Looking Forward Ep. 27 and Awful Television
By Winter Is Coming on in Editorial, Speculation.

Jorah Mormont

Oz of Thrones: Greeting and Salutations from the Unsullied Oz of House Oz, where a man is contemplating a contract with Littlefinger to take care of an unruly neighbor. It seems that if you have visitors to your Castle, and visitors disturb the grass of a neighbors castle, this is cause for a tongue-lashing from said neighbor. Being that I am a mild-mannered Lord, I took the lashing in stride while promising to said neighbor that future grass-disturbing incidents would not be tolerated by guests of House Oz. Undisturbed grass is apparently happier grass.

Ozzette’s sentiments were not as kind. “It’s a damn good thing he didn’t come over and talk to me. It’s freakin grass!” My lady has a point. While I somewhat understand the neighbor’s issue, his approach was confrontational and unnecessary, and now there is a weirdness whenever I see he and his very friendly family.

My grandmother always said, “You can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.” I still believe this to be true, as what I really want to do is take the truck over to his front yard and see if I can carve out the Hand of the King symbol in it while spinning my tires. But, a man must have restraint.

Here is the point, if there is one: It’s easier to let your emotions get the best of you; it’s easier to let your children run wild and give them no discipline; and it’s easier to throw a fit when someone unknown touches your chemically-infused centipede. But, is it best for us as a society? The short answer is no. So, how about we try to be civil to one another, especially if it involves something as simple as grass, or GoT message boards. We welcome all Sullied and Un alike to read and comment on non-book reader posts. But be nice. If it involves the book, just don’t mention it here. Cool? *End change-the-world-rant here*

Worst Episode?
A man has been subjected over the past few days to comments such as this: “Worst episode ever”, “dull”, “slow”, and even “boring” in regards to Episode 26 The Climb. Everyone has the right to their opinion, but that opinion may or may not be marginalized based on a rationale for such an opinion. A man also has the right to disagree. Let’s dissect those comments in reverse order:

Boring: No. Just no.

Dull or Slow: If you thought the episode was dull or slow, then you could either be comparing it to other high-intensity dramatic episodes accompanied with climactic scenes or you care very little for most of the characters involved in the episode. There is also a possibility of those that felt that the pacing itself was slow. As I mentioned in the newbie recap, I for one enjoyed the pacing. The episode was not as fast to jump from scene to scene, and we actually got to spend some quality time with some great characters. To each his own, but remember that one of the reasons the shows works is because we take time to invest in the characters, and we gradually get attached to them with some sort of emotional connection before some of them ultimately meet their demise. Otherwise, it would just be killing people. And there is plenty of mindless killing elsewhere on television where someone gets the business and you think, “meh, another fictional television death.”

Worst Episode Ever: This is a relative statement. Is it the worst episode ever on TV? Um, hell to the no. Is it the worst episode of GoT ever? I guess this is debatable. But I remember my father quoting something my great grandfather used to say about another topic: “The worst I ever had was good.” Draw your own conclusion as to what he was referring to. But it fits in this discussion as well….. Was it the worst episode? Arguably. But it was still damn good.

Awful Television
I have said before on many occasions that Game of Thrones has ruined me. I measure every other show by the GoT standard now, which is probably not fair and is undeniably unrealistic in terms of expectation.

Case in point: We don’t get to take in a whole lot of television at House Oz. Ozzette and I both work full time jobs. We are involved in our community. And we are extremely hands-on when it comes to the Ozlings. This leaves about an hour at night for some mindless TV.

The other night, I turned on one of the big four networks to check out the local news and I caught the last ten minutes of a show I have never viewed before. I don’t know what it’s about, or what the plot is, or who the primary players are other than the main character who I did recognize from another series. What I immediately noticed was this: the acting was horrible. The setting was atrocious. The production value was not good. And the scene itself was laughable.

Now, before we get all delvy into how good or bad Episode 26 was, let Oz be your friendly reminder that compared to most shows, especially those on the big four, GoT is head and shoulders above the rest. Yes, I know the budget is bigger, the cast is larger, and not all shows can be filmed in 4 or 5 different countries and be made to look like a feature film. But there is not much excuse for poor writing, directing, and acting.

So, thank you GRRM, D&D, and HBO for giving me this wonderful hour of escapism every week, and for making a lot of other television look like total junk in my eyes. For every positive there is a negative, indeed.

Looking Forward Ep. 27
Please keep in mind that Oz, as well as many others that read and follow are Unsullied (translation: we ain’t read no books). We discuss, speculate, and give our best guess on what might be coming up, as well as story lines that we would like to see more of in the coming episode. Sullied take part, but if it in involves the books, please do not speak of it!

**Are previews that have been released on HBO and other networks considered spoilers? My opinion is no, but if you disagree, read no further!

Here are some things that are true or might be true:

  • “The Bear and the Maiden Fair” is the name of the episode, written by George R. R. Martin.
  • There could be a bear in it.
  • It could involve Brienne, but I don’t know for sure. One of the previews depicted her in what looked like a pit with a gash on her neckline. Doesn’t look good either way.
  • Dany meets a guy who could be the leader, or ruler, or president, or slave trader, or dragon bait, of the new location we have seen on the credits called “Yunkai.” This too is only a guess. My primary question here is, what does she need from him or from Yunkai? My first guess is ships. Maybe dragon food? Do they have a Pet Supermarket there? Do they stock dragon food?
  • Theon might get tortured.
  • Sansa may try to swim out to get on Littlefinger’s boat.
  • Loras may swallow a sword.
  • Jon Snow may cut off Orell’s sword
  • Tormund may be the biggest badass of any of them
  • Ygritte may say, “while we wait on the wall, Jon Snow, can you do that thing with your tuuungue?”
  • Hodor may say, “Hodor”
  • Robb may stay where he is, and…
  • Arya may get into some mischief

Other than that, I have no idea. But it should be awesome.

Let’s put out the RSP (Raven Search Party) for Bronn. I may be mistaken, but I don’t think our brothel loving, Tyrion protecting swordsman has been seen since Ep. 2 of the current season.

The last subject of our RSP was for Lancel, and I am beginning to think we are not going to see him this season at all as he recovers from his wound suffered at Blackwater and his sword recovers from being used so much by Cersei. But he will surely be needed later by Cersei, especially if her marriage to Loras goes through and Jaime fails to make it back to King’s Landing.

Again, if you know the answers because you have read the books, or you have answers because you sought them from some other source, please DO NOT GIVE THE ANSWERS!!

Winter is a nice guy, but if he and FaB, HmR, and OitF have to moderate my posts much more, they may send Littlefinger after me. Please be respectful of the Unsullied, and my existence.

Until Monday with the Episode 27 Newbie Recap, have a great weekend! And may there be peace in your realm. -Oz


130 Comments

  1. Grijnwaald
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 12:53 pm | Permalink

    Hodor

    “I have said before on many occasions that Game of Thrones has ruined me. I measure every other show by the GoT standard now, which is probably not fair and is undeniably unrealistic in terms of expectation.”

    You’re not alone there Oz!

  2. M
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:01 pm | Permalink

    My initial reaction Sunday night was that the episode was boring but after letting it sit for a couple days, and after re-watching it, it definitely wasn’t boring. Not every episode can have flaming sword fights and dragons and de-handinations and resurrections and chases through the forests and Wall-climbs and near-rapes and cavesex andandand…we’d get too used to all the action. Every so often you need to step back for a breather and to refocus on where the story really is, or isn’t, heading. That’s what was needed at this point. This was our breather.

  3. Hollyoak
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:03 pm | Permalink

    M:
    My initial reaction Sunday night was that the episode was boring but after letting it sit for a couple days, and after re-watching it, it definitely wasn’t boring. Not every episode can have flaming sword fights and dragons and de-handinations and resurrections and chases through the forests and Wall-climbs and near-rapes and cavesex andandand…we’d get too used to all the action. Every so often you need to step back for a breather and to refocus on where the story really is, or isn’t, heading. That’s what was needed at this point. This was our breather.

    Well said. I just rewatched and feel the same way

  4. mariamb18
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:05 pm | Permalink

    Agree – GOT has ruined me for everything else on TV. And yes, the last episode was not dull or boring. It was different that the two episodes that preceded it but never boring.

