New in-depth report from the set in Northern Ireland
By Ours is the Fury on in Filming.

A new report from Northern Ireland brings fresh details about the filming of a notorious event for season three of Game of Thrones. McDoodils was able to access the location in Moneyglass (a place previously used for Winterfell sets) and shared several pieces of information about what he saw there.

This set report contains several spoilers from A Storm of Swords. Major SPOILERS for season three will be under the Read More. Proceed with caution!

It appears that filming is well under way for the Red Wedding, the biggest event in A Storm of Swords and one of the most defining moments in the A Song of Ice and Fire series. What sealed the deal in confirming that this was the RW being filmed? According to McDoodils:

What confirmed the “Red Wedding” for me was Mr Higgins revealing that [Imagine the Irish accent] “A massacre took place last night” and “major characters got their heads removed and sowed onto an ox.” I will admit I did laugh out loud at this point, obviously I explained what I thought it was.

Most likely, the landowner saw the corpse of a direwolf but didn’t realize that’s what it was, not being a fan of the show. It’s also possible that they did use an ox to simulate the gruesome head-swapping of Robb and Grey Wind, and that the ox will be CGI-ed into a direwolf in post-production.

McDoodils also observed battling extras and other details:

…it was still fantastic to see the Frey’s men battle it out with the Northmen. Before coming I had been told that there was to be gas men on set as thing were going to burn. This was confirmed to me immediately as the set was engulfed with “controlled” fire. The main focus of the scene was a wagon on fire rolling down a dirt road as the battle enraged around it. All the extras I seen were wearing generic gear, apart from one man who seemed to be wearing Lannister attire, the only reason I mention this is because this man has golden hair.

UPDATE: A reliable source confirmed with us that there are no Lannisters at the Red Wedding. So that last bit was a case of mistaken identity.

He also spotted a large banner with the sigil of House Frey and the Twins, confirming that this was the courtyard of the Freys.

UPDATE: We’ve learned that the Red Wedding will happen in episode 9 of season 3 and will be directed by David Nutter.

Ours is the Fury: Well, it’s happening! The Red Wedding is often cited as the moment people have been waiting for since the show began, and we’re almost there. It sounds like they’re pulling out the stops and not holding back on the gory details.


148 Comments

  1. feyrband
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:01 pm | Permalink

    Can’t wait!

  2. Andrew
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:05 pm | Permalink

    This makes me sad :(

  3. Hilda
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:12 pm | Permalink

    OMG! I am going to cry my eyes out! This is going to be so hard to watch!

  4. David
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:13 pm | Permalink

    There were Lannisters at the Red Wedding?

  5. NewJeffCT
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:14 pm | Permalink

    Non book readers will be stunned.

  6. damn_Ley
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:16 pm | Permalink

    The Young Wolf )=

  7. Andrew
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:26 pm | Permalink

    Oh jesus, imagine if they have Jamie take on Roose Boltons role? I shudder at the thought. Here’s hoping it some poor blonde-haired Frey he saw, instead.

    Very excited to hear details about it though. Many a tissue will be used when this episode airs.

  8. Arthur
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:27 pm | Permalink

    Poor Greywind…

    These Starks are always warned by their Direwolves but never listen.

  9. Lars
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:27 pm | Permalink

    David:
    There were Lannisters at the Red Wedding?

    That battle may not be RW related – just another battle shot in the same area.

  10. Aemon
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:29 pm | Permalink

    Anyone know if David Bradley (Walder Frey) is confirmed to be returning?

  11. Ours is the Fury
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:34 pm | Permalink

    It wouldn’t be that weird if they threw some Lannisters in the mix at the wedding, in the outside fighting part.

    Aemon,

    At least one extra has said they talked to him on set, so I wouldn’t be worried about David Bradley.

  12. thisone
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:46 pm | Permalink

    Arthur: hese Starks are always warned by their Direwolves but never liste

    Their mother understands, though. “Send Ser Rolph away. At once.”

    Can’t wait for this episode. Glad to hear they included the sewing.

  13. Lin Beifunk
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:50 pm | Permalink

    I dunno — from my personal POV, if I was a major house, I’d send at least one delegate to a fellow major house/major vassal wedding. Yes, yes, war and whatever, but guests are always safe under another’s roof…;)

    It also would give viewers a certain appropriately red fish re: who’s actually behind the Red Wedding. “Oh my god everyone,” says the casual viewer, “there was a LANNISTER THERE and we all know what THEY’RE LIKE.”

    Of course, we could be looking at a random blonde guy, and McDoodils saw wrong. Who knows.

  14. The mighty hodor
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:52 pm | Permalink

    It’s going to test the non book fans for sure,

    I think we need to stop talking about rw, before we ruin it for people who no clue what’s coming!

  15. Nezzer
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 10:59 pm | Permalink

    So the head-swap is in *_* Man, I just can’t wait for this season!!! This is going to be beautiful!! Wish I could be a Mormont and hibernate until March :(

    The mighty hodor:
    It’s going to test the non book fans for sure,

    I think we need to stop talking about rw, before we ruin it for people who no clue what’s coming!

    I believe thousands of non-readers have already being spoiled because of those FUCKERS that keep spoiling it everywhere, especially on YouTube. Thankfully, the majority is still unspoiled.

  16. Nezzer
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 11:01 pm | Permalink

    Aemon:
    Anyone know if David Bradley (Walder Frey) is confirmed to be returning?

    An extra said he/she met him on stage.

  17. Aemon
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 11:10 pm | Permalink

    Thanks for the news about David Bradley. How about Peter Vaughan (Aemon)?

  18. House Snow
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 11:10 pm | Permalink

    I think you guys should edit the post a little bit. Even calling the even notorious is pretty spoilierish

  19. Nezzer
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 11:12 pm | Permalink

    Aemon:
    Thanks for the news about David Bradley. How about Peter Vaughan (Aemon)?

    I don’t think we’ll see Aemon next season since it’ll have very few scenes at Castle Black. Even on season 1 he wasn’t a common sight. So I think Aemon and Peter Vaughan only on season 4.

  20. Ours is the Fury
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 11:22 pm | Permalink

    House Snow,

    Nowhere in the post up top does it say anything at all about the event. An event exists. That is not a spoiler.

  21. thisone
    Posted October 15, 2012 at 11:37 pm | Permalink

    People who actively search/browse the web for info about GoT probably know about events like the RW. Spoilers are everywhere, especially in the comments section of Youtube.

    And I don’t believe the spoiler tags on this site make any difference (for those who read the comments). People tend to be able to read between the lines — literally and figuratively.

  22. G_Lee
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:12 am | Permalink

    I’m gonna cry so hard haha. Seeing Richards head switched with Grey Wind is going to kill me. Didnt believe they would do that.

  23. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:33 am | Permalink

    A time of mourning…..soon.

  24. Joshua Taylor
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:34 am | Permalink

    Ours is the Fury,

    Thank you for the David Bradley confirmation Ours! It seems ridiculous but it I had to know for sure.

  25. Be
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:54 am | Permalink

    Ok, on the David Bradley confirmation.

    I was a bit worried he wasn’t going to make it or be replaced. Red Wedding is going to be nuts.

  26. Ren Snow
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:15 am | Permalink

    Too bad we won’t see the Greatjon biting off ears…

    I do hope we get to see Lame Lothar Frey, Jinglebell and Walder Rivers

  27. Ash
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:17 am | Permalink

    Maybe they go in a different direction and robb and walder have a dance off? American pie 3 style!!

  28. Tom O' Sevens
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:28 am | Permalink

    Really surprised we are going to see the head swap! Also excited about seeing Cat’s death. A lot of non reader viewers/reviewers dnt like her but even that will be a wtf moment for them :)

  29. Isabelle
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:39 am | Permalink

    G_Lee,

    Seriously. Switching the heads was so grisly and so senselessly over-the-top brutal…so of course they’re going to include it, but it’s going to be tough to watch/comprehend. The moment Tyrion recalled it in the book was the moment, for me at least, that cemented how truly horrible/malicious the event was.

