Art by Elia Fernandez
While the lack of casting news is annoying, it does give us more time to discuss the potential candidates for certain roles. We’ve already covered Ramsay Snow, Mance Rayder and Edmure Tully. This time we will look at one of the prominent female characters that will join the story in season three. That would be Olenna Tyrell née Redwyne, more often referred to as the Queen of Thorns. The Queen of Thorns is the grandmother to Margaery and Loras Tyrell and she comes to King’s Landing following the marriage pact between the Lannister and Tyrell houses. Tower of the Hand has her description as “tiny and wizened with white hair”. Let’s take a look at some top choices for the role!
Maggie Smith – This British actress is far and away the fans’ top choice for the role of Olenna Tyrell. Smith is a familiar face to many as Prof. Minerva McGonagall in the Harry Potter films. She also plays the Dowager Countess in Downton Abbey, a very similar part to the Queen of Thorns. While I think she would be perfect for the role, there are rumors that she wants off of Downton so she can return to the big screen. Even if that isn’t true, and she plans to remain on the show, then that may preclude her from joining Thrones.
Judi Dench – A very well-known and well-respected British actress, Dench is another popular choice for the role. You may recognize her as M from most of the recent James Bond films. She also appeared in the 2011 adaptation of Jane Eyre, casting by – you guessed it – Nina Gold. I think she could make a great Queen of Thorns, but would she be willing to commit to a TV show? And, perhaps more importantly, is it worth the budget hit of hiring someone of Dench’s stature?
Vanessa Redgrave – Yet another respected British actress of stage and screen (are you sensing a pattern here?) who the fans have put forth as a possible Olenna. Redgrave has appeared in dozens of films, some recent ones include Mission Impossible and Atonement. She has also appeared on the FX show Nip/Tuck, so she is not averse to TV work. I could see her as the Tyrell matriarch, for sure, and she might be more likely to do it than her fellow acting legends.
Sian Phillips – A Welsh film and theater actress, Phillips is best known for her work as Livia in the classic BBC drama I, Claudius. She parlayed that success into a number of film roles in the 80s, such as appearances in the original Clash of the Titans and David Lynch’s Dune. The majority of her work has been in TV though, appearing in dozens of TV shows over her career. Recently her work has been a host of TV show guest appearances. Whether that is by choice or not is the question. If not, she may be up for a recurring role in something like Game of Thrones.What do you think, folks? Do you like any of these fine actresses for the Queen of Thorns? Have someone else in mind? Share your thoughts in the comments below!
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217 Comments
Dame Maggie Smith for sure! She was the immediate face that popped into my mind when I was reading the Queen of Thorn’s part in the book!
Rukie44Quote Reply
Maggie Smith would just make me thing of her character in Harry Potter. She’s a great actress, but I don’t want her in GoT :/
Fionnula Flanagan is my pick.
CarneQuote Reply
Someone “relatively unknown”, please.
Not Maggie Smith. Or Judy Dench. Great actresses all, but wrong for the part, IMO.
LarsQuote Reply
I honestly don’t think there’s a chance of any of these unfortunately, but nice to speculate!
RossQuote Reply
Maggie Smith was also in the original Clash of the Titans. Just sayin’. I think she would be excellent as QoT and was my first casting choice.
But after seeing Anonymous, I think Vanessa Redgrave would be wonderful as well.
ConnieQuote Reply
Lars,
I think that’s what we’ll get. I really doubt the budget can handle “dream casting” of this level. But it’s fun to speculate.
WhiteMageQuote Reply
I am kinda liking Fionnula Flanagan
She played a very kniving woman on Lost, so she could fit.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001217/
She also looks a bit like Natalie Dormer so they could pull off the familiar relation thing, plus she is based out of Ireland, which would help her casting chances.
Omar BrownQuote Reply
I also would prefer a relative “unknown” in this role.
lovesduncanQuote Reply
I like all these ladies – but truth to tell all are at least average hight
What about Linda Hunt – she’s only 4′ 9″ and certainly could play wizened. She’s quite good as well.
freoduwebbeQuote Reply
She also came to mind but I couldn’t recall her name. She’d nail the part.
ConnieQuote Reply
I often tend to dislike who most fans want in certain roles, however I’m going to have to agree on this one – Maggie Smith 100%. She has the look, she has the talent, and when I originally read ‘A Storm of Swords’ back in 2005 (when I was 14 when I began reading the books, just prior to A Feast for Crows being released), I imagined her voice in my head, having been in the Harry Potter films.
She is just perfect for the role. However…I don’t think we’ll get her.
Michael HarperQuote Reply
Sian Phillips ! Cannot help but think that QoT is a lot like Livia.
ImpiQuote Reply
I am in agreement with the others who have said Fionnula Flanagan.
PaulternateQuote Reply
She isn’t in very many scenes, unless I’m not remembering it right.
They probably wouldn’t go after huge names (and their huge asking prices) for a glorified cameo.
I dono’t need my QoT to be someone I’d recognize right away.
(also: booooo to the thought of Maggie Smith leaving Downton. boooooo)
ZackQuote Reply
June Whitfield is my choice!
Nick LarterQuote Reply
I’m rooting for a completely left-of-centre choice – Angela Lansbury. She’s done TV, she’s a brilliant actress and it’d be fun to see her play something a little less ‘sweet’. I think she could be great.
If not – Sian Phillips gets my vote.
ViolaQuote Reply
Paulternate,
Wow! I dunno how I forgot about her! She’s fantastic!
Michael HarperQuote Reply
maggie smith or vanessa redgrave for sure!! of course judi would also be great, but maggie has something in her that makes me feel certain she would rock as Olenna… but Vanessa redgrave, one of the most talented actresses of our times would just be fantastic! any role you gave her she would do it and do it well… i’m ashamed to say i don’t know much about the last lady, but i’m guessing she would be nice
Carolina HQuote Reply
Many of these seem a bit too big for me, though I could see many of them in the role.
What about Susan Engel? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_Engel
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=susan+engel&hl=en&client=safari&sa=X&rls=en&biw=1024&bih=611&tbm=isch&prmd=imvnso&tbnid=FjrJO3N_bULAPM:&imgrefurl=http://www.nationaltheatre.org.uk/32200/company-members/susan-engel.html&docid=UDa-PDukmTxNkM&imgurl=https://media.nt-online.org/files/EngelSusanxWSTysc.jpg&w=149&h=224&ei=def1T5uxO-Kr0AWQhoG6Bw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=112&vpy=164&dur=593&hovh=178&hovw=118&tx=86&ty=118&sig=118364631621581297028&page=1&tbnh=133&tbnw=88&start=0&ndsp=20&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:73
Steve WestenraQuote Reply
First of all, hi, long time lurker, first time poster and all that, and now going back to topic:
There’s a small mistake on the text: Downton Abbey is an ITV series, not BBC.
Also, Maggie Smith is my top choice, but I can absolutely see any of this fantastic actresses doing it. Though Sian Phillips (who, let’s not forget, was an awesome Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam in Lynch’s adaptation of Frank Herbert’s Dune) comes a close second for me.
Aly the She-bearQuote Reply
All of the above choices are good. I vote for the highly unlikely choice for Angela Lansbury. She’s experienced in stage, screen, and tv. Plus we know that Jessica Fletcher/Mrs. Potts doesn’t mess around.
CallQuote Reply
Not sure about the three top names… while good, I there is one image that comes immediately to mind….Linda Hunt, http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001373/ though obviously she would need the white hair.
Fionnula Flanagan would be a fantastic choice too.
Kevin GoreQuote Reply
Sian Phillips is my favorite of these choices, but I suspect we won’t see anyone who is known as well-known as these women, based on some rumors I heard a while back.
Ours is the FuryQuote Reply
Jessica Walter. Lucille Bluth in Game of Throne…
Holy Shit
DrewNovakQuote Reply
This is one of the rare roles that I almost have no opinion for…
There are so many absolutely brilliant older UK actresses that could do well in the role it is hard to even limit the possibilities down!
That said, I really enjoyed Finnula Flanagan on Brotherhood (which used to air on HBO competitor Showtime), the mini-series Revelations, and I liked her as Elouise on LOST too. I think she has the attitude for the role and is the right size being all of 5′-2″.