    And that is quite an amazing photo of Ser Jorah!!!

  5. BeersBestFriend
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:07 pm | Permalink

    It was a slow episode to start the build up for the season finale

  6. Jonathan Loesche
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:07 pm | Permalink

    Bronn was there for Pod the Sex God

  7. GeekFurious
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:10 pm | Permalink

    Fake outrage is all the rage.

  8. Al Swearengen
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:14 pm | Permalink

    As much as GOT is amazing there’s still alot of great tv out there with Breaking Bad, Mad Men, Dexter, Sons Of Anarchy, Justified, The Walking Dead, Louie, Parks and Recreations etc.

  9. Oz of Thrones
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:18 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen,

    Agreed. But almost none of them are on one of the big four.

  10. GoT
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:19 pm | Permalink

    Oz i love your recaps, they are damn good!

  11. JP Dayne
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:19 pm | Permalink

    I think this is the worst post in the history of blogs
    I just read a whole lot of nothing

  12. I Know of Fear
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:23 pm | Permalink

    I haven’t had the chance to re watch this episode, but on first glance I thought it was awesome. I loved the exchange between Littlefinger and the Spider especially, that could almost count as a climax of sorts for this seasons political machinations. We also got to see the Lannister siblings with their quips and shipping as they follow the rule of “my enemy’s enemy” and a does of thrills at the wall.

    But apparently I am a casual fan and my opinion may not be valid in the eyes of some book readers because I don’t read any wiki articles, still refer to characters by title instead of name like Onion Knight and Red Woman, and find True Blood’s last season to be just as fun add this season of GoT. Oh well.

    My predictions for this week? Theon doesn’t come any closer to relief nor finding out what I’d going on. Bran learns something new about the dangers of having abilities like dream walking and Osha is vindicated. Tywin gas his plans fall apart and needs to blame somebody while Littlefinger had his plans come together, leaving Sansa and Shae to kill the dwarf.

  13. Baihu1983
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:24 pm | Permalink

    I liked it. It just happened to come after 2 of possibly the best episodes so far.

    But it was never dull or boring.

  14. Oz of Thrones
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:24 pm | Permalink

    GoT,

    Thank you GoT! Enjoy providing them.

    Check out JP Dayne’s comment below yours. For every positive there is a negative, indeed. Thank you too JP!

  15. Hawk
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:24 pm | Permalink

    there are 4-5 episodes in season two that would be in contention for worst AGOT episode before this past episode should even be considered in the discussion…

  16. umuckurlife
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:30 pm | Permalink

    Ah neighbor problems. I feel for you, Oz. I’ve got a crazy-lady neighbor who has been harassing us for years about trees & fences & sprinklers & issues with previous owners & more. But I received some great news a couple of weeks ago; she’s moving today…on my name day. What a wonderful gift!

  17. Yellow Dog
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:33 pm | Permalink

    GOT has ruined me for any other television …

    Thank you! I thought there was something wrong with me, that all the network dramas the critics all rave about and my otherwise intelligent (but non-GOT-watching) friends love so much drive me nuts with their obvious plots, shallow characterization and criminally juvenile writing.

    I can’t bear to watch any of them any more – I just end up screaming at the TV.

  18. Tessa_Leonie
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:38 pm | Permalink

    Ha, I feel you Oz. Dude next to me on the allotments (We do indeed sow) was being extremely bitchy and a significant part of me wanted to show him the pointy end of my pitchfork.

  19. Streamweaver
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:38 pm | Permalink

    A man wonders if he shall pay a visit to Balon Greyjoy?

  20. Michael274
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:55 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen,

    The Walking Dead a great show ? Lol, you make me laugh. The show is a piece of crap compared to the comic books . Now that’s what an atrocious adaptation means, book purists, remember that and be thankful .

  21. Michael274
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:57 pm | Permalink

    JP Dayne,

    Aww, did it hurt you feelings when you realised that he talked about poeple like you ? Poor thing !

  22. Mister Stark
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:58 pm | Permalink

    Don’t forget “Maron”, On IFC.
    Classic Marc Maron.

  23. hashtagsbyNoah
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:59 pm | Permalink

    Oz of Thrones,

    My initial thought was that JP was being snarky about “the worst” part. I’m going to stick with that because you know, glass half full.
    As an aside, your posts are awesome.

  24. Oz of Thrones
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 1:59 pm | Permalink

    umuckurlife,

    Congratulations…. that is a wonderful gift. And Happy name day to you.

  25. Hawk
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:08 pm | Permalink

    Michael274,

    you sound like an arrogant purist…I’m glad we’re not in the same fanbase!

  26. James
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:18 pm | Permalink

    Im a book reader, and my wife non-book reader. I was out watching the Habs get humiliated by the Senators so she watched it without me.

    After the show ended (and I was crying in my cups over the Habs), she texted me “BEST EPISODE EVER”.

    When I got home, I had high expectations after that text message, and honestly, I didn’t totally disagree.

    Sure, no flaming anything, but loved the pacing and I think for non-book readers the flow made it a good “catch you breath and remember who everyone is” moment.

  27. Michael Tschuertz
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:20 pm | Permalink

    There where really people saying it was boring?
    Really?

    Never feeled that way to me.

    Also rewatching Season 1 and Season 2 back to back, it really is something else.

  28. Norm
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:24 pm | Permalink

    I don’t think it even makes sense to talk about an episode being best or worst, or otherwise ranking episodes. Although of course the TV convention is that each episode stands alone, GOT is unusual in that it is more in the nature of a single story that is released in installments, like Charles Dickens did for “The Old Curiosity Shop” and other novels. People in the US stood on the dock waiting for the next installment to arrive by ship, calling out to the passengers on board, “Does Little Nell still live?” Likewise, we call out, “Has someone finally killed Joffrey?”

  29. The One Who Knocks
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:24 pm | Permalink

    Michael274 may have come off a little strong, but I have to agree with his sentiment. In the case of WD it’s not the purity in relation to the comics which is sometimes pretty close and sometimes not so close that drives the comic readers mad. It’s that the show during seasons 2 & 3 have just spun their wheels for several episodes at a time without moving forward.

    They also have a knack for creating the most unlikable and infuriating characters I’ve ever watched on television (Dale, Lori, Andrea). Especially since said characters are very likable in the comic version. Still, it’s a better show than most out there these days, but I wish they would get focused a bit more. 16 episode seasons of WD are just far too many.

  30. john
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:24 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen:
    As much as GOT is amazing there’s still alot of great tv out there with Breaking Bad, Mad Men, Dexter, Sons Of Anarchy, Justified, The Walking Dead, Louie, Parks and Recreations etc.

    Walking Dead is not great TV. It just isn’t. I know it’s subjective, but fuck…

  31. MRR
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:28 pm | Permalink

    I think I remember seeing footage of Lancel in one of the trailers or production videos, so I think we’ll be seeing him again this season. I could be mistaken.

    I think much of the reason we haven’t seen a lot of Bronn is that we haven’t really seen a lot of Tyrion. His scenes in the past few episodes have been pretty scant. Not that I’m complaining—I know that characters get skipped from time to time—but a lot of the action at King’s Landing is focused on Tywin and the Tyrells this season, so we’re seeing less of the Halfman, and that in turn means we’re seeing less of Bronn. That’s my suspicion, anyhow.

    I’m a book reader, so I knew that Jon and Ygritte were both going to make it up the wall, but I still found the climb scenes tense and exciting (much to my delight).

    I also thought the scene with Sam and Gilly at the beginning of the episode was fantastic. If you don’t enjoy simple, character-building scenes like that, this may not be the show for you.

  32. Veltigar
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:30 pm | Permalink

    I stick to my point that “The climb” was the worst episode in GoT-history. But I’m looking forward to next episode, written by the great GRRM himself. Sadly, I can’t really speculate since I’m sullied but I’m looking forward to the Unsullieds predictions :D

  33. Zack
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:39 pm | Permalink

    There were weaker episodes in S2, IMO, and early in S1. For a latter-half-of-season episode, this might be the worst to date. Still, as I said in my initial reaction, I enjoyed most of it.

    There’s alo precedent for episode quality to improve on rewatches and in the full context of their seasons when the arcs are complete.