  30. Isabelle
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:57 am | Permalink

    Tom O’ Sevens:
    A lot of non reader viewers/reviewers dnt like [Catelyn] but even that will be a wtf moment for them :)

    Yeah…however much I may have disliked her behaviour towards Jon or rashness in making decisions, if I hadn’t felt for her during the RW, I’d have thought myself made of stone (no pun intended). If the scene plays out with half the intensity and emotion of the chapter in canon, it will definitely be difficult not to be genuinely moved by her grief.

  31. Johan Sporre
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:40 am | Permalink

    I’m actually kind of looking forward to seeing the event, mainly because I can’t wait to see the reactions it brings, and partly because I don’t care for show!Robb that much since last season.

    If the actors do something special it might be another Ned-situation though, where I’m surprisingly moved by a death I’ve been expecting for some time.

  32. Arkash
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 3:27 am | Permalink

    I’m fearing the RW will all take place in the open… that the battle between Freys and Northmen will take place in the same spot where Robb will be killed.

    That saddens me… the vision of the RW in the Frey’s hall is more appealing than in the open.

  33. mummer
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 3:50 am | Permalink

    Arkash:
    I’m fearing the RW will all take place in the open… that the battle between Freys and Northmen will take place in the same spot where Robb will be killed.

    That saddens me… the vision of the RW in the Frey’s hall is more appealing than in the open.

    Why would you fear or be saddened by something that no one’s given you any reason to think will happen?

  34. Macha
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 3:53 am | Permalink

    Surprising as it may sound, a part of me didn’t think they’d show the bit with Grey Wind’s head. I’m glad (in a twisted way) that they’re not holding their punches but…this is really gut-wrenching.

  35. Ross
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 4:28 am | Permalink

    Macha: Surprising as it may sound, a part of me didn’t think they’d show the bit with Grey Wind’s head. I’m glad (in a twisted way) that they’re not holding their punches but…this is really gut-wrenching.

    I wasn’t sure they would either, whether for budgetary or sensitivity reasons or whatever. But I am glad it is in. Even though it only gets talked about third-hand in the books, it’s probably the image that disturbed me and stayed with me the most. So brutal.

  36. Carcinogen
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 5:06 am | Permalink

    Well… fuck.

  37. Michael
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 6:03 am | Permalink

    I’ve got the feeling that this will be the event that either makes or breaks the tv series. If the viewers react well to the Red Wedding like they did to Ned’s death, I think the future of the tv series will be guaranteed for many years to come (even through the slow and relatively uneventful period that is AFfC and the first part of ADwD). However, if the viewers react badly to it (ie they are so upset that they rage-quit the series), then the tv series might be screwed.

  38. garyd
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 6:04 am | Permalink

    I am really excited about watching the red wedding, without a doubt it is the one event in ‘ A song of ice and fire’ that moved me the most. (Actually nothing I have ever read in any book series affected me emotionally like reading the red wedding did. I had to re-read the entire chapter straight away to take it all in.) My only dissapointment is that the ‘Great Jhon’ will not be in the scene. The ‘ Great Jhon’ is my favourite minor character from the books, and was my favourite minor character from the first season. Hopefully they might cast the ‘ Small Jhon’ for the red wedding

  39. Ross
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 6:24 am | Permalink

    Hang on a sec…

    What confirmed the “Red Wedding” for me was Mr Higgins revealing that [Imagine the Irish accent] “A massacre took place last night” and “major characters got their heads removed and sowed onto an ox.” I will admit I did laugh out loud at this point, obviously I explained what I thought it was.

    This sounds like they sew Robb’s head to Greywind’s body – that never happened did it? Wasn’t it just Greywind’s head onto Robb’s body?

  40. aimlessgun
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 6:37 am | Permalink

    garyd:
    I am really excited about watching the red wedding, without a doubt it is the one event in ‘ Asong of ice and fire’ that moved me the most.

    Yeah, it affected me the most out of any event in the moment as it happened. However looking back on the books, the most emotional thing in book 3 is definitely Jaime freeing Tyrion, the killing of Shae and Tywin, and then Tyrion telling Jaime that he killed his son.
    And I have to wait until season 4 for that :(((

  41. Arkash
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 6:49 am | Permalink

    Ross,

    Maybe they will have both : Robb’s head on GW and GW’s head on Robb.

  42. Conor
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 7:14 am | Permalink

    Michael:
    I’ve got the feeling that this will be the event that either makes or breaks the tv series. If the viewers react well to the Red Wedding like they did to Ned’s death, I think the future of the tv series will be guaranteed for many years to come (even through the slow and relatively uneventful period that is AFfC and the first part of ADwD). However, if the viewers react badly to it (ie they are so upset that they rage-quit the series), then the tv series might be screwed.

    I don’t really understand how people can just decide to quit a series or book, obviously it happens but I can’t understand it. When a major event like the RW happens, I will be shocked and saddened BUT I always want to know what happens next. “How are they going to avenge him, what’s going to happen now that he’s gone “etc… How people aren’t more interested or at least curious to know what happens, I will never know.

    As long as the writing and production remains at the top quality it is at the moment hopefully people will stay with this show.

  43. Tyrion4Lyfe
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 7:36 am | Permalink

    G_Lee:
    I’m gonna cry so hard haha. Seeing Richards head switched with Grey Wind is going to kill me. Didnt believe they would do that.

    I would have been pissed off if they didn’t considering this is what Dan and Dave have been working towards all along…

  44. sareeta
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 7:39 am | Permalink

    Not that I’m looking forward to it, since it is a really upsetting event (more traumatizing than Ned’s execution), but I am glad they aren’t delaying it. Considering the series will likely get 6 or 7 seasons, tops, I am glad that they are moving things right along and following along with at least one book per season.

    I just hope book readers don’t spoil it for non-readers.

  45. David the Grey
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:04 am | Permalink

    I’ve read SoS twice, and don’t recall the switching of the heads! Either I am losing my memory, or I was so in shock that all of the details escaped me. I do recall being horrififed that both Starks were killed (not just one, but BOTH!) and then of course being thrilled (and scared) that one returns! What a roller-coaster of surprises! I’m going to start the series again soon for the 3rd time, hopefully to be freshened up for Season 3. These scenes are going to be amazing on screen, and I really look forward to the non book-reader’s reactions. You can imagine Twitter is going to explode for real this season.

  46. Winter Is Coming
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:08 am | Permalink

    Added some additional info to the post, the Red Wedding will take place in episode 9 of season 3 and will be directed by David Nutter.

  47. Aegon the Conqueror
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:16 am | Permalink

    So the trend continues with the huge moment of the season taking place in episode 9. Mayhaps season 4 episode 9 will be the Mountain and Red Viper duel.

  48. Winter Is Coming
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:23 am | Permalink

    Aegon the Conqueror:
    So the trend continues with the huge moment of the season taking place in episode 9. Mayhaps season 4 episode 9 will be the Mountain and Red Viper duel.

    My guess is it will be the battle at the Wall, when Stannis comes and saves the day.

    That would actually be kinda funny as it creates a bit of pattern:

    S1E9: Major character death
    S2E9: Major battle
    S3E9: Major character death(s)
    S4E9: Major battle

  49. sgeureka
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:25 am | Permalink

    Conor: How people aren’t more interested or at least curious to know what happens, I will never know.

    speaking for myself, when terrible fictional events happen, it may take me out of the fictional universe and make me extremely mad at the author/writers/producers on a meta-level. So I may stop reading/watching because (1) I can no longer enjoy the story from an in-universe perspective since the creative person’s existence is always at the back of my mind, and (2) I want to punish these people for hurting my feelings.