Like I wrote though, I think any number of actresses could excel as the Queen of Thorns!
darquemodeQuote Reply
I have always pictured Angela Lansbury as the queen of thorns! I’m not even sure if she’s acting anymore, and if she is, she’s likely too expensive, but I’d love to see her as Olenna.
I do hope that don’t cast someone considerably younger – I always pictured a small tart woman with big eyes and a deceptively sweet smile. :)
persephone88Quote Reply
She’s American. Not gonna happen–they’re not gonna cast an American unless they have a verrrry specific need that can’t be filled in the UK.
I love Jessica Walter though. After Arrested Development and Archer, I’d see anything she appeared in.
ZackQuote Reply
My vote would be for Eileen Atkins. A wonderful actress with a great wit, and maybe 1/5 of Maggie Smith’s profile. Maggie’s great but there’s no reason she should get ALL the best roles.
Geraldine McEwan from the Marple series would also be a good choice. Plus she could credibly be Natalie Dormer’s grandmamma.
Maxwell JamesQuote Reply
I don’t see why being on Downton Abbey would necessarily preclude Maggie Smith from doing this role. She might not want to do it for whatever reason, but Iain Glen has already shown that it’s possible to do both. He was in nine episodes of the first season of Game of Thrones, and then he did six episodes of the second season of Downton Abbey before doing another six episodes of the second season of Game of Thrones. And the Queen of Thorns would likely be a smaller role than Jorah Mormont. She only really needs to be in a handful of episodes, though with someone like Maggie Smith, the writers may want to write some additional scenes for her. Still, she could probably be in half the episodes or less.
JohnQuote Reply
Any of these actresses would be fantastic in the role. I’d also be surprised if we saw someone as important as Dames Maggie Smith or Judi Dench as Olenna Tyrell! I’d also be delighted to see that the role Tara Fitzgerald has is none other than the Queen of Thorns. I think she’d more than do justice to it.
puzzlnutQuote Reply
What about Lindsay Duncan or Polly Walker who both starred in HBO’s Rome?
John WQuote Reply
Omar Brown,
I had totally forgotten about her, and I would love to see her as the Queen of Thorns. I loved her in the Divine Secrets of the Ya-ya Sisterhood. I think it would be perfect! Yes, even more than Maggie Smith.
CortexiphanKid47Quote Reply
Ours is the Fury,
I was wondering about how big a name they would get also…
In that case how about a few lesser know actresses than most listed…. A few off the top of my head….
- Julia McKenzie was in Cranford, and played Ms Marple on BBC/ PBS.
- Also from Cranford, Imelda Staunton , She’s 5-feet tall and plays older quite well.
- Aussie actress Jacki Weaver was in Animal Kingdom and is only 5′-2″.
- Rosemary Harris has a long career, but recently was Peter Parker’s grandmother in Spider-Man in 2007.
darquemodeQuote Reply
Vanessa Redgrave would be amazing and she might agree to a small role where i doubt Maggie Smith or Judi Dench probably won’t.
My dream casting would be Marianne Faithfull, she has an amazing speaking voice and can do haughty extremely well. She’s also based in Ireland so that’s a plus.
Mirri MazQuote Reply
Judi Dench, no question. She’s not above doing brilliant bit pieces. The woman won an Oscar for 7 minutes of screen time!
XenkanMonkQuote Reply
I agree with Omar:
Fionnula Flanagan
HollyoakQuote Reply
Imelda Staunton is brilliant and would be perfect at ANYTHING.
Linda Hunt’s a great idea, and I can’t imagine the accent being a challenge.
I confess I pictured Helen Mirren, but I tend to picture Helen Mirren in just about everything.
AKA starofoberonQuote Reply
You could also put Tilda Swinton in make-up and cast her. She is a true Chameleon.
I could also see her as Lysa Arryn. But Kate Dickie did a great job in that role.
HollyoakQuote Reply
If you’re going to mention all these wonderful movie star actresses, then add Dame Helen Mirren to the list. She’s a phenomenal actor and I absolutely adore her (and have a bit of a woman-crush on her).
On the other hand, all these actresses above are fantastic, but they are the big names always mentioned when a role comes up for an older female character. I love that Nina Gold casts actors who are critically acclaimed and perfect for the roles they play in GoT but maybe not the “biggest” names (except maybe Sean Bean, who was the draw for the series).
All that being said, if I can’t have Helen Mirren for the QoT, I’m all for Fionnula Flanagan.
MaryS-NJQuote Reply
Miriam Margolyes for Queen of Thorns, please. She’s 5′ tall.
She’s been in a whole load of stuff, including Harry Potter and Blackadder.
She looks like this when she’s threatening:
http://commentisfreewatch.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/miriammargolyes_narrowweb__300x43604.jpg
King at the WallQuote Reply
I’m tellin’ you guys: Betty White!!
We’ve always thought of her as a comedy actress, but I bet she’s got some latent conniving old, canny, savvy, Grandma in there somewhere!
Kinda like Robin Williams, we KNEW he could be funny, but we had no idea he was such a great actor until later (Good Will Hunting, anyone?).
I think she would hit it out of the park.
EdQuote Reply
110% it won’t be Dame Maggie Smith. Or Helen Mirren.
But it WILL be an esteemed grande dame of British stage and screen and that points to a relatively small pool of contenders. I’d bet my house it’ll be one of the following:
Claire Bloom…previously cast by Nina Gold
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001954/
Judy Parfitt
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/littledorrit/images/char_lg_mrsclennam.jpg
Julie Walters – Harry Potter’s Mrs Weasley
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0910278/
Miriam Margolyes another venerable British actress who’s been in Potter http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0546816/
Younger than the above but both plausible as Olenna:
Cclia Imrie
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0408309/ and
Fiona Shaw (True Blood)
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0789716/
I’d also be really happy with Finnoula Flannagan who, like Fiona Shaw, is also Irish and might enjoy the opportunity to return from LA to work in rainy Ireland for a few months!
But my personal desire is to see the glorious Dame Diana Rigg in the role. She’s already a cult and genre favourite having starred in The Avengers and James Bond, and like Smith, Dench and Redgrave she’s among the first tier of BAD – British Acting Damage – but has hardly appeared on TV or film screens in the last decade and that might just qualify her as a fresh face and sufficiently ‘little known’ for GOT audiences – and she’s making her return to TV in this year’s Doctor Who! And didn’t she look quite like Natalie Dormer when she was younger??? http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001671/
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
Fionnula Flanagan (she´s wicked and fun) or Geraldine Mc Ewan.
Vanessa Redgrave and Sian Phillips are way tall for the Queen of Thorns I think.
andreaQuote Reply
A woman thinks all of these mature actors have much to offer the role of QOT, but prefers Dame Judi Dench due to her similar facial bone structure to Dormer and expertise at playing the venomous spider/perfect lady in past roles. Flanagan or Phillips would also suit, but dammit a woman wants Dame Judi Dench!
Who will play the twin guards for the QOT? A woman was thinking Dolph Lundgren and his twin Rolph, but is not sure now if Rolph really exists.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
I think Geraldine McEwan would make a brilliant Queen of Thornes but i think she’s actually pretty much retired from acting now, unfortunately.
Eileen Atkins is definitely an obvious front-runner but I just have this feeling that she’s been a bit ubiquitous of late playing very much to type and this making her too obvious a contender which will rule her out.
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
Oh, the one other actress I briefly considered and forgot (or wrote off)….Gillian Anderson.
She is another bigger name and much younger of course, but she has played much, much older in 2 roles in 2011 Great Expectations and The Crimson Petal and The White. She is petite and more than talented enough to pull off just about any role, and she is not adverse to taking smaller roles that are quirky, meaningful or just fun.
Plus she has been cast by Nina Gold 3 times in the last few years (Shadow Dancer, Crimson Petal, and Any Human Heart).
darquemodeQuote Reply
I have always pictured Dame Judi Dench, who is 5′ 1″ and therefore IMO not of average size, but quit small. She would be absolutely wonderful and she can be really stern and intimidating.
She also started out in TV and was a vital part of Cranford in 07 and 09, so I see no reason she would feel that TV sit to “small” for her. And according to IMDB she is not involved in anything right now.
Fingers crossed!!
DragenQuote Reply
Charlotte Rampling or Imelda Staunton :)
KateQuote Reply
In the Wiki of Ice and Fire she’s described as “old, with white hair and very small. She is older than Hoster Tully”. I know that characterization may do miracles, but I think, that Maggie Smith, Judi Dench or Fionnula Flanagan aren’t fragile enough. Sian Phillips, on the other hand, looked quite fragile in David Lynch’s Dune which was made 28 years ago.