    But this is the only S3 episode so far that I wasn’t immediately compelled to watch a second time. I usually watch the episodes twice on premiere night. This one I’ve still only watched the one time, no burning desire to watch again. For what that’s worth.

  34. Veltigar
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:40 pm | Permalink

    Michael274:
    Al Swearengen,

    The Walking Dead a great show ? Lol, you make me laugh. The show is a piece of crap compared to the comic books . Now that’s what an atrocious adaptation means, book purists, remember that and be thankful .

    Yeah, tWD is a really shitty show but I do enjoy it strangely enough. The characters and the storylines don’t really frustrate me. I’m rolling on the floor laughing with every decision the characters make (They are just so stupid… and these are the people that survived!). One thing I did find strange though: the comic books are indeed way better than the series and yet the best characters on the show (Daryl and my personal favorite Merle) aren’t in the comic books IIRC.

  35. I Know of Fear
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:47 pm | Permalink

    I don’t think anyone, sullied or not, thought Jon and Ygritte would die. For me it was a question of whether or not they would be separated from the group and if anybody would actually make it to the top in this episode (and to a lesser extent wondering if they night be caught by a crow that Jon didn’t know about or forgot to mention. And the whole storyline was worth it for the spectacle of the nail biting climb and the expansive vistas contrasting the two sides of the wall.
    MRR,

  36. Michael274
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:48 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    The show has been entertaining in the first season and the second half of season 2, i won’t deny that . But it seems they like to kill the only characters i care about and focusing on the ones i hate,not to mention the whole stupid plotline with the Governor and all the other crap . Now that i think about that, it’s funny how people complain that LF is a cliche villain, but if you compare him with the Governor you see what cartoon villainy means .

  37. WompWomp
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:48 pm | Permalink

    Oz of Thrones,

    Haha, maybe you’re being too gracious there, Oz, but who has time to pick a fight?

    Your enthusiasm is what a lot of vocal readers seem to be lacking. It’s my pleasure to read about how much you and other non-readers are enjoying the show. It certainly reinforces my own enthusiasm for this season.

  38. 3eyes
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:49 pm | Permalink

    Your posts are a great help; something to look forward to between episodes. Television lost me years ago, except for the occasional stunble across on PBS (Neverwhere!), but I was hooked on GoT from the first few minutes into ep 1. There is a reason it is so loved across national, linguistic and cultural barriers, even among we Unsullied. I look forward to a ripple effect in the industry, and a return to engaging and thought provoking programming that resonates for ALL viewers, so that we won’t have to waste our one hour per night.

  39. armando a
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:51 pm | Permalink

    This episode did not felt slow or boring to me!

    I love all the dialogue on the show. So for me the Tywin/Olenna scene is one of my fav from the season so far!

    I laughed at Tyron when he was trying to make Shae leave the room.

    The Tyrion and Cercei exchange was also very enjoyable. You know they are brothers after all, so I like when they don’t treat each other as enemies. There’s also the fact in this scene, where Tyrion is openly discussing with Cercei her “special” relationship with Jamie and she does not deny it to him, which it’s why I trust in her when she tells him, that Joffrey it’s prob the responsible for trying to get him killed.

    Sam and Bran scenes were good, but since they were just only at the beginning of the episode, they seemed a little out of place. I’m still very curious about Jojen and Meera, hopefully later this season or next they will have more to do.

    Poor Brienne, she seems like she’s not gonna have an easy time in these next episodes.

    I was very sad when they showed that Ros was dead, honestly I havent been as upset about someone dying on this show sin

  40. GreatJon of Slumber
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:53 pm | Permalink

    Let’s put out the RSP (Raven Search Party) for Bronn. I may be mistaken, but I don’t think our brothel loving, Tyrion protecting swordsman has been seen since Ep. 2 of the current season.

    True.

    However.

    Other than Tyrion, Jon, and Danys, my impression is that characters will wax and wane as their importance to the plot does the same over time. And we just haven’t had much need for Bronn this year, for that reason. In some ways, Bronn of Season 2 has been replaced this year by Thoros of Myr — colorful, fun supporting character, though with a touch of additional sadness, it seems.

  41. WompWomp
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:54 pm | Permalink

    john: Walking Dead is not great TV. It just isn’t. I know it’s subjective, but fuck…

    Walking Dead is like a reality TV show with questionable editing. Carl has been less of an annoyance, but I still feel cheated every time I give it another chance.

    Great make-up, some wonderful actors, but the show as a whole simply isn’t as rewarding as others out there.

    GoT is hitting its stride this season. It’s still hard to compare to TV-only stories like Breaking Bad and SoA, but that’s only because those shows are written to cover set ground each episode. GoT, as an adaptation, has a tougher time doing this, but the sheer quality of each moment this year puts it in its own league. It’s less a series of episodes and more a weekly dose of an experience. There is nothing else like it right now. Simply. Glorious.

  42. NONBOOKREADER
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:55 pm | Permalink

    This episode was great…it wasn’t the best but still great! My predictions for next episode…Brienne is attacked by a Bear (and maybe murdered) obviously….not sure how Jaime gets back to her because based on the clip it looks like he was leaving. Theon continues to be tortured with no pay off for us TV show fans….Robb makes another stupid decision that keeps on the path to being the stupidest KOTN in history….Bron makes an appearance!

  43. Utiz4321
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:58 pm | Permalink

    I thought episode 26 was a great episode and like all game of thrones episodes the hour seemed to fly by. But then I love this story and the adaptation of this story. If you want an action move every episode this isn’t the show for you, try watching the die hard series over and over again. This show is trying to tell a complex and extremely interesting story and the climb did that so I am happy.

  44. Veltigar
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:59 pm | Permalink

    Michael274:
    Veltigar,

    The show has been entertaining in the first season and the second half of season 2, i won’t deny that . But it seems they like to kill the only characters i care about and focusing on the ones i hate,not to mention the whole stupid plotline with the Governor and all the other crap . Now that i think about that, it’s funny how people complain that LF is a cliche villain, but if you compare him with the Governor you see what cartoon villainy means .

    Hehe, I have an advantage on you then. I don’t care about any character on tWD except for Merle, the only realistic character . And what I hated about his death was the pure stupidity of it all and not the fact that they killed him for me tWD is like a movie with Steven Seagal. They take themselves so serious that it turns into a comedy. I mean have you ever seen Talking Dead (I saw one episode)… They are so full of themselves and it’s just hilarious to see their characters and plotlines fail every time :D

  45. Hounded
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 2:59 pm | Permalink

    What the hell was all that about grass? And why do you say ‘Oz’ a compulsive amount??
    Apart from that I agree with all you said. And the next episode should be great.

  46. Iggy1eco
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:03 pm | Permalink

    “Hodor may say, “Hodor””

    Not much to debate here ;D

  47. MRR
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:11 pm | Permalink

    I Know of Fear,

    Yeah, my point wasn’t really about knowing the outcome, but about being able to enjoy the suspense regardless. They did a good job with that scene.

  48. Shock Me Sane
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:11 pm | Permalink

    I think some people look back at previous seasons with severely rose-tinted lenses, because Season 1 is practically unwatchable on a large HD TV as it was filmed so poorly compared to S2 and S3. It was still good TV, but man it was poor handling of HD.

  49. Oz of Thrones
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:14 pm | Permalink

    Hounded,
    Your questions…

    Grass…..LOL. That was the point.

    My compulsive name…. maybe I am obsessed with compulsive?

    And I can’t wait for the next episode either.

  50. Astonished
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:20 pm | Permalink

    OT

    Hilarious. Or Astonishing.

    The list of 2012 baby names was recently released. Arya was the fastest-rising baby name in 2012

    http://www.wired.com/underwire/2013/05/arya-popular-baby-name

  51. Thomas
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:24 pm | Permalink

    I’m sullied and didn’t even know Jorah wore jewelry until I saw the picture above.

  52. barak
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:29 pm | Permalink

    Where is that Jorah picture from?

  53. Winter Is Coming
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:32 pm | Permalink

    barak:
    Where is that Jorah picture from?

    HBO.com

  54. Michael274
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:40 pm | Permalink

    Winter Is Coming,

    Is the episode 7 preview going to be posted today ? I only ask because i want to discuss some things from it .

