Hizdahr zo Loraq cast
By Ours is the Fury on in Casting.

Joel FryA significant part in season four has finally been cast, and Entertainment Weekly has the exclusive: English actor Joel Fry will be filling the role of the wealthy nobleman who tangles with Daenerys Targaryen in Meereen.

A graduate of the Royal Academy of Dramatic Art, Fry has appeared on the British television programs Trollied, Plebs, and White Van Man, and features in the 2013 film Svengali.

Ours is the Fury: Fantastic to have a Hizdahr on board! Joel Fry has a great look and I’ve enjoyed the shows I’ve seen him in previously. I’m very pleased with the casting.


174 Comments

  1. Michel
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 4:58 pm | Permalink

    Nice, he looks the part.

  2. Morgan
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:01 pm | Permalink

    Wow, I wasn’t expecting Hizdar so Loraq to be cast for this season. The actor is a little younger looking than I would have imagined for the character but I think he’s a great choice.

  3. The Young Wolf
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:06 pm | Permalink

    A lot younger than I pictured Hizdahr. Might they being trying to make the Eastern politics similar to the Westeros politics, and Hizdahr is kinda in the “heir” role?

    Why this early? Save something for S5!

  4. Chickenduck
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:06 pm | Permalink

    Yay casting news!

    He’s younger than I imagined for the part, but we’ll see how he goes.

  5. House Mormont
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:06 pm | Permalink

    Good for him to be cast early, I thought the Hizdahr would be around 40-ish but that can be fixed with make-up, and he definitely has that Ghiscari hair

    Any thought on who’ll be cut from Meereen? the shavepate? the seneschal? Brown Ben?

    and in Dany’s story this season, will Quaithe appear for some prophecying? will they include her sexual awakening? I would think so since it’s HBO and they’ve been craving more nudity since Littlefinger left KL

  6. House Mormont
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:09 pm | Permalink

    and on people who worry about early castings, any characters from Season 5 that can be introduced in Season 4 will make it a lot less jarring for casual viewers the following season

  7. Win-Wun
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:10 pm | Permalink

    I’ve only seen him in comedic roles before, but I think he can pull it off. Looking forward to it (smiley face)

  8. Ours is the Fury
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:12 pm | Permalink

    I don’t think they ever specified Hizdahr’s age but I could be wrong. I was picturing him at around 30ish when I was reading. I doubt they’ll do anything to make him seem older. It makes sense to keep him of an age with Daenerys.

  9. Loki
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:12 pm | Permalink

    Great news! Always hated when people say that, but he looks exactly like i imagined Hizdahr. Im already missing his red winged hair though… D&D like to screw things up when it comes to exotic hairstyles and dresses.

  10. boze
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:14 pm | Permalink

    This is what’s left from ASOS:

    http://tinyurl.com/pzqd2x4 (about 20 chapters)

    Of course we’re going to see some AFFC/ADWD this season.

  11. That Stark boy
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:15 pm | Permalink

    Hmmmm… I like it! Still missing Belwas, though.

  12. Jordan
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:18 pm | Permalink

    I like the idea of casting a younger guy- not that Dany’s plotline necessarily revolves around “which guy will she choose” (although to an extent it does), but I like the idea of Hizdahr being “in the running”, and not an obviously bad choice (for similar reasons I like what the show did with Daxos).

  13. Jentario
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:25 pm | Permalink

    Holy hell, I just called it. I imagined him a bit older but sure.

  14. Sean C.
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:25 pm | Permalink

    I’ve been waiting to hear on any significant casting for Dany’s storyline this season, this being one of the areas where the casting gives a decent indication of how far the show is going to get.

  15. Hard Truths
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:28 pm | Permalink

    Hopefully this means Dany’s ADWD story will be wrapped up in season 5.

  16. Jentario
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:29 pm | Permalink

    The Young Wolf,

    There is more than enough for season 5. I also called a bad guy role for the Dany story and BBP (but that seems increasingly unlikely).

  17. Lonestarr1337
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:30 pm | Permalink

    IT BEGINS, SHOW-WATCHERS!

    THE AGE OF CONFUSING MEEREENESE NAMES IN UPON YOU!

  18. patchface
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:34 pm | Permalink

    I am so surprised so many people seem to think Hizdahr was supposed to be older. In the books he is described as young and handsome. I picture him as a young playboy, very spoiled, not particularly intelligent or brave. Anything but King material in other words.

  19. Bupol
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:34 pm | Permalink

    He looks perfect. Damn, now all I need is to see him in wig (?) and costume and he’ll pop up into my head every time I re-read ADWD.

  20. Jentario
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:36 pm | Permalink

    Hard Truths,

    I think we’ll get the Daznak Pit in either episode 9 or 10, unless they’re actually going to try and fit all of books 4 & 5 into one season, which would not be optimal IMO (optimal would be a season and a half).

  21. Jentario
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:38 pm | Permalink

    patchface,

    I have no idea why, but I imagined him at his late 40s.

  22. Bard
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:42 pm | Permalink

    “These are very tasty … you ought to try a few yourself, my love. They are rolled in spice before honey, so they are sweet and hot at once.”

  23. Barista Selmy
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:43 pm | Permalink

    LOCUSTS!

  24. Ours is the Fury
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:45 pm | Permalink

    Lonestarr1337: IT BEGINS, SHOW-WATCHERS!

    THE AGE OF CONFUSING MEEREENESE NAMES IN UPON YOU!

    lol
    if they thought the Valyrian names were bad…

  25. Jordan
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:46 pm | Permalink

    Bard,

    That made me imagine him saying, “I like my locusts like I like my women, sweet and hot”.

    Mandatory plug for Ben Plumm.

    One thing I was thinking generally, is that this casting makes me optimistic, as its a reminder that even when we haven’t heard of any important casting updates for a while, it doesn’t (necessarily) mean they aren’t casting any more important roles.

  26. Alvis
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:46 pm | Permalink

    He looks good! Now let’s see how far we’re going.

  27. Morgan
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:48 pm | Permalink

    patchface,

    I always thought of him as being quite a bit older than Dany. Obviously, she has been aged up for the show but I assumed they would still be going with some who looked older than Emilia. Oh well, I’m not complaining! Haha this might make it a little harder to dislike him though, he’s pretty attractive.

  28. Tatiana
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:49 pm | Permalink

    He’s definitely younger and lighter-skinned than I pictured Hizdahr to be, but I listened to the sample monologues on his page and liked what I heard. Plus I giggle that I find Hizdahr hotter than Daario now. Awwwwkward.

    (I know he was described as young, but I’d have thought they’d make him older than their current Daario at least, give how they chose to go with Daario in the first place.)

  29. Alvis
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:51 pm | Permalink

    Morgan,

    The 80-90% of the Essos gang is pretty attractive (including the new guys and the dead ones)

  30. patchface
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:52 pm | Permalink

    Morgan:
    patchface,

    I always thought of him as being quite a bit older than Dany. Obviously, she has been aged up for the show but I assumed they would still be going with some who looked older than Emilia. Oh well, I’m not complaining! Haha this might make it a little harder to dislike him though, he’s pretty attractive.

    If he was much older than Dany, don’t you think Dany would have mentioned it in her POVs? I think it is pretty clear that Dany thought of him as attractive (she wished he would f*** her rather than fall asleep) but very uninteresting

  31. moophasa *PB*
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:54 pm | Permalink

    I can’t honestly remember how GRRM describes him in the books, but I always pictured him being older. Not a problem though, I’m sure this guy will be great and I’m excited to see what they do with Dany’s storyline. At this rate though they will certainly have to add more material to her storyline…

  32. Steven
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:55 pm | Permalink

    Bard:
    “These are very tasty … you ought to try a few yourself, my love. They are rolled in spice before honey, so they are sweet and hot at once.”

    Barista Selmy:
    LOCUSTS!