GrzebykKQuote Reply
As much as I want Sian Phillips to be the Queen of Thorns I would gladly take Vanessa Redgrave. How awesome would it be to have two actresses who have played Anne Boleyn(Redgrave in a Man for all Seasons) as grandmother and granddaughter?
Another consideration is Francesca Annis. She’s not that big of a name despite being Ralph Fiennes’ older paramour for many years but she like Philips was also in David Lynch’s Dune as the Lady Jessica no less!
Annis isn’t as old either so she will be available more than some of the candidates. Makeup could make her look older.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
Holy mother of….perfection! I still can’t get her role from The Magdalene Sisters out of my mind, sent shivers down my spine. Good call, sir!
This would be fun! I love her to bits.
Out of the choices suggested in the main post, I’d go with Sian Phillips (nevermind the height). My personal choice would have been Phillida Law, whom I simply adore (again, I’m ignoring the height issue).
MachaQuote Reply
Lindsay Duncan is my default Lady Dustin. ;)
MachaQuote Reply
Eileen Atkins! Just don’t see Maggie Smith, Judi Dench, or Vanessa Redgrave doing it (because each of them have enough on their plate already). Trivia: Eileen Atkins was married to Julian Glover for a bit back in the day.
Shadowcat85Quote Reply
I did not know Sian Phillips before, but looking at that photo — that’s exactly the face I pictured. Would love to see her!
JayQuote Reply
Got to give a shout out to the suggestions of Diana Rigg and Angela Lansbury!!!
Both great picks which I wouldn’t have thought of!
If you’ve read my season 3 breakdown
http://podcastoficeandfire.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1332
You’ll see that while the Queen is throughout the book… she really has only 1 thing to do, and in my breakdown, I put it in Season 3, Episode 10.
SerCountryFriedSteakQuote Reply
Maxwell James,
My thoughts exactly.
Shadowcat85Quote Reply
Yes! I’ve loved Hunt since Year of Living Dangerously. Not exactly unknown, though, and probably not cheap unless she’s a fan.
Yellow DogQuote Reply
Who comes up with these “top choices” for the role? The description says, ““tiny and wizened with white hair” and yet we’re given 4 choices of whom only one really qualifies as tiny.
Maggie Smith is 5′ 5″ which makes her only 1 inch shorter than Natalie Dormer. She can’t appear “tiny” next to her on-screen granddaughter.
Vanessa Redgrave is 5′ 11″! Seriously? Someone wants the “tiny” Olenna to be 5 inches taller than Margaery?
Sian Phillips is 5′ 7.5″ and thus is 1.5 inches taller than Natalie Dormer.
Of the choices given, only Dame Judy Dench is actually “tiny” at 5′ 1″ and thus 5 inches shorter than Natalie Dormer. Of the 4 names proposed, only she actually qualifies for the role.
And what happened to an actress mentioned multiple times on this board, by multiple people? Fionnula Flanagan is only 5′ 2″ and thus also qualifies as tiny next to Natalie Dormer. In addition, Fionnula Flanagan has a GRRM connection, having appeared in his show Beauty and the Beast. She has no qualms about appearing in fantasy and sci-fi shows, having appeared in 3 different versions of Star Trek. And yet, she doesn’t make the list. I’m appalled.
LangkardQuote Reply
Im going with Sian Phillips…
Coltaine777Quote Reply
Good lord, Fiona Shaw is a giantess… at 5’8″, probably taller than many of the principle actors! And to whomever said Angela Lansbury would be fascinating in a less-sweet role, let me direct you to the Manchurian Candidate. She is CHILLING. What an amazing actress.
I’m not fussed, though like many I’d love to see half the names mentioned. I’m just glad she’s in — one of my favorites. So long as she’s sharp and snarky, I’ll be happy. I hope we get Left and Right, too, as extras.
NOW I JUST WANT STRONG BELWAS.
oh-bbQuote Reply
I take back my Angela Lansbury wish. I’ve had a rather inappropriate crush on Dame Diana since the Bond film she was in. She would be perfect. Ever seen the Mrs Bradley Mysteries? She could pull off Olenna.
Edit: And yes, Angela Lansbury is still working. This was a photo of her from May:
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02221/angela1_2221058b.jpg
ViolaQuote Reply
I don’t think Maggie Smith or Judi Dench are realistic possibilities, IMHO. It’s a very colorful part, but unless they really increase the size & scope of the speaking parts, it also amounts to a very colorful cameo – one scene with Sansa & Margy & Butterbumps and then the one scene at the wedding are what come to mind. I don’t really recall anything else?
NewJeffCTQuote Reply
oh-bb,
Hear, hear!
Sala Baker for Stong Belwas!
darquemodeQuote Reply
Maybe the bigger stars wouldn’t be available or affordable, but we still can dream. A woman thinks you are correct about the 2 major scenes QOT would play, but there may be more in the future that we don’t know about. Also the show adds scenes from time to time to move the story forward. Dame Judi Dench would bring so much gravitas to the role, that feeling when you get the first look at her that she’s “been there, done that” and is not impressed with the show of court at KL, but sees all the possibilities and all the politics at a glance and will have an impact one way or another. That’s the kind of feeling Dench brings IMO, so she’d be worth asking anyway. Whether she or any of the other more prominent actors can do it with schedules and negotiations, etc…that’s another question. We’re dreaming here, but sometimes dreams do come true.
Mrs. H’gharQuote Reply
It is known!
Omar BrownQuote Reply
Thinking outside the box, dude . Really like this idea, It is a very long shot but not impossible , as you say Ms. Anderson does take on some quirky roles. I think with a little make up, she could totally pull it off. Afterall a lot off characters in the show dont match their book descriptions.
Also love Fionnula Flanagan, and Maggie Smith. Please , please not Angela Lansbury. She is a good actress and all but “Murder she wrote” is on Daytime tv here so much I get angry every time her name is mentioned.
Two FeathersQuote Reply
How are you forgetting that they have, can, and will deviate from the books? Margaery Tyrell didn’t do much in ACoK, but they expanded her role in season 2. Same with Tywin Lannister. If you think they couldn’t squeeze in more Queen of Thorns scenes if they landed a top actress then you’re kidding yourself.
TolgerosQuote Reply
Two Feathers,
Here’s a pic of Gillian Anderson in The Crimson Petal and the White where she plays Mrs Castaway the aged madame (cast by Nina Gold).
darquemodeQuote Reply
I would love to see the actress Lindsay Duncan in the role. They would have to age her up a bit but she 1) has a history with HBO (she originally played Servilia, Caesar’s lover); watching her and Atia (Polly Walker) face off was a thing of beauty; and 2) she can play imperious, tough and sly with the best of them.
My second choice would be Fionnula Flanagan for pretty much the same reasons as Lindsay Duncan with the exception being the history with HBO which shouldn’t stop anyone from casting her.
Thanks!
Michelle Yvette PeeplesQuote Reply
Running through Nina Gold’s IMDB page, a few actresses she’s previously cast could fit the bill: Lindsay Duncan (Servilia from Rome), or how about Ruth Sheen (from Another Year)?
RoyaleWithCheeseQuote Reply
I don’t think they’ll get anyone so high profile. I think Sue Johnston would be awesome!
StarkyZGQuote Reply
You sound deranged – height is going to be way waaay down the list of attributes taken into consideration by Nina Gold when casting the part – if it is/was even taken into account at all! Olenna’s short stature, while mentioned in the book, is not the Queen of Thorn’s defining characteristc.
No doubt you were equally disappointed to learn the production didn’t actually shoot the series on location in Westeros.
Fidelity schmidelity!
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
darquemode,
Did you watched Great Expectations? although it was a very strange Miss Havisham I liked her in that role but I don´t think the TQT is a character for her. … she usually gets very intense, creepy and has no humor. IMO.
maybe I´m confused, but I always thought that the queen of thorns has very good humor.
andreaQuote Reply
Wow !!! Doesn`t she look amazing. I have not seen The Crimson Petal and the White , def. have to check it. I have had a crush on Gillian since her Scully days, but she is genuinely a very versatile actress. She was in a good wee film called The Greyhound with Robert Carlisle. It was set in modern(ish) Belfast, and she did a brilliant job with the thick Belfast accent, which is VERY difficult to pull off convincingly.