  55. Rhys
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:40 pm | Permalink

    I made the mistake of checking the checking the Westeros forum feedback for the episode before watching. The fact that so few rated it highly totally ruined my objectivity for the episode. I’ve watched it four times now (I think) and can’t understand why so many didn’t like it.

    Just my 2 cents worth but I feel that some book readers lose their critical thinking skills when it comes to the show. They’re desperate to see the scenes and hear the lines they remember from the books. For instance, I saw people complaining about the Bran scene in this episode. But what don’t understand is how that scene tells us things that are not plot related. For instance, it told us: Bran is maturing, hence he defused the situation between Meera and Osha, Jojen’s dreams have negative consequences, and Osha and Meera travelling together may be unsustainable. A very important scene. Books have a vast advantage in establishing character development, so shows often have to make do.

  56. Turri
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:41 pm | Permalink

    A bear there was
    A bear, A BEAR!
    All black and brown
    And covered with hair

  57. BothStarkGirlsAreGr8
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:41 pm | Permalink

    Astonished:
    OT

    Hilarious. Or Astonishing.

    The list of 2012 baby names was recently released. Arya was the fastest-rising baby name in 2012

    http://www.wired.com/underwire/2013/05/arya-popular-baby-name

    That’s really cool! But I do not like the “just for the sansa haters” jibe at the end of the article. That was uncalled for. Sansa is no less a badass than Arya.

    EDIT
    @Rhys Meh, I just didn’t like the Bran scene cause the cat fight between Meera and Osha was so undignified. I was not bothered about that stuff back in season 1, but the show has continnued to be sexist, especially compared to the books which are very empowering for female characters and readers alike, so by now I’m sensitized to the smallest things, suchs as a cat-fight, which wouldn’t have bothered me earlier.

  58. Winter Is Coming
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:45 pm | Permalink

    Michael274:
    Winter Is Coming,

    Is the episode 7 preview going to be posted today ? I only ask because i want to discuss some things from it .

    Of course! It will be up in about 15 minutes.

  59. Davy
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:46 pm | Permalink

    Hmm, I wonder. What do people like so much about Arya? I absolutely dislike her and I don’t understand what people like so much about her and now I am starting to wonder, why do you guys think Arya is so awesome?

  60. illuminatus
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:48 pm | Permalink

    I completely agree it was a great episode. There’s no pleasing some folks. Thoros’ sozzled admission that he’s a lousy priest and has no idea how he does what he does alone was worth the price of admission. Plus Arya is now double majoring in Archery and talking smack! Go, Wolf Girl, go.

  61. Ed
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:49 pm | Permalink

    Excellent post!

    M:
    My initial reaction Sunday night was that the episode was boring but after letting it sit for a couple days, and after re-watching it, it definitely wasn’t boring. Not every episode can have flaming sword fights and dragons and de-handinations and resurrections and chases through the forests and Wall-climbs and near-rapes and cavesex andandand…we’d get too used to all the action. Every so often you need to step back for a breather and to refocus on where the story really is, or isn’t, heading. That’s what was needed at this point. This was our breather.

  62. Ed
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    - She doesn’t take s&^%t
    - She stands up for herself
    - She’s got mad skills (standing on one foot, catching cats, sword fighting)
    - She’s got a big heart (“I’ll be your family”)
    - She’s cute as a button

    So, basically Mr Contrarian (I’m cool cause I’m different than everybody else!), something’s wrong with you if you DON’T like her! :-)

    Davy:
    Hmm, I wonder. What do people like so much about Arya? I absolutely dislike her and I don’t understand what people like so much about her and now I am starting to wonder, why do you guys think Arya is so awesome?

  63. Rhys
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    EDIT
    @Rhys Meh, I just didn’t like the Bran scene cause the cat fight between Meera and Osha was so undignified. I was not bothered about that stuff back in season 1, but the show has continnued to be sexist, especially compared to the books which are very empowering for female characters and readers alike, so by now I’m sensitized to the smallest things, suchs as a cat-fight, which wouldn’t have bothered me earlier.

    @BothStarkGirlsAreGr8 – I don’t agree. Meera and Osha have both shown themselves to be strong. They are two women effectively leading and protecting two relatively helpless boys. To me, that seems relatively empowered.

  64. BothStarkGirlsAreGr8
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 3:58 pm | Permalink

    Rhys: @BothStarkGirlsAreGr8 – I don’t agree. Meera and Osha have both shown themselves to be strong. They are two women effectively leading and protecting two relatively helpless boys. To me, that seems relatively empowered.

    Agreed, but they are fighting each other in an out of character and undignified way over who is better at cooking for these boys. Still, I admit, it’s not a big thing for anyone except me and others like me, who are sensitive to such things. After the way Cat the character has been treated on the show and lines such as “stupidest cunt alive”, “most girls are idiots” and “you sound like a bloody woman” it was just one thing too many, you know.

  65. Lavignac
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:01 pm | Permalink

    Open message to WIC (let’s adopt GOO’s Winterphil nickname I think it’s great…) :

    Mr. W.Phil, please do the right thing.
    Consult with HMR, FABio and OITF, and please offer Oz a renewal for a 5-year, YEARLONG contribution contract. I’m sure he can make us read something entertaining in the off-season!
    I am impressed by his combination of style, thoughtfulness, diplomacy, humor and accessibility.

  66. Michael274
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:03 pm | Permalink

    BothStarkGirlsAreGr8,

    Maybe you should stop watching television in general, because compared to GOT women are treated like crap in other tv shows .

  67. Shan
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

    Davy:
    Hmm, I wonder. What do people like so much about Arya? I absolutely dislike her and I don’t understand what people like so much about her and now I am starting to wonder, why do you guys think Arya is so awesome?

    Because she fits an archetype (“rebellious princess who would rather be a boy”) that we’re familiar with and comfortable with from the movies we grew up with? She seems like an interesting enough person, but I do think that *some* of the love comes from the fact that we’ve been trained to root for people like her since we were six. Rooting for someone like Sansa is harder because we’ve been trained to do the opposite.

  68. BothStarkGirlsAreGr8
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:10 pm | Permalink

    Well, GoT is pretty much the only thing I watch, lol xD I have the same sickness as others here. Nothing else feels as good anymore after GoT, even Mad Men, which I loved previoculy, looks merely avarage in comparison.

  69. Shan
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

    That said, I do appreciate that GRRM does things with the archetype that other people don’t. Arya is a more realistic take on it than the ones that turn up in other movies — which, unfortunately, means Arya winds up in more traumatized shape then most of the figures she resembles do. Bad for Arya, but good writing.

  70. Ms. D. Ranged in AZ
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:42 pm | Permalink

    Astonished,

    If had read GRRM’s books before my daughter is born I would have named her Arya too! But some day I will have grandchildren…….

  71. Oz of Thrones
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:50 pm | Permalink

    Lavignac,

    Thank you abundantly for your kind words. Whatever the future may hold, I have thoroughly enjoyed being the newbie recapper and representing the non-book readers on this great site for season 3. I appreciate you and all of the people that frequent WiC. It is my pleasure.

  72. Matt
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:51 pm | Permalink

    I think they just set the bar WAY too high with the endings of the last few episodes… The episode, I felt, was great in it’s own right. There were a ton of awesome scenes, and I think a vast majority really do miss Dany and her Dragons, so there is that.

    The episode needed something else I will agree… I won’t say anything to ruin it, but perhaps a second scene with Sam, to sort of tie in the (seemingly) arbitrary scene that opened the episode. But I think seeing as that GRRM wrote Ep 7, I think he stole this particular scene :P

  73. argilac's antler
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 4:54 pm | Permalink

    M,

    I’m with you and Hollyoak on this. Sunday night after it aired, I was truly disappointed and left feeling unsatisfied with the episode. A few days later I rewatched it and the episode flew by and it wasn’t as bad as I remembered. Although I am beginning to have an issue with the fragmented storytelling and I have a feeling that’s only going to get worse as the series continues.

  74. Roopert
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    Hi Oz

    Your neighbor story cracked me up. I think we have the same neighbor (I just have the female version – maybe your neighbor needs a friend? Happy to ship mine lock stock and barrel your way!). Thanks for your great recaps and viewpoints. They really add to my week waiting for the next episode.