    Along those lines, check out this article about that, pretty intriguing stuff (and absolutely spoilery, so don’t go there anybody who hasn’t read Dance with Dragons).

    http://meereeneseblot.wordpress.com/2013/09/27/untangling-the-meereenese-knot-part-i-who-poisoned-the-locusts/

  33. Jentario
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:57 pm | Permalink

    moophasa *PB*,
    I love that you kept PB in your name :)

  34. Jentario
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Permalink

    patchface,

    Spoiler code please

  35. Tar Kidho
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:02 pm | Permalink

    Damn, it’s happening sooner than I thought… I read up to book 4 and due to the long wait for ADWD said to myself that I’d (re-)read everything at once only when the entire series was finished. (I hate re-reads!) So for me the tv series has caught up with the books…

  36. Rygar
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:04 pm | Permalink

    Why couldn’t GRRM just name him….Tim?

  37. Morgan
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:06 pm | Permalink

    patchface,

    I guess I might not have pay that much attention to his descriptions when I was reading the book, I agree with Ours Is The Fury about thinking he was around 30. I don’t remember her ever really desiring him. Just because she wanted to have sex doesn’t mean she found him that attractive. They were married and if she had urges, why not?

  38. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:08 pm | Permalink

    Good, one down. Only four more left:
    Euron Greyjoy
    Aeron Greyjoy
    Brown Ben Plumm
    And Val/Dalla

  39. Ghost
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:09 pm | Permalink

    For some reason I always pictured Hizdahr older. This dude has a look about him that I like though and it seems right. I’ll take it.

  40. SokratesK
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:09 pm | Permalink

    Spot on!Now the only thing that remains ,is abetter version of Daario and we’re set for what it seems to be a really promising season ,although i have to say the casting was already huge to begin with,and i have no idead how the hell they’re going to keep up with it, since, judging by the books it’s going to expand even more!

  41. Easteros bunny
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:14 pm | Permalink

    Woohoo Hizdahr!

    Another complete and utter badass cast!

    No doubt season 4 is shaping up to be the greatest season in the history of cinema, tv and pop culture.

    On another note…dude where’s my hizdahr

  42. Turncloak
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:18 pm | Permalink

    Steven,

    This is not very eye opening. The Shavepate was my first guess as to who was leading the Harpy. Still doesn’t change the fact that The Mereen story line is incredibly dull IMO. What’s more upsetting is that Barristan’s mistake might cost him his life

  43. Not Today
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:26 pm | Permalink

    Looks like a younger brother of Syrio Forell.

  44. Darquemode
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:27 pm | Permalink

    Great to have some more casting news!

    Fry looks almost exactly how I pictured Hiizdahr zo Loraq honestly. Maybe Fry looks a few years younger than I pictured HzL… like many here it seems. I pictured Hizdahr in his mid-to-late-30s and Fry looks to be early 30s maybe. So not a big deal at all.

  45. Garlan the Gallant
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:34 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    Dude what? Shavepate isn’t leading the Harpy.

  46. Steven
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 6:54 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak:
    Steven,

    This is not very eye opening. The Shavepate was my first guess as to who was leading the Harpy. Still doesn’t change the fact that The Mereen story line is incredibly dull IMO. What’s more upsetting is that Barristan’s mistake might cost him his life

    Considering you obviously misread it it doesn’t surprise me it’s not very eye opening, it says nothing about who’s “leading the Harpy.”

  47. AngryRosFan
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:04 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    So did I. This actor is much younger than the Hizdahr of my head canon. And frankly, unless he’s annoying or arrogant, I can’t see that Daenerys would be lukewarm to him, because he’s fairly nice looking, which would be a change from the books. I always felt like bookDany was marrying a man old enough to be her father purely for political reasons, didn’t have any real passion for him, which is why she kept Daario around because he was the one she desired.

    I think it will be interesting to see how this works out.

  48. franco
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:06 pm | Permalink

    This is how I always picture Hizdahr http://awoiaf.westeros.org/images/thumb/e/ec/Hizdahr1.jpg/250px-Hizdahr1.jpg

    So, yes, the actor fits exactly my mental image of him, as usual Nina Gold made an excelent choice

  49. Deekan
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:06 pm | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    Yeeeeaaah..there is absolutely no way that any additional Greyjoys will be cast before season 5, with all the extra casting happening for this season already, or else this season will be uber cluttered.

  50. Skyofwelkup
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:21 pm | Permalink

    franco,

    That’s how I’ve always pictured him too! I am so excited for this season. Most of the events I’ve wanted to see on-screen will happen in season 4. I’m really looking forward to seeing how Dany’s storyline plays out.

  51. Steven
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:29 pm | Permalink

    AngryRosFan:
    Jentario,

    So did I. This actor is much younger than the Hizdahr of my head canon. And frankly, unless he’s annoying or arrogant, I can’t see that Daenerys would be lukewarm to him, because he’s fairly nice looking, which would be a change from the books. I always felt like bookDany was marrying a man old enough to be her father purely for political reasons, didn’t have any real passion for him, which is why she kept Daario around because he was the one she desired.

    I think it will be interesting to see how this works out.

    I never really got that impression, from what I remember she thought he was pretty good-looking but she just wasn’t attracted to him, more because of his character than his appearance. I always pictured him as a somewhat soft nobleman type, which is pretty much the opposite of Drogo and Daario.

  52. Cy
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:32 pm | Permalink

    Much cuter than I expected!

    My assumption is that he will be introduced this season (hence why he has been cast), but not become a major player until season 5. Based off the books, there’s not much left of Dany’s story to tell from the 3rd book besides the intro to Mereen so they’re probably going to have to embellish to fill a full ten episodes… maybe they’ll end her story this season with the marriage proposal from Hizdahr (?).

  53. mariamb
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:44 pm | Permalink

    Lonestarr1337:
    IT BEGINS, SHOW-WATCHERS!

    THE AGE OF CONFUSING MEEREENESE NAMES IN UPON YOU!

    Those names made for tedious reading.

    Anyway, Joel looks perfect for the part. Welcome to the cast. S4 is going to be fabulous.

  54. sunspear
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 7:52 pm | Permalink

    Ah yes, Hizdhar zo Loraq. Or as I like to think of him ‘ the guy in Dany’s plot line whose name I can remember.

  55. sunspear
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 8:06 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Hard Truths,

    I think we’ll get the Daznak Pit in either episode 9 or 10, unless they’re actually going to try and fit all of books 4 & 5 into one season, which would not be optimal IMO (optimal would be a season and a half).

    Personally I was thinking for Dany:

    End season four with her locking up her dragons.
    End Season 5 with her marriage to Hizdahr (she’ll need to be deemphasized that season)
    Have the dragon pit happen in episode 2 season 6.
    Then include the Battle of Meereen and whatever it takes to get Dany started on her way to Westeros by the end of season 6.

  56. obsidian
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    I like the look of our Hizdahr.

    Locusts – it’s unlikely they were supposed to kill. As the linked essay points out , no one could guarantee she’d eat them , and certainly , she would not be expected to pig out like Belwas..especially in public. But even a few might have been enough to make her miscarry. There was consternation over her affair with Daario and that it might result in pregnancy would be one big reason. Hizdahr would have an interest in that , as would the Green Grace .Later , when Dany gobbles the little green berries, she does seem to be aborting.

  57. WeirwoodTreeHugger
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 8:32 pm | Permalink

    Easteros bunny:
    Woohoo Hizdahr!

    Another complete and utter badass cast!

    No doubt season 4 is shaping up to be the greatest season in the history of cinema, tv and pop culture.

    On another note…dude where’s my hizdahr

    This joke got old a really long time ago. You should try for more creative trolling next time.

    Anyways, this actor is better looking than I imagined. Then again, who am I to complain about good looking men filling my TV screen? I wonder when the Green Grace will be introduced. She’s my guess for the Harpy.

  58. Hi-Fi
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 8:45 pm | Permalink

    Not gonna lie, hope he gets naked.

