Watch the Game of Thrones season 4 “trailer for the trailer”
By Winter Is Coming on in Media.

Silly me, here I thought those Vine videos were the only early glimpses we would get of the Game of Thrones season 4 trailer. But now HBO has gone and uploaded a 15 second trailer tease to Youtube.

Winter Is Coming: I don’t know what else to say other than, I am sufficiently teased!


478 Comments

  1. Patchy Face
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:41 pm | Permalink

    Wow just found this on You Tube myself and was blown away! This one is only 15 seconds – can’t wait for the long version on Sunday.

  2. House Mormont
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:42 pm | Permalink

    How long are we expecting the full thing to be?

  3. Tom Hilton
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:43 pm | Permalink

    Chelsea Wolfe for background music! Great choice.

  4. Patchy Face
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:44 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    Oh Rygar – you are so predictable!

  5. haltwhogoesthere
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:44 pm | Permalink

    Game of thrones, pls. my body can only take so much.

  6. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:44 pm | Permalink

    My two favorite clips, Arya with Needle and a Giant trying to break through the gates beneath the Wall.

  7. SerCountryFriedSteak
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:45 pm | Permalink

    With this & the Vines, there’s only about 15 more seconds left to see.

    Boo!

  8. Grijnwaald
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:46 pm | Permalink

    Squeeeeeeee!!!! Can’t wait!

  9. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:47 pm | Permalink

    SerCountryFriedSteak,

    The trailer will be 2 minutes long, so there is a minute and a half left to see.

  10. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:51 pm | Permalink

    Patchy Face,

    How so? I usually last longer.

  11. Zack
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:53 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap:
    SerCountryFriedSteak,

    The trailer will be 2 minutes long, so there is a minute and a half left to see.

    Much of that is likely to be behind the scenes talking heads though.

  12. Arthur
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:53 pm | Permalink

    Lol…

    GoT is the only series that can get away with releasing a trailer of a trailer and still generate this much excitement…

  13. Tom Hilton
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:55 pm | Permalink

    Tom Hilton: Chelsea Wolfe for background music! Great choice.

    Nailed down the song: Feral Love.

  14. Veltigar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:55 pm | Permalink

    Funny that they release it all at once isn’t it?

  15. Omar Brown
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:57 pm | Permalink

    They are already doing scenes from the last book, GRRM is SO screwed.

  16. Aldi_A
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:58 pm | Permalink

    I f you look closely you can see the champion of Meereen riding out to face Dario.

  17. serum
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:58 pm | Permalink

    HOLY SHIT!!!!!!

  18. Hoyti Von Totiy
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:58 pm | Permalink

    Is that Reek on the horse with the white flag?

  19. Laurentius
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:01 pm | Permalink

    Outrageous!

    I don’t understand why they couldn’t at least give us a teaser glimpse for the vine teaser footage for the teaser for the trailer for the tv-show.

  20. Patchy Face
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:01 pm | Permalink

    Is that a Stark bannerman looking at battle aftermath? Looks like their sigil. Could it be remnants of RW?

  21. growingstrong
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:02 pm | Permalink

    Chelsea Wolfe! And wtf is Margaery’s hair??

  22. Sam W
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:04 pm | Permalink

    GET HYPE

  23. Summer is Coming
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:05 pm | Permalink

    omg I think this season, Marg’s hair will get its own credit in the opening credits.. that good it is!

    joke aside, if you look closely, Cersei also has an elaborate hairstyle.

  24. ACVG
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:06 pm | Permalink

    im not complaining…. BUT this is the 3rd teaser with Tyrion walking the aisle in chains… okay we get it
    umm i hope margearys wedding hair is some kind of joke lol
    arya looks great here
    cant wait
    that could be theonon the horse going to treaty with the “leftover” ironmen on moat caitlin

  25. House Mormont
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:07 pm | Permalink

    growingstrong,

    it’s magnificent, (be grateful the popcorn dress could always come back)

  26. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:08 pm | Permalink

    Summer is Coming: I think this season, Marg’s hair will get its own credit in the opening credits.. that good it is!

    In season 2 it was the box with arm holes for a dress, now it’s the “Roger the Alien” perm :P

  27. Hoyti Von Totiy
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:09 pm | Permalink

    ACVG,

    That is not his name you must now his name it is Reek it rymes with leek.

  28. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:14 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    Hey man, just be honest. It’s been awhile… Lol

  29. ACVG
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    sorry! a girl forgets

  30. Ozymandias
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

    Very impressed and it’s not the full trailer.

  31. Jen@House Stark
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:16 pm | Permalink

    Stick ‘em with the pointy end, Arya. Little badass girl, wow.

  32. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:17 pm | Permalink

    Ok I am officially non productive today.

    I wonder if daario Hollywood will take him out in one shot…. pure Hollywood style- or if he’ll take a hit first in pure Belwas style

  33. House Mormont
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:22 pm | Permalink

    Faced with the prospect of waiting two days for this trailer, I have no idea how I survived the off season

  34. growingstrong
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:24 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    Hah! I actually kind of liked the popcorn dress. The hair is growing on me, though…

  35. GeekFurious
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:25 pm | Permalink

    I need a trailer for the trailer about the trailer’s trailer.

  36. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

    GeekFurious,

    And then a behind-the-scenes of the campaign that gave us all the sodding trailers!

  37. The Dragon Demands
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:27 pm | Permalink

    Patchy Face:
    Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 2:44 pm | Permalink
    My two favorite clips, Arya with Needle and a Giant trying to break through the gates beneath the Wall.

      

    Or, could they be *retroactively* establishing that Duskendale happened?

    The Red Wedding tends to overshadow it, but I always felt that such a big part of Roose Bolton’s crimes is that he *sent FIVE THOUSAND men under his command into an ambush* at Duskendale, because he wanted to kill off Northerners who were loyal to the Starks. Betraying men who trusted him as their commander – always putting soldiers from other Houses in danger while holding back his own Bolton men. It’s his modus operandi.

  38. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:28 pm | Permalink

    Zack,

    No it won’t. They are releasing a trailer, not an ‘In Production’ video.

  39. zaprowsdower
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:28 pm | Permalink

    YESSSSSS

  40. Jordan
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:30 pm | Permalink

    GeekFurious,

    Trailerception.

  41. Dragons125
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:34 pm | Permalink

    TRAILER!!! *so excited*

  42. Grynthaline
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:35 pm | Permalink

    Ho shit the wedding!

    HO SHIT THE WEDDING!!!

  43. Brock
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:36 pm | Permalink

    Better give us a 2 minutes+ trailer for god sake.

  44. Patchy Face
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:38 pm | Permalink

    The Dragon Demands,

    Now that I look more, may have something to do with Moat Caitlin. The more I review the trailer, the more excitement I feel.. Don’t know if I can make it til April. Gahhhh

  45. trish
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:38 pm | Permalink

    Aldi_A,

    which scenes?

  46. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:42 pm | Permalink

    Brock,

    And another extended preview for the new characters

    1. Oberyn and Ellaria
    2. Styr
    3. Mace
    4. Daario mk. 2 (because he was introduced too late to feature him last season)
    5. The Vale Lords
    6. Hizdahr
    7. Leaf

    That’s about it, there aren’t as many significant characters introduced this time, mainly the background people now, and those returning after 2 or 3 seasons like Lysa & Thorne.

  47. The Flayed Man
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:47 pm | Permalink

    I just jacked off to this. Now time for some nighttime fun with Reek

  48. Stone Cold Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:49 pm | Permalink

    Wondering if that’s Theon riding to Moat Cailin or someone riding through the aftermath of the Red Wedding.

  49. Hoyti Von Totiy
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    ok it is confirmed that Clegane has the helm at the begining of the duel

  50. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:53 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    Thanks the old gods and the new that Sandor’s not gonna be her barber. What do you mean fat!?

  51. Colty
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:55 pm | Permalink

    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    How/where is it confirmed?

  52. Ozymandias
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 3:58 pm | Permalink

    Some people here are blind….
    You can see of the first Vine that The Mountain wears something on his head then lost it.

  53. Awake Iron!
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:00 pm | Permalink

    Omar Brown,

    Which of the trailer scenes you think is from the last book? Or are you refering to the sneak peek of Dany in blue?

  54. Joan Català
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:01 pm | Permalink

    My thoughts:
    - Melisandre keeps burning people.
    - First look at the new Daario as the rider charges towards him.
    - The guy spitting fire should really watch out. He nearlt burnt the guy passing by.
    - Cersei continues to look like a total b****.
    - Tyrion’s shot is too spoilery. They shouldn’t have.
    - Awesome looking giant charging the wall gate.
    - Reek sent to clear out Moat Cailin?
    - Ugly hairdo they’ve put on Natalie/Margaery
    - Arya with longer hair. Still wearing same clothes since the end of season 1.
    - Stannis’ cavalry charging through the forest at the Wall.
    - Jon fighting in the woods. Now this can be one of two things:
    1) He is sent to engage the wildling party south of the wall.
    2) He’s fighting outside Mance’s tent once Stannis has arrived.

  55. Aldi_A
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:02 pm | Permalink

    trish,

    At 4 seconds you can see the new Dario. Also Dany, Barristan and Jorah can be seen in the background.

  56. Ozymandias
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:02 pm | Permalink

    Omar Brown,

    He’s slow, D&D don’t want to ruin the Show by ruining the pace.
    And they’re GODDAMN RIGHT.

  57. Colty
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:04 pm | Permalink

    Ozymandias,

    Oops sorry. I haven’t scrutinized every frame of the 6 second vine like everyone else here, apparently :)

  58. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:04 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    Oh Rygar…

    Anyway, everyone get on the hype train. It’s going to be a long ride!

  59. dizzy
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:06 pm | Permalink

    This is the season I’ve been waiting for. So many incredible moments.

  60. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:08 pm | Permalink

    Joan Català,

    The clip of Jon fighting is at Crasters Keep. He leads a mission early in the season to capture/kill the mutineers before Mance and his army find them and learn how few men the NW has.

  61. Doug
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:08 pm | Permalink

    I’m almost positive you can actually see Stannis on horseback when his men are charging in. If that’s what that is, and it’s pretty obvious it probably is. I believe he is right in the middle. Look between the trees, right in front of his banner. Pretty sure that’s him.

    Looks great. Only this could do a teaser for the teaser. And in reality given the vine videos that was a teaser for the teaser for the teaser.

  62. Steve
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:10 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap:
    Joan Català,

    The clip of Jon fighting is at Crasters Keep. He leads a mission early in the season to capture/kill the mutineers before Mance and his army find them and learn how few men the NW has.

    He heals pretty quick in TV land.

  63. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:13 pm | Permalink

    jentario,

    Join us. Its fun. And you’ll be number 100. A prestigious honor.

  64. ebevan91
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    Is that a Greyjoy flag at 0:09?

    This is from season 2 but the flags look the same. I think the lighting in the S4 trailer makes it look brighter.

    http://blog.zap2it.com/frominsidethebox/Game-of-Thrones-What-Is-Dead-May-Never-Die-season-2-episode-1.jpg

  65. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    Tom Hilton: Nailed down the song: Feral Love.

    You are awesome. Expect THIS to be the song playing in the trailer:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwT3DIIXWNA

  66. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:15 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    Attractive offer…

  67. House Baggins
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    Could be him approaching Moat Cailin nice call

  68. deathdreams
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    Who are these people complaining about the women’s hair and dresses?

  69. dragonreborn
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:17 pm | Permalink

    Wow! that margaery simpson hair!!

    and the song! when I saw the vines I thought the music was composed by ramin djawadi. it reminds “the climb” track.

  70. Andrew
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:18 pm | Permalink

    Almost certain the lone rider is Theon approaching Moat Cailin. If you pause it the rider certainly has Alfie Allen’s profile.

  71. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:20 pm | Permalink

    Sister Wrister,

    That’s just gross.

  72. Taena
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:21 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap:
    Joan Català,

    The clip of Jon fighting is at Crasters Keep. He leads a mission early in the season to capture/kill the mutineers before Mance and his army find them and learn how few men the NW has.

    Surely this is still a guess.. Not confirmed.. I definitely think this and the vine looks like Craster’s Keep but she’s right, could be other woods!

  73. Taena
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:22 pm | Permalink

    I just.. I love it all… :’)

    So happy right now.. Can’t wait for Sunday..

  74. Ser Low-Res
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:22 pm | Permalink

    Here are some screencaps I took. I hope the proper trailer will have higher resolution…

  75. Jen@House Stark
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:22 pm | Permalink

    dragonreborn:
    Wow! that margaery simpson hair!!

    Rofl!!!!

  76. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:23 pm | Permalink

    jentario,

    Dooo Eeeeeet

  77. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:24 pm | Permalink

    Steve,

    He’s tough. A couple weeks rest and he is good to go.

  78. utherwolf
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:25 pm | Permalink

    I don’t know if that is a giant rushing to the gate. To me, it looks like Jon Snow.
    Can’t wait for sunday.

  79. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:25 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    Join us. ;)

  80. Ours is the Fury
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:28 pm | Permalink

    Not even joking here- do not go down the road of making fun of the actresses’ looks, especially calling the young ones fat. This is not a new rule.

  81. Ours is the Fury
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:30 pm | Permalink

    utherwolf: I don’t know if that is a giant rushing to the gate. To me, it looks like Jon Snow.
    Can’t wait for sunday.