    And don’t let the trolls get you down. Curious how much they’ve contributed to the world this week …… :-D

  75. Independent George
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    I’d probably rate S2E2 or S2E4 as my least favorite episodes, and I’d still give them a solid B-.

    I was going to defend other television programming – I truly believe we’re in the Golden Age of television – when I realized that I don’t watch a single show on the networks anymore. Not a single one – all of my favorite shows are on cable.

    I still spend plenty of time on television, but I log more hours watching PBS (Nova, Mind of a Chef, and America’s Test Kitchen, or 2 hours/week) than I do the big four (zero).

    ETA: Wait, I do watch Person of Interest. But that’s still less than PBS.

  76. Impi
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 5:17 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen:
    As much as GOT is amazing there’s still alot of great tv out there with Breaking Bad, Mad Men, Dexter, Sons Of Anarchy, Justified, The Walking Dead, Louie, Parks and Recreations etc.

    There are exactly 2 shows that I will drop almost anything to assure that I get to watch realtime (not DVR’d). Game of Thrones and Justified. I really wish more people would give Justified a chance. It is just so very good, top to bottom. Smart, well-written, well-acted show.

  77. Nagga's Kin
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 5:20 pm | Permalink

    Dept. of Completely Baseless Predictions For Shits and Giggles:
    ————————————————————————

    - Tywin slaps Joffrey silly, takes his crossbow away and orders Tyrion to get rid of the dead whore before the Tyrells find out. Pod rustles up a ladder and an area rug. The Twitterverse explodes.

    - Margaery teaches Tommen dominoes because Cersei doesn’t know how to play the game. Wine is spilled, a dress is ruined. Oh noes! In the background, Varys introduces Bronn to Olenna. Oh yes!

    - Bran has a dream in which he sees Jon Snow about to join the Mile High Club with his bird. Just then, the headless ghost of Ned pops up and shoves Bran off the precipice. His fall is broken by two large pillows, which Osha and Meera use to fight with each other. Bran notices how big the wolves’ teeth have become. When he wakes up, Jojen is staring at him. Pregnant pause aaaand … scene.

    - “Boy” formally introduces himself to Theon, because manners. This tells us nothing, actually. The name Odor is transacted.

    - Yara receives a raven message and dons her cuirass. Time to put some salt water in the barrel.

    - In a surprise twist, the other feather bed on the S.V. Mockingbird is occupied by a Dornish girl. I use the term loosely, but she counts. Book purists lose their religion.

    - Khaleesi shows up in Yunkai with her posse, demands to know “WHERE ARE OUR FREEDOM FRIES?!?” Over in the FZ, Jorah strikes a pose. Missandei attempts to translate.

    - Jamie works on his stump speech. He is unaware Brienne is getting more than honey in her hair, here, there and everywhere.

  78. Grijnwaald
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 5:33 pm | Permalink

    Ed:
    - She doesn’t take s&^%t
    - She stands up for herself
    - She’s got mad skills (standing on one foot, catching cats, sword fighting)
    - She’s got a big heart (“I’ll be your family”)
    - She’s cute as a button

    So, basically Mr Contrarian (I’m cool cause I’m different than everybody else!), something’s wrong with you if you DON’T like her!:-)

    OMG this

    Arya is my favourite character for all those reasons. I mean, she has some killer lines, “Face, tits, balls, I het him right where I wanted”

  79. Springwillcome
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 5:36 pm | Permalink

    Next episode everyone just freaks out:
    Cersei freaks out because Loras has managed to get himself some”French” sleeves while she hasn’t.”I shall NEVER marry a guy who is better dressed than I am!”
    Gilly, Sam, Ygritte and Jon go on a doubledate behind the wall (most awkward doubledate ever…) and Sam freaks out because Gilly thinks Jon is the better singer of the two of them.
    Meera and Osha freak out because Bran thinks his mum is the best cook ever and her rabbit stew is certainly better than anything both Meera and Osha could come up with!
    Apart from that: we might hear another performance of “The Bear and the Maiden fair”

  80. WildSeed
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:17 pm | Permalink

    Grijnwaald:
    Hodor

    “I have said before on many occasions that Game of Thrones has ruined me. I measure every other show by the GoT standard now, which is probably not fair and is undeniably unrealistic in terms of expectation.”

    You’re not alone there Oz!

    I am spoiled, sullied, a creature of higher expectation and standard, a diva.
    I watched a production of Merlin ( BBC ) and a few other poorly demonstrated
    medieval films and I was a fuss bucket throughout the watch. If you haven’t
    seen ” the Last Legion “, a film that employs pretty much the entire cast of GoT,
    you probably find yourself swearing at the tele, or at least being disappointed.

    As for Oz’s proclamation to ruining his neighbour’s lawn with a trunk, let’s
    have him consider a white Raven to the neighbour’s home with a message
    stating ” Winter is Coming “, or ” the Red God will exact his due ” (:

  81. WildSeed
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:23 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen,

    There are a few select cable and free channel choices to consider, you name
    a few. For me, the fussiness I deal with now are shows of the same genre
    as Game of Thrones.

  82. David The Grey
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:23 pm | Permalink

    Nice and comedic way to post about a serious topic, OoT!

    And regarding your speculations, I loved these the most:
    •Theon might get tortured.
    •Loras may swallow a sword.
    •Ygritte may say, “while we wait on the wall, Jon Snow, can you do that thing with your tuuungue?”
    •Hodor may say, “Hodor”
    •Robb may stay where he is, and…
    •Arya may get into some mischief

    These had me cracking up!

    I share your feelings of ruinage about other TV shows, except for me it’s that way with fantasy novels. I won’t say any more about books, but it’s terrible when you have been exposed to something that just blows you away and gives you a whole new worldview – you can never go back. It’s like going back to the town you used to live in decades ago and wonder how you could’ve ever lived there…..? lol

    Keep up the good work!

  83. WildSeed
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:24 pm | Permalink

    Ed:
    - She doesn’t take s&^%t
    - She stands up for herself
    - She’s got mad skills (standing on one foot, catching cats, sword fighting)
    - She’s got a big heart (“I’ll be your family”)
    - She’s cute as a button

    So, basically Mr Contrarian (I’m cool cause I’m different than everybody else!), something’s wrong with you if you DON’T like her!:-)

    Proud to have her as my baby sister, or a daughter. She’s got moxie *>*

  84. Oz of Thrones
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:42 pm | Permalink

    David The Grey,

    Thanks David… My hope is that GoT raises the bar for better television in the future. What I don’t want to see is cheap knock-offs of fantasy shows trying to cash in on the popularity of GoT. But I am sure we will. Originality, production, writing, and acting would go a long way for the big four.

  85. René
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:47 pm | Permalink

    Trying to be civil to oneother? Like no unnecesary walking over someone else his grass?

  86. Easteros bunny
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:48 pm | Permalink

    It’s interesting to read about the people who are finding season 3 slow or boring, oh how they are going to eat their words in the next few episodes :p

  87. Kaldor
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 6:53 pm | Permalink

    What did I just read.

    Someone was tired I guess, or alone, or both ;-P

  88. WeirwoodTreeHugger
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 7:11 pm | Permalink

    It kind of blows my mind to see people call The Climb slow or boring. Compare even the slightly less terrible episodes of Revolution to the “bad” episodes of GOT. It’s not even close. The only one of the newer genre shows I haven’t given up on is Orphan Black.
    Sure the books are better. With a few exceptions (like the 1990′s Little Women) the books are always better than t.v. or movie adaptations. The fact is GOT is one of the very few shows past or present that are worth obsessing about.

  89. Lord Selwyn
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 7:28 pm | Permalink

    I think that some viewers believe an episode is slow because they are confusing ‘drama’ with ‘action’ or ‘spectacle. There are no dragons, swordfights, military battles or dramatic wall-climbs in ‘House of Cards’, but there is certainly plenty of ‘drama’. Same with GoT: the machinations in KL, a monologue from Thoros, or a friendly dinner with Roose Bolton, may not be as visually spectacular as something like wildfire consuming ships, or a dragon incinerating a slaver, but they are certainly dramatic and just as important for the characters involved.