Two FeathersQuote Reply
andrea,
I did see it and she gave a truly brilliantly odd performance!
That was one of the “fun” roles I was thinking of!
I’m not sure she is right either honestly. I saw somewhere online that someone suggested her for the role and I thought about it for a while… I don’t see it happening, but it would be an interesting twist for sure!
darquemodeQuote Reply
Viola,
My nothing-innappropriate-going-on-here-at-all crush on Rigg started when I first encountered Mrs Peel in The Avengers repeats on tea-time telly in the early ’90s.
I love the Adela Bradley Mysteries – Rigg is great in them, brilliantly sharp, sly, humorous and knowing. And I thought she was still quite alluring in that too even though she must’ve been about 60 then…so i guess the crush was beginning to take an inappropriate turn!
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
Two Feathers,
I do not have the knowlege of accents, but Gillian has done so many BBC/ITV roles and her various accents have all seemed believable to me. I know she was raised in London until she was like 6 or 7 I think, so she first learned her language skills around all those UK accents. That helps I’m sure.
ETA:
I looked at Wiki and appears she moved out of London to Michigan when 11. So that is a number of years she lived in the UK.
darquemodeQuote Reply
My nothing-innappropriate-going-on-here-at-all crush on Rigg started when I first encountered Mrs Peel in The Avengers repeats on tea-time telly in the early ’90s.
I love the Adela Bradley Mysteries – Rigg is great in them, brilliantly sharp, sly, humorous and knowing. And I thought she was still quite alluring in that too even though she must’ve been about 60 then…so i guess the crush was beginning to take an inappropriate turn!
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
It’s the Queen of Thornes – look at the flowers in the first two pics!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/southyorkshire/sense_of_place/sy_people/images/rigg_150.jpg
http://images4.fanpop.com/image/photos/23100000/Mrs-Bradley-and-the-Ancient-Mystery-diana-rigg-23124497-800-600.png
http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/13400000/Diana-Rigg-diana-rigg-13437047-381-450.jpg
http://www.jsrpages.co.uk/pics2/2drlmbm.jpg
Ok, no more Diana Rigg related posts from me, it’s not like i’m her agent or anything. Diana Rigg DIANA RIGG DIANA RIGG….DIANA RIGG GODAMMIT!!!
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
As much as I want Anderson in the series I would prefer her as Selyse Baratheon or later in the series as Lady Barbrey Dustin who I have a feeling will play a big part later on.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
that´s the humor I was talking about (forget the drinking), I loved that bloody inmoral dragon lady (or this is just for mean asian women?).
Joshua Taylor,
I think I said that to annoy you ;) I knew you’d come out to defend her. Personally I never saw her do humor.
andreaQuote Reply
Is Crimson Petal and the White worth checking out? I love the subject matter involved and GA and Romola Garai….
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
andrea,
Gillian can do humour. She is notorious for giggle fits (she has an amazing laugh) on the sets of the X Files and other shows. If she is told to put some wry humour into the role I am sure she can pull it off.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
Still thinkimg Margolyes, who has the right mix of deviousness and wit to pull it off. That said, Weaver is an interesting choice as well.
Greatjon of SlumberQuote Reply
Also Gillian has just wrapped a series in Belfast called The Fall which co-stars Ian McElhinney and Michael McElhatton. Also cast by Nina Gold. She does have some productions on her plate though….
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
I was firmly in the Maggie smith camp until I saw the Vanessa Redgrave suggestion. Brilliant! More importantly, probably attainable unlike the others.
HamiltonguyQuote Reply
Can we find a way to get all four of them into the show !?
JustaBlokeQuote Reply
Joshua Taylor,
I’ve just started watching it this week and watched the first 2 of 4 episodes. It is interesting…
It has a dreamlike quality to many of the scenes as various characters have fantasies… It threw me off at first, but after 2 episodes I have gotten used to it. Romola Garai has many sex scenes and is naked quite a bit if that influences you. XD
I probably will not watch it again in the future, but I find it entertaining enough to watch the once and I have liked a number of the performances in it including Garai, O’Dowd and Mark Gatiss.
darquemodeQuote Reply
I dislike all the choices. I would prefer to have Ian Glenn in drag as the Queen O’ Thorns. THAT would rule.
RygarQuote Reply
Always been a Joanna Lumley man myself………:) PURRRRRRRRRRRRDY.
Two FeathersQuote Reply
Miniseries is really strong but I preferred the book, definitely recommend checking out both. GA doesn’t feature in the miniseries much so you should definitely catch her in Great Expectations where she plays a great Miss Havisham. Contrary to earlier posts, she’s not actually portraying an ‘old’ Miss Havisham in this particular adaptation; this Miss H is only supposed to be in her early forties and the character’s parchment skin and white hair is due to various deficiencies resulting from self-neglect and lack of sunlight due to hidning within the shuttered confines of her house since the day of her jiltment (not a spoiler – jiltment also not a word!)
Better than both though is her turn in BBC’s Bleak House (also featuring Charles Dance/Daddy Lannister) where she plays the mysterious/sinister Lady Deadlock – and it’s this performance more than any of her others that makes me want her to be cast as somebody/anybody in GOT so badly!
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
darquemode,
I frankly do not care if the role of Strong Belwas is played by an android in a gorilla suit — I just want him in there. He has so many hilarious moments and I think Dany’s storyline needs that sort of levity!
oh-bbQuote Reply
Two Feathers,
Joanna Lumley as the QOT, she’d be bloody brilliant – nay, ABSOLUTELY FABULOUS!
EdMORE TULLYQuote Reply
I think Fionula Flanagan has a sly look about her, which would be perfect for the QoT. She gets my vote.
Varamyr FourskinsQuote Reply
Lookit: if we can get Dame Judi through her Nina Gold/Jane Eyre connection…I’m just saying…Michael Fassbender would make a flipping brilliant Beric Dondarrion. (I can dream, can’t I?)
angelitaQuote Reply
slightly off-topic:
I think I’ve seen that under the name The Mighty Celt. God I love that film, it really stayed with me, and you’re right – her acting was GREAT.
On topic: If height is that big of an issue, how about….*drums*…. Sheila Reid. She’s tiny! :)
http://www.birmingham-rep.co.uk/about/search-the-company/sheila-reid/
MachaQuote Reply
Your totally correct. The greyhound was the co-star in the film. ……… I am comfortably numb just now , so please excuse my brain freeze..:)
Two FeathersQuote Reply
Why hasn’t anyone mentioned the obvious… Betty White! lol
PanchoFranciscoQuote Reply
Sheila Reid would be perfect for this role, and i think she would be far better than any big name actresses as that would just be a distraction in my opinion.
jonsidQuote Reply
My bet is on Sian Phillips…something about her face and her smile just seems right for Olenna, the woman who, I’ve no doubt, could outfox Littlefinger and Varys combined.
Although I must admit, I also adore Maggie Smith and would love to see her get more screentime, but perhaps not in GoT.
JohQuote Reply
Macha,
Brazil! don´t remember her character though. She seems fine yes.
just some Pink Floyd there or… diazepam? I hope you´re getting better.
andreaQuote Reply
PanchoFrancisco,
Ed mentioned her earlier in the comments. :)
Ours is the FuryQuote Reply
Initially like many I zoomed in on Maggie Smith, but thinking on her work in Coriolanus, Vanessa Redgrave would be an equally fine choice.
The Dragon DemandsQuote Reply
I’m quite surprised by the prominent names listed as possibilities, undoubtedly
any would own the role of Olenna Tyrell. Ironically each have individual strengths
that would enrich their portrayal of lady QoT. However I’m remaining optimistic
about Fionnula Flanagan or Geraldine McEwan as it would be “more bang for the
buck”. This has me thinking whom will play along as her accompanying son.
WildSeedQuote Reply
Too Tall.
WildSeedQuote Reply
Hopefully they call Maggie she is the best choice!
FlorenciaQuote Reply
Would you consider Ms Rigg for the role of lady Dustin ?
WildSeedQuote Reply
Eileen Atkins has the look…..
NicNicQuote Reply
I’ve always seen her as Prunella Scales.
Colin HicksQuote Reply
Brenda Blethyn! 5’2″
Gatehouse AmiQuote Reply
EdMORE TULLY,
Oh I have seen Bleak House. As soon as I saw it I thought Charles Dance would be an amazing Tywin Lannister….and then they casted him!