    Pretty sure it’s a giant, based on the face.

    http://24.media.tumblr.com/652a1c805da236eefd746bc1ed3f79af/tumblr_mz7aszw97x1r9h4heo2_1280.jpg

  82. Nick_Scryer
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:31 pm | Permalink

    utherwolf,

    Definitely a giant, this version is 1080p. You can see it better here:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOIPdsW2iso

  83. Bannerless Bro
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:32 pm | Permalink

    Andrew,

    And it’s a white flag. Just like in the book. It’s kind of weird they are making all this stuff happen earlier than they should. By the next season they will be heading full into DWD territory then.

  84. ebevan91
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:33 pm | Permalink

    Ser Low-Res:
    Here are some screencaps I took. I hope the proper trailer will have higher resolution…

    They should take advantage of that new 4k on Youtube :p

    But it’ll probably just be 720, if we’re lucky we’ll get 1080.

  85. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:35 pm | Permalink

    New Daario looks to be about to throw his lady-dagger. Hopefully just into the rider’s horse or the duel would be awfully short!

  86. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:35 pm | Permalink

    Ours is the Fury,

    Join us.

  87. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:36 pm | Permalink
  88. Ours is the Fury
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:36 pm | Permalink

    Everything is screencapped on the WiC Tumblr already, btw.

  89. Abyss
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

    Made big GIFs again. Proper speed this time, I think the clips are short enough, so you don’t really need slow motion.

    After Battle
    Arya
    Cersei
    Daario
    Dany’s Crew
    Feast
    Fire
    Giant?
    Jon
    Rider
    Riders
    Tyrion
    Wedding

  90. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:39 pm | Permalink

    Abyss,

    You are a goddamn hero. Permalink and bookmark time.

  91. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:41 pm | Permalink

    Abyss:
    After Battle

    I like the crow seen in that shot.

  92. YvyB
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:47 pm | Permalink

    Ozymandias,

    Oooooh that was bothering me ! Thanks !

  93. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:47 pm | Permalink

    Sister Wrister,

    Ah. I thought you meant elevator eyes. Kudos to the Bobby reference.

  94. Ours is the Fury
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:48 pm | Permalink

    You can express you can disagreement, that’s fine, but do not keep reposting the same jokes referencing the actress’s weight.

  95. Kyrion
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:49 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Just like George like to put in the books, I really didnt think Crows did that to corpses lol

  96. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:52 pm | Permalink

    Where’s my Bronn? :o(

  97. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:54 pm | Permalink

    Omg Fury deleted my reply as well. What is this ridiculous damage control?? I didn’t call anybody fat!
    Pure thrones reference.
    And your bold type reads loud and clear, but please…. Don’t be a cowardly moderator tell me to my “face” that I’ve said something offensive and maybe Ill understand.
    Again, Maisie is beautiful. And not in a weird way.

  98. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:55 pm | Permalink

    The actress playing Fat Walda looks fit.

  99. Yago
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:57 pm | Permalink

    Rygar

    lmao

  100. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:58 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    … :)

  101. Kyle
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:58 pm | Permalink

    I posted this in the Vine topic, but it’s more appropriate for this posting. For those who missed it:

    From the 16-second teaser, in the shot of the wedding ceremony, I can spot Cersei and Tywin on the front row (Tywin is mostly obscured by Joffrey.) On the bride’s side, Mace Tyrell is on the right of the screen.

    Back on Joffrey’s side, the first row lining the aisle, from Tywin back towards the banners, I see Tyrion (mostly obscured behind Tywin), Jaime, Pycelle, an unknown dark-haired woman (Shae?), Varys, and behind Varys, I believe Sansa. Then a man who resembles Ser Ilyn Payne, but probably not him. It would be good to see him again, though, since his illness will likely prevent much of his role moving forward.

    I cannot make out anyone on Margaery’s side besides her father. I’m assuming her grandmother is hidden behind the bride herself.

    These are some of the 23 cast members mentioned in this production blog.

  102. ebevan91
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:59 pm | Permalink

    I like the looks that Joffrey and Margaery give each other. Joffrey’s like “Oh yeah finally getting me a queen. Margaery is like “lol not for long”

  103. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 4:59 pm | Permalink

    Rygar: The actress playing Fat Walda looks fit.

    Typo?

  104. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:02 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    He’s in the shot of the feast very briefly. He’s seen for a second and then obscured but he’s there!

  105. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:03 pm | Permalink

    Fat Walda. Hope she’s at the wedding.

    Sploosh. Or whatever the male equivalent to sploosh is… Which I guess is…. Sploosh.

    I guess jizzing is the preferred commentary here. Ill wait till I get home

  106. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:06 pm | Permalink

    Kyle: Then a man who resembles Ser Ilyn Payne, but probably not him. It would be good to see him again, though, since his illness will likely prevent much of his role moving forward

    It’s a terrible loss, but this time last year he was given only 9 months to live, but he’s still going for now at least. Shame he couldn’t turn up anyway because of his farewell tour, but there’s no concrete way of predicting these things, much like Melisandre’s flames.

  107. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:06 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    OMFG I see him!

  108. NimbusWarrior
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:07 pm | Permalink

    OMG! I don’t have words, I will wait…

  109. TheBerylfly
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:07 pm | Permalink

    I can’t see my Kevan (

  110. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:09 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    And there’s young Pod there making a millisecond appearance at the end of that segment!

  111. GreatJon of Slumber
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:11 pm | Permalink

    A giant! That’s what that was! Thank you everyone for figuring it out. And yes, I’m very intrigued by that pale horse coming upon another horse type stuff, maybe that is Moat Cailin, but we’ll see. Wow, CRAZY. This season is going to be INSANE.

  112. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:11 pm | Permalink

    Kyrion:
    Hodor’s Bastard,
    Just like George like to put in the books, I really didnt think Crows did that to corpses lol

    That crow does seem to be enjoying its feast! Then again, I thought they only liked eyeballs (see Excalibur).

  113. Annara Snow
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:11 pm | Permalink

    Bannerless Bro,

    It’s not weird. They can’t have Theon skip an entire season.

    My guess was, even before this came out, that they’ll show him as full blown Reek, from the early ADWD chapters, helping Ramsey take Moat Cailin, and in some scenes with Ramsey and Roose but I think they’ll leave the Jeyne Poole story for the next season. Imagine if they did it like this: Arya leaves Sandor in episode 6 or 7, and we don’t know what happened to her for a while; then Roose says Arya has been found and she’s going to travel north to marry Ramsey. The Unsullied would freak out and go: “WTF?! They didn’t really capture her… or did they?!” And then in the finale, we learn it’s not really Arya that’s marrying Ramsey, and we see the real Arya hopping on a ship to Braavos.

  114. Nessa
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    It’s orange flag for House Martell!
    Hoyti Von Totiy,

  115. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: That crow does seem to be enjoying its feast!

    And still no dragons dancing to The Bear & The Maiden Fair :(.

  116. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:14 pm | Permalink

    Wow, if they’re getting to Moat Caitlin already then it won’t be long before the books are caught up. If it does turn out to be part of Theon’s ADWD story, it looks like we’ll be fully caught up with AFFC and ADWD by the end of Season 5. In a way, that’s kind of expected, as many feel that there is only one season’s worth of dramatic material. But on the flip side, it is pretty bold to simply forge ahead of GRRM. I just hope TWOW is out before they write Season 6.

  117. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:15 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    At what second can you see them? I tried to look but can’t see Bronn anywhere.

  118. summer
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:16 pm | Permalink

    omggg i feel like it’s so soon for the trailer i’m just not prepared in any way :0 . The song is good but i liked the songs for s2 and s3 trailers way better

  119. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:18 pm | Permalink

    jentario,
    Bronn is at the very end of 0:04 and Pod is hiding there behind the juggler at the tail end of 0:05 just as the waiter is turning.

  120. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:20 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    Nice catch!

  121. Jordan
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:20 pm | Permalink

    Looking at the “After Battle” scene and the WIC screencap, I’m going to support the theory that white flag guy is Theon/Reek coming to treat.

  122. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:22 pm | Permalink

    EDIT: I see Bronn too! Some impressive spotting going on here.

    summer,

    Yeah, I like the way the song begins but it doesn’t really go anywhere. The best song and Game of Thrones trailer will always be the “Seven Devils” one. Still gives me chills.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I93RFzrPQqw

  123. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:23 pm | Permalink

    jentario:
    Cary Storm,

    Nice catch!

    The King of the GoT emotiocons!

  124. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:23 pm | Permalink

    jentario,

    Look at Abyss’s gifs above, the one labelled “feast” shows him.

  125. summer
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:26 pm | Permalink
  126. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:26 pm | Permalink

    Sister Wrister:

    no. I was trying to assimilate irony and sarcasm.

  127. Veltigar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:26 pm | Permalink

    Quick question: Do we already know if they asked another band to record a song?

  128. Annara Snow
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:27 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    The trouble with adapting AFFC/ADWD is that there are lots of different storylines for many different characters in many different locations – but every character has only one season worth of storylines – or less (you have to really stretch the Sansa AFFC stuff into one season, or Bran’s stuff from ADWD). Even characters who have a lot happening in their story, like Jon, would suffer from the storytelling perspective if their arc were cut into two.

    GRRM solved the problem by telling the whole story for half of the characters in each of the books. Unfortunately, you can’t really do that in a TV show like GoT.

  129. Mariya Martell
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:28 pm | Permalink

    Kyle:
    I posted this in the Vine topic, but it’s more appropriate for this posting. For those who missed it:

    From the 16-second teaser, in the shot of the wedding ceremony, I can spot Cersei and Tywin on the front row (Tywin is mostly obscured by Joffrey.) On the bride’s side, Mace Tyrell is on the right of the screen.

    Back on Joffrey’s side, the first row lining the aisle, from Tywin back towards the banners, I see Tyrion (mostly obscured behind Tywin), Jaime, Pycelle, an unknown dark-haired woman (Shae?), Varys, and behind Varys, I believe Sansa. Then a man who resembles Ser Ilyn Payne, but probably not him. It would be good to see him again, though, since his illness will likely prevent much of his role moving forward.

    I cannot make out anyone on Margaery’s side besides her father. I’m assuming her grandmother is hidden behind the bride herself.

    On which side will the Dornish sit? :P

  130. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:28 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    Well there was the news about Sigur Ros, but I’m not sure if that was jut a cameo or a cameo and a recording.

  131. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:30 pm | Permalink

    Ours is the Fury,

    Do you also teach pre-school? It seems like that would give you the skills to tolerate this bunch after receiving this news. It’s like a bunch of pre-K types after chocolate in here today!

    Although, you got to hand it to Rygar for the Fat Walda comment. That was an absolute zinger.

  132. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:32 pm | Permalink

    Rygar: January 10, 2014 at 5:20 pm | Permalink
    Looking at the “After Battle” scene and the WIC screencap, I’m going to support the theory that white flag guy is Theon/Reek coming to treat.

      

    ???

  133. Al Swearengen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:34 pm | Permalink

    Trailers for trailers……………smh what the hell happened to the world?

  134. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:36 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    That trailer was just about the best thing ever. I was an Unsullied back then…

  135. Ozymandias
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:36 pm | Permalink

    YvyB,

    Glad I helped :)

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I’m with you on that one.

  136. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    Annara Snow,

    Yeah, exactly. I believe he almost doubled his number of point of views in AFFC and ADWD. And he probably halved his rate of plot progression within the text itself. So the overall number of significant plot points happening to characters we already have been introduced to is surprisingly low (arguably ‘half a book’ worth of material).

    Now, people can argue about just how significant the plot points are etc, but the number of PoVs isn’t up for debate. This problem can’t really be rectified by adding in those characters for the tv show and devoting significant time to them as the cast is extremely crowded as it is and tv audiences are not as patient as book readers. So D&D probably only have on choice…

  137. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:38 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen:
    Trailers for trailers……………smh what the hell happened to the world?

    I don’t know about you, but I’m happy. They’re just trying to generate buzz so tons of people will watch it live and stay long enough to give True Detective a chance.

  138. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:41 pm | Permalink

    Damn it, I can’t say “where is the season 4 trailer?!” anymore. What a shame, a damn shame.

  139. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:42 pm | Permalink

    jentario,

    That wasnt me broski

  140. Veltigar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:43 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones:
    Veltigar,

    Well there was the news about Sigur Ros, but I’m not sure if that was jut a cameo or a cameo and a recording.

    Oh, right now I remember! Thanks

  141. Ozymandias
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:44 pm | Permalink

    jentario,

    The next three months are going to be horrendous, not looking forward to that period.

  142. Turncloak
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:44 pm | Permalink

    Ours is the Fury,

    Fury is the Mod that was promised. I shall not cross you :)

  143. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:44 pm | Permalink

    jentario,

    Haha, it must be weird to go from Unsullied to Sullied, waiting for Season 2 without a clue that there would be Blackwater. Although funnily enough, when I watched season 2, it had been a while since I had read the book, so my memory was pretty fuzzy on Blackwater anyway!

  144. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:44 pm | Permalink

    Annara Snow,

    I like it! Your thoughts on Reek and Aria

  145. tysnow
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:44 pm | Permalink

    Where is Roose and Walda Frey in the clips I cannot spot them?

  146. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:46 pm | Permalink

    Rygar: no. I was trying to assimilate irony and sarcasm.

    I know dude, I should have winked at you. I’m just surprised nobody got the Robert reference…. I mean, who else says “you’ve got fat!”

  147. Dragonslayer
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:49 pm | Permalink

    I think we ‘ve got our High Septon from Second Sons back. The guy in the Sept of Baelor looks very similar (from behind).