  59. Selmy
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 9:22 pm | Permalink

    That’s weird, people were just discussing whether any new characters would enter Dany’s story-line in season 4.

    Surprised Hizdahr has been introduced this early but this guy seems pretty cool.

    Things I want to see from Dany’s story-line in season 4

    Barristan doing something awesome. Whether its defeating the Meereeneese champion or saving Dany from a would-be assassin the show-watchers need to see why the book readers call him Barristan the Badass.

    To further the Dany/ Jorah relationship. Namely the kiss. I’m assuming that Jorah will be banished in the season 4 finale.

    Naked Missandei.

  60. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 9:23 pm | Permalink

    Steven,

    I’m not gonna lie, it was hard for me to stay interested in the whole Meereenese chapters of ADWD, so I may be mistaken, but I got the impression Hizdahr was gay and had no desire for Dany other than for power. Or perhaps I have him confused with Xaro. You can tell that I’m not a huge fan of Daenerys.

  61. sand snake
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 9:27 pm | Permalink

    Not too crazy about this casting choice. Hizdaq should be older and more boring looking. This guy looks too hot for the role.

  62. Hounded
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 9:38 pm | Permalink

    He looks more like Daario to me. Except the hair.

  63. Dweezil
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 9:58 pm | Permalink

    That Stark boy,

    GRRM and D&D have repeatedly stated belwas will not be in the show.

  64. Phil
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 10:04 pm | Permalink

    Weird how everyone is saying he looks too young and good-looking for Hizdahr, because i always pictured the character as somewhat young, and I thought in DwD Dany does mention him as being an attractive man, just with a lame personality

  65. King Tommen
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 10:13 pm | Permalink

    And just in case it wasn’t 100% confirmed yet, Hoji Fortuna (the guy that was reportedly cast a little while ago and everyone assumed was Brown Ben Plumm until HBO furiously denied it) has been tweeting and sharing photos from Split and other spots in Croatia where GoT is currently filming and today tweeted out “Winter is Coming”.

    Can we just go ahead and say the guy’s on the show? Not sure why HBO denied it so vehemently.

  66. Ours is the Fury
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 10:24 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen: Can we just go ahead and say the guy’s on the show? Not sure why HBO denied it so vehemently.

    HBO denied that he was Brown Ben or any notable role. It’s possible that he’s an extra or a featured extra or something along those lines.

  67. King Tommen
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 10:41 pm | Permalink

    Ours is the Fury: HBO denied that he was Brown Ben or any notable role. It’s possible that he’s an extra or a featured extra or something along those lines.

    I suppose that’s possible but he’s a fairly accomplished actor who is about the furthest thing from a “local” as you could get. They’d really bring a guy in from overseas to be a featured extra? He’s also got a recent video of himself practicing sword play which seems like a weird thing for an extra who did not have a stunt backgroud, but a theatrical one to be doing.

    I mean, we’ve got a post listing all the adult film actresses who are going to be essentially interchangeable window dressing in a 30 second scene with no lines, should we at least not be including this guy?

  68. Easteros bunny
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 10:43 pm | Permalink

    WeirwoodTreeHugger,

    So I’m not allowed to be excited? So being excited is called trolling? Please so not insult me like that.

    I didn’t know fans had to be so bloody serious about everything.

  69. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 11:00 pm | Permalink

    My thoughts on this:
    I have never seen any of his work, but he has the right look. As for the whole age issue: I don’t know where people are getting ‘mid-late forties’ from, I always pictured Hizdahr as being in his mid to late twenties, so this guy seems about right.

    I also don’t see why people are assuming this means we will go deep into ADwD in season 4. I am expecting Hizdahr’s role in season 4 to be something along the lines of this: a representative for Meereen, similar to the Yunkish noble from season 3, and then in a scene or two late in the season after Daenerys takes the city. Basically a sort of cameo to establish the character ahead of the ADwD material in
    seasons 5 and 6.

    As for Daenerys’ story as a whole: I think the most natural place to end season 4 would be with her deciding to stay and rule. As for season 5, I think the most natural place to conclude it would be with Daenerys agreeing to marry Hizdahr. Season 5 would mostly be about the shadow war and the instabilities within Meereen, and their engagement marks an end to those instabilities. That leaves the knot for the first half of season 6. As for the fighting pits, I am predicting that to be in episode 5 of season 6. As for the battle of Meereen, I would expect that to be in episode 2 of season 7. Although it would be nice for it to be in season 6, Stannis vs the Boltons will likely be in season 6 and they don’t have the budget to have both of those events in one season.

    Deekan,
    I don’t see how that would make it clustered. Because of the leech scene we know that Balon will have to die very early in season 4. It only makes sense for Euron to crown himself in season 4, so that they can set up the Kingsmoot to happen early in season 5.

  70. Ours is the Fury
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 11:44 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen: They’d really bring a guy in from overseas to be a featured extra? He’s also got a recent video of himself practicing sword play which seems like a weird thing for an extra who did not have a stunt backgroud, but a theatrical one to be doing.

    I mean, we’ve got a post listing all the adult film actresses who are going to be essentially interchangeable window dressing in a 30 second scene with no lines, should we at least not be including this guy?

    Yes they would bring a guy from overseas to be a featured extra. For example, the man who played the Unsullied soldier who got his nipple cut off last season was a British actor flown over. There were several others actors and stunt men who were flown in to be Unsullied. The slave on the Walk of Punishment who refused a drink of water from Daenerys is another British actor flown to the location, not a local extra. There have been some this season. As for a post, there already was a post that featured Fortuna weeks ago so I’m not sure what your complaint is.

  71. Eren
    Posted September 27, 2013 at 11:57 pm | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    I think your theory isn’t taking into account the fact the show is only 8 season. So season 4567 Dany stay in one place and the last season for the last book. Isn’t that cutting it too close.

  72. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 1:05 am | Permalink

    Eren,
    yes, and the books are only going to be a trilogy…

    The 8 season/80 hour figure isn’t something set in stone, it is merely an estimate. I take it the same way as GRRM’s 3/4/6/7 book comments; “this is what we are aiming for, but if we need more we will have more”.

    Also, it would still keep with the 1 book = 1 season (except for ASoS) pattern:
    1 – AGoT
    2 – ACoK
    3/4 – ASoS
    5 – AFfC/ADwD
    6 – ADwD/TWoW
    7 – TWoW
    8 – ADoS (and any remaining TWoW stuff)
    possibly 9 – ADoS part 2.

    So in the end:
    AGoT – 1 season
    ACoK – 1 season
    ASoS – 2 seasons
    AFfC – 0.5 seasons (running parallel with the first half of ADwD)
    ADwD – 1 season (half running parallel with AFfC, half running parallel with TWoW material)
    TWoW – 1.5 seasons
    ADoS – 1 or 2 seasons

    Also, where is the 7 in ’4567 Dany stays in one place’ coming from? it would be 4.5-6.5, with her briefly returning in 7.

  73. Caravaggio
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 2:40 am | Permalink

    Easteros bunny:
    WeirwoodTreeHugger,

    So I’m not allowed to be excited? So being excited is called trolling? Please so not insult me like that.

    I didn’t know fans had to be so bloody serious about everything.

    Stop playing dumb. The “overly excited to the point of mocking and being outraged because it’s genuine” bait and switch is played out. Well, every court needs a fool, so carry on while we receive the casting news with level heads.

  74. Pau
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:09 am | Permalink

    sunspear: Personally I was thinking for Dany:

    End season four with her locking up her dragons.
    End Season 5 with her marriage to Hizdahr (she’ll need to be deemphasized that season)
    Have the dragon pit happen in episode 2 season 6.
    Then include the Battle of Meereen and whatever it takes to get Dany started on her way to Westeros by the end of season 6.