I was one of the peeps from the early days before the original pilot that wanted GA for Catelyn Stark.
But I love Michelle in the role. There’s still Ellaria Sand, the Green Grace or Lady Dustin for GA to sink her teeth into.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
WildSeed,
Lady Dustin’s a little younger isn’t she? Like late 40′s early 50s?
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
Rygar,
How about Dame Edna?
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
Personally I hope they go with an unknown actress here instead of blowing the budget on a super star kike Judi Dench or Maggie Smith (although the two would be brilliant).
There are better roles to waste money on (like David Wenham for Edmure Tulley, please Nina!) Or you know the cgi effects needed for the growing dragons failing that.
Aegon the ConquerorQuote Reply
Extra money spent on Brenda Blethyn would be worth it, she was born with an extra finger?! (imdb?!)… serves her role well.
Gatehouse AmiQuote Reply
Annette Crosbie maybe. I know she is most well known in the UK for her sitcom work, but she has an air of authority about her, and a glint in her eye that I think could be the QoT.
Taking a look at her filmography she has plenty of experience in period dramas! and anyone who was in Hawk the Slayer has to be worth it :D :P
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0188950/
Adam BigdenQuote Reply
Brenda Blethyn,yes please!!
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000950/
JohnQuote Reply
Omar Brown,
Fionnula Flanagan is perfect
DrewQuote Reply
OT, but I was just wondering why Season 3 hasn’t been added to the Episode Guide yet, I realise we have no information other than episode 27 will be tentatively called Autumn Storms, but still! :)
John-Michael LelievreQuote Reply
And you sound like a dimwit. The defining characteristic of the Queen of Thorns is exactly the combination of her large personality packed into a tiny body. There are plenty of characters with strong personalities in the books, what makes Olenna different IS her stature. That you don’t get that is really rather sad.
LangkardQuote Reply
Maxwell James,
I like both your suggestions.. but Geraldine McEwan could be really quirkily wonderful
( I haul out the Barchester Chronicles with her and Alan Rickman, Nigel Hawthorn etc. etc. on a regular basis ) ;)
Now I have to back up and see who others are suggesting. I, too ,think we’d be unlikely to get the fan faves..but I like Fionnula Flannagan , as well.
ObsidianQuote Reply
Langkard,
I think his point is that physical descsriptions from the books has nothing to do with the casting in this series.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
I love Maggie Smith and Judi Dench, they’re amazing, but it’s like no-one can think of any other actresses over 60 so they just say them even though it’s highly unlikely….
Fionnula Flanagan is a great suggestion. I’m also a big fan of Geraldine McEwan although she doesn’t fit the role quite as well as Fionnula imo.
msdQuote Reply
Fionnula all the way for me! She can be suitably sharp-witted and shifty as she proved in Lost. While a huge actress like Maggie Smith or Vanessa Redgrave would definitely be a boon for the show, I can’t help but feel their presence would be distracting. Like, you’d just think “Hey, Maggie Smith!” rather than “Olyna Tyrell” whenever they were on screen…
Django DjavosQuote Reply
In another thread a month or so ago I posted links to a pic of Fionnula Flanagan from the 1970′s when she still had red hair. Side by side with a pic of Natalie Dormer, they could be sisters. Just one more reason why I’ve been going on about Fionnula Flanagan for months now for that part.
Here’s that pic again:
younger Fionnula Flanagan with red hair
Natalie Dormer with red hair
Same eyes, same nose. Enough said.
LangkardQuote Reply
Which explains why Peter Dinklage is playing Tyrion, Lena Headey and Emilia Clarke wear blond wigs, etc.?
LangkardQuote Reply
I have no objections to any of the actresses mentioned in this thread. Would like to suggest the Phyllida Law though. Great actress that for some reason never get the praise/recognition she deserves.
http://images.zap2it.com/images/celeb-74175/phyllida-law.jpg
http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3134242560/nm0492373
David TQuote Reply
OT: Sarah Bolger was cast as Sleeping Beauty in the new season of Once Upon a Time. : (
Hi-FiQuote Reply
Really? Appalled?
AlanQuote Reply
Langkard,
Or why Jorah Mormont looks nothing like book Jorah or why Targs don’t have purple eyes or why Tyrion is handsome or Maegaery is aged up? Or the debacle regarding Stephen Dillane’s casting?
There is of course some fidelity to the books but some stuff just doesn’t translate to the screen not to mention that it’s better to get the best actor for the role. I daresay the role of Olenna would not be ruined if someone of tall stature was cast for the role. Then again some people think Jaime Lannister is ruined as well so it’s hard to say :-)
Not trying to argue here friend.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
I always pictured Betty White as the Queen of Thorns :)
MatMcCQuote Reply
David T,
I’ve got to side with David here. Great choice! I’ve always pictured someone like Phyllidia Law as QOT when I read the books. I could see honestly see someone like Phyllidia telling Butterbumps to pump up the volume. Though I’d like to see those A-list actresses mentioned earlier, let’s be real. No Vanessa, Maggie, Judy, Sian.Whoever Nina Gold and company decide to cast I’m sure will be wonderful and I can’t wait to see her and all of her frail badassery…
MrsWunQuote Reply
Langkard,
oh Langkard, I know you´re right. I too said that TQT must be little.
Olenna’s height is an important physical feature because the only thing people see is a small, harmless old lady (yeah, right). If the actress is tall and imposing, the character is sold a bit beforehand. Yes?
andreaQuote Reply
In my head she is Helen Mirren, even if all these are absolutely wonderful.
Valyrian EyesQuote Reply
Dame Edna is playing the Goblin King in the Hobbit. No joke.
LexQuote Reply
I think they should cast Betty White…
;)
Pastor_of_MuppetsQuote Reply
Eileen Atkins or Linda Hunt
MichaelQuote Reply
A few more thoughts:
–This show hasn’t gone in much for “stunt” casting, or casting a well-known actor/actress in a role that is much smaller than they are in terms of comparable fame. Sean Bean is a star. Peter Dinklage was well known, and this show has boosted him further into stardom (the Emmy helped; he might take another one home this year). If there is one role that would probably worth for a big name Judi Dench-style thing, someone you’re just hoping will chew the scenery, the Queen of Thorns is it – really, she’d get great stuff in 2 big episodes early on, and then fade mostly into the background for a while – a great while. So if that’s a few days of work for a great actress, it’s something you can see happening. I still don’t see Maggie Smith doing it, or Judi Dench (who I think would be better), and why I see someone more on the level of Miriam Margolyes. A few other possibles:
–Geraldine Chaplin. She’s 68, somewhat wizened looking already, and British. If the show can have one Chaplin, why not another.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001036/
–Gemma Jones. She’s 70. Big voice, keeps the Harry Potter connections alive, and she’s known for playing Bridget Jones’s Mum.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0428121/
–Brenda Fricker. May be a bit big for the part. But really, it’s been years since people saw her on screen – she’s been doing TV, she’s Irish, she’s 67, she’s a hell of an actress. She’s not quite the face that Maggie Smith is, or Judi Dench, but more recognizable than an unknown.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0002084/
–Joan Plowright. Not as busy as she’d been in the past. At 84, she’s definitely got the white-haired thing going on. She’s great at playing haughty, entitled dames, and an easy one for the silver-tongued Queen of Thorns. Whether she’d sign on for a fantasy series is another question, but if I’m wish-casting, I’m going with her.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0687506/
–Sylvia Syms. She might be a bit more Maggy the Frog than the Queen of Thorns, but I’m sure she’d suffice. She did nice work as the Queen Mum in The Queen, Helen Mirren’s Oscar winner. (As for Mirren, well, it is HBO…I’d be waiting for her to get naked rather than listen to her dialogue.)
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0843401/
That’s all I got. A few ideas. Probably all wrong but what can you do.
Greatjon of SlumberQuote Reply
Ed,
She plays “bitch” supremely well.
It’s a shame my great aunt passed away years ago. That part was WRITTEN FOR HER!!!! (she was awesome)
KGQuote Reply
Not to be morbid, but the potential longevity of the show could be a factor in who they cast. I think that Maggie Smith would hit it out of the park, but she’s 77. I sure hope she makes it to the ripe old age of 177 million billion but if the show goes on for 10 years that has to be a concern, for anyone they cast.