  148. Throner
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:49 pm | Permalink

    I know it likely could be Theonwith the white flag but what if it is a certain Frey who will be meeting a dead fish soon. The lighting and atmosphere in that shot would fit a dark/supernatural scene and the fact that he has a white peace flag and is still killed without a thought could add to the ruthlessness of LS. Maybe he’s got the flag because he is going to meet the brotherhood to release some Frey POWs

  149. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:50 pm | Permalink

    Sister Wrister,

    Join us.

  150. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:51 pm | Permalink

    Well, I can officially say that my world has ground to a halt today.

  151. Veltigar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:53 pm | Permalink

    About white flag dude

    If it’s Theon, could he be going to Asha somehow? I don’t remember the Ironborn at Moat Caillin being named, so it would be pretty random if they just plant them there. But if they have Asha with her army of badasses attacking the North to save Theon, they might get cut off somehow and then Ramsay sends Theon to tempt them to surrender.

  152. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:56 pm | Permalink

    I think the White Flag is not a “White flag of surrender” But the flag born by the Kingsguard. Innit it?

  153. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:56 pm | Permalink

    Dragonslayer:
    I think we ‘ve got our High Septon from Second Sons back. The guy in the Sept of Baelor looks very similar (from behind).

    Don’t worry, he’ll soon be whacked, to be replaced by Rowan Atkinson as the High Sparrow.

  154. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:57 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,
    You make a hellova Caucasian. I’m just gonna have to check with my accountant as I’m worried this might bump me up into a higher tax bracket….

    I’m equally surprised that I’m borderline banned for jokes I didn’t really make.

    And yes, I’m making this all about me. As if proclaiming shooting my load all over the 30 of trailer isn’t all about me… And myself… And my hand….
    Of the king?

  155. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:58 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    WiC.net fucked me up again. Quotes are going crazy these days…

  156. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:59 pm | Permalink

    Ok. Back to regularly scheduled programming of post-auto-erotic-over-analyzation…
    I usually just go to sleep.
    Excuse my quips, they are meant for nobody in particular. I get it. I’m geeked too.

  157. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:01 pm | Permalink

    Sister Wrister,

    You’re not banned. If the amount of my comments that have been deleted were quantified in inches, they’d be John Holmes.

  158. Al Swearengen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:04 pm | Permalink

    jentario,

    I like trailers and generating buzz but creating trailers just to tease another trailer is taking the piss. HBO aren’t the only ones guilty of doing this.

  159. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:05 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar:
    About white flag dude

    If it’s Theon, could he be going to Asha somehow? I don’t remember the Ironborn at Moat Caillin being named, so it would be pretty random if they just plant them there. But if they have Asha with her army of badasses attacking the North to save Theon, they might get cut off somehow and then Ramsay sends Theon to tempt them to surrender.

    The problem with that is that Asha and her crew already know that Ramsay is a disgusting son of a bitch. So no way in hell would they surrender to him. Also, Asha needs to somehow end up in Stannis’s hands not Reeks. It’s really difficult to tell how this particular storyline will play out.

  160. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:05 pm | Permalink

    Kyle,

    http://postimg.org/image/xmumysbdn/full/

    These are the faces I could discern, besides the obvious Joffrey and Marge.

  161. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:09 pm | Permalink

    Not sure surrender is necessary here. It could all still work out

    Family, Duty, Hodor: The problem with that is that Asha and her crew already know that Ramsay is a disgusting son of a bitch. So no way in hell would they surrender to him. Also, Asha needs to somehow end up in Stannis’s hands not Reeks. It’s really difficult to tell how this particular storyline will play out.

  162. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:09 pm | Permalink

    Sister Wrister,

    Your load is all over this thread now.
    Maybe that’s why WiC.net is demolishing my comments more often than not.

  163. Atreyu
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:11 pm | Permalink

    Tell me honestly, does this merkin make my ass look fat?

  164. ebevan91
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:12 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen:
    jentario,

    I like trailers and generating buzz but creating trailers just to tease another trailer is taking the piss. HBO aren’t the only ones guilty of doing this.

    It’s hilarious that today we got a teaser (Vine) of a teaser (the 15 seconds trailer) of a trailer (the full trailer on Sunday).

  165. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:15 pm | Permalink

    ebevan91,

    The Vine teasers were teasing the full trailer and not the trailer’s trailer. It just happened that some shots overlapped.

  166. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:15 pm | Permalink

    Atreyu,

    Honestly… Yes.
    EDIT: Hope you’re not a cast member, otherwise I’m in trouble.

  167. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:16 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor: The problem with that is that Asha and her crew already know that Ramsay is a disgusting son of a bitch.So no way in hell would they surrender to him. Also, Asha needs to somehow end up in Stannis’s hands not Reeks. It’s really difficult to tell how this particular storyline will play out.

    The Moat Cailin issue is further complicated by the fact that Vic occupied it until he received word about Balon’s death, after which Vic departed and left only a small group of ironborn to defend the castle. How will that be adapted now that Yara is in the area and Vic probably won’t be seen until S5?

  168. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:18 pm | Permalink

    Atreyu:
    Tell me honestly, does this merkin make my ass look fat?

    I’m not sure I can comment. Are you a young actress?

  169. Rygar
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:19 pm | Permalink

    jentario:
    Atreyu,

    Honestly… Yes.
    EDIT: Hope you’re not a cast member, otherwise I’m in trouble.

    Ha your edit ruined my joke!

  170. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:24 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    I got there first, buddy. Get in line.
    Also, no harm intended!

  171. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:26 pm | Permalink

    Sister Wrister,

    The problem is we don’t want Asha/Yara to meet Ramsay, we want her to meet Stannis. But Stannis will be attacking the Wall whilst Yara has just left for the Dreadfort. I doubt the Deepwood Motte storyline will ever come into play so there’s no obvious way for them to ever meet.

    So maybe we need an alternate storyline. Yara is on here way to the Dreadfort but stops off at Moat Caitlin, perhaps to continue the journey on foot or for supplies. Or perhaps its not Moat Caitlin. At any rate, she meets up with Ramsay and gets captured by him. Together Yara and Reek are prisoners and are taken back to Winterfell. Stannis is now at the Wall and marches directly to capture Winterfell because, well, no one cares about Deepwood Motte. Theon and Yara, along with fake Arya, escape from Winterfell and meet Stannis.

  172. jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:29 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I don’t think that will happen. It will be a shame if she won’t be in the Kingsmoot. I don’t think the arc you suggest would be worth that change.

  173. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:29 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: The Moat Cailin issue is further complicated by the fact that Vic occupied it until he received word about Balon’s death, after which Vic departed and left only a small group of ironborn to defend the castle. How will that be adapted now that Yara is in the area and Vic probably won’t be seen until S5?


    I don’t think Yara is going to Deepwood Motte. I think Yara is going to the Dreadfort. I’m actually quite liking my idea that she gets captured on the way by Ramsay, remains with Theon in Winterfell and finally escapes with Theon to reach Stannis. It’s far from perfect, given what Ramsay tends to do to his prisoners but I can’t think of a better option.

    EDIT: Sorry, completely misread your post. But yeah, my point can still make sense just as long as they pretend Vic comes from somewhere else.

  174. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:32 pm | Permalink

    jentario:
    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I don’t think that will happen. It will be a shame if she won’t be in the Kingsmoot. I don’t think the arc you suggest would be worth that change.

    Yeah it’s not ideal but can you think of an alternative arc which gets Yara to Stannis before the end of Season 5?

  175. Jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:35 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    How about what happens in the book? It was perfectly fine IMO and would make for a great episode 7-8 moment. I am talking about Deepwood Motte, of course.

  176. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:37 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    How about what happens in the book? It was perfectly fine IMO and would make for a great episode 7-8 moment. I am talking about Deepwood Motte, of course.

    But Yara is on her way to take out Ramsay. So what makes her change her plan and take/go to Deepwood Motte instead?

  177. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:42 pm | Permalink

    Yara gets caught at sea while the Dragonstone fleet is on its way to Eastwatch

  178. Atreyu
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:46 pm | Permalink

    Rygar: I’m not sure I can comment.Are you a young actress?

    I can be, sailor.

  179. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:46 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm: Yara gets caught at sea while the Dragonstone fleet is on its way to Eastwatch

    But she’s on the wrong side of Westeros. No way in hell she gets there in time. Especially if she doesn’t travel across the land.

  180. Jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:48 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    Who says she changes her plan? I just hope she gets done with it this season and ends up back on Pyke early in season 5.

  181. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:49 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm:
    Yara gets caught at sea while the Dragonstone fleet is on its way to Eastwatch

    The ironborn defeated at sea? I have problems with Stannis taking Yara along for his Castle Black adventure. Will she party with Selyse and her jarbabies? Truthfully, she probably will fail in her Theon mission and return to the Iron Isles flustered.

  182. Dolorous Ned
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:51 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    If she aks nicely, maybe Littlefinger will let her use his teleporter.

  183. Sareeta
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:52 pm | Permalink

    Ooh, I really like the music (especially the guitar). Trailer for the trailer was pretty awesome. My favorite was probably the shot of Arya.

  184. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:53 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I was gonna say “teleporter” but someone beat me to it.

  185. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:54 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    She just said she was going to find her baby brother and bring him back. It would be pretty embarrassing and pathetic if she returned in Season 5 without doing anything. Also, I don’t think the Deepwood Motte thing will be in the tv show as I think the battle at Winterfell is what the budget will be saved for. That scene with Asha in the book, whilst cool, is a lot easier to write than to film (given that she’s not a big draw for show viewers)

    Ultimately, I guess I now see Yara’s scene at the end of Season 3 as the beginning of a big diversion from the books instead of just a minor one. Time will tell if it turns out like that.

    @Cary Storm: LOL, the tried and tested “teleporter”. Maybe that is the solution!

  186. Jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 6:58 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    Well, the battles you’ve mentioned are a season apart. So budget won’t be an issue. As for YarAsha not being a fan favorite, that’s the whole point of developing her in seasons 4 & 5. I think season 5 (being a nearly actionless season) will desperately need to keep scenes like this.

  187. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:04 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    I’m predicting either the battle for Winterfell or the battle for Meereen in Season 5. But you have a point that the battle for Winterfell is probably Season 6 material and so Deepwood Motte could potentially work well in Season 5. I’m just skeptical because a host of new characters enter the picture in AFFC/ADWD and I don’t see them devoting too much time to storylines that aren’t all that big.

    Ultimately, I would like to see Deepwood Motte but am not sure how it can happen whilst still making narrative sense for both Yara’s story and the tv show as a whole.

  188. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:05 pm | Permalink

    I think the development with Yara in the S3 finale points to a major deviation and a way to insert her into the Theon/Ramsay storyline since they’ve emphasized the Yara/Theon relationship on the show much more than what it was in the books.

    She is bound and determined to go to the Dreadfort and rescue Theon. What possible event has her turn around and head home or go to Deepwood freaking Motte? Is she going to say “oh well, I gave it a good shot, guess I’ll pack it in and not rescue my brother which I vowed to do.”

    She’s getting captured by Ramsay and I would imagine, they’ll link her back with Stannis by having her escape with Theon from Winterfell in S5. It’s going to be Season 4′s “Gendry to Dragonstone” deviation.

    BTW, the presence of the Kingsmoot in S5 does not hinge on Yara’s involvement. They can choose to have it or not have it depending on what they’re doing with the Greyjoy uncles but Yara isn’t essential to the scene happening.

  189. Jentario
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:05 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree, since I don’t see a problem. Either way, I’m off.

  190. Nick Larter
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:11 pm | Permalink

    Was that Needlewith Arya!? :D

  191. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:14 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Haha, so I’m not the only person who thinks this. You know, I thought I just thought of the idea myself, but knowing me I probably read it on wic.net, forgot about it, and then thought of it ‘independently’. :P

    Jentario,

    Fair enough. I’d also say that there is a distinction between what I personally would like to see, story wise, and what viewers would like to see. So I do have sympathy for you viewpoint, even though we do disagree.

  192. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:18 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    So Yara will be the fake Arya, Ramsay’s new bitch? Just kill her already if she doesn’t matter.

  193. Iron Bank of Wit
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:18 pm | Permalink

    What a great teaser. Call me sufficiently teased. Only 86 days to go . . . (My inner child screams, “I wanna, I wanna, I wanna. . .”)

  194. Chickenduck
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:23 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Maybe. Although I suspect S4′s “Gendry to Dragonstone book change moment will be Dontos to the Eyrie, where he’ll take Marillion’s role.

  195. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:24 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Lol. No, she would be captured by Ramsay who would want to terrorize her, but Roose orders him back to Winterfell. Events in Winterfell, such as the marriage to fake Arya, distract him from torturing Yara or anything, so she’s simply stuck as a prisoner, perhaps speaking with Reek.

    Theon later sees fake Arya (maybe Jeyne Poole) being abused by Ramsay and decides to help her escape. He uses Yara as his primary ‘spearwife’, perhaps with actual spearwives there as well and they make their escape in time to meet up with Stannis.

  196. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:29 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard:
    King Tommen,

    So Yara will be the fake Arya, Ramsay’s new bitch? Just kill her already if she doesn’t matter.

    NONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONOFUCKINGNO

  197. Dolorous Ned
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:31 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    The Kingsmoot may not hinge on Yara’s presence, but I think she’s important as a famliar face for the Unsullied. Otherwise it’ll be just random people they don’t know competing for a throne they don’t care about. On the other hand, Yara is such a minor character it maybe doesn”t matter that much.