  90. I Know of Fear
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    Oz of Thrones:
    David The Grey,

    Thanks David… My hope is that GoT raises the bar for better television in the future. What I don’t want to see is cheap knock-offs of fantasy shows trying to cash in on the popularity of GoT. But I am sure we will. Originality, production, writing, and acting would go a long way for the big four.

    I don’t think you have to worry about cheap knockoffs considering most executives still think the genre is too niche for broad appeal, and those that don’t think that aren’t in a hurry to compete with HBO. If you see anything similar, it is not going to sell itself as a drama full of intrigue.

    That said, I am looking forward to Syfy’s next foray into the genre: Sinbad. Of course the show will have a radically different tone and is more likely to resemble other adventure serials like Merlin instead of a drama like Battlestar Galactica. But having a different cultural sandbox could make for some nice escapism if they do it justice.

  91. sunspear
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 8:11 pm | Permalink

    I agree. The climb was only slow by GoT own standards. Any other show could only dream of doing something as great as the Wall climb.

    BothStarkGirlsAreGr8: o not like the “just for the sansa haters” jibe at the end of the article. That was uncalled for. Sansa is no less a badass than Arya.

    No no, Sansa is significantly less of a badass than Arya is.

  92. Arya Dunyett
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 8:24 pm | Permalink

    Oz, I had to laugh at your struggles with the bitchy neighbor. I could be that person, picking the neighbors’ toys out of my garden, scaring the tots back indoors. I do try to muffle my complaints so as to live peacefully with my surrounds. Who knows – that neighbor might just be another GoT fan! What a world!

    I love your suspicious mind and its delightful spews. We all need this, as said before by another poster, this pastime to fill that interminable pause between exceptional media events.

    BTW, I find that planning exotic and complex revenge is often just the ticket for calming the ire. I smile to myself as I think of the large wad of pink bubblegum I will jam into the front door lock of the harpy next door.

    Also, using closed captioning isn’t just for the hearing impaired. It is a treat to read the words that you think you heard, such as French sleeves, when what Loras was actually gushing about was fringed sleeves.

  93. Delta1212
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 9:12 pm | Permalink

    Yellow Dog:
    GOT has ruined me for any other television …

    Thank you!I thought there was something wrong with me, that all the network dramas the critics all rave about and my otherwise intelligent (but non-GOT-watching) friends love so much drive me nuts with their obvious plots, shallow characterization and criminally juvenile writing.

    I can’t bear to watch any of them any more – I just end up screaming at the TV.

    Deadwood and The Wire. I put Game of Thrones and those two in the same category of show, not based on level of quality (though all three are excellent), but they are very high quality ensemble shows that are as much, or more, about the location and society being depicted as any specific character, they are very morally grey and they start out with someone who seems like he’s going to be the main character of the series and then quickly branch out into this huge, well developed world full of characters who are so much more interesting.

    And all three shows throw you in the deep end and expect you to keep up with what’s going on without handholding.

    There are other very high quality shows, including others I think are better done than some of those three, but those are of a piece.

    And quite coincidentally, all done by HBO. I know that “The Sopranos in Middle Earth” is the famous tag line, but the better descriptor would have been: This show is to fantasy was Deadwood was to westerns and The Wire was to crime dramas.

  94. Shan
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 9:52 pm | Permalink

    No no, Sansa is significantly less of a badass than Arya is.

    I disagree. Sansa would be dead by now if she were in Arya’s shoes, and Arya would be dead by now if she were in Sansa’s shoes. Sansa does make some dumb mistakes, but not nearly as dumb as the mistakes Arya would make in the same situation. I like her, but she doesn’t have very much self-control. Sometimes “not taking any shit” can be a strength, but sometimes it’s a weakness — particularly if it means that you’re not *capable* of taking any shit to serve a more long-term goal.

    Remember when she wouldn’t kneel to Tywin, and kept mouthing off to Tywin, and pulled that sword on Thoros just because he made her mad, and stole that message about Robb even though she had no idea what she was planning to do with it, and so on? She gets away with it because she’s cute and people like her, but she has a real problem with self-control — mostly because, just like Sansa, she was a little spoiled growing up. (Remember when her dad let her keep a real live weapon even though she was thinking of stabbing her sister with it?)

    I like Sansa, and I like Arya, and I think that both of them are badasses, but they both also have their moments of weakness — Arya as well as Sansa. There’s a difference between being strong and just attacking everyone who gets in your way, whether or not attacking them will actually solve your problem. Sometimes the more badass choice is to just put your head down, endure what’s happening, and wait for the opportune moment to do something that will actually work.

  95. I Know of Fear
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 10:39 pm | Permalink

    sunspear,

    Sansa is not less badass than the little girl running back to mommy while being driven by emotions that can only get her killed, like an ill considered desire for revenge against the king.

    I think much of the audience only elevates Arya above her sister because she always shared their opinion of Joffrey. I know I smirked when Sansa called him brave and Arya snorted in response. And I laughed heartily when Sansa said he would give her kids with beautiful golden hair and Arya groaned “seven hells!”

    But Sansa has stayed in the capital and survived the game without being taught the rules. The first season showed us a naive girl who thought she would be romanced by a prince before she gave birth to a son who would rule a continent. She thought about revenge for one moment and nearly pushed Joffrey to his death when she was force to look at Ned’s head (that wouldv’e been poetic considering what happened to Bran) but maintained a cooler head once the Hound warned her she’s only make things hard for herself.

    From season 2 onwards she has shown herself to be one of the most cunning people in King’s Landing. Who else has beeen able to redirect Joffrey’s bloodlust to spare not only herself, but random strangers? Who else has resisted Tyrion’s repeated, soothing attempts to be a confidant and speak a truth that could very easily be used against them? And most impressive was her ability to say anything she needed to about her family and her own opinions so she could stay under the aegis of the title “future queen” and then keep her mouth shut so she could gracefully get out of that position before it killed her. The only time she’s let her guard down was when she tried to warn someone else of the fate she avoided as Joffrey’s bride. And even then, I don’t doubt the Tyrell women are cunning enough to have manipulated her into spilling any beans they wanted.

    Sansa is a badass who has “kept her enemies closer” while she herself played the game of thrones. And she didn’t have to win to avoid dying either! All she needs to do is finish growing up and gain friends/spies and she could go toe to toe with any schemer on the small council. Sure Sansa turned up several chances to leave the capital, but her fate would be far from certain on the road North or with her crazy aunt Lysa.

    BothStarkGirlsAreGr8,

    The comments about “most girls are idiots” and “you sound like a bloody woman” stuck out to me too. Even if it wasn’t out of character to hear these statements, they did grate on me the wrong way. But this scene with Osha and Meera didn’t strike me as a catfight at all, it struck me as a pissing match between skilled hunters/trappers about butchering meat for survival. The idea that they were “cooking for these boys” didn’t cross my mind at the time, and I hope that’s not what the show wanted to reduce them to.

  96. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 11:42 pm | Permalink

    WeirwoodTreeHugger:
    It kind of blows my mind to see people call The Climb slow or boring.Compare even the slightly less terrible episodes of Revolution to the “bad” episodes of GOT.It’s not even close.The only one of the newer genre shows I haven’t given up on is Orphan Black.
    Sure the books are better.With a few exceptions (like the 1990′s Little Women) the books are always better than t.v. or movie adaptations.The fact is GOT is one of the very few shows past or present that are worth obsessing about.

    Agreed on all of this. The Climb, on a whole, is probably not the equal of the two episodes that preceded it – but it’s more than solid and has a lot of great, memorable moments to it.

  97. Gatorfisch
    Posted May 10, 2013 at 11:59 pm | Permalink

    This book reader is looking forward to the Melisandre/Gendry storyline…and the Bran/Rickon storyline…I like being as unsullied as the rest of you.

  98. Astonished
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 12:14 am | Permalink

    Ms. D. Ranged in AZ,

    Dear lady,

    Cheers to you remembering anything about game of thrones when your grandchildren spawn from the dark, shapeless sea. I know I won’t.

    But, must you ramble on about the book? The people have spoken, and they react to the show. The book fans are merely a springboard and later a nuisance.

    Just sayin’… the children are getting older… just older. Unlike Eli. Unlike Hit Girl.

  99. Alan
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 12:20 am | Permalink

    1. One of the interesting things about GoT is that the show is eminently re-watchable, and is almost always better for me on the second viewing.