ScottEQuote Reply
Langkard,
There are similarities. I could see her in the part, despite my irrational dislike of the latter half of LOST. This and David T‘s choice are probably my favorites at the moment.
If I’m being entirely unreasonable, though, managing to get Dame Judy Dench for this part would certainly merit beefing up the role a smidge!
ZackQuote Reply
You just blew my mind. However , I have heard some say that Cersei is the Lucille Bluth of westeros, so it might get confusing :^)
JillQuote Reply
The argument being made by the insulting person to whom I initially responded was that physical appearance made absolutely no difference at all. That is quite clearly and demonstrably false.
Purple hair, an older Margaery – those are all things which can be changed. The reason Peter Dinklage is Tyrion is because the part requires a man of his acting ability and his height, not just his acting ability. His physical good looks are unavoidable. A trade-off had to be made to get the best possible person for that role. So ugliness went away.
The same goes for why Lena Headey and Emilia Clarke have to wear wigs. They must be blonde and white-haired respectively. The Mountain must be really tall. Maester Aemon must be really old, and so on. Some things can be changed and some things are integral to the characters.
In the case of the Queen of Thorns, her physical presence is integral to the entire characterization. As I said before, it isn’t just about a character with a strong personality – the story is full of those. The Queen of Thorns is a memorable character precisely because her strong personality is disguised in a diminutive, seemingly frail body.
Casting a too tall actress in the role would be lessen the impact of the character, in essence removing half of her “charm”, if such a word can be applied to Lady Olenna. As Andrea put it above, the character traits would be sold too early. Cheapened. Made less important. At that point, why bother with an Olenna at all?
And we can certainly argue in a friendly way. This ed person notwithstanding.
LangkardQuote Reply
Yes. Appalled. That people would even consider a 5′ 11″ actress, as good as Vanessa Redgrave is, just boggles the mind. A Lady Olenna the same height as Loras Tyrell? Almost half a foot taller than Cersei? Think of the visuals. Yes, appalled.
LangkardQuote Reply
An excellent suggestion, although I’m still entirely for Fionnula Flanagan. Geraldine Chaplin looks very much like a Lady Olenna, except for being just a tad too tall. I can imagine Joan Plowright, as well. Is she well, though? She hasn’t acted in several years.
LangkardQuote Reply
I agree that the Queen of Thorns should be tiny, it is an important physical factor for that role… however, they can do a lot with camera angles etc.
There are tons of famous american actors who are very very short, but when you see them on screen they look tall. I’m sure an actress of average height could pull off this role as long as they make her look shorter which they can do.
Bonnie BlueQuote Reply
Sian Philips but as Ours is the Fury said, probably not a role to spend too much on.
Jordan HealeyQuote Reply
What about Left and Right? If the QoT is in u can’t leave out the redwines.
Some mummerQuote Reply
Some mummer,
Left and Right aren’t the Redwynes. Those are different dudes.
KGQuote Reply
Langkard: Yes. Appalled.That people would even consider a 5′ 11″ actress, as good as Vanessa Redgrave is, just boggles the mind.A Lady Olenna the same height as Loras Tyrell? Almost half a foot taller than Cersei?Think of the visuals.Yes, appalled.
You honestly need to get some perspective or learn the definition of the word. One or the other.
AlanQuote Reply
I don’t think that any of the featured actresses are quite right. Too recognisable. Annette Crosbie or Stephanie Cole please! Either one of them could knock this role out of the park without breaking a sweat.
The KingshaverQuote Reply
LMAO !!
WildSeedQuote Reply
I see you’ve decided to return to your old insulting ways. Guess you go back in the not worth reading their posts pile. I am fully aware of the meaning of the words I choose to use. And I think that you telling other people to get some perspective is the most ironic thing I’ve seen this week.
Irony – look it up. You’ll find it in the dictionary between hypocrite and jerk.
LangkardQuote Reply
Helen Mirren has been on my mind too and far above the possible cast list of older
great actresses. She would be superb but not bloody likely.She’s been known to do
small and big budget films. I watched her in the “Tempest” maybe 3 times, and
she was a force of wonder in “Prime Suspect” yet I fear we’d be cheated with high
hopes. I’m not betting on the list that includes Vanessa Redgrave either. As if we
could have any impact here or gaze into the director’s crystal ball or compete with
westeros.com without going mad, I’m gonna shoot for the middle ground. Fionnula
Flannagan and Geraldine McEwan have been named ( among others ) that I see
as strong contenders and easy on the purse. Most suggested here would shine in their
own right and make the role memorable. I do hope Ms Mirren is a fan though.
WildSeedQuote Reply
Langkard,
Now you got me to look up the meaning for appalled. But I do not get it, does it mean “negativly surprised” or “horrified”. I found both, the first one seems ok.
Sorry english is not my mother lanquage, would just like to get the point of the argument. ;)
AbendsternQuote Reply
Dismayed would be a closer definition.
LangkardQuote Reply
Yup, you’re right, this ain’t “Masterpiece Theatre”. Lady Dustin may or may not
become essential to GoT scripts and not too soon anyway. Yet if the role were
to be a POV character in later seasons, a commanding actress would become
essential.Ms Rigg was not my best choice, I was just echoing a previous post.
I’m not even gonna mention Charlize Theron as a contender as some suggested,
think my head would explode :D
WildSeedQuote Reply
Eileen Dunn
Fionnula Flanagan
or
Brenda Blethyn
caoimayQuote Reply
A left-field choice but I think she would be amazing. For a start, she’s tiny, but more importantly, she’s an incredible actress with a great range. Plus she’s as mad as bag of ferrets so if they sent her out to do press it would be incredible.
Now it’s out there, I’m flying the banner for Miriam as the Queen of Thorns! I don’t even think it would be a stretch for her; she’s already got most of the mannerisms.
HouseLarkQuote Reply
Vanessa Redgrave would be great if we can’t get Judi Dench
Pau SorianoQuote Reply
How about Helen Mirren?
socrates kQuote Reply
Ex bond girl Honor Blackman?
rickyQuote Reply
John W,
How can Polly Walker be suggested for both the roles of Cersei AND the Queen of Thorns??? All right, I suggest her for the role of Jojen Reed, because it seems that being in HBO’s Rome qualifies people to become any character in any series.
Lindsay Duncan is too young as well.
I’d be happy to have any of the ladies in this list, but Vanessa Redgrave gets my vote.
ieiazelQuote Reply
Fionnula Flanagan, absolutely: loved her in “Lost” and “The Others”. She would make for a very good Olenna :)
Luca CorradiniQuote Reply
I don’t know if she has been mentioned but I’ve always seen her as Sheila Hancock. Probably a bit tall for some at 5’8.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dorothy/images/sheilahancock_profile_526_296.jpg
Annette Crosbie is another good suggestion but in saying that most of the suggestions seem fine.
Oh yes and Omid Djalili as Strong Belwas (with a bit moreweight).
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0229084/
Half FootQuote Reply
Please, please, please not Fionnula Flanagan.
To me, she represents everything that is wrong with the latter seasons of Lost. Whenever she was on screen, the show’s plot got a little more nonsensical.
BlusterBlasterQuote Reply
EdMORE TULLY,
I like where your head is at! When I was reading the books Claire Bloom (circa Clash of the Titans) is definitly who I was thinking of. Another suggestion I would make is Julie Christie. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001046/
DanielleQuote Reply
that’s not really her fault tho, is it?
anyway, can’t say I have any suggestions (was gonna suggest actress who played Livia Soprano but I keep forgetting she died) but I’d rather they avoid any well known TV/Hollywood faces.
jkbQuote Reply
that sounds like a gross exaggeration. while some actors look different from what’s described on the page, most bear at least some resemblance, while others seem to have walked right out of the book onto the screen
MATTHEWQuote Reply
WildSeed,
I pictured Gillian Anderson for Lady Dustin. Especially in the conversation with Reek scene from ADWD. That would be amazing. One of the best passages of the book if you ask me.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
No, appalled does not mean “dismayed”, unless the word is being mis-used. The word definitely connotes surprise or shock (with some disgust mixed in), with very negative connotations.
One can be dismayed without being surprised.
MATTHEWQuote Reply
i must say i thought of Vanessa Redgrave while reading a storm of swords
stephenQuote Reply
Annette Crosbie would be perfect. I am going to second Kingshaver on that call.