    This didn’t happen to me with GRRM’s books though, and I hope this doesn’t happen for the majority of viewers with season 3.

  50. Ross
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:29 am | Permalink

    Winter Is Coming:
    Added some additional info to the post, the Red Wedding will take place in episode 9 of season 3 and will be directed by David Nutter.

    Interesting thanks – I guess not surprising, based on the chronology, the trend for episode 9 dramatics, and the genuine need, I think, for an episode post-RW for non-readers to come to terms with what has occurred (e.g. did that ACTUALLY happen?!)

    As for David Nutter, seems a good choice – Old Gods and the New was one of the standouts last year. I see on IMDB he has been given episode 10 to direct as well.

  51. Arkash
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:31 am | Permalink

    I dont like the fact that it is ep9 again… people will be expecting something to happen in it, while none of us, book readers expected it… it was in the middle of the book, with lots of planning for future events….
    Putting it in 9 will destroy some of the surprise, imo…

    And I really hope the landowner was wrong… GW’s head is supposed to be sown onto Robb’s, not the other way round ! ^^

  52. Duff Man
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:33 am | Permalink

    Ross,

    Yeah they never said anything about sewing Robb’s head to Greywinds body only GW’s head being sewed on to Robb’s.

    I wasn’t sure that they would show this part on TV, but I’m glad they are including it.

    I was also kind of hoping they would save the RW for episode 10 instead of 9, just so people don’t start to expect all “major” events to happen in episode 9 every season. I guess season 4 will help change that a bit as the PW will be early in the year.

    One more thing with the RW being in episode 9 I’m hoping that doesn’t mean we get Stoneheart in episode 10. Have to let that event sink in for a while.

  53. Ours is the Fury
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:35 am | Permalink

    I assume they did both. Another extra mentioned that there was a dummy of Richard Madden on set last week, so they probably swapped both heads.
    I don’t think it being in ep 9 is a problem. On most the shows, the major climaxes to a season usually happen in the last or the second-to-last episode of the season. GoT isn’t unique in that regard.

  54. Cricky
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:40 am | Permalink

    I was on set yesterday for the ‘not so red’ part of the wedding. Wish I was there for the action later this week :(

  55. Ross
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:42 am | Permalink

    Ours is the Fury: I don’t think it being in ep 9 is a problem. On most the shows, the major climaxes to a season usually happen in the last or the second-to-last episode of the season. GoT isn’t unique in that regard.

    That is true and I agree but I guess the point people are making is that it becomes a bit predictable – which is the opposite of GRRM’s books. The whole power of the big moments in the books is that they happen so arbitrarily, as opposed to the climax to a crescendo.

    BUT I can’t see how else they could do it – there’s too much to tell beforehand for it to be before episode 9 and I do think you need that episode afterwards to help people process it. They could have left it until season 4 I suppose, but I think they’ve made the right decision.

  56. MyBFFTheHound
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:55 am | Permalink

    So, the 26th of May it is then. (Assuming no breaks in the schedule.)

  57. Anon
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:58 am | Permalink

    Really hope they leave Lady Stoneheart out until S4. I think it’ll lose too much of it’s impact if they shove her in at the end of s3, it would be preferable to have it saved to the end of s4 and be one of the climatic events of that.

    I wonder if they will bump Talisa off at the RW too? Though sometimes I half suspect that she will turn out to have some connection to the Lannisters and her Volantine back-story will be just a cover.

  58. Klavonivs
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 9:03 am | Permalink

    It will be sooooo refreshing not having to type “RW” after episode 9 airs…..:)

  59. Khaleesi In Training
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 9:09 am | Permalink

    I think that the non-book readers will hang in there. I think that the episodes will be done well enough to hook people into wanting to come back to see what happens next. It was after Ned’s death in S1 that I started reading the books because I couldn’t wait a year to learn what happened next.

  60. Ours is the Fury
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 9:35 am | Permalink

    Some more photos from the Essaouira filming, from a distance. You can see the port, the fort walls, some cages, and a bit more. The black-clad soldiers are visible in the first photo, in formation. I’d be surprised if they weren’t the Unsullied, at this rate.

    http://wicnet.tumblr.com/post/33706386180/more-photos-of-the-essaouira-morocco-filming-from

  61. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:02 am | Permalink

    Khaleesi In Training:
    I think that the non-book readers will hang in there.I think that the episodes will be done well enough to hook people into wanting to come back to see what happens next.It was after Ned’s death in S1 that I started reading the books because I couldn’t wait a year to learn what happened next.

    I’m not going to spoiler tag anything through ASOS below, b/c if you’ve read this far.

    There’s simply no way that there is going to be a huge rage quit issue, in my opinion, for the following reasons:

    1) Most non-book readers don’t care as much as Catelyn and Robb as readers did. Ignore any changes to the characters for the moment; we simply haven’t spent as much time with them as you can in a book. That sense of attachment is not there. If this were Arya, the story would be different. But it’s not.

    2) Most non-book readers I know will think Robb and Catelyn deserve it. Everyone I know constantly refers to their bad choices. This is somewhat true in the book, but it is more pronounced in the show.

    3) The type of viewer of Game of Thrones that didn’t come from fantasy is different from the fantasy reader. Most fantasy readers aren’t used to their heroes dying unheroically and early. The TV watchers who are watching this are the same people watching Breaking Bad or Mad Men or Homeland, in many cases. They LIKE lead characters dying. It makes the show for them.

    4) Everyone’s been spoiled. “No one is safe.” “It’s so shocking.” “I’ve been waiting three years to see this.” They may not know what, but they know when.

  62. Jen@House Stark
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:13 am | Permalink

    Andrew:
    This makes me sad :(

    Talk about spoilers, oh my Godswood.

  63. Joshua Taylor
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:14 am | Permalink

    Ross,

    An X Files veteran for the RW? Awesome! If he brings the same tension that he brought to “Ice” than it will be perfect.

  64. sunspear
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:23 am | Permalink

    Winter Is Coming,

    I don’t think so. They’ll have a hard time stretching out the remains of ASOS beyond episode 5, unless they include a ton of filler. I was thinking the Kingsmoot or Slynt’s execution.

    Arkash,

    I was thinking, if they play up the fact that Arya is supposed to marry one of the Frey’s, they could use her arrival as a way to misdirect the audience into thinking something will happen with her.

  65. Isabella
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:41 am | Permalink

    sunspear,

    “I was thinking, if they play up the fact that Arya is supposed to marry one of the Frey’s, they could use her arrival as a way to misdirect the audience into thinking something will happen with her.”

    Another possible misdirection: My non-reader friend is convinced that the Frey girl who Robb was supposed to marry will turn out to be really beautiful and there will be some kind of love triangle. I think they could suggest that in previews…..

  66. Conor
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:45 am | Permalink

    Ooh I’m so ready! Why does it have to be so far away?!?!
    *Spoiler pic* http://i50.tinypic.com/za99z.png

  67. The Kingshaver
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:53 am | Permalink

    They should get a George Bush head and staple it onto an ox. Just for for shits and giggles.

  68. Cary Storm
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:55 am | Permalink

    Anon,

    I’ve got a strong feeling that Talisa is going to turn out to be connected to the Lannisters as well. Especially since we don’t have the betrayal of the Westerlings to contend with. I have a offhand side bet that Talisa might also take over the Lady Taena character’s role as well, in S4 and S5.

  69. KatieJo
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:57 am | Permalink

    “A massacre took place last night” and “major characters got their heads removed and sowed onto an ox.”

    D: WHY GEORGE. WHY.

    I am both terrified and excited to see the reactions to this episode once it airs. I think there will be several support groups that come out of it.