    I like that but instead of episode 2 of season 6, think episode 4, as they like to put the wtf moments there for the critics to review

    Caravaggio: Stop playing dumb. The “overly excited to the point of mocking and being outraged because it’s genuine” bait and switch is played out. Well, every court needs a fool, so carry on while we receive the casting news with level heads.

    Lol I think you’re reading too much into it

  75. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:12 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    I think the Battle of Meereen should and will be in season 6 and the Battle of Winterfell should be early season 7.

  76. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:21 am | Permalink

    sunspear,

    That works better. It would be terrible to try and stretch what little is left of Dany’s plot after the Pit in a whole season. But that would mean Dany’s season 5 will be a bore-fest… Hopefully she falls into the background for that season so show watchers won’t hate her like most book readers :/

  77. Ross
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:25 am | Permalink

    I don’t think I read GRRM’s descriptions very closely as I had the stadium announcer from ‘Gladiator’ in my head for Hizdhar.

    I recognise the actor, I think he had a small part in British comedy twenty twelve (in the useless PR company ‘Perfect Curve’)

  78. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:43 am | Permalink

    Jentario,
    I would actually say the opposite :P. There is more that they can do with the material in Meereen (especially from the knot onwards) than there is in the North, so it would be harder to delay Stannis vs the Boltons that long. Also, having Stannis vs the Boltons in season 6 allows them to end that season with Jon’s death. Either way could work well, though.

    Overall, though, I still think that the best thing for Daenerys’ storyline would be:
    season 4A: build up the divisions with Jorah and establish Meereen
    season 4B: taking Meereen and the immediate fallout (Jorah’s banishment, executing the 163 slavers etc), ending with her declaring she will rule Meereen
    season 5A: the shadow war, ending with the dragons being chained and Daenerys telling Hizdahr that she will marry him if he can stop the deaths. Depending on how they adapt it the shadow war could be great
    season 5B: preparing for the Yunkish siege, ending with Daenerys agreeing to marry Hizdahr (which marks the end of the internal instability, as far as they are concerned)
    season 6A: the knot, with the fighting pit in episode 4 or 5
    season 6B: the Barristan and Quentyn plots. My theory is that Daenerys’ first few chapters in TWoW chronologically take place at the same time as Barristan’s ADwD chapters, so we could get all of Daenerys’ dothraki stuff in this time as well
    season 7: battle in episode 2. My theory is that Daenerys will return right at the end of the battle, and that the Meereenese stuff will be concluded shortly after. So episode 2 could end with Daenerys declaring it is time to go to Westeros. Most-all of the rest of her season would then be their journey to Westeros.

    The problem with having the fighting pits in season 5 is that it would require the storylines of other characters (namely Tyrion, and to a lesser extent Quentyn) to be extremely rushed, while keep the knot for season 6 would allow them to do justice to those storylines (or in Quentyn‘s case, allow them to build him up).

  79. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:58 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    The fact is, having Stannis vs the Boltons would PREVENT having Jon’s stabbing at the end of the season. You forget that it hasn’t happened yet in the books, even if the timelines are a bit off. How I would do it is to show Stannis is cornered in the snowy lake and to cut away just before the battle begins somewhere in episode 10, then at the end of the episode Jon receives the letter. The Battle in the Ice is not the Battle of Winterfell, there is still a lot of setup left, and unless you believe Stannis is actually dead (and no one believes that), then there still a lot of time left till the Battle of Winterfell.

    I really think that the Meereen storyline needs to conclude as soon as possible and Dany should be on her way home early in season 7 or even in the season 6 finally (assuming that’s what happens in TWOW shortly after the battle) because there’s only so much Meereen one can take. Not getting the Battle of Meereen in ADWD and having to wait was a huge disappointment (much less than having to wait for Winterfell IMO), and I’d rather the show make better use of the half of TWOW they need for season 6.

  80. Lollius Palicanus
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:04 am | Permalink

    They probably won’t work out Quentyn’s storyline, as it seems to me to be largely filler.

  81. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:04 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,
    Part 2
    Yeah, I already realized that it makes no sense. It’ll have to be S6E4 or so.

  82. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:12 am | Permalink

    Lollius Palicanus,

    Necessary filler. It’s what will likely set up Dorne to join Aegon and fight against Dany in the second DotD. It could be omitted but part of me thinks that he’ll appear in Meereen, even if most of the rest of his journey will be cut.

  83. loco73
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:15 am | Permalink

    Hizl fo’ shizzle my nizzle! Yep great choice! Welcome to “Game Of Thrones” dear sir! Oh, beware the dragons and their Mother!

  84. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:26 am | Permalink

    Jentario,
    My impression, while reading the books, is that Stannis vs the Boltons has happened, and that the first section of TWoW will, chronologically, run parallel to the last ~20 chapters of ADwD. I don’t believe that Stannis is dead, or even that Ramsay sent the letter, but I do think that the battle happens before Jon’s death.

    Lollius Palicanus,
    I thought that Quentyn’s arc was very necessary for the plot, and that it will translate to tv brilliantly. I would say that the two PoV characters at greatest risk of being cut entirely are Aeron and Areo, but even then I doubt it simply because they are PoV characters.

  85. Turncloak
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:47 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    You are correct. The battle of ice happens prior to Jon recieving the letter as confirmed by GRRM. D&D have two approaches. They can use Jentarios theory and have Stannis cornered and then cut to Jon’s letter and then show the battle later; or they can actually show the battle of ice first and then show Jon reading the letter in the next episode. Chronologically speaking the battle of ice happens before Jon reads the letter

  86. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:52 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    I think the Battle of Ice happened- where the Manderlys turn on the Boltons, kill the Freys and make an arrangement with Stannis, after which Lord Manderly returns to the Boltons saying they managed to kill Stannis (giving him the sword as proof) while he’s actually infiltrating the castle with many of Stanis’s men dressed as Freys (like the Trojan horse) and waiting to attack from the inside at the right moment. This fits nicely with the letter.

    I’m any case, Stannis can not be revealed to be alive until after the Pink Letter scene, which means the battle and its aftermath will have to be shown, like in the books, after Jon’s stabbing.

  87. Chickenduck
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 5:21 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu:
    Jentario,
    My impression… is that the first section of TWoW will, chronologically, run parallel to the last ~20 chapters of ADwD.

    GRRM has already confirmed this to be correct.

    The sample chapter from TWoW with Stannis and Theon happens before the last scene of ADWD.

    There’s an interesting theory discussed on the westeros forums as to whether Stannis himself actually wrote the “Pink Letter” addressed to “Bastard”, in an effort to trick Jon into coming to Winterfell… Although he probably didn’t expect him to get stabbed.

  88. Al Swearengen
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 5:24 am | Permalink

    Wow this is awful casting.

  89. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 5:26 am | Permalink

    Chickenduck,

    Yes, but we don’t know if the actual Battle of Winterfell and it’s aftermath already happened. We just know that the first few Theon/Asha chapters will run concurrent to the last few ADWD chapters.

  90. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 6:10 am | Permalink

    Jentario,
    It only needs to happen like that IF Ramsay is the one that wrote the letter.

    Chickenduck,
    This is purely speculation, but my theory for the north in TWoW is this: The Manderlys and Umbers turn on the Boltons, making the battle even. Davos then returns with Rickon… and an army of Skagosi. They flank the opposition and the Boltons are defeated. Roose is either killed or manages to escape. In the aftermath Stannis executes Ramsay as Theon looks on. Then from Davos’ perspective, he comes forward with Rickon and Wyman Manderly thanks Stannis for bringing the North “our Stark… Our king” and the northerners turn on Stannis. Davos is captured but spared as a courtesy for retrieving Rickon (and he becomes the PoV for Rickon), while Asha, Theon, Stannis and a small number of his men manage to flee north. Then from Asha’s perspective we see Stannis shaken. He writes a letter to Jon from Ramsay’s perspective (the pink letter), and seals it with the wax from the letter Ramsay sent to Asha. His hope is to draw Jon south; if he has a son of Winterfell… Rickon’s half-brother… by his side he will be able to make peace with the north. Asha then explains the Kingsmoot to Stannis, and how it is void because of Theon’s absence. She promises to overthrow Euron and raise the Iron Islands for Stannis if he lets them go. In his desperation he agrees (this sets up the Iron Islands in TWoW).