  198. Arya Dunyett
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:32 pm | Permalink

    Atreyu: Tell me honestly, does this merkin make my ass look fat?

    Not just fat, but heavily furred. Try wearing it on the front.
    Is this Bart?

    Thirsty for news, I’m up for any GoT tease I can get from HBO. Thanks a bunch!

  199. SM4e
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:35 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    Nice catches. Might the man on Cersei’s left be Kevan? I do really hope they reintroduce him in this season.

  200. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:35 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard:
    King Tommen,

    So Yara will be the fake Arya, Ramsay’s new bitch? Just kill her already if she doesn’t matter.

    I happen to think that linking Yara into Theon’s story at this point is a far more effective way to build sympathy for Theon and a better use for the character than any of the things that Asha is up to in the books prior to falling into Stannis’ hands. Just my opinion.

    As for whatever they’re planning with fArya, that remains to be seen although it’s interesting to note that the show has not done one single thing to set up the presence of Jeyne Poole or any similar type of figure to this point. Like zilch.

  201. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:36 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I must admit I am totally lost with that storyline, but I will keep an open mind about it. I could see her losing her ironborn support and barely escaping the Bolton wrath, then finding some way to contact Theon/Reek before/during Winterfell. But as a captive of Ramsay? She wouldn’t last a week. More and more, I am believing that something is definitely tragic between Theon/Yara this season and next. Maybe D&D know something about Yara’s fate that we don’t?

  202. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:37 pm | Permalink

    Dolorous Ned:
    King Tommen,

    The Kingsmoot may not hinge on Yara’s presence, but I think she’s important as a famliar face for the Unsullied. Otherwise it’ll be just random people they don’t know competing for a throne they don’t care about. On the other hand, Yara is such a minor character it maybe doesn”t matter that much.

    The show found a way to introduce Stannis and the Dragonstone crew into S2 who were all completely new characters barely spoken of before. I’m sure they can find an effective way to introduce the Greyjoy uncles as well without Yara’s presence.

  203. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:40 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Maybe they use the real Arya and she doesn’t go to Braavos? That’s what I would do.

    Kidding.

    But seriously, I’m wondering if Littlefinger’s sly glance towards Arya when speaking to Tywin in Season 2 will ever come to anything. It seemed like they were hinting at it in Season 3 when Cersei says: “you failed to locate the Stark girl”. Could that somehow tie into fake Arya?

  204. Benoit
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:42 pm | Permalink

    Something I wanted to talk for some time: who was the Septon who married Tyrion and Sansa in season 3? Is that the High Septon? Cause this time again, it seems that the same actor is officiating the wedding of Joffrey and Margaery (same haircut). So it seems to me that this is the High Septon, no? And if it is the case, will they keep him for the next seasons?

  205. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:43 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    That’s an equally valid alternative. Crucially, like the other theory, it doesn’t involve her going to the Kingsmoot or Deepwood Motte, which would be a significant but plausible change from the books.

  206. Eljuma
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:44 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor:

    But she’s on the wrong side of Westeros. No way in hell she gets there in time. Especially if she doesn’t travel across the land.

    This is a world without train and roads. Sea travel is far faster than land travel. Plus, she’s already left in the fastest ship the Ironborn have, while the other guy still has to pack a lot first.

  207. Atreyu
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:47 pm | Permalink

    Arya Dunyett: Not just fat, but heavily furred. Try wearing it on the front.
    Is this Bart?

    Thirsty for news, I’m up for any GoT tease I can get from HBO. Thanks a bunch!

    You get me. We are now married. I shall report to the huscarle for my flying squirrel fitting.

  208. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:47 pm | Permalink

    Eljuma: This is a world without train and roads. Sea travel is far faster than land travel. Plus, she’s already left in the fastest ship the Ironborn have, while the other guy still has to pack a lot first.

    Look at a map of Westeros and then tell me that. The Northern part of Westeros hasn’t even been mapped! So is she going to go around Dorne?

    EDIT: So here’s the map.
    http://gameofthrones.net/images/Westeros_Maps/Map_Westeros_Political.gif
    She going to get from Pyke to Eastwatch by only travelling by boat?

  209. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:48 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor:
    King Tommen,

    Maybe they use the real Arya and she doesn’t go to Braavos? That’s what I would do.

    Kidding.

    But seriously, I’m wondering if Littlefinger’s sly glance towards Arya when speaking to Tywin in Season 2 will ever come to anything. It seemed like they were hinting at it in Season 3 when Cersei says: “you failed to locate the Stark girl”. Could that somehow tie into fake Arya?

    Possibly but I think it’s more likely that they just kind of pretend like Arya and her escapades with Tywin didn’t happen. Tywin’s not long for this world anyways and Littlefinger’s already left King’s Landing for good.

    I think the line from Cersei to LF about failing to locate Arya was to wrap up that request and underline to the audience that LF had given up on that particular mini-quest for him (it doesn’t really appear like he tried at all to be honest). Cersei framed it as, “well you messed that up, but here’s something more important that you actually need to accomplish..” which he did end up coming through for her on.

  210. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:49 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor:
    Hodor’s Bastard,
    That’s an equally valid alternative. Crucially, like the other theory, it doesn’t involve her going to the Kingsmoot or Deepwood Motte, which would be a significant but plausible change from the books.

    But I will really miss THIS scene!

  211. David The Grey
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:52 pm | Permalink

    My god, this is my favorite time of year! When the trailers start coming out and we get the first glimpses of what is to come. Just a few short months. I cannot wait to see everything! More Dany, more Arya, more Jon Snow, more Tyrion, more everything! And yeah, that other clip with the Red Viper is simply amazing! 42 weeks of waiting for 10 short weeks of bliss. It’ll be here soon!!!

  212. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:53 pm | Permalink

    Eljuma: This is a world without train and roads. Sea travel is far faster than land travel. Plus, she’s already left in the fastest ship the Ironborn have, while the other guy still has to pack a lot first.

    On the show, “travel by water” is pretty much shorthand for, “we can get you to this place as fast or slow as we want to and not worry about the logistics of travel time”.

    In the S3 finale, Yara even explicitly laid out her boat travel route to the Dreadfort which would mean that unless she gets hijacked on the water, she’s more or less going to pull up right near the Dreadfort on her boat so it would make it exceedingly difficult for her to be intercepted anywhere else. And if she’s going to make it to the Dreadfort, what other option is there for her but to be captured by Ramsay?

  213. Michel
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:54 pm | Permalink

    OMG ASKMDKMSAKMDAMKDKMADSKMDASKM I JUST DIED HERE!!!!!! OMGGGGGGGGG

    I CANT BELIEVE THEY ARE ALREADY DOING THE REEK PART!!!!!! OMGGGGGG!!!!!!

  214. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:55 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: But I will really miss THIS scene!

    And you will cry, and I will cry, and our fan tears will cleanse our spirits. Some things just have to be cut. And unfortunately it’s always the non-plot essential scenes that die first.

    I’m just praying we still get both Euron and Victarion at the Kingsmoot. At this point, Aeron seems like a pipe-dream.

  215. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:57 pm | Permalink

    I think I found Jon’s theme song for this season:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAgnJDJN4VA

    Anyway, there are so many great visuals in those trailers, I am very much looking forward to it. All of the action scenes look epic.

  216. Turncloak
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Yara’s route will lead her to be intercepted by Stannis. It is known

  217. Arya Dunyett
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    Atreyu,

    Ooooh! Bliss! Must stop waxing (and waning). I shall carry my Wikipedia at all times when in your hirsute company.

  218. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:00 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor:
    I’m just praying we still get both Euron and Victarion at the Kingsmoot. At this point, Aeron seems like a pipe-dream.

    I think it is too late to pray. We are all in the grasp of the weirnet and the whims of R’hlorr! And it is snowing outside!

  219. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:03 pm | Permalink

    So since we see the scene of a giant trying to ram through the gates underneath the Wall in this trailer, I assume they’ll need to have someone from the NW play the Donal Noye role. I’m not sure why they’d include the Giant part without the other half and it’s really a great dramatic moment to have during the battle.

    So the question will be, since Donal Noye has not been cast, will they be substituting another known character into the spot? My vote is for Grenn as it would be a heroic way for him to exit and it does not appear like he plays much more of a role in the books after this battle. Better to have him killed off then just sent away to hang out at another outpost along the Wall.

  220. Turncloak
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:05 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: Cary Storm:
    Yara gets caught at sea while the Dragonstone fleet is on its way to Eastwatch

    The ironborn defeated at sea? I have problems with Stannis taking Yara along for his Castle Black adventure. Will she party with Selyse and her jarbabies? Truthfully, she probably will fail in her Theon mission and return to the Iron Isles flustered.

    The ironborn have been defeated at sea in the past…by Stannis

  221. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:05 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak:
    King Tommen,

    Yara’s route will lead her to be intercepted by Stannis. It is known

    So she’s going to hang out with Stannis the entire time he’s at the Wall? That seems kind of silly. Far more likely they throw her into the Theon/Ramsay story since that is the more logical fit for her. Otherwise, it’s Theon and Ramsay hanging out together for another whole season which I don’t think anyone wants.

  222. James Williams
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:06 pm | Permalink

    Al Swearengen,

    I don’t understand why it’s a problem though…it’s not like the full trailer was going to come out today whether they put this trailer tease out or not…would you like LESS content? I never understand why the trailer for a trailer thing bothers people…you are getting MORE not less…it’s not depriving you of anything

  223. Colty
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:09 pm | Permalink

    That Reek shot is beautiful. Really captures what I felt when I read his chapters in ADwD. I fucking love the cinematography in this series

  224. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:10 pm | Permalink

    jentario: Sister Wrister,

    Your load is all over this thread now.Maybe that’s why WiC.net is demolishing my comments more often than not.

    Oh man, I back off to actually get something done an I miss all the fun!
    Glad to be welcomed with open arms, you may just wanna close your eyes ;)

  225. ted
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:10 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I think the siege of winterfell will begin at the end of season 5. Although there have been plenty of deviations from the book, this seige will happen, the show runners have introduced all the main characters for it. Delaying it to Season 6 (later than in the book) is inconsistent with what they have done so far. IMO, the limited patients of the tv audience just like the reader requires that, by the end of season 5, the Stark kids demonstrate the kind of power needed to avenge the death and mutilation the family has suffered. This demonstration (Arya’s first real assassination (ADWD Chap. 64) and, particularly relevant to the seige, Bran facilitating the reemergence of Theon through the tree (ADWD Chap. 46 + 51)) comes just in time in the books, it won’t be delayed in the show.

  226. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:12 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen:
    In the S3 finale, Yara even explicitly laid out her boat travel route to the Dreadfort which would mean that unless she gets hijacked on the water, she’s more or less going to pull up right near the Dreadfort on her boat so it would make it exceedingly difficult for her to be intercepted anywhere else.

    That would give the show no credibility though. How can she sail to the Dreadfort? It’s not possible. What route does she take? The idea just baffles me. I mean, I can’t remember how bad Littlefinger’s teleporting was in Season 2 but surely it wasn’t that bad?

    http://gameofthrones.net/images/Westeros_Maps/Map_Westeros_Political.gif

    King Tommen,

    I think you may be right. Certainly the battle needs a few Night’s Watch casualties.

  227. Eljuma
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:15 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor:

    Look at a map of Westeros and then tell me that. The Northern part of Westeros hasn’t even been mapped! So is she going to go around Dorne?

    YES. Before 1869 the fastest way to go from New York to San Francisco was sailing all the way down and turning around Tierra del Fuego. Westeros is only the size of South America even counting the land beyond the Wall, so this is less than half that.

    Family, Duty, Hodor:

    EDIT: So here’s the map.
    http://gameofthrones.net/images/Westeros_Maps/Map_Westeros_Political.gif
    She going to get from Pyke to Eastwatch by only travelling by boat?

    Why would she do that? She’s going to The Dreadfort.

    Rewatch the scene where she tells Balon her plan. She even speaks of sailing “up the Narrow Sea all the way to the Weeping Water”. WW is the river flowing nest to TDF.

    http://awoiaf.westeros.org/images/c/cd/The_North2.jpg

    In other words, she’s going to mend the river and attack TDF from behind (read: take Theon and leave ASAP), right from where the Boltons don’t expect the Ironborn coming. Typical Viking stuff.

  228. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak: The ironborn have been defeated at sea in the past…by Stannis

    Oh, I guess there is that Greyjoy Rebellion thing….what the hell is Yara thinking?

  229. Sister Wrister
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor: Jentario,She just said she was going to find her baby brother and bring him back. It would be pretty embarrassing and pathetic if she returned in Season 5 without doing anything. Also, I don’t think the Deepwood Motte thing will be in the tv show as I think the battle at Winterfell is what the budget will be saved for. That scene with Asha in the book, whilst cool, is a lot easier to write than to film (given that she’s not a big draw for show viewers)

    Ultimately, I guess I now see Yara’s scene at the end of Season 3 as the beginning of a big diversion from the books instead of just a minor one. Time will tell if it turns out like that.

    @Cary Storm: LOL, the tried and tested “teleporter”. Maybe that is the solution!

