moderated

  443. Ser Lyonel the Laughing Storm
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 11:31 am | Permalink

    Under the sea Ron Paul gives hand jobs to man tarays I know oh oh oh

  444. Ser Lyonel the Laughing Storm
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 11:34 am | Permalink

    I think George Jefferson or who ever wrote the constitution can go fuck em you too!

  445. Ser Lyonel the Laughing Storm
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 11:38 am | Permalink

    Nah but real talk why hasnt Melisandre at least mentioned Dany?

  446. Shock Me
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 2:43 pm | Permalink

    I’m a HUGE fan of the former President but I don’t think even he cares about this. Especially compared to the movie that was made called The Assassination of George Bush while he was still in office.

    In fact, I think he probably said something like “Hey Look. Laura. I’m on Game of Thrones!”

    Much ado about nothing.

  447. Forrest Grump
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 6:25 pm | Permalink

    Given the ideological bent of the overwhelming majority of HBO’s programming, one can certainly be forgiven if GoT’s producer’s protestations of an “accident” are taken with most of an ocean’s worth of grains of salt. I mean, during a hunt in the prop department for severed heads, someone just ‘happened’ to stumble over one with the likeness of GWB and [i]no one noticed the resembelence[/i].

    Riiiiiight…..

    If it was merely an ‘oversight’, then I assume that we can expect to see Obama’s severed head on an upcoming episode. What with all the beheadings on GoT, I should imagine that the need for heads will be greater than ever. Can’t spare anyone, right?

  448. witless chum
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 8:49 pm | Permalink

    Fuck HBO several times. I’d respect them a lot more if they’d just say, “Lighten up, Francis.” and ignore this kind of complaints.

  449. Ser Lyonel the Laughing Storm
    Posted June 21, 2012 at 10:31 pm | Permalink

    I like to pretend that Bush read ASOIAF and had a never ending story like adventure that went wrong

  450. Steven Swanson
    Posted June 25, 2012 at 1:04 am | Permalink

    Sooooooo….been on vacation and offline for a week, did y’all work this bullshit out?


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