  70. hinka
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:00 am | Permalink

    Alan,

    Your are right I guess… most people aren’t so much attached to robb and cat… but i wasn’t it in the book and i still was shocked.
    And there is one thing you forget… there are 8 episodes to focus on robb and cat in season 3!

  71. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:12 am | Permalink

    sunspear:
    Winter Is Coming,

    I don’t think so. They’ll have a hard time stretching out the remains of ASOS beyond episode 5, unless they include a ton of filler. I was thinking the Kingsmoot or Slynt’s execution.

    While I don’t know that Winter’s idea of delaying the second battle with the Wildlings until Episode 9 works (there’s still a lot of Jon’s storyline there to be told), I’m not sure why anyone would think there’s some lack of plot to be had in the second half of Storm.

    While some of the plotlines are thin (Bran — but he’s always thin) and some are of just medium amount (Arya, who has some great interaction with the Hound, but there’s only three or four major book plot points), some are so incredibly full.

    Depending on where they end, Jon has a battle, then another battle, then is taken as a traitor, sent to treat and betray Mance Rayder as a sacrificial assassin, and then there’s a THIRD battle when Stannis comes to save the day. Then he’s got to be vindicated and eventually raised as LC.

    In KL, you need the PW, the introduction of Oberyn, Jaime returning home and his interaction with Tywin, Cersei and Tyrion, the trial of Tyrion, Oberyn versus the Mountain, Sansa’s plotting and escape, Tyrion’s murders and escape, Varys being Varys and Littlefinger being Littlefinger. Not to mention Sansa, Lysa and LF in the Vale once they leave.

    I’m not sure how they are going to play Dany, but I expect there to be another city to conquer — I don’t see any reason for them to combine everything into one.

    Plus, don’t forget that in Season 4, we probably get Theon we don’t get in the books, perhaps Rickon and Osha check-ins, Brienne and Stannis check-ins that aren’t in the books as well as getting some of the Kingsmoot or Dorne, I suspect.

    In other words, there’s no way they run out of plot. There’s so much plot.

    I have no idea why people have this incredible need to rush through it. None of this even accounts for those character moments/the little things that aren’t major plot points.

  72. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:19 am | Permalink

    hinka:
    Alan,

    Your are right I guess… most people aren’t so much attached to robb and cat… but i wasn’t it in the book and i still was shocked.
    And there is one thing you forget… there are 8 episodes to focus on robb and cat in season 3!

    That’s true. I hope they spend time building Robb up both as likeable and kicking some Lannister butt. Get our hopes up.

    I am not as annoyed by Talisa as many, but I sincerely hope they don’t have her in on it and I hope they kill her off in the RW. The whole Jeyne possible sideplot doesn’t seem important enough to care about and I’d rather they parse here than elsewhere.

  73. Zack
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:28 am | Permalink

    Alan,

    Yeah. I’m of the opinion that getting as much time spent in the world as possible is only a good thing. I don’t really think methodical pacing is a problem because there is so much material to mine and I don’t need huge plot advancements if I just get to hang out with the characters, world and lore. There will be plenty to do for season 4.

  74. Caro H
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:30 am | Permalink

    I feel like crying!! They will have Robb’s head sewn into grey wind’s!! :( oh excited but sad! And then episode 10 will have everyone learning about it. If they have joff being the first to tell Sansa I am going to cry even more… This is random but I think it would be interesting to seef’s reaction to Cat’s death

  75. Quowala
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:37 am | Permalink

    I’m in a strange state of “I can’t wait!!!!!” and “Noooo! I’m dreading it!”

    So… Baelor… Blackwater…

    What will the RW episode be called?

  76. Direhound
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:39 am | Permalink

    Has there been any more speculation on Tom Brooke’s Role? http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Tom_Brooke
    I think a Jinglebells would be a good fit. I can’t see another way for the RW to end appropriately without that sort of cruel hostage setup.

  77. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:45 am | Permalink

    I was not a fan of Catelyn and I didn’t really have a huge connection with Robb in the books. And yet the RW still hit me like a sack of bricks. This will be by far the most emotional, jaw dropping scene in the series. I’m really looking forward to the reaction of non-readers. I’m expecting most to be more shocked by Cat’s murder than Robb’s. The challenge will be making it a surprise in the show, because honestly, it is tougher to do on screen. When re-reading the third book it is clear there are signs of the impending doom. Almost to the point where I kick myself for not expecting it while reading the first time.

  78. rear me roar
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:51 am | Permalink

    David the Grey,

    they put the wolf head in Robb and they through Cat in the river because she was a Tully but i think that is in book four that the switch was mentioned, excuse my bad English =)

  79. Serena
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 11:53 am | Permalink

    Alan: I’m not going to spoiler tag anything through ASOS below, b/c if you’ve read this far.

    There’s simply no way that there is going to be a huge rage quit issue, in my opinion, for the following reasons:

    1)Most non-book readers don’t care as much as Catelyn and Robb as readers did.Ignore any changes to the characters for the moment; we simply haven’t spent as much time with them as you can in a book.That sense of attachment is not there.If this were Arya, the story would be different.But it’s not.

    2)Most non-book readers I know will think Robb and Catelyn deserve it.Everyone I know constantly refers to their bad choices.This is somewhat true in the book, but it is more pronounced in the show.

    3)The type of viewer of Game of Thrones that didn’t come from fantasy is different from the fantasy reader.Most fantasy readers aren’t used to their heroes dying unheroically and early.The TV watchers who are watching this are the same people watching Breaking Bad or Mad Men or Homeland, in many cases.They LIKE lead characters dying.It makes the show for them.

    4)Everyone’s been spoiled.“No one is safe.”“It’s so shocking.”“I’ve been waiting three years to see this.”They may not know what, but they know when.

    1) I don’t agree. I am very much attached to Robb since Season 1.
    2) NO!! No one deserves to be betrayed and murdered. Why people are always blaming the victim!?!?

    After watching the first season, I was searching the internet for news and so. I found this fanart: http://www.fanpop.com/spots/a-song-of-ice-and-fire/images/3471560/title/rob-dead-photo
    I was shocked and nearly cried.

    Then I started reading the books and was looking forward to read more about Robb. But he didn’t show up much. Book!Robb is acutally boring. When I read the RW I was crying so bad, because I pictured Richard Madden the whole time. I think people care more about Robb from the TV series, but thats just my opinion.

    PS: Sorry for my english, I usually speak german.

  80. Joshua Taylor
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:07 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    Not to mention that both women characters share the same initials!

  81. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:08 pm | Permalink

    Serena: 1) I don’t agree. I am very much attached to Robb since Season 1.
    2) NO!! No one deserves to be betrayed and murdered. Why people are always blaming the victim!?!?

    After watching the first season, I was searching the internet for news and so. I found this fanart: http://www.fanpop.com/spots/a-song-of-ice-and-fire/images/3471560/title/rob-dead-photo
    I was shocked and nearly cried.

    Then I started reading the books and was looking forward to read more about Robb. But he didn’t show up much. Book!Robb is acutally boring. When I read the RW I was crying so bad, because I pictured Richard Madden the whole time.I think people care more about Robb from the TV series, but thats just my opinion.

    PS: Sorry for my english, I usually speak german.

    Your English is fine!

    It’s not that I don’t think people will be affected; it’s that I think the chances of people no longer watching because of it are incredibly low.

    I do think people are fundamentally less attached to the characters in the show, and while I may have underestimated the lure of Richard Madden, I think Kit Harrington’s flowing locks will get the ladies by. :)

    As for blaming the victim, there’s going to be a lot of that. Catelyn, Robb (and Ned) made a lot of mistakes. People are going to see this coming to a certain extent. And a lot of them aren’t going to be especially broken up over losing Bad Idea Catelyn.