    2. I can’t say this was my favorite episode, but people should re-watch the first couple of episodes. Compared to when this show was finding this stride, this episode was a masterpiece.

  100. Astonished
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 12:25 am | Permalink

    Alan: 1. One of the interesting things about GoT is that the show is eminently re-watchable, and is almost always better for me on the second viewing.

    Interesting. I only watch the GoT episodes once, and while inebriated so to dampen the disappointment. I’m only trying to stay positive. Cheers.

  101. please please please
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 1:08 am | Permalink

    The fact that people say this episode was slow, or even boring, bodes ill for the rest of the series.

    This season, and the one after that, are going to be the most action packed of them all. That’s just a fact, though I suppose the last two books might be as action packed as storm of swords (can’t konw yet).
    What’s important is that both A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons are much slower books than the first three, and transporting them to TV properly might be a challange.

    I mean, this episode had one of the most impressive action scenes ever on TV (they were climbing the freaking Wall!), and still people thought it was boring. How would this short attention span EVER going to cope with 2 seasons full of politics, and slow, delightful character development?

    The showrunners have already ruined one plotline in order to shove more mindless action and violance into the story (that’l be Dany’s story in the 2nd season – the ugly mass wev’e seen from HBO has next to nothing to do with her story in the books, which by the way didn’t end with her executing anyone, and didn’t have teleporting sorceres taking control over any city) and I fear they might decide they have no choice but to butcher the later books to make them more interesting for the casual fan of the show.

    And when I see people complaining that episode 6 was boering? If fear the show producers would be right to think most people can’t handle a slow story. That’s a real shame.

  102. Julie
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 1:11 am | Permalink

    When we only get 10 episodes per season so who has time for a breather? It isn’t the old days when a season is 22 episodes and we have time to develop characters. We have to get to know them from all the tragic stuff going on around them.

  103. Shan
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 2:20 am | Permalink

    please please please,

    I think the problem with ADWD and AFFC isn’t so much that they *are* slow as that they *start* slow. We eventually do get to big stuff, but there’s so much buildup to it that we’re all kind of checked out by the time we get there.

    What could be neat is if D&D set some of that stuff up at the end of Season 4. If they trim whatever they can of the dull stuff, they could possibly turn the rest into a cliffhanger. Buildup is a lot more fun if you get a little and then have to do the rest in your head as you wait a year to find out what happens.

    That’s my hope, anyway.

  104. Gaius Baltar
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 4:55 am | Permalink

    I believe some people ruining thier own enjoyment of show with seeing sexism where there is none. Meera and Osha was not about cat fight about who is better cook for boys. It was cultural clash, sort of ironical, since Osha is fairly respectfull and loyal to “southern nobleman” Bran and Meera is probably most skilled lady in terms of survival in wilderness in whole Westeros. And both are doing practically same thing, protecting young males who need protecting. And there are other reasons for this scene as Rhys already stated.

    Its was silly criticism same as last year with Stannis and Mel in season finale. It was not about him being abusing to her at all. It was great scene which showed small moment of Mel uncertainity, Stannis utter despair and her masturfull handling of the situation. It was all about Stannis wanted believe all sacrifices were worth, Red God is real, it showed us his starting transformation from practical user of religion to true believer. Yet countless people only wanted to see from this scene its “sexism”, that Stannis is abusive to Mel…

  105. Lisa Y.
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 4:56 am | Permalink

    I wonder if a study can be commissioned to determine if there’s a link between people who say the last episode was “boring” or “slow” and: 1. their age, 2. their gender, and 3. appearances by Emilia Clarke? If memory serves me well, there seems to be a correlation between complaints of an episode being “boring”–and an appearance by the Khaleesi. No, I’m not going to do such a study myself. But I think there’s a more obvious reason why some episodes are “boring” to certain segments of the audience.

    As far as the next episode 7, I note from the preview that Brienne gets shoved (thrown? dropped?) into that pit while wearing that pinky-orangey monstrosity of a dress. How many more indignities can that poor woman endure?

  106. Gaius Baltar
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 5:15 am | Permalink

    Lisa Y, that funny obseravation, its true for me only 2 episodes i found bit boring were both episodes with no Dany. I am male as you can expect, but i am in my 30th, so its not about my teeny lust, its just i found her story arch best this season, last year it was Theon and Dany arch was very bad.
    I think main reason for some episodes being unpopular to larger group of veiwers is some episodes are unfortunate combination of less interesting characters/story archs. So for example in this season if there is no Dany in episode, there should be good Lannisters and Starks scenes, because Sam, Bronn, Roz, Podric or even Tyrrels or Litllefinger scenes are not that appealing to make majority of veiwers satisfied.

  107. Renaud
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 5:35 am | Permalink

    Oz,

    Just saying, if you want to see great television, I truly recommend watching Mad Men and Breaking Bad. Those two shows have the best acting, the best writing and the best cinematography in TV, in my opinion.
    GoT is an amazing show, but it’s not the only one on TV :-)

  108. MUGger
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 8:08 am | Permalink

    YMichael274:
    Veltigar,

    The show has been entertaining in the first season and the second half of season 2, i won’t deny that . But it seems they like to kill the only characters i care about and focusing on the ones i hate,not to mention the whole stupid plotline with the Governor and all the other crap . Now that i think about that, it’s funny how people complain that LF is a cliche villain, but if you compare him with the Governor you see what cartoon villainy means .

    Killing characters that I like . . . Leaving the bad guys alive . . . Naw, Game of Thrones isn’t anything like THAT!

  109. Boojam
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 9:02 am | Permalink

    If “Yunkai.” is more elaborated than in the books … fireworks galore!

  110. Michael274
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 9:08 am | Permalink

    MUGger,

    I don’t think you understood what i meant, i said killing off the likable characters and leaving the annoying ones alive . Thanks for the smartass attitude however !

  111. jkb
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 9:54 am | Permalink

    MUGger: Killing characters that I like . . . Leaving the bad guys alive . . . Naw, Game of Thrones isn’t anything like THAT!

    GoT bad guys (and other good drama baddies) are still entertaining to watch (joffrey <3), but watching some shit TWD characters do is just annoying and painful to watch. that governor dude and his plotline is just fucking ridiculously retarded.

    not saying TWD is totally bad and i still watch it – it's just not in the same league as GoT/Breaking Bead/Sopranos/Wire etc.

  112. cabbo
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 10:45 am | Permalink

    The Climb was better than most of the second season.

  113. cabbo
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 10:48 am | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    The comic books stopped being good a year ago, just in case you want to get into them.

    When they start living in the community, it all goes downhill.

  114. Rafael
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 11:46 am | Permalink

    GoT:
    Oz i love your recaps, they are damn good!

    I agree :)

  115. sunspear
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 12:59 pm | Permalink

    Shan,

    I Know of Fear,

    The ONLY reason Sansa has survived in the Red Keep is because the Hound and Tyrion are watching out for her. She didn’t convince Joffrey to stop beating her, and she didn’t do anything about the men that about to rape her. Arya proved she could adapt to living with people who wanted to hurt her in Harrenhal.

    And your examples of her intelligence are terrible. Margaery and Tyrion both keep Joffrey in check better than her. Her repeated lies to Tyrion only show she doesn’t understand that he wants to help her.

  116. Zack
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 1:09 pm | Permalink

    sunspear,

    Not to mention the awfully generous usage of the word ‘badass’ to mean somebody who has just managed to not die. Everybody living in the world is not a badass. Being alive isn’t enough.

  117. Shan
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 8:24 pm | Permalink

    sunspear:
    Shan,

    I Know of Fear,

    The ONLY reason Sansa has survived in the Red Keep is because the Hound and Tyrion are watching out for her. She didn’t convince Joffrey to stop beating her, and she didn’t do anything about the men that about to rape her. Arya proved she could adapt to living with people who wanted to hurt her in Harrenhal.

    And your examples of her intelligence are terrible. Margaery and Tyrion both keep Joffrey in check better than her. Her repeated lies to Tyrion only show she doesn’t understand that he wants to help her.