    FDH,
    I’m with you here. I like te way the yarasha conversation here is headed. I also see a major deviation, as they’ve set her up for something despite her really not doing so much in the books to date. I think they will streamline that whole arc, and do not see why it is necessary for her to be present at the KM. she can still be bummed from getting the shaft in that one…
    Would make a fascinating dynamic for her to wind up in a certain “engagement” but I think she is too outspoken to not spill the beans… And the Northmen would not buy it

  230. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:23 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Well, if that white flag shot is Theon (and I hope it is) they will be doing a little more than continuing their torturey business. We have Charlotte Hope returning and whatever that entails (some hunting would be my guess) and we have the Yara confrontation.

    I don’t agree with you that they will use her for FArya. I just see her men being slaughtered (due to some Theon quisling behaviour) and her being about to be killed (or whatever) by Ramsay when Roose intervenes. He will either have arrived to help defeat the Ironborn or just arrive in the nick of time a la Tywin at Harrenhal to subvert chaotic evil with lawful evil. I picture Roose telling Yara that her father is dead in a very sinister way (like he did with Jaime) and then telling her to return by land and bring all of the Ironborn still in the North home with her.

  231. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:23 pm | Permalink

    Eljuma,

    Oh wow, you’re right, she does say she will travel ‘up the narrow sea’. Which means she’s going to sail past The Arbor, past Sunspear, and past Dragonstone? That’s pretty crazy and extremely dangerous! Heck, whatever works for tv.

    That throws a spanner in the works of the Moat Caitlin theory at the very least.

  232. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:24 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor: That would give the show no credibility though. How can she sail to the Dreadfort? It’s not possible. What route does she take? The idea just baffles me. I mean, I can’t remember how bad Littlefinger’s teleporting was in Season 2 but surely it wasn’t that bad?

    http://gameofthrones.net/images/Westeros_Maps/Map_Westeros_Political.gif

    Yara actually says explicitly in the S3 finale that she will sail “up the Narrow Sea and the Weeping Water to the Dreadfort”. This essentially means that she’s going to sail around the Southern part of Westeros, come up the Narrow Sea then up the Weeping Water (attached to the Narrow Sea) who’s banks are on the Dreadfort.

    So while taking a trip a good chunk of the way around the continent seems long, it’s really the only legitimate way to get to the Dreadfort by water from the Iron Islands. And in the books, Victarion’s trip to Essos is an even longer journey to a point to it’s not absolutely ridiculous since she says she’s taking the fastest ship and hauling ass to get there. She’ll probably show up at the Dreadfort a few episodes into the Season which would mean she’d have been travelling for enough time. Catelyn was able to get a ship down to King’s Landing in about an episode in S1 so as I said, they don’t really care about the distance. Being on a boat means you can get there in really good time and I don’t think the show wants you to think to much more about it than that.

  233. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:30 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    I didn’t think it was feasible safety-wise anyway. It’s ok if you’re Victarion and you’ve got a huge fleet, but what would ships near Dragonstone do if they saw a lone member of the Iron fleet?

    I suppose they’re taking a bit of artistic license here.

  234. Markus
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:36 pm | Permalink

    Cmon now, Asha beeing captured by Ramsey would get absolutely slaughtered worse than Theon, gangraped and made somekind of skinless slave in a dungeon for attacking Dreadfort if they are true to Ramsey’s character. No, the point of Asha going to rescue mission is to get to know her character before she goes back to the Kings Moot, she will be needed there because she is the only character that has been presented that will be represented in the KM. Also Asha being prisoner with Theon would take away his amazing lonely arc in Winterfell, it is one of the best written character pieces George has ever done and they should be careful to change anything at all. Asha is going to the KM and escape with a crew from Euron and be stranded in the north when Stannis takes her. Or something like that, beeing captured by Ramsey….you just dont get captured by Ramsey and end up as the same person.

  235. Kyrion
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:41 pm | Permalink

    To lineup with the books, perhaps Ramsay Bolton splits his forces? Sends some men to take Deepwood Motte, occupies Winterfell, and sends Reek to Moat Caitlin to wait to join his forces with Roose. Perhaps Yara will confront the men in Deepwood Motte, defeat them, then prepare to march on Winterfell when Stannis surprises her from behind in the next season, and everything is lined up

    This assumes that the Kingsmoot will not happen onscreen, especially since the logistics will be a nightmare since Yara isnt getting much screen time, it just wouldt work to develop her character. Dorne will occupy too much of season 5 to have the Iron Islands take up space, we get Dorne, and loose the Kingsmoot. Its the best thing we can ask for.

  236. ATG
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:43 pm | Permalink

    Man cant wait to feast my eyes upon the whole trailer

  237. WeirwoodTreeHugger
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:44 pm | Permalink

    I’m hoping that Charlotte Hope is fArya.

  238. King Tommen
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:49 pm | Permalink

    WeirwoodTreeHugger,

    Not sure if serious but seeing as though she’s one of Theon’s sadistic co-conspirators at the Dreadfort, her posing as Arya is a bigger deviation than anything else since she is about as far from “innocent” as we can get. Why the hell would Theon need to rescue her? She helped get his dick cut off.

  239. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:55 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,
    WeirwoodTreeHugger,

    I think Myranda will be made short work of. She will be in however many episode it takes for a CV to say “various” directors instead of one or two but will probably be killed. I heard they would have brought back the other girl Violet but she is/was pregnant/had a baby.

    If Roose goes to King’s Landing this season for the PW and whatnot, then they’ll give a proper retcon intro to Jeyne and say “Littlefinger stowed her away when Ned Stark’s men were slain blablabal” and there you have it. If not they can just have Roose show up with her and explain her past in season 5. I think we will see Jeyne (though we’ve missed a Jeyne before).

  240. WeirwoodTreeHugger
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:55 pm | Permalink

    The area Arya in looks more mountainous than anywhere in the books she went right? Maybe a trip through parts of the Vale?

    It’s kind of nice seeing a picture of Joffrey knowing he is about to die. Although I will miss Jack Gleeson,

  241. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:58 pm | Permalink

    So I was thinking the other day about the whole Asha/Yara story arc for this season and I had an idea. So she said that she is going to get Theon by sailing up the Weeping Water. What if she gets there after Theon, Ramsay, and the majority of the Bolton forces have left? So she easily takes the Dreadfort and is holding position there. This would effectively cut out Deepwood Motte and reduce the cast size (Glover’s aren’t included). So Asha/Yara stays here and this is where Stannis comes in and seizes the Dreadfort, apprehending the Greyjoys. I feel like it would make more sense to non-readers than him going to Deepwood Motte. It’s not a flawless plan but I feel like for Dan and David, it would seem that they don’t have many options regarding this aspect of the story.

  242. WeirwoodTreeHugger
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 8:58 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    I think it would be interesting. Ramsay turns on her and she becomes a victim herself. Theon relates to her as another former aggressor turned victim. His ADWD chapters turn into a redemption arc and rescuing someone who helped hurt him in the past would fit with that.

  243. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:11 pm | Permalink

    After The Feast,

    It works, but if that’s the case, why didn’t they keep her at the Kingsmoot in the first place? Waiting around at the Dreadfort is no more exciting than waiting around at Deepwood Motte.

    Really, I think Yara has committed herself to this new dynamic storyline that is difficult for us to predict. I think the aim of her storyline is to simplify her story arc such that it integrates with other main characters much sooner. The book version has drama but it is separated from the main cast making it difficult to deal with in a tv show with limited time and limited budget. I expect a meeting with Ramsay or Stannis in Season 4, and probably it’ll be Ramsay. This will somehow lead to her being under Stannis’s control, taking us into TWOW.

    Sister Wrister,

    Cheers!

  244. Markus
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:16 pm | Permalink

    You guys are changing too much, dont go astray with all these fanfictions that simply dont work well.

    Yara will simply come, strand her men at Moat Catlin after a lost battle go back to KM when her father dies and promise to come back with more men. Theon will come in and give his men over to Ramsey. Asha will lose KM and go to some other castle Greyjoys have previously conquered (it has been mentioned they have conquered castles) or be stranded in the North until stannis comes.

  245. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:18 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    Yeah because it will most likely turn out drastically different from the books it’s hard to say where they will go with her. I just hope they don’t make it annoyingly different (i.e. her meeting up with Ramsay). That just wouldn’t make sense because she is still to meet him in the books. If what you say is true, I’m hoping it’s Stannis and they just speed her arc up.

  246. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:24 pm | Permalink

    Markus,

    Problem is, we’ve just been informed that she’s not going anywhere near Moat Caitlin, as in Mhysa she said she’s sailing ‘up the Narrow Sea’.

    I originally though she would sail all the way to Moat Caitlin, and go by horse to the Dreadfort, but instead she’s leaving south from Pyke, going around Dorne and coming North all the way to the Dreadfort. So she can only really be intercepted by Stannis at Dragonstone or Ramsay at The Dreadfort. If Theon is indeed at Moat Caitlin, he’s nowhere close to Yara.

  247. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:26 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    You stole my reply. I just re-watched that scene to make sure I heard her correct. I did.

  248. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:30 pm | Permalink

    Markus,

    It’s not fan fiction. We are merely trying to predict what will come next. If I had it my way I wish the show followed the books verbatim but it doesn’t so if we want to guess at what’s coming next we have to adjust ourselves so that we are not constrained by the book.

  249. Kyrion
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:30 pm | Permalink

    After The Feast,

    I like that, though they will have to cut the bit in ADWD where Jon persuades Stannis NOT to attack the dreadfort, now he’ll basically will and hold there? I like him being in the forest before the battle of Winterfell, plus the lake is in the forest where the battle will take place, its hard to wrap around your head but this is the cost of cutting and combining arcs

  250. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:32 pm | Permalink

    Kyrion,

    Yeah changing the story does have a sort of domino effect. All we can do is wait and see what Asha/Yara is up to this season.

  251. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:38 pm | Permalink

    Kyrion,

    Yeah, and I really hope we get something equivalent to that Jon scene. I thought that was a really important moment where he used his wits and saved Stannis’s ass. But if Yara’s not at Deepwood Motte we probably won’t ever get this.

    After The Feast,

    Exactly. This site is built around speculation on upcoming seasons, and as the seasons progress naturally we expect bigger and bigger deviations. Now I may have been pretty long-winded about explaining my ideas but I’m still having fun. :P

  252. Marco
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:39 pm | Permalink

    I since heard correctly, but am I the only one that thought the theme music from these mini trailers was the imperial march?

  253. Dragon Punch
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 9:53 pm | Permalink

    I thought Reek had a rainbow banner though?

  254. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 10:06 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    Yeah and that’s the fun part of it: thinking of things to pick up the slack from deviations in the book. I think they will cast Euron and and Victarion for next season so the show will have to rely on Asha/Yara to carry the Greyjoy plot (excluding Theon). Watch Dan and David write it so Asha gets to the Dreadfort, captures it, then gets a raven about the death of Balon, thus calling her home. So this renders her mission absolutely pointless. I feel like at that point the nonreaders would just give up on the Grejoy arc.

  255. JamesL
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 10:45 pm | Permalink

    WeirwoodTreeHugger,
    It’s already been confirmed that Arya goes to the Eyrie this season.

  256. LordStarkington
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 10:51 pm | Permalink

    JamesL,

    Where?

  257. Greenjones
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:00 pm | Permalink

    LordStarkington,

    Maisie and Rory filmed in Iceland in the Summer where Sophie Turner and Aidan Gillen also filmed. A producer in an interview with Icelandic tv said they were filming the Vale there, I’m pretty sure. Also, the CV for the Knight of the Gate http://archive.is/USr6Y says he appears in more than one episode, so he will likely be seen through both Arya and Sansa’s viewpoints to establish another “so close but so far” moment where Stark siblings almost reunite but don’t.

  258. Andrew
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:03 pm | Permalink

    I am super excited. A trailer of a trailer. Man, HBO’s marketing department knows us too well.

  259. Cary Storm
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:08 pm | Permalink

    After The Feast,

    This makes infinitely more sense than any of the Yara meets Ramsay theories above. Also, Charlotte Hope is NOT FAKE ARYA. makes entirely NO SENSE in any rational adaptation.

  260. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:11 pm | Permalink

    After The Feast:
    Family, Duty, Hodor,
    Watch Dan and David write it so Asha gets to the Dreadfort, captures it, then gets a raven about the death of Balon, thus calling her home. So this renders her mission absolutely pointless.I feel like at that point the nonreaders would just give up on the Grejoy arc.

    Interesting that you mention it because it does seem to be a familiar strategy that D&D pursue, in which major storyline changes are made with no net plot differences:

    1) Talisa: significant storyline change (replacing JW and travel to the Twins), no net plot diff (just more brutal)

    2) Gendry: significant storyline change (replacing ES, travel w/Mel), no net plot diff (royal bastard bloodletting w/leeches, escape back to mainland)

    3) Ros: significant storyline change (invented char), no net plot diff (dies as means to bolster Joff’s insanity)

    4) Theon/Ramsay: significant storyline change (pre-PoV torture-porn), no net plot diff

    5) Locke: significant storyline change (no Brave Companions), no net plot diff so far (Jaime’s hand, Brienne, Bear) but there is a hint he might go to the wall (where he will perish, hence no net plot diff)

    6) Daario – amalgamation of SB & Daario? Will he best the Meereen champ and be our lucky locust guy as well?

    7) Loras – dying on Dragonstone in S5 vs dying at KL in S4? Any net plot diff?

    8) Jaime/Brienne – Will Jaime’s/Brienne’s early arrival at KL have any real plot affect, other than interesting conversations?

    9) Yara? – Does her presence at the Kingsmoot matter? Will she do something at the Dreadfort/Winterfell and end up in Stannis’s hands anyway?