  82. Catherine Henry-Greskovic
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:13 pm | Permalink

    I may have to watch that episode alone. I know I’m going to bawl my eyes out and my husband will think I’ve lost my mind!

  83. Lin Beifunk
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:15 pm | Permalink

    Hey, admins, and/or anyone who had been paying attention: do we have official confirmation that Hannah Murray is back as Gilly this season? She’s the titular character of (one of three) hour long Skins reunion film(s), and read-throughs are being done this week.

    Wasn’t Craster’s up in Iceland, or did they film those scenes in a more temperate climate? If in Iceland — aren’t they postponing those shots until December or something? If so, er…I guess she can do both at once, but…

    I also might be misinformed. Not about the Skins stuff, but about the GoT stuff.

  84. KG
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:17 pm | Permalink

    Macha,

    I am on the record several times about not caring about changes between book and TV, but I must admit that leaving that out would have bummed me out.

  85. pntrlqst
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:20 pm | Permalink

    I don’t see the point of bringing in a new director who is better than anyone on the show (Maclaren) and not giving her the best scene to direct. Baffling.

  86. Ours is the Fury
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:24 pm | Permalink

    Lin Beifunk: do we have official confirmation that Hannah Murray is back as Gilly this season?

    Hannah Murray seen in Belfast with other actors at the hotel, so she is back as Gilly. Craster’s Keep is filmed in the Belfast area, not in Iceland.

  87. Serena
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:27 pm | Permalink

    Alan: Your English is fine!

    It’s not that I don’t think people will be affected; it’s that I think the chances of people no longer watching because of it are incredibly low.

    I do think people are fundamentally less attached to the characters in the show, and while I may have underestimated the lure of Richard Madden, I think Kit Harrington’s flowing locks will get the ladies by.:)

    As for blaming the victim, there’s going to be a lot of that.Catelyn, Robb (and Ned) made a lot of mistakes.People are going to see this coming to a certain extent.And a lot of them aren’t going to be especially broken up over losing Bad Idea Catelyn.

    Thanks! Thats because I watch my favorite series in english. The german syncronisation is often very bad (not always, but in the case of GoT very bad, they translate the names: Jon Schnee and Königsmund are the worst).

    I get your point. I didnt stopped reading the books, altough I was very pissed. There are many other great characters left.

    Ja, but I really hate it, when people do that! Do they also read about crimes in the newspaper and assume, that the victims get killed, raped or something because they made bad decisions or did something else wrong. My point is: Its is never the fault of the victim. Nothing justifies violence.

  88. Anon
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:29 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    I wonder if she end up being in on it or if it will be that she is a Westerling and has just been hiding her identity (but it was still a love match).

  89. Winter Is Coming
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:29 pm | Permalink

    pntrlqst:
    I don’t see the point of bringing in a new director who is better than anyone on the show (Maclaren) and not giving her the best scene to direct. Baffling.

    It may have had something to do with scheduling. Maclaren is a very busy director. And I think Nutter will do a good job with the scene. Don’t forget he directed the “Theon seizes Winterfell and executes Ser Rodrik” scene, which was a fantastically well-acted and emotionally-charged scene.

  90. HugeFloppyGut
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:32 pm | Permalink

    hinka:
    Alan,

    Your are right I guess… most people aren’t so much attached to robb and cat… but i wasn’t it in the book and i still was shocked.
    And there is one thing you forget… there are 8 episodes to focus on robb and cat in season 3!

    I was attached to Robb..i was rooting so hard for him to get revenge for his father and try to return all of his family to saftey

  91. Anon
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:32 pm | Permalink

    Lin Beifunk,

    Hannah Murray is back.

    I think Craster’s stuff filmed in N.I, it was stuff beyond that which was filmed in Iceland

  92. Bannerless Bro
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:33 pm | Permalink

    Arkash,

    There is actually a “battle” (more like massacre) scene described in the Arya chapter. They are filming that.

  93. MyBFFTheHound
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:34 pm | Permalink

    pntrlqst:
    I don’t see the point of bringing in a new director who is better than anyone on the show (Maclaren) and not giving her the best scene to direct. Baffling.

    This puzzles me as well!

  94. Mimsy
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:38 pm | Permalink

    The head swap is an ultimate mocking of House Stark and to do it to sweet, curly haired Rob is infuriating! About as infuriating as the Starks not listening to their direwolves! I’m looking at you JON!

    This series better end with the remaining Starks cleaning everyone’s clock!!!

  95. HouseLark
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:43 pm | Permalink

    Got to admit, I was hoping they would skip over the whole head swap thing, it’s a terrible enough image in my head, I’m not sure I need to see it on screen. Still, I can’t wait for next season knowing for certain that we will be getting the RW. I wonder where S4 will end now, my guess is the death of Tywin which may be the most satisfactory endpoint, well maybe not as satisfying as Joffrey’s death but I doubt the producers will want ASOS running into three seasons in which case the PW and Tywin on the toilet will both have to be next season.

  96. Nezzer
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 12:55 pm | Permalink

    Conor:
    Ooh I’m so ready! Why does it have to be so far away?!?!
    *Spoiler pic* http://i50.tinypic.com/za99z.png

    The best depiction of Lady Stoneheart I’ve seen. Can’t wait to see Michelle Farley like that :D

  97. Macha
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:05 pm | Permalink

    KG:
    Macha,

    I am on the record several times about not caring about changes between book and TV, but I must admit that leaving that out would have bummed me out.

    Oh, I’m pretty attached to certain moments as well, I understand. Don’t get me wrong, I think it’s great they decided to go all hardcore. Don’t know why I felt they might shy away from it. I’m glad they didn’t. It’s such a strong image that really stays with you.

  98. KG
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:10 pm | Permalink

    And of all the names they’ve given the uh … returned character, I always liked Mother Merciless best.

  99. Khaleesi In Training
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:11 pm | Permalink

    Alan:
    3)The type of viewer of Game of Thrones that didn’t come from fantasy is different from the fantasy reader.Most fantasy readers aren’t used to their heroes dying unheroically and early.The TV watchers who are watching this are the same people watching Breaking Bad or Mad Men or Homeland, in many cases.They LIKE lead characters dying.It makes the show for them.

    This is an interesting point that I hadn’t thought about before. You know it’s a great story when it can be so polarizing with different audiences.

  100. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:18 pm | Permalink

    Alan: That’s true.I hope they spend time building Robb up both as likeable and kicking some Lannister butt.Get our hopes up.

    I am not as annoyed by Talisa as many, but I sincerely hope they don’t have her in on it and I hope they kill her off in the RW.The whole Jeyne possible sideplot doesn’t seem important enough to care about and I’d rather they parse here than elsewhere.

    Well said, I agree with your points here….

  101. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:22 pm | Permalink

    Ours is the Fury:
    Some more photos from the Essaouira filming, from a distance. You can see the port, the fort walls, some cages, and a bit more. The black-clad soldiers are visible in the first photo, in formation. I’d be surprised if they weren’t the Unsullied, at this rate.

    http://wicnet.tumblr.com/post/33706386180/more-photos-of-the-essaouira-morocco-filming-from

    Thanks for these.

  102. Imp_Slap!
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:24 pm | Permalink

    Klavonivs,

    “It will be sooooo refreshing not having to type “RW” after episode 9 airs…..:)”

    Actually I still plan on doing that. You know for sake of brevity.

  103. Winterdark
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:26 pm | Permalink

    Funny it appears in ep9. I made two breakdowns for season 3. One, the more fast paced version had the RW in ep8 and the PW in ep 10. The other, the one I eventually went with had the RW as the season closer. So neither of them had it in ep9. At least I had the BoB right last season (more or less I spread it out over eps 8, 9 and 10 intercutting it with other events)

  104. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:28 pm | Permalink

    Catherine Henry-Greskovic:
    I may have to watch that episode alone.I know I’m going to bawl my eyes out and my husband will think I’ve lost my mind!