PrivateIronQuote Reply
While I agree with you that Lady Olenna should not be tall…simple camera tricks can fix that easily. Unless they beef up the role, we are talking very little screen time for the character. Personally I don’t want a big name for this role. With such a small role it has to be a quick sell character. Nothing to do with their ability, just their celebrity. With Lord Frey, by the time my mind quit thinking “Hey it’s Filch!” and got back into the story, the scene was over. I fear a big name for the QoT would do the same. A lesser known actor would avoid this. I have no problem with known actors for larger roles as I can make the transition from recognition to character belief and then I’m good after that. Just my opinion.
fuelpaganQuote Reply
I am all for a tall QoT only if she’s played by Conan Stevens. Seriously, give the fans something to gush over and bring him back in a role he is most suited for.
Or Dame Edna. Thanks JT, made my morning. :)
RygarQuote Reply
LOL @ people getting “appalled” over taller actresses being suggested. Talk about being overly dramatic. So what if the actress playing her isn’t “tiny”? Is her size really that defining of a characteristic? As long as the actress is elderly, female, caucasian and can display wit, biting criticsm and scheming, we’re all good. Everything else is just not that important.
Sure, it’d be nice to get them to look as much as GRRM’s descriptions in the books, but what really matters is the “defining” traits, and as far as physical traits go the only really important ones are that she is an old lady and she has to be white for obvious reasons. Things like hair color, eye color, height, weight etc are just not that important in this case. Might as well be “appalled” over the fact that Daenerys doesn’t have purple eyes or that Stannis isn’t bald.
VanderhookQuote Reply
Cannot imagine that Judi Dench would be affordable… or available… but she’d be a dream. Fantastic presence with just the right mix of dignity, power and humor (and the Queen of Thorns can inject some much needed humor into our dark world of Westeros).
She can also bring still more star power and respectability to the growing respect Game of Thrones has been earning. Anyone see the exquisitely stupid “Chronicles of Riddick?” Even a turkey like that one benefited just from having Judi in the credits… and her unmistakable voice in the trailer.
Never gonna happen. She’d be way to pricey. But we can dream.
ChrisQuote Reply
My old insulting ways? I’m frankly baffled, because I don’t have a history of that. Care to back it up? I’m no saint here, but hatching you are confusing me with someone else.
Appalled means you are extremely shocked, horrified and/or fearful of something. Like a person is appalled to find a company pouring chemical waste into the drinking water. The word horrified and shocked and dread are used for reasons in the defining and not surprising or mildly annoyed. It’s not used for small things unless it’s ironic or the person has no perspective.
I asked you if you really meant appalled, and you clarified. I hought perhaps you had misused or used it in hyperbole. But no, apparently casting a tall Queen of Thorns is apparently somewhat akin to a horrifying event in your eyes.
There are a lot of appalling things in life. I’m surprised this made anyone’s list.
AlanQuote Reply
Lesser known actress who can pull off the role well, please.
QoT is a great character, but not worth a big budget hit to get a star for this role. Not worth it at all.
LoFQuote Reply
The actual common usage of appalled both has an element of shock and an element of horrifying. Someone might be appalled at the horrible state that someone is living in, for example, if their apartment is in squalor — dirty, no water, etc. It is often used to describe to the reaction to some very, very serious and bad things.
It can be used to describe much more trivial or less bad things. But when it is done there these days, it is almost always done for comedic effect of some kind. In other words, intentional hyperbole, or overstatement for effect that you don’t really mean. I am APPALLED that you do not have fancy mustard for my hot dog! I demand to see the manager!
That’s how it is actually used — people don’t use appalled to say “I’d be bummed if…” or “I’d prefer X.” It’s the reaction to encountering something so wrong that you are shock or horrified, and there is often an element of dread.
————-
We all love Game of Thrones and ASOIF on these boards, but I get tired of people placing casting decisions and things like the QoT height on a level with people’s reactions to urban poverty, problems with the health care system, or any number of real life issues. The anger displayed bothers me — this simply is supposed to bring joy, not consternation. And perhaps it’s not my place, but it annoys me when I have to read complaints that pale next to what normal people have to deal with on a day to day basis.
I’m not going to argue further on definition. That wasn’t my point. If Langkard is saying he/she was saying that they didn’t like the idea of a tall QoT, fine. Then I agree. If he/she wants to go on as if it is the end of the freaking world, then I disagree.
AlanQuote Reply
It would be nice to see Dench or Smith in the role but I won’t hold my breath.
The KingslayerQuote Reply
I´d like to see Maggie Smith as the QoT, but I´m sure Nina Gold will knock me out of my socks with the person she´s going to cast. In Gold I trust :)
blackbird7309Quote Reply
Gemma Jones. She was the nurse at Hogwarts in the Harry Potter films, and has been in tons of other stuff.
I love all the choices here, but I’d rather they put the budget toward bigger and better dragons than blow any money on a Special Guest Star who has what, two scenes?
Richard WeetabixQuote Reply
I would really like Judy Dench as the Queen of Thorns. She played a similar role in Pride&Prejudice as Darcy’s aunt and she was fabulous! Of course the budget will be a huge obstacle… :/
OliveQuote Reply
You couldn’t be more wrong.
From Merriam Webster’s Online : http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/appalled
See the word I highlighted in bold. Next time, look it up before you argue with someone about the definition of a word. Mmkay?
Alan,
See the above definition. Find a nice cozy place where the sun doesn’t shine to stick it.
LangkardQuote Reply
Linda Hunt! She’s the right size and age.
VicarQuote Reply
Langkard,
It’s not the appropriate term to use, bro. If you meant “dismayed”, you should have used the word “dismayed”. “Appalled” is not synonomous with “dismayed”, its a stronger version. As your reference to the dictionary point it out it means “overcome with [..] dismay”. Overcome, thats the key difference. You’re not allowed to just say something outlandish, stand by it, and when others point out how ridiculous it is, change the meaning to suit something less outlandish.
VanderhookQuote Reply
I meant appalled and I used it in its sense as being filled with dismay. A stronger version of dismay. You continue to assume that I didn’t mean the stronger version. And you are entirely incorrect. If you want to argue with the definition, go contact Merriam-Webster, or Oxford, or any of the other dictionaries out there. I meant it exactly as I used it.
If you want to argue that I meant something I didn’t mean, or that I’m changing the definition, by all means do so. But you should know that is ridiculous and fallacious. I used the correct definition. I haven’t changed how I used the definition of it, or anything else. The only thing that has changed is that when proven wrong, several people – you included – have chosen to try and make a change to my intent in order to make your own arguments correct. Think about that.
You are allowed to make incorrect assumptions about what I intended and then argue from that basis. That doesn’t make you right. It just, as the saying goes about the word assume, makes an ass out of you and me.
LangkardQuote Reply
Okay, I see that you understand that appalled is a strong version of the word dismayed. I apologize for assuming otherwise.
I still maintain that it’s absolutely ridiculous to have that sort reaction. As another poster said, if you are to have that sort of extreme reaction to a casting suggestion of a minor character in a TV show, you need to gain some perspective.
VanderhookQuote Reply
And that qualifies as an ad hominem attack. Unable to argue the point, you have to resort to making a comment about me instead of what I said? You’re just as bad as Alan, then. It is good to know. I don’t turn the other cheek. When insulted I will return the favor. If you can’t discuss the points being debated without being insulting to the person making the arguments then expect to receive in kind.
How is my making a big deal about what I see as the casting requirements for Lady Olenna not having perspective and yet you arguing about the definition of a word and assuming incorrectly my intent in using the word is having perspective. Pot, meet my friend, Ser Osmund Kettleblack.
LangkardQuote Reply
Vanessa Redgrave , she looks powerful.
and we’ve never had an old grandmother in the show before.nice change!
negarQuote Reply
Langkard,
Ad hominem arguments are when you attack the person, not the subject at hand. I’m criticizing the subject at hand: that you are showing a very extreme reaction to something that just isn’t very important. If you’ve read my previous posts you’ll see that that has been my objection the entire time. I assumed you were trying to weasel out of your statement of being appalled, and criticized that as well, but I was wrong and admitted that, but that doesn’t change that I think it’s wrong to have such an over-the-top reaction and shows a lack of perspective.