    There is a chance all this Yara storyline deviation will lead us back in alignment with major plot expectations, but we’ll have to wait and see. There is that damn butterfly effect though….

  261. WeirwoodTreeHugger
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:12 pm | Permalink

    JamesL:
    WeirwoodTreeHugger,
    It’s already been confirmed that Arya goes to the Eyrie this season.

    The Eyrie though? Or did you just mean the Vale. I can’t think of any reason she’d go the Eyrie.

  262. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:12 pm | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    Well i personally think her meeting Ramsay would be utter bullshit. If she is going to meet anyone, make it Stannis so it just speeds up her story. But then the problem is she isn’t present for the kings moot. Her story is just kind of a mess right now.

  263. After The Feast
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:14 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Nice catch! I didn’t even really realize a sort of pattern. I want to believe her trip isn’t for nothing but either way it causes problems.

  264. Maester Blaster
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:14 pm | Permalink

    I saw Sansa in the front row of the wedding and thought; She is the groom’s ex. and a traitorous Stark. She is a political nobody. Why is she in front just because she is a main character in the story?

    Then I remembered she is married to the Groom’s Uncle.

    I am dumb.

    On a related topic, I was initialy displeased that Jamie got back to KL so early, but then I thought It will be cool watching his conflict for the entire season as Tywin and Cersei crap on Tyrion. It will give good motivation for his break from the love of his life and the decision at the end to jailbreak his little bro. Also, lot’s of crunchy good Nicoli vs. Lena vs. Chuck D. staring contests before the end of the era.

  265. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:28 pm | Permalink

    Maester Blaster:
    I saw Sansa in the front rowof the wedding and thought; She is the groom’s ex. and a traitorous Stark.She is a political nobody. Why is she in front just because she is a main character in the story?

    But is she wearing a hairnet? We need hi-def pixel-by-pixel analysis now!

    He jailbreaks Brienne too, which should be interesting!

  266. Scott Wood
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:31 pm | Permalink

    Joan Català: – Tyrion’s shot is too spoilery. They shouldn’t have.

    I don’t think it’s too spoilery… It indicates he gets into trouble, which is enough to arouse interest, but it doesn’t give any hints as to why… If I were unsullied, I’d guess that he threatened Joffrey one too many times and got smacked down for it.

  267. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 10, 2014 at 11:44 pm | Permalink

    Maester Blaster:
    On a related topic, I was initialy displeased that Jamie got back to KL so early, but then I thought It will be cool watching his conflict for the entire season as Tywin and Cersei crap on Tyrion.It will give good motivation for his break from the love of his life and the decision at the end to jailbreak his little bro.Also, lot’s of crunchy good Nicoli vs. Lena vs. Chuck D. staring contests before the end of the era.

    (Sorry I messed up my previous response to you)

    Jaime also jailbreaks Brienne, which should prove quite interesting. Will they put her in jail for her protection or for something else? And, as others have speculated, will Tyrion and Brienne get to have a convo while incarcerated?

  268. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 12:20 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: Interesting that you mention it because it does seem to be a familiar strategy that D&D pursue, in which major storyline changes are made with no net plot differences:

    1) Talisa: significant storyline change (replacing JW and travel to the Twins), no net plot diff (just more brutal)

    2) Gendry: significant storyline change (replacing ES, travel w/Mel), no net plot diff(royal bastard bloodletting w/leeches, escape back to mainland)

    3) Ros: significant storyline change (invented char), no net plot diff (dies as means to bolster Joff’s insanity)

    4) Theon/Ramsay: significant storyline change (pre-PoV torture-porn), no net plot diff

    5) Locke: significant storyline change (no Brave Companions), no net plot diff so far (Jaime’s hand, Brienne, Bear) but there is a hint he might go to the wall (where he will perish, hence no net plot diff)

    6) Daario – amalgamation ofSB & Daario? Will he best the Meereen champ and be our lucky locust guy as well?

    7) Loras – dying on Dragonstone in S5 vs dying at KL in S4? Any net plot diff?

    8) Jaime/Brienne – Will Jaime’s/Brienne’s early arrival at KL have any real plot affect, other than interesting conversations?

    9) Yara? – Does her presence at the Kingsmoot matter? Will she do something at the Dreadfort/Winterfell and end up in Stannis’s hands anyway?

    There is a chance all this Yara storyline deviation will lead us back in alignment with major plot expectations, but we’ll have to wait and see. There is that damn butterfly effect though….

    This is a good post. Despite all of the concerns, the net effect has been to lead characters more or less physically where they should be anyway. A few minor characters have died slightly earlier or later than in the books, but the larger effect in terms of plot machinations have been relatively contained. Yara could be a difference, but it’s true that she’s not needed at the Kingsmoot anyway.

    However, the suggestions that she’d become fake Arya, or take Val’s place, or jump off the boat onto a skiff piloted by Osha on the way to Skagos, or something, are a bit ridiculous.

  269. Lorss
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 12:38 am | Permalink

    How about hearing of certain man in a hanging bridge with a wet crow in his shoulder??? That would make her change her plans… In not sure if my post is clear but i dont knoe how to hide spoilers…

  270. Chickenduck
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 12:42 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Good post. Different route, same destination.

  271. After The Feast
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 12:44 am | Permalink

    Lorss,

    I think that goes with her hearing of Balon’s death, thus forcing her to return to claim the seastone chair

  272. Cary Storm
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:48 am | Permalink

    After The Feast,

    That’s exactly what I’m saying. It’ll put Yara into Stannis’s hands easier without having the complication of the Kingsmoot, which they’ll probably cut anyway. Too bad, but I think the Kingsmoot can be cut entirely without any depreciation in plot.

  273. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:51 am | Permalink

    it’s hard to predict what needs to happen with Yarasha and Theon because we don’t know the end of their arc

    If the Battle of Ice happened chronologically before The Pink Letter then Theon’s material should be started now
    If Stannis really lost the Battle of Ice then Yara doesn’t even need to meet him because the only thing she does while with Stannis is meet Theon

  274. Cary Storm
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:53 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: 6) Daario – amalgamation of SB & Daario? Will he best the Meereen champ and be our lucky locust guy as well?

    Well there’s no question that is Daario ready to best some champion in front of Meereen. I have to wonder about the locusts though. Daario is a hostage at that point in the books…

  275. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:56 am | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    I thoughtGrey Worm, would eat the locusts, not because of a big appetite like Belwas but because he never had luxury before, it’s not like SB died anyway

  276. loco73
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 3:22 am | Permalink

    Sorry to repeat myself but…that scene between the Red Viper and The Mountain, specifically the Red Viper’s fighting style, reminds me of the fighting style Achilles (Brad Pitt) used against Hector (Eric Bana) in the movie “Troy”. That was a pretty good one. I wonder, since David B. was involved with “Troy”, if he was inspired by that particular scene as a model for the RV vs. Ser Gregor…? It would be awesome if some of the elements from the Achilles versus Hector fight could be integrated into this one….

  277. loco73
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 3:28 am | Permalink

    Here is a pic from the AFI awards show…and who do we have here, but our three strays, Maisie Williams aka Sansa Stark, Emilia Clarke aka Daenerys Targaryen and Kit Harrington aka Jon Snow! Its from Jan.10/’14.

    http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3370046976/rg1611831808

    Derp de derp…..

  278. loco73
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 3:51 am | Permalink

    Oh yeah…way to go John Bradley…I mean Sam!

    http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3318063360/nm3849842?ref_=nmmi_mi_all_evt_15

  279. Veltigar
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:08 am | Permalink

    loco73:
    Sorry to repeat myself but…that scene between the Red Viper and The Mountain, specifically the Red Viper’sfighting style, reminds me of the fighting style Achilles (Brad Pitt) used against Hector (Eric Bana) in the movie “Troy”. That was a pretty good one. I wonder, since David B. was involved with “Troy”, if he was inspired by that particular scene as a model for the RV vs. Ser Gregor…?It would be awesome if some of the elements from the Achilles versus Hector fight could be integrated into this one….

    Hmm, I don’t think D&D as writers have great influence over the way the director and whoever is the choreographer for this fight scene decided to put this scene together. They might have made a note and said RV vs. Gregor. Inspiration Troy but that’s about as far as it goes I’d imagine. It’s the responisbility of director and choreographer to make something interesting out of the ducks and jabs of the RV Of course I don’t know who choreagraphed this, perhaps the same guy who did Troy works for Got?

  280. Veltigar
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:17 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard:
    8) Jaime/Brienne – Will Jaime’s/Brienne’s early arrival at KL have any real plot affect, other than interesting conversations?

    There is no real need for interesting conversations, seeing the plethora of great characters and possibilities for dialogue in KL alone. So, there are going to be a few changes I think. For starters I think Gendry might end up with Brienne and triPod, just like I think he will in the books, but sooner. I also think that Brienne might get some clue about Sansa’s whereabouts, so that they can cut all the pretty aimless wandering (I liked those scenes in the books, but they would drag on the silver screen) and have her go to the Vale straight away

  281. kevin
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:23 am | Permalink

    Bannerless Bro,

    No they won’t because the character that have no DwD and FfC chapters in season 4 are:
    Sansa, Arya, Jon, samwell, jaime, Tyrion.
    Davos probably doesn’t have DwD material. No news about Manderly.
    No news about Dorne and about Greyjoy brothers, so probably only some theon and Yara stuff are going to be seen on screen.

    AffC chapter:
    - maybe cercei has her first aFfC chapter.

    DwD chapter:
    - Bran, probably ends with him meeting with 3ER
    - Danny probably have her first DwD chapter. And the locking of the Dragon’s that happened between the first and second chapter.
    - Reek probably ends with Moat Coalin in season 4. Would be a nice way to end the season. Theon betrayed the Iron born.

    there are some things that are in season 4 that are in DwD beside what I post her, but that are small things like: More Margaery and cercei mental catfight. A bigger introduction of Hizdahr before his DwD story. It doesn’t involve his DwD story but we get a good idea what kind of man he is.

    Still GRRM needs to write fast to keep on track, but I’m not going to worry till the season that will show some WoW material (probably the end of season 5 will contain some of Bran from WoW but still Martin already wrote that so he can easily give that material to D&D, but for the rest) that will be season 6 material. And if Martin release his book before that, I’m going to worry when the next season is the season that have some DoS material.

  282. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:36 am | Permalink

    Cary Storm,

    Of course it can be done. It’s the easiest thing they can do. But scenes like the Kingsmoot are the whole point of creating this show, anyway. It can be done without Yara, yes- but what’s the point? Why take her on a trip around the world only to cut her out of a bunch of good scenes that would potentially spice up season 5? What do you honestly think is going on in D&D’s heads when they say “let’s just get Yara to Stannis faster. Derp” when the payoff of getting them together hasn’t even been achieved yet? What is the point of getting them together, what will it earn the writers except to speed up one story line by two seasons? What will they do with Yara after she is taken by Stannis that will have made this change worth it? Do you honestly believe they will cut out Jon’s advice to Stannis to attack the Iron Born and rouse the mountain clans? This “small change” you people suggest uproots half of the awesome Stannis arc in ADWD, and for what? I honestly don’t understand the thought process behind it, and why D&D would even consider it.

    If you ask me, Yara’s trip is meant to replace the Moat Cailin incident. That’s it. If she meets with Stannis along the way, it will be a really stupid change IMO as it prevents a number of awesome scenes from existing.

  283. kevin
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:42 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Can work. If they find out that it’s not Arya. Roose can always say to Ramsey: It’s Yara, not Arya. Can’t you put letters in the right place.

  284. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:47 am | Permalink

    kevin,

    One thing is certain, they will make three seasons out of three books (ADWD, AFFC and TWOW). D&D have said before that they hope this will be an 80 hour saga, which translates to 8 seasons (actually, it would need a few more episodes to reach 80- hopefully the last season will be extended like BB). The question is, really- how much of those three will be from books 4&5? Would they give TWOW+ a little ADOS two full seasons? It does seem like TWOW is going to pack a lot of plot development, unlike the last two books…

    I like to think and hope that it will be a season and a half (averagely, as some arcs will last nearly two seasons while others will barely last one season) of ADWD and AFFC and another season and a half of TWOW, with season 6 making an awkward mesh of TWOW and ADWD (because I don’t think AFFC material will ever outlast season 5- there just isn’t enough). That way, season 7 will be mostly if not wholly TWOW, and GRRM will only have to worry before season 8.

    Either way, if he doesn’t get book 6 out before season 5, he is fucked. And it will be his fault, too.

  285. NomadicDirewolf
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:02 am | Permalink

    looks so awesome from a sulllied perspective, cant wait till it airs! But I do wonder, has that spoiled too much for the unsullied? it showed a lot i mean pretty much all the major events of the season bar a few

  286. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:09 am | Permalink

    NomadicDirewolf,

    It showed action at the Wall and a wedding. Those aren’t at all spoilers of what’s to come. The duel only makes sense to us Sullied, I doubt Unsullied will ever connect the dots on that one until late in season 4 (if they even remember the trailer by then). In fact, the only thing I’d consider spoilery is Tyrion in chains, but since that will happen so early on in the season, I guess HBO don’t really have a problem spoiling it. Also, you can barely see the chains, and no one will ever guess WHY he’s in chains. So that one spoiler is not too bad. I wouldn’t have shown it if it were up to me, but it isn’t, so… Yeah.