    I can relate to your feelings here, just after reading the passages associated with
    the RW I was so stunned , I tossed the book across the room. There was a 24 hr
    break before reading resumed.

  105. Turncloak
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:38 pm | Permalink

    RW is episode 9 like I said :p

  106. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:41 pm | Permalink

    pntrlqst:
    I don’t see the point of bringing in a new director who is better than anyone on the show (Maclaren) and not giving her the best scene to direct. Baffling.

    Is it really baffling? McLaren is an amazing director and I had hoped she’d get the scene in question. But Nutter is hardly chopped liver. And even if you get past scheduling (McLaren is currently working on the last eight episodes of BB at minimum), there’s the question of her being an unknown.

    Not her talent, but her ability to capture the tone and style of GOT, as well as interact with the actors and crew, on a project she hasn’t been involved with for three years. McLaren is a writer and producer or BB, and if D&D are paranoid about this scene, perhaps they preferred a known quantity?

    (Yes, I know Neil Marshall worked out great.)

    I can understand disappointment, but when people use words like bafflement, I can’t tell if you really couldn’t think of any good reason she’s not doing it or you are just defaulting to the standard critical position of “the people who are running this thing are idiots.”

  107. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:47 pm | Permalink

    My consideration for Catelyn Tully-Stark included much admiration, including
    her son Robb. The author portrayed her as a respected and wise daughter, wife
    and mother. She was not infallible however, a reasonable expectation since
    GRRM balanced her strengths against her weaknesses. Given the political
    period and role of most women, she proved her devotion to her family and
    wise counsel to her eldest son during an significant political upheaval.
    Compared with most women of her stature, she surpassed them in that
    knowledge and principle. I do not dismiss her distain and ill treatment of Jon,
    in fact it was incomprehensible. To me, that was her largest error in judgement.
    Her compassion and values excelled, except for her unwillingness to demonstrate
    love to a motherless boy. I agree with GRRM as he commented recently, that
    Catelyn was strongest female in ASOIAF.

  108. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:49 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    Good call.

  109. sunspear
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:51 pm | Permalink

    Alan,

    It isn’t the lack of plot that’s the problem, it’s the lack of content. After the Red Wedding, there are only 400 pages left in ASOS (paperback). That’s half what they had to make season 1. There simply isn’t enough stuff to go beyond episode five without either putting in a bunch of filler or starting in on AFFC and ADWD.

  110. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:51 pm | Permalink

    Khaleesi In Training: This is an interesting point that I hadn’t thought about before.You know it’s a great story when it can be so polarizing with different audiences.

    Yep. One of the things I notice when I post here, or read Westeros, or boiled leather, or TWOP, and then talk to my friends… I suddenly realize how differently we all watch/read the series.

    There’s a huge range of what we all care about — characters, backstory, prophecy, riddles, grittiness, violence, sex, humor, shock value, etc. And I’m as guilty as any at focusing in on what I like in particular.

    It’s why I tend to give D&D a pass at times. The story is so very vast — not only in plot and characters, but in themes and even elements. You could take ten hours filled with the exposition of Robert’s Rebellion or the Blackfyres. And a lot of people understandably want that. But they have to make a decision on what the TV show is ABOUT. And that needs to be a smaller scope for even 80 or 90 hours of television than 10,000 pages will be. Forget budget, just think about comprehension and attention spans.

    To complain about costuming or the lack of a particular vision when I got Baelor and Blackwater and an awesome Arya waterdancing with Syrio and a story that has held thematically coherent across so many actors… seems greedy.

  111. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:52 pm | Permalink

    Jen@House Stark: Talk aboutspoilers, oh my Godswood.

    Winter is Coming, indeed.

  112. Ours is the Fury
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 1:56 pm | Permalink

    I wouldn’t necessarily look at it as, Red Wedding is ep 9 and everything after that page in ASoS comes after that episode. We don’t know how they are breaking down the book. There are things from before the Red Wedding that may not be on the show until after the RW, either in S3 or 4. There’s no way to tell.
    We already know they’ve filmed scenes with Theon that aren’t in the book, and I think we’ll see more from Littlefinger than we see in the first half of ASoS. Katie Dickie (Lysa Arryn) filmed already for S3, but we weren’t supposed to see her at the Eyrie until closer to the end of ASoS/S4. So they must’ve added a scene for her. They’re developing aspects and I don’t think they’re going to lack for material.

  113. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:02 pm | Permalink

    sunspear:
    Alan,

    It isn’t the lack of plot that’s the problem, it’s the lack of content. After the Red Wedding, there are only 400 pages left in ASOS (paperback). That’s half what they had to make season 1. There simply isn’t enough stuff to go beyond episode five without either putting in a bunch of filler or starting in on AFFC and ADWD.

    That’s simply not true. Plot is content. I listed out a ton of things that need to happen and for every major plot point scene, there’s a couple of set up scenes needed to drive through.

    Again — Look at Sansa. Sansa herself, in Season 4, will need 2-3 scenes revolving around the escape plotline (10-15 minutes) as well as some interaction with the Tyrells/hairpiece (5-10 minutes). Then there’s the PW itself (10-15 minutes) and the escape (5 minutes), arrival at the Eyrie (5 minutes), some Lysa, LF and Sweetrobin crazy time (10-15 minutes) including the castle, and then goodbye (5 minutes).

    That puts Sansa at 50-70 minutes. Sansa got 45 minutes last year. Even if I’m a bit heavy with the minutes, all the major characters run from just a half-hour to 90 minutes (for Tyrion last year).

    They have some time to let the plotlines breathe, which is good. They aren’t going to run out of content. So very much happens.

  114. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:03 pm | Permalink

    sunspear,

    We have zero idea of how much new stuff they will add. It is also possible that they add AFFC/ADWD material into the second half of season 4 and stretch out the King’s Landing ASOS material by adding new scenes. The producers have talked about no longer going book by book, instead electing to adapt the series as a whole. They will move events forward and back to suit the show.

  115. Delta1212
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:04 pm | Permalink

    Quowala:
    I’m in a strange state of “I can’t wait!!!!!” and “Noooo! I’m dreading it!”

    So… Baelor… Blackwater…

    What will the RW episode be called?

    Bells

  116. Morgan King
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:09 pm | Permalink

    I still think the RW at ep 9 is a mistake – it’s surprise value is a huge part of it’s emotional power, and there are tons of other climaxes at the mid point of aSoS, but I’m sure they will handle it well, as they almost always have.

  117. TheFlayedLady
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:23 pm | Permalink

    The RW :( which means

    The Hound will be dying in a ditch somewhere

    Oh me oh my!

    On the plus side. Ramsay is Coming *fist pumps the air with her flaying blade*

  118. MyBFFTheHound
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:24 pm | Permalink

    Quowala:
    I’m in a strange state of “I can’t wait!!!!!” and “Noooo! I’m dreading it!”

    So… Baelor… Blackwater…

    What will the RW episode be called?

    Bread and Salt.

  119. TheFlayedLady
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:24 pm | Permalink

    Is that comment hidden? FML, I don’t know what I’m doing, so apologies if non-readers can see that :/

  120. Jane
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:27 pm | Permalink

    Forever bitter Umber and Dacey Mormont won’t be appearing.

  121. pntrlqst
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:40 pm | Permalink

    Alan,

    It’s baffling because I’m a spoiled brat who wants it in ep.8 and I usually get what I want. So I’m baffled I didn’t get my way. :p

  122. oierem
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:43 pm | Permalink

    Alan: That’s simply not true.Plot is content.I listed out a ton of things that need to happen and for every major plot point scene, there’s a couple of set up scenes needed to drive through.