    After that we have 3 Melisandre chapters at the wall: the first is the immediate aftermath of Jon’s death. Jon’s body is thrown in an ice cell. The second is Stannis returning. He demands to know why Jon never rode south, and Melisandre tells him about the assassination and that the Night’s Watch will no longer provide him with refuge. With his last hope gone Stannis, the pure iron, breaks and leaves in silence, his destination unknown. He doesn’t appear again until much later (possibly not even until ADoS), and when he does he will be an antagonistic figure (possibly leading the Others). In the third Melisandre chapter we see her looking into the flames and reflecting on the situation. She finally realises that Jon is Azod Ahai and goes to his body… (End chapter). The chapter immediately after it is Jon’s first chapter. He is warged into Ghost for most of the chapter, but at the end he feels the presence of his body as a container to warg into. The chapter ends with him standing over Melisandre’s corpse.

  91. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 6:38 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    Now that is pure speculation. I think you went a bit far with Stanis leading the Others but otherwise… I never understood why people insist that Ramsay didn’t write the letter. Is there any evidence whatsoever that implicates that?

  92. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 6:59 am | Permalink

    Jentario,
    My main (only) reasoning for the Stannis leading the Other’s thing is Daenerys’ vision where she is fighting ‘the usurper’ on the trident, and the usurper’s army is armoured in ice.

    As for Ramsay’s letter, I don’t actually have any evidence for it, it just seems like something GRRM would do :P.

    EDIT: I guess there is one thing: Why would Ramsay think Jon has Jeyne and Theon?

    And now that I look it up, there is some stuff that suggest that Mance was the one that wrote it.

  93. NomadicDirewolf
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 6:59 am | Permalink

    cant say im too suprised to see this part cast this season given that they have been bringing other storylines forward this season, and dany’s is probably one of the ones in which this makes the most sense, otherwise the entire season would have to be the siege and then battle of meereen, but i think this season will conclude that around mid season, and introduce a few plotlines in meereen toward the end, bringing forward the banishing of jorah to the end of the season to give dany’s arc a good ending</b in terms of the actor, if you look at the portraits on the internet (dont know if this is a valid source) he looks about the same age and appearance (suprising given how distinctive hizdahr looks), so in terms of that i like this casting, just have to wait till season 4 comes around to see how good an actor he is i guess.

  94. Hounded
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 7:05 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    That’s an interesting theory for sure. I agree with Jentario that Stannis leading the others is a bit far-fetched though.

  95. sunspear
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 7:13 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    Ugh, I really hope that isn’t what happens. If the Northerners turn on Stannis after all he’s done for them, the others can kill them all as far as I’m concerned.

  96. Chickenduck
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 7:20 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    That seems reasonable. It seems fairly obvious that the first part is correct – the Manderleys and Umbers turning on the Freys/Boltons. And I think it’s highly likely that either Stannis or maybe Mance wrote the pink letter, either because they wanted his help in the battle, or because they had some other reason for wanting a Stark back in Winterfell.

    On another note, my favourite minor character, for some reason, has long been Mors Umber. Hoping we get to see that Crowfood maybe in S5.

    One other thing I hope to see in the North/Wall storyline in TWoW – discussion of exactly who Ned Stark’s mother was. GRRM includes in detailed genealogies of all the main characters, with basically anyone who matters discussing their parents and grandparents at some point in general conversation. EXCEPT… Ned. Lots about his father’s line, but nothing about his mother, except for small snippets about a Flint grandmother. All that talk in the books about the mystery of Jon’s mother, maybe it’s partially a veiled hint that we need to think about who Ned’s unspecified mother is.

    Also wondering if it’s relevant that Stannis is 1/4 Targ, after I got thinking about it listening to the discussion on the last GOO… Although maybe that just reflects that a lot of noble families acquired a Targ-in-law at some point.

  97. Veltigar
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 7:31 am | Permalink

    Chickenduck:
    Ser Tahu,

    snip

    tWoW spoilers It’s pretty obvious that Ramsay wrote the letter after receiving wrong information by Stannis. Remember the Theon sample chapter? In that chapter Stannis weeds out the traitors in his midst. One of those traitors was a maester with two ravens, who was ordered to send word of Stannis position and strength to WF. Stannis used those ravens (and help from the Manderleys) to feed lies to Ramsay who then moved to claim the credit of the “victory” over Stannis.

  98. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 8:20 am | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    This. I firmly stand by my Trojan Horse theory.

  99. Garlan the Gallant
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 8:31 am | Permalink

    sand snake,

    ?? In the books he is described as slim and slender with flawless skin.

  100. Veltigar
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 8:44 am | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Veltigar,

    This. I firmly stand by my Trojan Horse theory.

    That theory has more merrit than all the others so I support it as well

  101. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 8:50 am | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    I just find it weird that anyone but Ramsay wrote the letter. I don’t understand why there are so many theories about it… Why can’t it just be Ramsay, plain and simple?

  102. GeekFurious
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 9:03 am | Permalink

    Chickenduck,
    This is purely speculation, but my theory for the north in TWoW is this:

    Wow… why have I never read this theory about who wrote the letter before? That actually makes so much sense!

  103. Harry Lime
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 9:16 am | Permalink

    Lonestarr1337:
    IT BEGINS, SHOW-WATCHERS!

    THE AGE OF CONFUSING MEEREENESE NAMES IN UPON YOU!

    Hizdahr is a pretty distinctive name. And show watchers will have the advantage of being able to put names to faces, so they’ll probably have it easier than we ever did.

  104. Eren
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 9:24 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    You said season 7 episode 2 is the big battle over there and that would mean she hasn’t gone to westro yet. I don’t think the tv audience would like that she still is at that city for those 4 season. I think season 4 she take the city. Season 5 her rule and relationship to established peace. Early season 6 the war and end of season wow stuff that I hope lead to her return to westero.

  105. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 9:26 am | Permalink

    sand snake,
    I know! How dare they make Hizdahr someone who looks like how Hizdahr is described in the books! Ridiculous! D&D are ruining the show…

    In all seriousness, there are ONLY two differences between my mental image of Hizdahr and this guy:
    1) I pictured Hizdahr with shorter hair
    2) I pictured Hizdahr as being a little bit darker.
    Basically, I pictured this image: http://awoiaf.westeros.org/images/e/ec/Hizdahr1.jpg

  106. King DBC
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 9:39 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    There’s no way they drag out the so called knot that long, no way! ADWD needs to be pretty much done and dealt with by the end of S5, I agree with the guy who said end that with the fighting pit. I’ve read your blog thing where you predict the seasons, it’s all great and stuff except that you drag AFFC/ADWD out way too much… The second half of S6 should be well into TWOW. The fourth episode of S6, I think, could end with Varys’ return. There’s the WHOA for the critics.

  107. Turncloak
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 9:40 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    You left out how the ice will play a deciding role in the battle against the Boltons. Stannis: “We hold the ground”. The ice has many holes and is completely fished out. Stannis will do battle against The Boltons on a frozen lake and Boltons army will fall through the ice similar to the battle of ice in history. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Ice

  108. Hard Truths
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 10:43 am | Permalink

    The show is not going to run 10+ years; D and D have said on multiple occasions that they envision 8 seasons (which seems like the max, as a different producer was quoted at 7 seasons last yr). So in my mind it becomes a numbers game; if we are going to see 80 hrs of ASOIAF wouldn’t you rather see 15 hrs of AFFC + ADWD and 30 hrs of TWOW + ADOS then the opposite? (I am obviously operating under the assumption that TWOW + ADOS will be the payoff to AFFC + ADWD’s setup).