  287. Greenjones
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:25 am | Permalink

    This song works really well, maybe not as well as Seven Devils, but still really well. I hope the lyric “lead them to die” is used to emphasize an epic moment, because that lyric applies to quite a lot of leaders in aSoIaF. It’s almost a shame that the lyric “lead them to die” was never used over an image of Robb Stark.

    Jentario,

    Also, the average person won’t look at screencaps and notice that Stannis’s sigil is being carried by those riders in the Haunted Forest. Looking at gifs and screencaps of a trailer is particular for a certain brand of internet savvy fan.

    Other than Tyrion being arrested, nothing is shown that wasn’t well established in the last season. As for the RV v Mountain duel, I showed someone unfamiliar with the books and all they had to say at that vine/gif was “who is that?” My smirking reaction was “you’ll find out.”

  288. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:28 am | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    Yeah, it’s mostly spoilery in retrospect.

  289. OldeCrone
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:49 am | Permalink

    Regarding Margery’s hair – I think they go the “wiggy” route with that character as Natalie Dormer is a natural blonde. Now that I’ve had a chance to catch up on most (not all) of the books, I would still they the deviation I like least is the introduction of Talisa (I think Talisa fans have agreed to disagree with me about that). It does look like show Yara’s plot line is going to differ from book Asha’s and I’ll just wait and see what the show-runners do with that strand of the story before I make a judgement. I haven’t minded all the deviations – for instance in ACOK book Yoren gives book Arya a short but severe beating – I don’t particularly want to see a young girl being beaten on TV, though something similar happened with Sansa and the screen version was toned down from the book version – also, and I don’t think this needs spoiler alerts, the confrontation between Cressen and Melisandre ends up similarly to the show version but there is (if I remember rightly) a chapter of build-up to the show-down in the book whereas it was over in minutes on TV. I can live with that (well I was Unsullied when I saw that episode and also I appreciate that in a work as long as “A Song of Ice and Fire”, the work has to be curtailed somehow to fit into 10 hour long episodes per year). On the whole I’m not too fond of adapters playing overly fast and loose with their source material (for example in NBC’s “Dracula” the adapter(s) has/have made one character gay who wasn’t gay in Bram Stoker’s novel and no, I’m not anti-gay characters per se, just against changing a character who was straight in an original work into a gay one for a show). EDIT: I tried to put spoiler alerts about Yoren and Arya but they aren’t showing in my post – somebody kindly posted yesterday how insert spoilers for a mobile phone but I’m on a Desktop computer presently

  290. Falcool
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 6:45 am | Permalink

    loco73,

    Veltigar,

    Actually, when I watched Troy a while ago I noticed that Troy is written by David Benioff XD So yeah, he might take inspiration from that film. And what’s also funny is that Commander Mormont, Ned AND Pycelle plays in that movie. I also noticed that Benioff might’ve taken inspiration for the unsullied from some of the Greek soldiers.

  291. Turri
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 6:56 am | Permalink

    I did a rough POV chapter count to see where the meat of the story is at in S4 under some common assumptions of how far it’ll go into later books. It comes down to 24 chapters of ASOS, 5 of AFFC and 6 of ADWD. That’s only half as many chapters as the previous seasons used, so there should be a lot of room to include Team Dragonstone, for example.

    KL (until Tywin’s death): Tyrion 6, Jaime 3
    Wall (until after battle): Jon 5, Sam 1
    Dany (until dragon kills child): 4 (2+2)
    Eyrie (Sansa until Only Cat): 4
    Arya (until FM): 3 (2+1)
    Brienne (until the Whispers): 4 (0+4)
    Bran (until 3EC): 2 (0+2)
    Reek (until fArya): 2 (0+2)
    Epilogue (Stoneheart): Merrett Frey 1

  292. StormsFury
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 7:22 am | Permalink

    How big are the dragons in ASOS and ADWD? (I haven’t read the books but I’m going to start on book 1 soon) I don’t know the time lapse in the books but isn’t it gonna be strange if they are suddenly a lot larger?

  293. TheBerylfly
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 7:27 am | Permalink

    SM4e:
    Greenjones,

    Nice catches. Might the man on Cersei’s left be Kevan? I do really hope they reintroduce him in this season.

    One can hope, since someone looking very similar to the man on Cersei’s left sat in Lannister tent overlooking the Viper-Mountain battle (see the first vine)

    (I don’t think it’s neccesary to spoilertag this, mhm? i mean, they pretty much set it out for everyone to see)

  294. TheBerylfly
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 7:28 am | Permalink

    There is also someone in a headdress looking very much like Olenna’s in that PW shot, but I doubt they would seat the QoT so far behind on her own granddaughters wedding to the bloody king

    StormsFury:
    How big are the dragons in ASOS and ADWD? (I haven’t read the books but I’m going to start on book 1 soon) I don’t know the time lapse in the books but isn’t it gonna be strange if they are suddenly a lot larger?

    There is about two years passing between the birth of Dany’s dragons and events of ADWD, (and three years all in all) and they grow gradually overtime. A dragon will grow so long as it has meat and freedom, after all. They do get pretty big, especially Drogon (the black and red one), bigger than horses
    Now show’s timeline makes less sense, since they tried to sell all the events from the start of the first season to Tyrion’s wedding as taking place over one year, so idk

  295. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 7:58 am | Permalink

    How will the ever too season 4?

  296. OldeCrone
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:06 am | Permalink

    OldeCrone: I would still they the deviation I like least is the introduction of Talisa

    In my earlier post I should have said “I would still say the deviation I like least” ……

  297. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:21 am | Permalink

    OldeCrone,

    On the spirit of fixing mistakes…

    Jentario:
    How will the ever too season 4?

    I meant to write “out do” and not “too”. I blame autocorrect.

  298. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:05 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,
    Very good post, well said. In fact, this whole conversation has been extremely fun to read. I do consider YarAsha to be the real wildcard of S4, though, and it will be her arc that really reveals how they plan to tackle AFfC/ADwD. I like to think that, like with the many examples you listed, she will end up in a position that lines up with the major events of the books, but we will have to wait and see. Will it be the ‘Talisa is a Lannister spy’ of S4, or will it be a real deviation…

    Also, where are you pulling this Lora’s dies in S4 thing from? And just for the record, as far as we know he isn’t dead in the books yet. My current theory regarding that: he is badly injured, but not quite as badly as Cersei claims. He returns to the capital, and because he is so hotheaded he insists on being Margaery’s champion despite his wounds. He puts up a decent fight, but because of his injuries he is killed. Margaery loses her trial and is executed.

    Cary Storm,
    I also think Grey Worm will eat the locusts. Also, assuming that he isn’t the harpy (because I am a simpleton I think the harpy is Hizdahr) I think Skahaz will be cut with Grey Worm taking his role in the stuff at the end of ADwD.

    Jentario,
    Assuming that we are right about S6 being a mix of the late ADwD stuff and early TWoW stuff, with some material from those books running parallel for different storylines, then it could definitely come close. It all depends on how strong the first 1/4-1/3 of TWoW is. I am expecting S5 to be roughly at the same level as S2, but I honestly think S6 could, depending on TWoW, be S1 level or better. Seasons 7 and 8 (and 9 if there is one) are complete unknowns.

  299. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:16 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    Actually, you’re right. Season 6 will be amazing, assuming we’re right.

  300. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:18 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    Nobody thinks Skahaz is the Harpy. Most believe it’s the Green Grace, Skahaz is just running his own game based on that theory. Kinda like a Meereenese Littlefinger.

  301. House Snow
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:25 am | Permalink

    IMO Moving Yara closer to the other main characters and cutting out her seige stuff is a no brainer. Even you like book yara (I didn’t) I don’t see how you could like her plot arc. If there is a common theme to the adaption its that major charcters aren’t left by themselves and thats the big problem with Yara, the ironborn, and non-RV Dorne. They are too isolated too work well and it takes too long, if it happens at all to have a rooting interest. So of course they are rerouting storylines to put people together. It common sense

  302. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:28 am | Permalink

    Turri,

    So looking at the main characters, the number of chapters left for Season 5 and beyond are:

    Jon: 13
    Tyrion: 12
    Cersei: 12
    Daenerys: 8
    Jaime: 8
    Samwell: 5
    Theon: 5
    Arya: 4
    Davos: 4
    Brienne: 4
    Sansa: 3
    Bran: 1

    Total: 79
    (assuming my count is accurate)

    For comparison, AGOT has 72 chapters. So essentially, numbers wise we have a books worth of chapters left for our main characters. But given the slow plot progression, those chapters actually cover quite a lot less than AGOT. For example, Samwell’s journey and Tyrion looking at turtles are unlikely to occupy much screentime. Likewise, the contributions from side characters will likely be severely cut down.

    So really, there’s scarily little left to cover, when you actually break it down. As ridiculous as it sounds, it is actually quite feasible to cram all of AFFC/ADWD into one season.

  303. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:48 am | Permalink

    House Snow,

    So you don’t think we’ll see Dorne or the Iron Island’s storylines at all in season 5?

  304. Turncloak
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:48 am | Permalink

    House Snow,

    I freaking loved when Stannis liberated the deepwood motte from Yara/Asha. I can’t stand the ironborn taking the North.

  305. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:50 am | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,
    One thing you’re forgetting is the average chapter length. The number of pages per chapter pretty much doubles between AGoT and ADwD. And correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t Tyrion looking at turtles only a single paragraph, and not a very long one at that?

  306. OldeCrone
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:50 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    Jentario: I blame autocorrect.

    I didn’t think of that Jentario. I know the “Did you spot my deliberate mistake” get out of jail clause – I’ll have to file the autocorrect one in my memory for future use. I know that hasn’t much to do with GoT Season 4 ……..

  307. Turncloak
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:51 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    I believe Loras is in 100% health. Cersei has not even seen his wounds. Cersei is so dumb that I don’t trust her point of view at all. Some good acting by Margaery when she yelled “dieing is not dead”. Cersei is getting played, hard.

  308. Patchy Face
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:51 am | Permalink

    Andrew,

    HBO knows us well because they lurk here. And we have been talking about a trailer of a trailer for at least a month.

  309. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:51 am | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    Except for the fact that you completely cut the Iron Islands, Dorne, Quentin, JonCon, and Melisandre chapters. Which add at least twenty chapters. Probably more.

    So essentially what you’re saying is that if we cut tons of shit, it is doable.

  310. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:54 am | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    I agree the scene at Deepwood Motte is not worth cutting. And removing Yara from the Kingsmoot will only be a good decision if they intend to completely cut the Iron Islands story (which would be a terrible decision IMO).

  311. Summer is Coming
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:55 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu:
    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Also, where are you pulling this Lora’s dies in S4 thing from? And just for the record, as far as we know he isn’t dead in the books yet. My current theory regarding that: he is badly injured, but not quite as badly as Cersei claims. He returns to the capital, and because he is so hotheaded he insists on being Margaery’s champion despite his wounds. He puts up a decent fight, but because of his injuries he is killed. Margaery loses her trial and is executed.

    Maragery choose Trial of the Faith, no trial by combat for her.

  312. tysnow
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:55 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    My point exactly, WoW will be a book so packed with major events and characters that it will take almost two full seasons to film. Therefore the events from AFfC/DwD need to be concluded by the end of season 5, if 6 and 7 are devoted to WoW and a tad of DoS. This leads me to believe D&D will condense and remove many elements that aren’t essential to propelling the story. HBO is concerned with keeping it straight forward for their subscribers not aligning it verbatim to please hard core book fans. The whole KM stuff is a side arc not essential to propelling the story (hence Yara’s rescue plan to get her to the North and Stannis). Dorne is important because the HBO adaption is focusing on KL more than the North, Dany is 2nd and North a very close 3rd. This becomes evident if you look at the popularity of Dany’s and the KL arcs among the casual viewers, unfortunately to the chagrin of us belonging to team Stark. Though it appears from the clips that team Stark is going to make a furious comeback this season.
    Concerning condensing Dany’s arc, D&D possibly will condense and propel her story so that the Battle of Mereen is the big season 5, episode 9 event. They cannot push it to season 6 otherwise the series will need to be 9 seasons long.
    My take (now I would love GoT to go 10 seasons and keep closer to the books) is that seasons 4 and 5 will focus on AFfC/DwD. Then seasons 6 and 7 will almost entirely make up WoW and season 8 containing the material from DoS; eight seasons, 80 epidodes. But, D&D could go the BB, Twilight, HG and HP route and have season 8 be split into two parts, this would enable them to stretch AFfC/DwD into almost three seasons. If the Battle of Mereen is pushed to season 6, ep. 9, then there is no way D&D can conclude GoT in 8 seasons as they need two for WoW alone.

  313. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:01 am | Permalink

    tysnow,

    I think 1.5 seasons should be enough for TWOW, and 1 season isn’t enough for AFFC and ADWD (I do actually think the Iron Islands shouldn’t be cut). So a season and a half of each is what I want.

  314. Lightbringer
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:02 am | Permalink

    Someone help me with this. According to many Jon’s clip presents him fighting at Craster’s Keep against the mutineers. When exactly did that happen at ASOS (I haven’t read past this book). I only remember him resting at Castle Black until the siege.

  315. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:05 am | Permalink

    Lightbringer,

    It’s a deviation. Since they’re combining the two battles at the Wall and putting them in episode 9, they need something for Jon to do during season 4. Most people thought Bran would be the one to run into the mutineers, but it seems not…

  316. Patchy Face
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:05 am | Permalink

    tysnow,

    I just hope that HBO and D&D will take the series to 8 seasons – really can’t imagine HBO going past that. I am afraid that 7 seasons would really make for a rushed and unsatisfying ending.