    Again — Look at Sansa.Sansa herself, in Season 4, will need 2-3 scenes revolving around the escape plotline (10-15 minutes) as well as some interaction with the Tyrells/hairpiece (5-10 minutes).Then there’s the PW itself (10-15 minutes) and the escape (5 minutes), arrival at the Eyrie (5 minutes), some Lysa, LF and Sweetrobin crazy time (10-15 minutes) including the castle, and then goodbye (5 minutes).

    That puts Sansa at 50-70 minutes.Sansa got 45 minutes last year.Even if I’m a bit heavy with the minutes, all the major characters run from just a half-hour to 90 minutes (for Tyrion last year).

    They have some time to let the plotlines breathe, which is good.They aren’t going to run out of content.So very much happens.

    Then tell me what Bran is going to do in season 4 , please :)

  123. AA
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:52 pm | Permalink

    oierem,

    Season 2 left out all of Jojen and Meera’s backstory from ACOK, so Season 3 might spend a lot of Bran’s plot time filling that in. I suspect we will see the Summer and Jon encounter in Season 3, but the Bran story might not make it much further than that. Season 4 will have him reaching the wall, meeting Sam and eventually meeting Coldhands. All of that can be dragged out over the course of the season, Bran doesn’t need much screen time. And maybe they will go a bit into his travels just beyond the Wall.

    Sorry for the lack of spoiler tags, but I figured this far down in the chat anyone reading has read the books.

  124. Tim
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:57 pm | Permalink

    Andrew,

    Don’t see how that would make sense because Brienne would have to be there and Jamie would be missing his sword hand by that point in the story.

  125. Carne
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 2:59 pm | Permalink
  126. Nezzer
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 3:16 pm | Permalink

    Carne:
    First look at Kraznys?

    Nice costume. Can’t wait to see it on fire :D

  127. Quowala
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 3:23 pm | Permalink

    MyBFFTheHound,

    That’s my favorite suggestion so far. Sounds so mundane. Won’t be at all. Mwa ha ha ha.

  128. Nancy
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 3:39 pm | Permalink

    I agree. I cannot re-read that part in the book. I don’t know if I am going to be able to watch the episode. I think I might cry like a baby. Love the characters and love the actors…hate to lose both :(

    I hope for Lady Stoneheart, Resurrected Jon and Arya to get their revenge on them all
    PS: I wish the set reports for this were kept hush-hush, keep some surprise. Plus, I do know people who stopped watching the show after Ned died. I won’t be surprised if some don’t find this over the top and stop watching. I don’t think it will be enough that the show would have to worry. It’s not like Martin’s book sales plummeted after A Storm of Swords.

  129. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 4:52 pm | Permalink

    Well, it will be a sad episode to watch, we all knew that it would be. TV watchers tend to be MORE attached to Robb, as his story has been expanded on screen and he was not a POV character in the books (all his actions were told 3rd hand). A woman is not surprised that they are doing the “head thing” since, if memory serves, the Freys accused Robb of skinchanging into Grey Wind during the wedding reception as an excuse for the murders. If a woman recalls correctly, the Freys switched the heads to back up their story that Robb was an evil skin changer who wantonly killed while in Grey Wind’s skin, and that this was starting to happen at the reception so they killed him to stop it. This gave them their fake justification to kill their own king, and under their roof during a “guest rite” situation. The Freys would have had to spread that gossip beforehand in order to have the soldiers in the balconies and in the other surrounding rooms “on guard” and prepared to move at the signal given by their commanders. Guest right was serious business back then, and supernatural beings were feared. Brutal though those actions are, there was a rationale for them that has to be used in the show in order to make people understand the intrigue that happened and how they were able to convince people to do those things. Heinous as those acts were and as against the principles/laws of the realm that they were, they would have had to have been convinced to participate since kinglsaying was also a detestable act. Also shows how superstitious a people they still were back in those days, that stories like that could spread, be believed, and lead people to awful acts with thin reasoning behind them. Sort of like the Salem witch hunts stuff, but centuries earlier. Much of the aftermath of the RW was told only in 3rd person also, so it will be interesting to see how these episodes are written.

  130. Lin Beifunk
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 6:07 pm | Permalink

    A (very late but nonetheless) big thanks to everyone who confirmed Hannah Murray’s return. Not a huge character, I know, but she’s such a cute Gilly (and cuter still with Sam) I’d be a little bummed if they had to recast her.

  131. WildSeed
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 6:55 pm | Permalink

    Mrs. H’ghar,

    You said it Mrs H’ghar, this is brutal, but depicted the actions and intent from
    the ASOIAF books. Robb’s story , at some point in ASOS, was voiced by others.
    I had such high hopes for him, but I grieve Greywind ( more ) from that point
    on. There was no coming back from those brutal acts ( for those two especially,
    and the GreatJohn notably ). I’ll conjure up my brave face m’lady, with kleenex
    on the ready. I may just swear at the television though .

  132. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:08 pm | Permalink

    pntrlqst:
    Alan,

    It’s baffling because I’m a spoiled brat who wants it in ep.8 and I usually get what I want. So I’m baffled I didn’t get my way. :p

    Fair enough. I would have loved to see what she did with it as well. :)

  133. Ryan E
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:11 pm | Permalink

    It seems likely that the ASOS Wall plot line will last to the end of Season 4. So much material there, and I expect Season 3 to end with John arriving back at the Wall and the first battle with the Wildlings on the south side of the wall which leaves a season worth of material there for Season 4. I could also see them stretch out the King’s Landing story to that point.

  134. Alan
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:14 pm | Permalink

    oierem: Then tell me what Bran is going to do in season 4 , please :)

    Bran is a problem. He has been from day one of the series. They’ve solved it by barely showing him and having almost nothing happen when they do.

    I expect, like AA, most of Bran’s storyline will involve the Reeds and conversation and a lot of exposition. It will probably end with Queenscrown and I don’t expect to see Coldhands and Sam.

    And in Season 4 and 5 and 6…there’s just not that much. Perhaps there will be story and action added or moved — perhaps Bran will be hunted as he rushes north in a much more specific manner. Perhaps the Nightfort will be drug out. Perhaps they will show much more of the three eyed crow as he goes north. I dunno.

    What I do know is that they aren’t going to rush through EVERYONE else’s storyline to keep Bran’s exciting. They haven’t so far — he’s done very little in two seasons.

    There’s absolutely zero evidence to believe the writers are interested in speeding up the pace, and certainly not to accomodate Bran’s storyline.

  135. Nancy
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 8:53 pm | Permalink

    Very true, Mrs. H’ghar..
    what you said is about the Frey’s rationale for killing Robb is illuminated in Book 5 when Davos has an audience with Wyman Manderly. I just wish the show would have played up the connection between the Starks and their Direwolves, because I think to people who have not read the books, it’s going to be out of left field. But then season 3 could bring warging into focus as well. I think there should be a scene earlier in the season where some of Robb’s men are alarmed by how in tune he and Grey Wind are.

  136. Amsterpaul
    Posted October 16, 2012 at 10:32 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm:
    Anon,

    I’ve got a strong feeling that Talisa is going to turn out to be connected to the Lannisters as well. Especially since we don’t have thebetrayal of the Westerlings to contend with. I have a offhand side bet that Talisa might also take over the Lady Taena character’s role as well, in S4 and S5.

    That is awesome speculation. and very possible.

  137. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 12:46 am | Permalink

    Nancy:
    Very true, Mrs. H’ghar.. what you said is about the Frey’s rationale for killing Robb is illuminated in Book 5 when Davos has an audiencewith Wyman Manderly.I just wish the show would have played up the connection between the Starks and their Direwolves, because I think to people who have not read the books, it’s going to be out of left field.But then season 3 could bring warging into focus as well. I think there should be a scene earlier in the season where some of Robb’s men are alarmed by how in tune he and Grey Wind are.