    Also, if the show loses momentum it could lose the causal viewer, which might mean a decline in budget, a fewer number of seasons, or cancellation before the story is completed. Multiple seasons of Dany playing Abe Lincoln and day dreaming about Daario would be the death of this show.

  109. Veltigar
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 11:15 am | Permalink

    Turncloak:
    Ser Tahu,

    You left out how the ice will play a deciding role in the battle against the Boltons. Stannis: “We hold the ground”. The ice has many holes and is completely fished out. Stannis will do battle against The Boltons on a frozen lake and Boltons army will fall through the ice similar to the battle of ice in history. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Ice

    It’s fantasy and all but I was under the impression that the ice on said lake wasn’t that thin. Sure, Stannis men cut a lot of holes in it but I believe that ice restores very very quickly in the kind of conditions around the lake. Of course this is fantasy so suspension of disbelief and all that but still… An interesting alternative for the cracking ice that I have seen proposed before was the idea of a fortress of snow. In that scenario Stannis would board of a perimeter around the edge of the village by creating a wall of snow. The battle would be a lot bloodier but it could happen since the Freys are entirely unprepared for winter warfare while Stannis has battlehardened veterans and northerners on his side

  110. Veltigar
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 11:23 am | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Veltigar,

    I just find it weird that anyone but Ramsay wrote the letter. I don’t understand why there are so many theories about it… Why can’t it just be Ramsay, plain and simple?

    Well for starters I think that it’s worth noting that it is not just Ramsay plain and simple. Ramsay wrote the letter after he was fed false information by Stannis BAMF Baratheon. I think that those readers that have not yet checked out Theon’s sample chapter can be easily confused. Personally, I was convinced that Stannis fed Ramsay BS after reading Jons final chapter but I get that people could believe otherwise. What baffles me is that people who have read Theon’s sample chapter still believe in one of those retarded theories (e.g. Mance wrote it, Stannis wrote it, etc.).

  111. Lollius Palicanus
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 1:02 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    I fully agree, that’s what I meant. It would be very strange for George to include an unnecessary POV (maybe an unfortunate POV like Hotah, but hey). Yet, for television Quentyn’s journey is a major detour without many payoffs, so it will likely be mostly cut. His arrival in Meereen will remain though.

    Ser Tahu,

    Yes they will be cut too, Arianne easily replaces Hotah and could use some more fleshing out anyway.

    I believe the showrunners have stated that not every storyline will be included, I think these three are the major candidates, together with Brienne’s detour, Victarion’s journey, and possibly (although not hopefully) even Sam’s explorations (and fat pink mast). So long as they don’t cut Euron/Victarion entirely or Young Griff…

  112. Khal-A-Bunga
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 1:20 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen,

    Do you have to bitch and moan about everything? And please, change your user name. The fictional Al Swearengen was a great man, and you… Are not. Con Stapleton is a much more fitting user name, if you’re going to stick to the Deadwood theme.

    Anyway, I’ve never seen this guy in anything, so I can’t speak to his acting abilities, but he’s got a good look. Nina Gold has very rarely let us down (I’m looking at you, stable boy who gets stabbed by Arya…), so I’m not too concerned about whether or not he’ll be good for the part.

    The casting, in general, hasn’t been all that exciting for me this season. It’s interesting that they’re casting some characters I definitely did not expect to see this early on, but I’m more excited to hear about Euron, Victarion, Doran, and a few other characters we’ll likely see in the fifth season.

  113. Lollius Palicanus
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 1:23 pm | Permalink

    Edward James Olmos 4 Doran.

  114. Joshua Atreides
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 1:24 pm | Permalink

    Khal-A-Bunga,

    More of a Bill McCall if you ask me. “I’m not impressed…”

  115. Joshua Atreides
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 2:57 pm | Permalink

    Jimmy Smits for Doran

  116. richard casey
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:10 pm | Permalink

    I always saw him in my head as a much older and unappealing man who dany was all but forced to marry.

    Not sure where i got that from but i always saw it as no possible way she would ever want him

  117. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:32 pm | Permalink

    richard casey,

    She kinda said he was hot, so that’s just not true. I did imagine him as much older, though.

  118. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 3:44 pm | Permalink

    Joshua Atreides,
    I can never find someone who looks like the Doran in my head. For me it has to be someone between the age of 50 and 70 with favor of something in between and he has to have an extremely nice/sympathetic face that is almost sad/depressed. The rest can be done with wigs and makeup, but this much is necessary IMO.

  119. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:00 pm | Permalink

    Lollius Palicanus,

    Saw him in Dexter and I’ve got to disagree.

  120. Chickenduck
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:41 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar: Well for starters I think that it’s worth noting that it is not just Ramsay plain and simple. Ramsay wrote the letter after he was fed false information by Stannis BAMF Baratheon. I think that those readers that have not yet checked out Theon’s sample chapter can be easily confused. Personally, I was convinced that Stannis fed Ramsay BS after reading Jons final chapter but I get that people could believe otherwise. What baffles me is that people who have read Theon’s sample chapter still believe in one of those retarded theories (e.g. Mance wrote it, Stannis wrote it, etc.).

    Dude, we’ve all read the sample chapter – the various pink letter theories showed up on the internet :because of: the chapter.

    It might just be the obvious answer, but we’ll just have to wait and see. GRRM doesn’t tend to do the obvious thing.

  121. Jentario
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 4:43 pm | Permalink

    Chickenduck,

    Show me evidence that Ramsay didn’t write the letter and I’ll start listening.

  122. Harry Lime
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 5:36 pm | Permalink

    Okay, I’ll play along: Demian Bichir for Doran.

  123. Lollius Palicanus
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    Of course Stannis did not write the pink letter. It would be a horrible character assassination. Him calling himself a false king? Him calling Melisandre and the spearwives whores? Him proclaiming that he has friends (contrasting to the chapter where he meets Catelyn and Renly in aCoK)? Him implying that he was sent by Jon? Him coming up with eating people’s hearts? And most of all, Stannis lying about Ramsay being trueborn? No way.

  124. Khal-A-Bunga
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 6:06 pm | Permalink

    Alexander Siddig for Doran! Ray Stevenson for Victarion! Lars Mikkelsen for Euron!

  125. Rygar
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 6:08 pm | Permalink

    And Charlie Cox as Arys Oakheart

  126. Stanley Barrett
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 7:36 pm | Permalink

    Lollius Palicanus,

    You understand we’re talking about Stannis impersonating Ramsay, not writing his own point of view, right?

  127. Chickenduck
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 7:50 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Chickenduck,

    Show me evidence that Ramsay didn’t write the letter and I’ll start listening.

    Well, this could be coincidence, but Theon tells Stannis in the sample chapter that “He wants his bride back, and he wants his Reek back”, which is echoed exactly in the letter, just with “he/his” changed to “I/my”.

    Furthermore, would Ramsay call Mance’s baby a Little Prince? Wouldn’t he just think of him as another wildling brat? Stannis on the other hand DOES refer to him as such on numerous occasions.

    Could be completely wrong, and the line could just be a coincidence, but GRRM doesn’t usually do coincidence :)

    And anyway, it’s fun to theorise!

  128. Chickenduck
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 7:55 pm | Permalink

    Also, the letter doesn’t have Ramsay’s seal, just a smear of pink wax…

  129. Joshua Atreides
    Posted September 28, 2013 at 11:20 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    Re: Charlie Cox: at least he won’t be sent back dead in a box…. Oh wait.

  130. Khal-A-Bunga
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 2:48 am | Permalink

    Rygar,

    Great idea. Loved him on Boardwalk Empire.

  131. Lollius Palicanus
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:23 am | Permalink

    Stanley Barrett,

    Of course, but even if his sense of justice would allow him to impersonate Ramsay, Stannis’s personality would intervene with his writing. We have often seen that Stannis discards possibilities which are very pragmatic in favour of doing ‘the right thing’ in his eyes. It would be horribly a-typical to impersonate someone he despises, and even more so to write the things I have listed.