If I were using an ad hominem attack it would be more along the lines of “You have no right to be appalled of Olenna’s casting suggestions because you lack perspective”. I’m not doing that, I’m saying you don’t have any grounds to be appalled, because being appalled at a casting suggestion for a minor character is in an of itself a ridiculous thing to do, and it shows that you have a lack of perspective. Understand? I’m saying you lack perspective BECAUSE you are appalled. I’m not saying being appalled is wrong because you lack perspective (which would be an ad hominem attack like you said).
VanderhookQuote Reply
If you’re truly appalled by the suggestion, then you’re appalled. If someone else thinks that reaction is a bit extreme, then they think it’s a bit extreme. You’re both allowed your opinions and emotions.
For my part, I tend to think that appalled is a word to be used in situations that are a little less…I don’t know…frivolous? than the hypothetical casting of an actress in a television series. However, if it’s that important to you, then who am I to say that you aren’t appalled?
Now– to business.
The height of the actress is a valid concern, but I think it’s worth considering that they managed to manipulate the apparent height of actors playing hobbits and dwarves etc. rather well in Lord of the Rings, and that they’ve been making Tom Cruise seem tall for years. In other words: while it would undoubtedly make it easier on the production team to have a legitimately frail and short person cast as Olenna Tyrell, it does not mean that taller people should be excluded from the discussion: anyone can be made to seem shorter, frailer and, for that matter, older than they actually are.
cassQuote Reply
How about the entire definition, including that whole “to be overcome…”
If you were really “overcome with dismay” — just incapable of doing anything, then yes, you have severe issues if the idea of a 5’11″ woman playing the QoT makes you that way.
What’s clearer now to me is that you both have anger issues and have no real idea how the word is used in real conversation. There’s a massive difference between denotation and connotation in addition to the fact that you’re not really understanding the denotation here.
Why don’t you sit the next few plays out, champ?
EDIT: ooh, I get the added fun of you not understanding what an ad hominem attack is. An ad hominem attack is if I said “You’re a dick.” Not asking for clarity on your use of a word everyone else agrees is pretty strong, then commenting that that is an extreme reaction to an actress being suggested that is too tall for a role.
I maintain that you need to get some perspective, and this thread has just convinced me more of it. There’s no reason to be _angry_ or _appalled_ about any of this.
AlanQuote Reply
As for Olenna Tyrell, her defining characteristics include her snark and her political savvy and intelligence.
While it would be nice for all that to come in a cute, little package — it makes for a wonderful contrast — Olenna Tyrell’s size is not defining of her character like say, Brienne’s or Tyrion.
For Brienne or Tyrion, it is core to their personality — it defines how other view them and more importantly, how they view the world.
Olenna is known as a snarky old biddy. And she’s known to Cersei and Tyrion as a plotter, IIRC, even if they don’t know the extent of it. It’s only Sansa who seems surprised at her political savvy. Either way, Olenna does not feel defined by her size, and no one seems to discount her because of her height.
So I fail to see how it’s important. It’s like Missandei being 10, or Mance being non-descript. It’d be nice to keep; it makes for a nice introduction, but it’s hardly core to the character or the plot (like say, blond hair for the Lannisters is).
AlanQuote Reply
Eileen Atkins
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0040586/
She played Maddy, the hermit goat lady in “Cold Mountain” who nurses Inman back to health. Watch the scene with her and study her delivery. She’s the one and only Olenna I can picture.
Maester of PuppetsQuote Reply
So the script the actors went by had no impact ? Serendipity?
WildSeedQuote Reply
Mhm. I always thought she sold that nonsense quite well. Hell, they had a whole cast full of solid talent. The actors can’t make the script not be awful though.
Anyone know of anything starring Ms Flanagan that isn’t quite so ridiculous? I’d like to see her on a good script.
ZackQuote Reply
Zack,
For Flannagan: One word: Brotherhood. Criminally underrated series.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
Alan,
I agree 100% Which is why Sian Phillips or Redgrave would be awesome in the role.
Joshua TaylorQuote Reply
As much as I like actresses like Dench or Smith I have to say that my knowledge about elder English actresses is bit vague. Most of them I only know from one or two movies/series. So the thing I want from my QOT is easily satisfied, unknown. No Smith and in no way ever Dench. Geraldine McEvan I know only from Ms.Marple and I have no idea if she has any acting chops for evil and intelligent GOT-player. Though I liked Marple, so I have faith. Geraldine Chaplin has looks so going to that direction also gets my agreement. Fionnula Flannagan could also give nice vibes but I personally like my Queen bit more frail and maybe…. withered? That pretty much closes the door from actors like Joan Plowright who have healthy cheeks and round face.
How tall she is is not really much concern to me because height can be easily modified with tricks of the trade but face is lifeline to actor and that is really hard to chance without loads of money and time. QOT has always been big thing to me and when they confirmed the casting I took couple of dance steps of joy. I usually am pretty ok with Golds casting choices but this one I’m gonna follow with care.
rorschach-Quote Reply
Betty White.
Yeah. I said it.
SeanQuote Reply
Linda Hunt, Angela Lansbury, Judi Dench, and Betty White are my personal choices. Linda Hunt is taking a part-season off from NCIS: LA, wonder why? :D I can always hope(that she’s QoT).
sherryQuote Reply
Angela Lansbury was always who I saw in the role, so she’s still my top fan cast pick
LegionQuote Reply
I am a tremendous admirer of Linda Hunt as a performer, but I don’t think she is right for QOT particularly. I’m gravitating towards F.F. or perhaps Eileen Dunn.
TheImpsNoseQuote Reply
Vanessa looks amazing!
Errm, I mean she would be perfect for the role, not that I would find her sexually arousing o_X
What is Dead may….Quote Reply
Tolgeros,
I had kinda hoped they would decide to shmush Olenna’s character into Margaery’s since tvshow Margaery is more a player and less a pawn than the Margaery of the books, IMO anyway. Oh well. And as for casting, I’d rather have an unknown but awesome character actor play her than a big name.
Lordlings and LadiesQuote Reply
Appearance is important to some roles, not to some others. Tyrion had to be played by a dwarf. We all would rightfully have been “appalled” if he were played by a tall actor. Likewise, Lannisters should have blonde hair and Targs should have white/blonde hair (genetic extremes being the product of inbreeding), just like Baratheons must have black/dark brown hair. These are indispensable plot points because of the controversy surrounding the parentage of certain characters that shape the story as a whole.
Ser Jorah didn’t have to be bald because the way he looks isn’t a big deal, except insomuch as he should be ordinary enough for Dany not to be smitten with him. Xaro Xhoan Daxos didn’t need to be white either. Nina Gold has plenty of latitude to be flexible on appearance with pretty much any character outside of the four great houses (Stark, Lannister, Baratheon, Targaryen), and even then Cat and Robb having red hair obviously wasn’t *that* important. If you wanted to cry fidelity to the text, it should be a lot more “appalling” that virtually every young character has been aged up significantly.
The Stannis WayQuote Reply
A little better thanks sweetling……….:) Lyrics by Floyd, numbness by milk of the poppy
(diazepam).
Two FeathersQuote Reply
tyrles roollssss!!!
blablaQuote Reply
I think Charlie Chaplins daughter Geraldine (mother of Oona/Talisa) would be the best choice for the role http://www.lahiguera.net/cinemania/actores/geraldine_chaplin/fotos/5887/geraldine_chaplin.jpg
Santi GilaQuote Reply
Dame Judi Dench is my dreamcast Queen of Thorns… Helen Mirren could be wonderful in the role aswel… and I am not completely against the idea of Betty White… just love her to pieces!!!! I think she could pull off the witty Queen of Thorns without even breaking a sweat!
Lisa GougetQuote Reply
Judi Dench recently revealed that she had a degenerative eye condition and is going blind. She has trouble reading scripts. She did say that she wanted to still work to keep busy, so a small role on Game of Thrones may be something she is willing to do.
SheldonQuote Reply
Carne,
I’m with you on this one.
Jen@House StarkQuote Reply
Fionnula Flanagan is my pick as well.
Jen@House StarkQuote Reply
After watching Downton Abbey, it’ s gotta be Maggie Smith.
JiunQuote Reply
Daily Mail is printing it as confirmed (online at least). Seems like its right. Look up her younger photos and compare to Natalie Dormer and I think you get the perfect casting.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2172802/Hannah-John-Kamen-whips-fever-ahead-Spice-Girls-musical-Viva-Forever.html#ixzz20TzqrY2l
Levi AgeeQuote Reply