    This woman is also hoping for more “warg action” in S3 as it seems to be mostly only Bran who’s had any warging scenes thus far. Since Lady is no longer around, wonder if Sansa could warg with a raven?

  138. Mrs. H'ghar
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 12:53 am | Permalink

    WildSeed:
    Mrs. H’ghar,

    You said it Mrs H’ghar, this is brutal, but depicted the actions and intent from
    the ASOIAF books. Robb’s story , at some point in ASOS, was voiced by others.
    I had such high hopes for him, but I grieve Greywind ( more ) from that point
    on. There was no coming back from those brutal acts ( for those two especially,
    and the GreatJohn notably ). I’ll conjure up my brave face m’lady, with kleenex
    on the ready. I may just swear at the television though .

    Well, Wildseed, we will not be the only viewers reaching for a tissue, it is known! But, a well-admired aspect of GRRM’s writing is the fact that he MAKES you care for the characters, and D&D have embraced and sometimes enhanced that aspect in the show. A woman cares more for show-Robb than book-Robb, so the RW will definitely sting. The direwolves look so great when we catch a glimpse of them …’tis sad to see any of them go.

  139. Hinka
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 1:23 am | Permalink

    Best episode name that i could image is (like MyBFFTheHound said):

    Bread and Salt

  140. WildSeed
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 3:52 am | Permalink

    Alan: Bran is a problem. He has been from day one of the series.They’ve solved it by barely showing him and having almost nothing happen when they do.

    I expect, like AA, most of Bran’s storyline will involve the Reeds and conversation and a lot of exposition.It will probably end with Queenscrown and I don’t expect to see Coldhands and Sam.

    And in Season 4 and 5 and 6…there’s just not that much.Perhaps there will be story and action added or moved — perhaps Bran will be hunted as he rushes north in a much more specific manner.Perhaps the Nightfort will be drug out.Perhaps they will show much more of the three eyed crow as he goes north.I dunno.

    What I do know is that they aren’t going to rush through EVERYONE else’s storyline to keep Bran’s exciting.They haven’t so far — he’s done very little in two seasons.

    There’s absolutely zero evidence to believe the writers are interested in speeding up the pace, and certainly not to accomodate Bran’s storyline.

    You’ve made fine assertions here Alan, as readers we were patiently ( or nearly
    dismissed ) waiting Bran and Rickon’s story to continue. We were fed tidbits here
    and there, but GRRM later explained in a few interviews, the separately written
    character chapters. There was much to consider as he interwove their stories,
    and some fans did not appreciate the point to to do so. We have now ADWD,
    which includes more of Bran but not Rickon ( a mention only ). I’m sure you’re
    aware of this too. From the reader’s perspective, we’ve come to accept the
    continuation and GRRM’s pledge to draw some completion in the coming years
    2+ books and a compendium ). That’s a long time to consider from the perspective
    of a miniseries. I’m certain Benioff & Weiss realised this and engaged in publicised
    discussions with GRRM, quite possibly about what do about Bran and Rickon
    ( and possibly the the Direwolves as well). GoT may gain an interesting POV
    from this, in the end, and perhaps before readers do.

    Sorry for rambling, I have no idea why I’m up this late :D

  141. Alan
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 12:01 pm | Permalink

    WildSeed: You’ve made fine assertions here Alan, as readers we were patiently ( ornearly
    dismissed ) waiting Bran and Rickon’s story to continue. We were fed tidbits here
    and there, but GRRM later explained in a few interviews, the separately written
    character chapters. There was much to consider as he interwove their stories,
    and some fans did not appreciate the point to to do so. We have now ADWD,
    which includes more of Bran but not Rickon ( a mention only ). I’m sure you’re
    aware of this too. From the reader’s perspective, we’ve come to accept the
    continuation and GRRM’s pledge to draw some completion in the coming years
    2+ books and a compendium ). That’s a long time to consider from the perspective
    of a miniseries. I’m certain Benioff & Weiss realised this and engaged in publicised
    discussions with GRRM, quite possibly about what do about Bran and Rickon
    ( and possibly the the Direwolves as well). GoT may gain an interesting POV
    from this, in the end, and perhaps before readers do.

    Sorry for rambling, I have no idea why I’m up this late :D

    Yeah, I think you are saying we could see D&D add to their story in a way GRRM finds consistent. I think so, too. I wouldn’t mind it — as someone who already knows the story, I love the pieces we didn’t see — Jaime and Tywin or Robert and Cersei or even Arya and Tywin (which didn’t happen definitively in the books). The Margaery fluffer scene is still one of my favorites and not just for the obvious reasons.

    It’s new and by and large they’ve done a very good job of making sure it is something that could have or even very probably did happen. It’s like an appendix or something. I don’t consider it canon for the books, but as long as it’s something consistent, I find I really enjoy them, and perhaps more than seeing most of the scenes straight from the books.

  142. Alan
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 12:04 pm | Permalink

    I think the weirder thing for me, in general, as we talk about pacing, is that book readers who post about these things, really, really, seem to want to rush things.

    I wouldn’t mind if ASOS took three seasons. But most people seem to want to cram it into 1.5, cut Feast and Dance down to one season combined, etc.

    I don’t really get it.

  143. Ed
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 12:24 pm | Permalink

    Me too, Garyd, me, too.

    garyd: I am really excited about watching the red wedding, without a doubt it is the one event in ‘ A song of ice and fire’ that moved me the most. (Actually nothing I have ever read in any book series affected me emotionally like reading the red wedding did. I had to re-read the entire chapter straight away to take it all in.)

  144. Caro H
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 2:50 pm | Permalink

    Since it is probably the interior scenes of the RW the ones that are being filmed this week, i wonder if Talisa won’t attend the event cause the girl who plays her just posted a pic of her sitting the iron throne with a nice silver gown- hope that dress isn’t fancy enough for a wedding

    http://instagram.com/p/Q5JbgrQJr0/

  145. WildSeed
    Posted October 17, 2012 at 4:59 pm | Permalink

    Alan:
    I think the weirder thing for me, in general, as we talk about pacing, is that book readers who post about these things, really, really, seem to want to rush things.

    I wouldn’t mind if ASOS took three seasons.But most people seem to want to cram it into 1.5, cut Feast and Dance down to one season combined, etc.

    I don’t really get it.

    It’s just anxiety, admixed with fear and greedy appetite. We are hoping for a story
    that we recognize, fearful of the revisions, and desiring as much as we can get
    ( before GoT folds or takes a different angle ). Fans are unpredictable, even cray
    cray. Readers are neurotic. Luckily I realize this, but that does not make me
    immune. Having a life full of other compassions, or demands, helps to ground
    us in the present tense. I really try to believe this, it helps me coast while
    awaiting the next installment ( TWOW ) in 2015.

  146. Tír Airgid
    Posted October 19, 2012 at 5:24 am | Permalink

    I don’t know if this was reported, but on Tuesday 16th, a new pink GOT sign appeared by the magheramorne quarry they use to film The Wall and other exterior settings, directing “tech vehicles” to head towards the main gate of the quarry, so they’re probably shooting something there too.

  147. Quowala
    Posted October 19, 2012 at 8:22 am | Permalink

    Winter Is Coming,

    Imagine if season 4 episode 9 had The Mountain VS The Red Viper and the battle at the wall with Stannis. That would make for the most epic episode ever!

  148. lyanna
    Posted October 19, 2012 at 8:45 pm | Permalink

    the red wedding feels like the end of the game of thrones as if nothing can match this change in the game . i jhope there are a few surprises that we dont know about because danerys has become boring sorry to say she seems lost in dance of dragons, the starks are all of in crazy directions and even though i am obsessed with this i have rewatched and reread the books , i want a surprise .


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