    Is there, by the way, any indication that Ramsay has a seal ring in the books? I always understood the lack of a seal as a sign Roose had died against Stannis in some way (or perhaps assassinated and hidden by Mance Rayder), so he wouldn’t have had the seal.

  132. Dolorous Ned
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 8:33 am | Permalink

    Here’s another one.

    https://twitter.com/Tilly210/status/384263332150005760/photo/1

    I wonder what that greenscreen is for.

  133. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 8:38 am | Permalink

    Dolorous Ned,

    Boomsplosions.

  134. Hounded
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 9:08 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    I think that Stannis will reclaim Winterfell for the Starks. Davos rocks up with Rickon and an army of Skagosi (loyal to Rickon and the Starks.) Then the northerners like Wyman Manderly and maybe a freed GreatJon are like ‘thanks for that Stannis, Rickon is our new King now’. Stannis is furious but realizes he can’t win in a fight against them so retreats to the NightFort which he takes as his seat. This will be reminiscent of the Night King. He won’t become an Other or lead the Others or anything like that though.

  135. mariamb
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 9:12 am | Permalink

    H. Stark,

    Great photos – thanks! Did not spot Michiel Huisman in any of them. Wondering if they will change up Daario’s “look” now that there is a different actor (for example, ditching the Fabio wig). It will be interesting to see how our new Daario will be introduced.

    Found Iain Glen in photo #13.

  136. Chickenduck
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 9:38 am | Permalink

    mariamb:
    H. Stark,

    Great photos – thanks! Did not spot Michiel Huisman in any of them. Wondering if they will change up Daario’s “look” now that there is a different actor (for example, ditching the Fabio wig). It will be interesting to see how our new Daario will be introduced.

    Strongly doubt it. When you re-cast, you usually try and keep EVERYTHING the same as much as possible, so that it’s completely obvious to the audience that it’s the sane character.

    And anyway… Drogo and Faabio have already established Dany’s “type” as being “Muscular, murderous, but with suspiciously well cared-for long, shiny hair and makeup. So they’ll probably stick to it.

  137. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 11:30 am | Permalink

    Hounded:
    Ser Tahu,

    I think that Stannis will reclaim Winterfell for the Starks. Davos rocks up with Rickon and an army of Skagosi (loyal to Rickon and the Starks.) Then the northerners like Wyman Manderly and maybe a freed GreatJon are like ‘thanks for that Stannis, Rickon is our new King now’. Stannis is furious but realizes he can’t win in a fight against them so retreats to the NightFort which he takes as his seat. This will be reminiscent of the Night King. He won’t become an Other or lead the Others or anything like that though.

    With respect to both you and Ser Tahu’s speculations, I agree that Stannis is destined to serve as a major force in the final vision of Westeros but he will never attain his true dream of ultimate rule. He is drawn as a tragic figure, imho. If he doesn’t perish as a result of battle or his actions with the Others (or other deals with Mel/R’hllor that he makes), I can see him in the position of “Brooder of the North”…possibly a key liaison between the supernatural threat of the North and the rest of Westeros….maybe he will help reshape the vision and understanding of the North (or is that Bran’s job?) and rid it of the “threat”.

    To me, something about Stannis’s character indicates a destination of “what ifs”, more brooding, and isolation. I wouldn’t put it past GRRM to create a tolerant alliance between Mance and Stannis either (if Mance actually matters on a large scale anymore). If the “pink letter” is actually more than the “obvious” (as others have speculated) then there is much possibility there.

  138. Eljuma
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 11:39 am | Permalink

    Al Swearengen,

    Wow, y

    Al Swearengen:
    Wow this is awful casting.

    Wow, you aren’t trying anymore.

  139. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 12:10 pm | Permalink

    Selmy:
    That’s weird, people were just discussing whether any new characters would enter Dany’s story-line in season 4. Surprised Hizdahr has been introduced this early but this guy seems pretty cool.

    Interesting casting choice. Thx for the info, OitF (and others).

    I have a feeling he will be introduced to Dany this season playing the noted role as a master of political intrigue and balance of power around Slaver’s Bay (much like in ADwD…sort of…) in order to ramp up the various power struggles. Obviously, there will be conflict between Hizdahr and Daario/Selmy…supposedly with Jorah out of the picture…and forcing Dany to make a choice about her future. Then by the end of S4 and throughout S5, things get heated and unstable.

    This, along with the adventures of all those others, even the hapless Quentyn, as they race to get to Dany, could get very interesting as the plot leads to Daznak’s Pit (major CGI) by the end of S5 and the battle of Meereen. I think this a decent opportunity for the showrunners to showcase the robust drama in Slaver’s Bay without too much drag .

    Hint to HBO/D&D (*laughs*)…minimize the teenage dilly-dallying and focus on the intense treachery and mysterious prophesy at work in Yunkai/Meereen, please.

  140. Ghost
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 1:02 pm | Permalink

    Question for you guys about the Pink letter. Does anyone else find it weird that there is no mention of Ramsay’s huge spikey hand writing like we hear about in his previous letters to Jon and Asha?

  141. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 1:29 pm | Permalink

    Ghost:
    Question for you guys about the Pink letter. Does anyone else find it weird that there is no mention of Ramsay’s huge spikey hand writing like we hear about in his previous letters to Jon and Asha?

    Yes, quite odd…of course it could be a GRRM editing issue since the pink letter scene is still “unofficial”….but little things like the lack of Ramsay’s seal (as Chickenduck pointed out) in the pink wax and the handwriting question probably do matter…(oh, those pesky details!)

  142. TheBerylfly
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 2:49 pm | Permalink

    I hope they will cast the Green Grace, 100% sure she is the harpy and a sympathetic character to boot

  143. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 2:49 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,
    You people have managed to make me not shun those theories right away now. That said, I still think that my original theory is the most likely because it just seems like the right thing for Stannis to do in his current situation.

  144. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 2:51 pm | Permalink

    TheBerylfly,

    Season 5, my friend. Same goes for the Shavepate aka the Locust poisoner if that awesome new theory is correct.

  145. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 3:12 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Hodor’s Bastard,
    You people have managed to make me not shun those theories right away now. That said, I still think that my original theory is the most likely because it just seems like the right thing for Stannis to do in his current situation.

    I forgot to credit you as well in my original response. The alternatives to the “obvious” are fun to ponder. I rather enjoyed your “trojan horse” approach with the Frey/Bolton infiltration. On another note, I don’t quite follow the “Stannis death” theories and the issue with the Jon/Stannis timeline either….I seem to be missing some key info.

  146. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 3:16 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    We know for fact that the last Jon chapter in ADWD happens after the first few Theon/Asha/camp Stannis chapters in TWOW. How much farther, we don’t know but it’s safe to assume that the battle in the ice already happened.

  147. Veltigar
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 3:46 pm | Permalink

    1) The Pink letter could have been written by a maester or someone else on the orders of one of the keyplayers.
    2) Ramsay does not have a seal
    3) From tWoW sample chapter of Theon Read the bolded part but only if you are okay with being spoiled
    Stannis gestured at the black birds in the cages. “These two are not so clever, I presume.”

    “No, Your Grace. Would that it were so.”

    “Tell me, then. Where are these two trained to fly?”

    Maester Tybald did not answer. Theon Greyjoy kicked his feet feebly, and laughed under his

    breath. Caught!
    “Answer me. If we were to loose these birds, would they return to the Dreadfort?” The king

    leaned forward. “Or might they fly for Winterfell instead?”

    Maester Tybald pissed his robes. Theon could not see the dark stain spreading from where

    he hung, but the smell of piss was sharp and strong.
    “Maester Tybald has lost his tongue,” Stannis observed to his knights. “Godry, how many

    cages did you find?”