    What I’m saying is that all the Tyrions and Hounds in the world couldn’t have saved Arya if she’d been at court. You’re saying that she survived Harrenhal because she was smart, but that’s just not true. She was lucky. Tywin happened to find her attitude cute. If he had not happened to find her attitude cute, she would not have been able to modify it, and she would have gotten herself killed with her big mouth. She only has one way of being, and she can’t change the way she is. That’s why people like her, but it’s also a weakness in a lot of situations — a weakness that Sansa does not possess. Again, I’m going to point you toward her pulling her sword on Thoros for literally no reason while surrounded by his men, thereby risking not just her own life but the lives of her friends, just because he pissed her off. That’s not strength. That’s weakness.

    And I’m sorry, but not trusting Tyrion was absolutely a smart move. He can’t even keep Tywin from making her marry him. He has very little power, and the very little protection he could offer would not be worth the risk of revealing her secrets to him and hoping that he won’t use them to save himself the next time he finds himself in a desperate situation (which he does seem to have a knack for winding up in). He may want to help her, but she is in no way his priority — he wouldn’t put her safety ahead of that of people he actually, you know, cares about, instead of just pities.

    Also, if you’re going to condemn Sansa for getting help from Tyrion and the Hound, you’re going to need to condemn Arya for getting help from Jaqen H’Gar and Yoren and Syrio. And if you want to condemn people who can’t manipulate Joffrey as well as Margaery Tyrell, you’re going to have to cross Cersei, Tywin, and Tyrion off the list of badasses as well. (The best Tywin could do was have him drugged, which hardly counts as “controlling” him.)

    Again, I want to stress that I like both of them, but you’re putting them to a double standard that isn’t fair.

  118. Ours is the Fury
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 8:29 pm | Permalink

    Gaius Baltar,

    People rarely “want” to see sexism. We see it because that is how we perceive it, and your dismissing it does not erase our experience of it.

  119. Vlad
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 9:34 pm | Permalink

    @Shan

    WTF, dude? Are you talking about the show, or the books? If it’s the latter, control yourself and at least acknowledge that your posts are full of spoilers.

  120. Braincandy
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 10:01 pm | Permalink

    sunspear,

    If Sansa was helped by the Hound and Tyrion than Arya was helped by Tywin and Jaqen.
    They’re both coping, with some assistance, in their new circumstances equally well but using different styles.

  121. Delta1212
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 10:04 pm | Permalink

    Vlad,

    Um, everything in Shan’s post is from the show, and a number of things referenced are actually deviations from the book that are only from the show. I’m not sure where you’re seeing spoilers.

  122. David The Grey
    Posted May 11, 2013 at 11:22 pm | Permalink

    I Know of Fear: I Know of Fear

    Posted May 10, 2013 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    Oz of Thrones:
    David The Grey,
    Thanks David… My hope is that GoT raises the bar for better television in the future. What I don’t want to see is cheap knock-offs of fantasy shows trying to cash in on the popularity of GoT. But I am sure we will. Originality, production, writing, and acting would go a long way for the big four.

    I don’t think you have to worry about cheap knockoffs considering most executives still think the genre is too niche for broad appeal, and those that don’t think that aren’t in a hurry to compete with HBO. If you see anything similar, it is not going to sell itself as a drama full of intrigue.
    That said, I am looking forward to Syfy’s next foray into the genre: Sinbad. Of course the show will have a radically different tone and is more likely to resemble other adventure serials like Merlin instead of a drama like Battlestar Galactica. But having a different cultural sandbox could make for some nice escapism if they do it justice.

    I’d try Sinbad out. I enjoyed dabbling into The Arabian Nights as a child, along with my fairy tales, Aesop’s fables, and Greek myths. I even enjoyed Once Upon A Time enough to purchase Season 1 so I could catch up on the episodes I missed. Was it Must See TV, though? No, not like GoT. I haven’t watched Grimm, which is the other fantasy-themed show that I’m aware of on the Big 4. Not sure if it’s watchable or laughable?

    Aside from the fantasy is a niche genre, I definitey think production and writing play a big factor. You get a show with good writing, it will attract more serious actors, but that probably would drive the costs up. Might be harder for the Big 4 to fill up a 22 episode season with an expensive show. I remember reading about The Following (on Fox) limiting itself to a smaller season, so I wonder if that might become a trend that will allow networks to shoot for quality writing, acting and production? As far as orignality – well – I wouldn’t wait on that one for the Big 4!
    I really can’t invest the time I used to have to watch every favorite show anyway, I’d probably have to limit mysel to just a few shows a week even IF there were gobs of awesomeness in mainstream TV. I’m satisified with turning to the other networks for quality programming. As long as I can go through the year with at least one show to look forward to each week, I’m a happy camper.

  123. tysnow
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 5:24 am | Permalink

    Hawk,

    Yes, and season two was nominated for an Emmy, so it shows you even when it is not at its best it is still better than 99%.

  124. Vlad
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 7:04 am | Permalink

    Delta1212: probably not fair

    Don’t know. I read something about Tywin poisoning Joffreay and stoped reading.

    Have I missed something like that on the show? I don’t think so.

  125. Grijnwaald
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 10:47 am | Permalink

    Vlad: Don’t know. I read something about Tywin poisoning Joffreay and stoped reading.

    Have I missed something like that on the show? I don’t think so.

    Nice one dipshit

    USE SPOILER TAGS

  126. I Know of Fear
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 4:15 pm | Permalink

    Zack:
    sunspear,

    Not to mention the awfully generous usage of the word ‘badass’ to mean somebody who has just managed to not die. Everybody living in the world is not a badass. Being alive isn’t enough.

    When you play the game of thrones, you win or you die. Sansa managed not to die when she left her place as the future queen. I doubt Marge will be that lucky the next time someone tries to marry or usurp Joffrey.

    And of course Sansa isn’t as good as Marge and Tyrion when it comes to manipulating people, she’s only been at it for a few months and doesn’t have any spies. If the Hound had stuck around he could have been the first spy, and in a few years Sansa coulda been on the same path as Littlefinger and Varys.

    By the way, if anyone thinks they see a spoiler, please do not repeat it without adding spoiler tags. I’ll just try to ignore what I saw considering how off the wall it sounds anyway.

  127. modiglian
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 4:52 pm | Permalink

    BothStarkGirlsAreGr8,

    A few women have power due to their bloodties, be it being born noble, rich or wed to a rich/noble man.

    A few women are smarter and more independent than others but still… feminism never happened at Westeros (as it didn’t happen on medieval/reinassance EU), that’s all.

    You can’t watch GoT and stick XXI century social labels on it.

  128. I Know of Fear
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    modiglian:
    BothStarkGirlsAreGr8,

    A few women have power due to their bloodties, be it being born noble, rich or wed to a rich/noble man.

    A few women are smarter and more independent than others but still… feminism never happened at Westeros (as it didn’t happen on medieval/reinassance EU), that’s all.

    You can’t watch GoT and stick XXI century social labels on it.

    Perhaps you can’t expect a society from medieval France to share modern day perspectives and values, but you can criticize 21st century fiction (that invents characters for a TV audience) with modern analytical frameworks.

  129. Dany's One-Eyed Dragon
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 5:19 pm | Permalink

    “USE SPOILER TAGS”??? This a newbie non-book reader blog. Why is it so difficult not to post any spoilers at all? Nice work Shan and others that just can’t resist using material that happened in the books or will/may happen in the books to prove your point regarding someone’s contrary opinion based solely on watching the show.

    Enjoy the Oz blogs, but only going to read Oz’s Recap blog on Wednesday nights going forward. By then all spoilers should be blacked out and post volume slow enough so that repost spoilers don’t get through.

    Oz and WIC – Thanks for attempting to monitor the newbie blogs for spoilers, not a fun job I imagine. My only recommendation would be to blackout a person’s entire post – not just a sentence or part or a sentence – if you believe it contains any spoilage. Then, no further discussion will result and the poster will realize something they said was a spoiler. With no comment at all to be viewed by other, he or she will get frustrated and stop posting on the newbie blogs -or- (if it was an innocent mistake) provide more carefully drafted posts like the more regular book reader bloggers in the future.

  130. I Know of Fear
    Posted May 12, 2013 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    Oz and WIC have done an amazing job. I just want posters to think about what thread they are in before they say something. Following the rules would be a great way to say “thanks” for the writing Oz does and for the discussion space provided by WIC.


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