    “Three, Your Grace,” said the big knight in the silvered breastplate. “One was empty.”

    “Y-your Grace, my order is sworn to serve, we… ”

    “I know all about your vows. What I want to know is what was in the letter that you sent to

    Winterfell. Did you perchance tell Lord Bolton where to find us?”

    “S-sire.” Round-shouldered Tybald drew himself up proudly.

    “The rules of my order forbid me to divulge the contents of Lord Arnolf’s letters.”

    “Your vows are stronger than your bladder, it would seem.”

    “Your Grace must understand — ”

    “Must I?” The king shrugged. “If you say so. You are a man of learning, after all. I had a

    maester on Dragonstone who was almost a father to me. I have great respect for your order

    and its vows. Ser Clayton does not share my feelings, though. He learned all he knows in the

    wynds of Flea Bottom. Were I to put you in his charge, he might strangle you with your own

    chain or scoop your eye out with a spoon.”

    “Only the one, Your Grace,” volunteered the balding knight, him of the winged pig. “I’d leave

    t’other.”

    “How many eyes does a maester need to read a letter?” asked Stannis. “One should suffice,

    I’d think. I would not wish to leave you unable to fulfill your duties to your lord. Roose Bolton’s

    men may well be on their way to attack us even now, however, so you must understand if I

    skimp on certain courtesies. I will ask you once again. What was in the message you sent to

    Winterfell?”

    The maester quivered. “A m-map, Your Grace.”

    The king leaned back in his chair. “Get him out of here,” he commanded. “Leave the

    ravens.” A vein was throbbing in his neck. “Confine this grey wretch to one of the huts until I

    decide what is to be done with him.”

    “It will be done,” the big knight declared. The maester vanished in another blast of cold and

    snow. Only the knight of the three moths remained.

    Stannis glowered up at Theon where he hung. “You are not the only turncloak here, it would

    seem. Would that all the lords in the Seven Kingdoms had but a single neck… ”

  148. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:00 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar:
    Stannis glowered up at Theon where he hung. “You are not the only turncloak here, it would seem. Would that all the lords in the Seven Kingdoms had but a single neck… ”

    Thx. Upon further review….I’m still debating…:-)

    Shall we have a Maester roast?

    Also, that last statement by Stannis has become my favorite quote: “Would that all the lords in the Seven Kingdoms had but a single neck… ” …that is so Stannis…

  149. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:05 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    Aaaand convinced again. Sorry, but Ramsay wrote the letter. No question.

  150. Veltigar
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:11 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: stand — ”

    Thx. Upon further review….I’m still debating…:-)

    Shall we have a Maester roast?

    Also, that last statement by Stannis has become my favorite quote: “Would that all the lords in the Seven Kingdoms had but a single neck… ” …that is so Stannis…

    It’s fairly obvious that Stannis fed Ramsay BS and Ramsay than rushed to claim the honor for the “victory” when you read the sample chapter isn’t it :D
    And that line is indeed very great! Caligula was a poet at heart XD

  151. Veltigar
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Veltigar,

    Aaaand convinced again. Sorry, but Ramsay wrote the letter. No question.

    It baffles me that there is still debate amonst people who read the sample chapter. It’s as strange as people claiming that Faegon is real or that R+L=J isn’t true

  152. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:21 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    Yep. Anyway, the beginning of TWOW is poised to be at least as explosive as the end of ASOS, which makes ADWD and AFFC’s slow set-ups more than worth it!

  153. Nick_Scryer
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:21 pm | Permalink

    Lots of pics today of filming, one in particular could give us an idea of where Dany’s story might end this year.

    *Spoilers of course*

    http://i.imgur.com/SOupSsL.jpg

    Roast lamb? Dany’s story could be ending with Drogon killing the farmers daughter and Dany calling for the Dragons to be captured.

  154. Veltigar
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:25 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Veltigar,

    Yep. Anyway, the beginning of TWOW is poised to be at least as explosive as the end of ASOS, which makes ADWD and AFFC’s slow set-ups more than worth it!

    It’s going to be legendary :D

  155. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:32 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    Hurry up GRRM, write like the wind!

  156. boze
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:43 pm | Permalink

    Nick_Scryer,

    Could you provide a link to the other pics? ;)

  157. Arkash
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 4:56 pm | Permalink

    boze,

    Same request ! =D

  158. boze
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 5:18 pm | Permalink

    Nick_Scryer,

    Well, thanks.. but those are “old” pics, already posted on WiC.net. :)

    Where does the “roast lamb” pic come from?

  159. Nick_Scryer
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 5:30 pm | Permalink

    boze,

    Holy Shit! Totally missed that post, I must’ve been a lot more seriously hungover this weekend than I first thought to have missed that!!

    The Lamb pic is just from the GOT Reddit.

  160. Rygar
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 5:42 pm | Permalink

    Doran will be Tim Curry. With an amazing tan.

  161. Ser Tahu
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 7:54 pm | Permalink

    Nick_Scryer,
    I don’t think it indicates where Daenerys’ storyline ends. I think it is either just a prop food item or, more likely, used to show that the dragons are going after larger prey to help foreshadow Drogon eating the child in season 5. It doesn’t look remotely human enough to be for that scene.

  162. Jentario
    Posted September 29, 2013 at 11:59 pm | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    The thing is, they seem to be snapping pictures of it, not filming it. Possibly to get some textures for CGI…

  163. Lazlo Woodbine
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 3:04 am | Permalink

    I like casting news. :)

    I wonder if he’ll get to keep the awesome hair-do.

  164. queenofthorns
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 9:53 am | Permalink

    This casting is spot on, IMO! Maybe people aren’t remembering well, but according to Dany Hizdar is supposed to be both young and handsome. Turns out he’s a total bore in the sack, and a slimy coward, but that has little to do with his appearance.

    Edit actually I have no idea what this guy identifies as, so nix my comment about race…

  165. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 11:28 am | Permalink

    Veltigar: It’s fairly obvious that Stannis fed Ramsay BS and Ramsay than rushed to claim the honor for the “victory” when you read the sample chapter isn’t it :D
    And that line is indeed very great! Caligula was a poet at heart XD

    I wonder if that Stannis/Caligula quote is GRRM’s homage to one of his cats, who shares the name of that infamous over-sexed Roman ruler! :-)

  166. Uther Greenshirt
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 1:31 pm | Permalink

    or Malcom McDowell? :P

  167. KG
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 2:26 pm | Permalink

    He’d better be a hell of an actor, because that Keanu Reeves look gives me grave doubts-by-association.

  168. Jon Blackfyre
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 4:53 pm | Permalink

    I wanna see Hugh Laurie as Doran.

  169. WildSeed
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 5:39 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: I wonder if that Stannis/Caligula quote is GRRM’s homage to one of his cats, who shares the name of that infamous over-sexed Roman ruler! :-)

    Poor Caligula , no one quite understood him like his sister did……. *U* ..sigh.

    The brief discussion above, regarding the TWOW sample chapter, and the
    letter sent to Jon via Ramsey vs Stannis, is compelling. Thanks to
    Jentario and Tahu and Chickenduck, I’ll have much to ponder when I take
    up reading the final passages again and the next book, specifically. I’ve
    passed on the sampler thus far, I’m too greedy for the entire meal *>*

  170. Arkash
    Posted September 30, 2013 at 8:01 pm | Permalink

    Very interested to see what they do of Meereen !

    Since Dany doesnt have that much chapters in Storm, it is the perfect opportunity for them to create a lot of material to have the viewer being interested in Meereen !

    Could be interesting and give D&D the opportunity to create something were needed (many people dont give a shit about Meereen in the books, they can do something of their own to make it thrilling !).

  • Recent Comments

  • More from FanSided

  • Archives

    • 2014 (341)
    • 2013 (679)
    • 2012 (550)
    • 2011 (512)
    • 2010 (309)
    • 2009 (174)
    • 2008 (47)
  •