  317. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:14 am | Permalink

    Summer is Coming,
    So she did. I forgot about that completely.

  318. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:15 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    I wanted to focus on main characters as that is what the audience will want to focus on. But yes, Iron Islands need to be in. That’s 7 chapters – but Aeron may be cut. The amount of Dorne needed really depends on the significance of this plotline down the road – a maximum of 5 chapters, but could probably use just 2 as if the Myrcella plotline isn’t all that significant it will probably just be scrapped. Quentyn could be pretty much scrapped or seen only through Dany’s PoV without any plot-related problems. Jon Con and Aegon will be in, but the majority of their chapters can overlap with Tyrion’s PoV. Only 1 PoV really necessary there. And Melisandre only has 1 chapter too.

    So all in all that adds 11 further chapters that I would say are necessary to include, meaning we need to cover 90 chapters in one season. As Ser Tahu points out, the chapters are actually longer on average in AFFC/ADWD but I believe this is more than counteracted by the slow plot progression. That’s definitely up for debate though.

    As for Tyrion and Turles, yeah probably. :P
    But his whole arc was a massive disappointment for me in ADWD and I think a lot of it could be left out, including Penny.

  319. House Snow
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:18 am | Permalink

    Jentario:
    House Snow,

    So you don’t think we’ll see Dorne or the Iron Island’s storylines at all in season 5?

    I think we will see Dorne,just abridged, since I think there is probably a feasable way to connect the stories, also I wouldn’t be shocked for the story to find a way to send non-essential parties to the KL story over to Dorne so that there are some familiar faces there (maybe Bronn).

    On the ironborn I think they will yada yada yada Euron taking the throne. I don’t think they are necessarily cutting the kingsmoot. I got the distinct impression from the book that Yara’s plan is to recall the Kingsmoot with Theon present. If that is the case I think cutting out the first kingsmoot is just a way of removing redundancy as well as having the kingsmoot at a point when we may be more familiar with the parties involved and thus more invested.

  320. Summer is Coming
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:30 am | Permalink

    Cut that, cut that, cut that! I don’t get people who say that! If most of the things you say to be cut are actually cut, what remains of the story we really love?

    I liked affc/adwd, with some small exceptions (like some of Brienne chapters that were indeed boring and could have been cut), and for the show, scenes can be added, perfected, and completed where is need for such. But the rest?
    *I liked the dornish plot (Myrcella’s cowning could make an excellent plot for S5, and Arianne’s doubts about her father, until Doran mentions Quentin going to get fire&blood) Even Quentin I liked. His story is short, but one of the saddest the books have, and could very well be adapted in S6.
    *The Iron Islands plot seems incomplete a bit, but the Kingsmoot is material for S5.Tthe scene when euron has the horn blown it’s a must for the show!! I actually can see a cold opening for this season (4) with Balon’s death. Victarion’s journey is S6 of course, and could very well include the battle of Meereen as a climax that season. Even GRRM said that was intended for adwd!
    * and Tyrion… if GRRM had included the first 6 Tyrion chapters in affc, people wouldn’t have been soooo against Aegon because he would have appeared sooner right? and his mistery is a season 5 must! Tyrion is kidnapped by Jorah and he says he’s taking him to the queen.. BAM! season ending.
    * Brienne… yes her story can end in the cliffhanger of affc in S5, and then not appearing in S6 (the way Yara missed most of S3), until the final episodes taking Jaime with her, and actually see what happens. so that’s small entering of twow. and there are many more things that can be adjusted, but not cut them altogether. it’s silly! what’s the point of making this adaptation if you cut massive chunks of the story?

    Let’s make S5 with only Dany, Jon and Tyrion, the Big3… oh yes and spice a bit with some Arya and Cersei (the badass kid, and the bitch queen) and cut all the others that remain right? to hell with Sansa, no one likes her right? to the bin with Dorne, and the IronIsles, who needs more new places? Oh, but add Jaime, because he’s the 180 turnaround character, and Varys, cuz’ he’s so mysterious, and QoT and Marg, and LF, etc. My point is: yes cut the useless passages and characters that don’t give steam for the plots, but don’t cut plots altogether..

    D&D&B will do a good job at this!

  321. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:36 am | Permalink

    Just to clarify; I’m really saying that the Chapters left in Season 5 for side characters can be collapsed down to around 11 Chapters worth of material. The Chapters left for main characters, without doing any ‘collapsing’, is 79 chapters. However, if you do get rid of some of Tyrion’s long journey with Penny, Samwell’s travels etc, you could end up with more like 60 Chapters worth of material. Making the sum total about equal to that of AGOT.

    About my ruthless cutting: I’ll be honest. I quite like AFFC/ADWD, but to pretend that I wasn’t disappointed by both of them would be a lie. Nevertheless, I would like to see AFFC/ADWD covered in about 1.5 seasons. But I really think the overall viewership will nosedive as a result, and I don’t think it is what is best for the show when it comes to the viewership as a whole.

  322. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:43 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu:
    Hodor’s Bastard,
    Also, where are you pulling this Lora’s dies in S4 thing from? And just for the record, as far as we know he isn’t dead in the books yet. My current theory regarding that: he is badly injured, but not quite as badly as Cersei claims. He returns to the capital, and because he is so hotheaded he insists on being Margaery’s champion despite his wounds. He puts up a decent fight, but because of his injuries he is killed. Margaery loses her trial and is executed.

    Thx, Ser. It is a fun conversation.

    I also find the Loras dying-on-Dragonstone mummery quite an interesting theory. If you have read some of my wide-eyed and crazed posts with Jordan and others over the past week, you will quickly realize that I have come to conclusion that Loras is being slowly dismissed by GRRM and the show. His death is inevitable, imho. Plus, you should know that I have a grudge against show Loras because of his unbelievable statement about Brienne’s innocence in S2. [How could he possibly come to the conclusion that Renly died via supernatural forces?] He needs to have another escalating confrontation with Brienne because of his suspicions…but the show seems to have dismissed that. So, rather than running amok and tipping some cows, I complain here. :)

  323. cosca
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:32 am | Permalink

    Summer is Coming:
    Cut that, cut that, cut that! I don’t get people who say that! If most of the things you say to be cut are actually cut, what remains of the story we really love?

    For most people, if you cut half of DWD/FFC, the story we really love would pretty much be intact.

  324. Bard
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:37 am | Permalink

    Still GRRM needs to write fast to keep on track, but I’m not going to worry till the season that will show some WoW material (probably the end of season 5 will contain some of Bran from WoW but still Martin already wrote that so he can easily give that material to D&D, but for the rest) that will be season 6 material. And if Martin release his book before that, I’m going to worry when the next season is the season that have some DoS material.

    And how do you know that he’s already written material for Bran’s storyline? He made no comments himself on his progress with TWOW so far, apart from saying he has about “a quarter done” in April last year. He could have had a good run with some POV chapters, maybe even entering ADOS territory, he could also lagg behind with some other storylines. We just don’t know.

  325. cosca
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:38 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard:
    Plus, you should know that I have a grudge against show Loras because of his unbelievable statement about Brienne’s innocence in S2. [How could he possibly come to the conclusion that Renly died via supernatural forces?]H

    I don’t believe he ever said anything about a supernatural cause of death. He just assumes that Stannis had Renly killed somehow, by assassins or some other method. I may be wrong there though.

  326. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:42 am | Permalink

    Bard,

    It’s possible, but Martin’s stated numerous times that Bran’s the hardest POV to write for because his story features so many magical elements and he’s basically having to imagine the thoughts and reactions of a child in very hostile situations. Most of the material for this season will need to be invented purely for the show by the writer’s based on the information about the upcoming book plots already revealed to D&D, and Cogman too in some cases. It’s either that or have 6 or 7 episodes where the same exposition occurs in slightly different ways and places over and over, “‘Til we forget that it is a lie!”

  327. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:54 am | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,
    INTENSE SPOILERS, BEWARE

    I think combining AFFC and ADWD for a season and a half will make for two awesome seasons. Season 6 will clearly be awesome since it’ll hold all the climaxes that should have been in ADWD as well as the continuation of some major arcs (Jamie and Brienne getting to Stoneheart, Arianne meeting Aegon, Marge two trials at King’s Landing…). Let’s focus on season 5, then. Here’s how I’d do it, and I think it would make for a great season:

    Episode 1: Tyrion sailing to Pentos with Varys, finding out he’ll be en route to Dany. The killings at Meereen begin when a body is found, and Dany goes to see her locked up “babies”- symbolic to her restraining the dragon inside her. The Watch needs to elect a Lord Commander, Jon + Stannis + Mel + Davos scenes. I would also add the first few Dorne scenes, which means Doran getting the news of Oberyn’s death and a general introduction to this arc. Also, Tywin’s funeral. Arya at the House of Black and White. The episode ends with “Mance” getting burned.
    Episode 2: Tyrion, Varys and Illyrio meet the Griffs. Jon is elected as LC and a rivalry between him and Slynt is set up. Brienne in the Riverlands- meeting Nimble Dick. Victarion, Euron and maybe Aeron get introduced (he seems ripe for cutting IMO), the Kingsmoot gets set up. Sansa and Littlefinger at the Eyrie, the rising issue of the Lords Declarant. Reek and Ramsay set out to meet Roose and fArya, and head towards Winterfell.
    Episode 3: Jon kills Slynt, decides to send Gilly, Sam and Aemon to Oldtown. Bran learning how to “fly” (with ravens) courtesy of Bloodraven. More of Dany’s men get attacked, and she decides to infiltrate the pyramids and take hostages. Brienne fights some outlaws in cracklaw point. At King’s Landing, Tommen and Marge get married and the tension between Cersei and the Tyrells increases.
    Episode 4: this one centers around the Kingsmoot, cutting away from it every few minutes to catch up with other characters. Yara arrives along with the brothers, they talk before, and then the big scene happens. The episode ends with the horn being blown. Sam and Gilly leave, Arya begins her training in Braavos, Tyrion on the ship with the Griffs (beginning to suspect an issue).
    Episode 5: at Dorne, Arianne and Arys sleep together and she convinces him to crown Myrcella- at the end of the episode, Doran finds out they left the castle with Myrcella. Cersei sends Jamie to eliminate Riverrun and the Blackfish. Brienne comes across Gendry (who joins her) and gets a lead on Arya’s location, heads for the BWB. Arya becomes Cat of the Canals. The pale mare hits Meereen, Dany gets a proposal from Hizdahr. Jon gives Stannis good advice- Stannis sends Davos to Manderly and heads toward Deepwood Motte. Sam reaches Braavos, meets Arya.
    Episode 6: Dany talks with her many advisors and decides to marry Hizdahr, realizing she has let go of her dream for Westeros. She meets her dragons again- symbolizes her longing. Jon learns that Tormund’s Wildlings settled in Hardhome, fights with Rattleshirt and figures out he’s actually Mance. Davos is imprisoned and “killed” by Manderly. Reek and the Boltons reach the ruins of Winterfell and announce the wedding to the North. Sansa and Littlefinger deal with the Lords Declarant, Bran learns how to connect to the Weirnet, gets some visions- the episode ends with a glimpse at the Others attacking Hardhome.
    Episode 7: Stannis meets with the leader of a mountain clan and tells him of the plan to attack the Ironborn. Brienne comes across a gravedigger in some sept and follows a lead to the BWB. Cersei initiates her plan to destroy Margery, reveals her interactions with Maggy to Lady Merrywether. The Iron Born attack some random place at the Reach (not necessarily the shield Isles). Yara has a scene in Deepwood Motte. Tyrion unveils Aegon’s identity. Arianne meets with Darkstar and is ambushed by Doran’s men, Darkstar attacks Myrcella. Jaime and Bronn(?) practice sword fighting on their way to Riverrun.
    Episode 8: Jon learns of the attack on Hardhome through Melisandre, takes Mance and some NW members beyond the Wall on a mission to save Tormund. Tyrion and the Griffs pass through the sorrows. Doran reveals his true intentions to Arianne (no more Dorne this season), Dany marries Hizdahr, Sam confronts Daerion and sets sail back to Oldtown. Stannis takes Deepwood (Yara’s fate left uncertain). Jamie reached Riverrun and speaks with the leading Frey. The episode ends with Davos and Manderly, the North Remembers.
    Episode 9: The episode centers around Jon’s assault on Hardhome and only cuts away to other storylines every few minutes. The emphasis would be on tons of wights and Others, and tons of hopelessness. Jon would manage to save Tormund and a few hundred Wildlings but at the cost of a large portion of his men. Reek and the Boltons invite the Northern lords to Winterfell, Brienne fights Rorge and Biter at the inn and is saved by the BWB, Cersei and Marge fall to the Faith and get imprisoned. Jamie gets Riverrun to surrender without shedding blood.
    Episode 10: Arya throws her stuff and abandons her past, Sansa and Littlefingef leave the Vale and he tells her of his plans. Cersei in prison going crazy, and the fallout of the happening is KL. Jon and Tormund speak after the battle. Dany meets her dragons again but this time they are ANGRY which makes her cry, she finally fucks Daario. The Yunkaii threat is set up. Tyrion is abducted by Jorah. Euron sends Victarion after Dany. Stannis speaks with the captured Yara and speaks of his intended assault on Winterfell. Aemon dies on the ship and Sam eulogizes him- proceeding to sleep with Gilly. The season ends with a montage of all the main characters (including Dorne and the Iron Islands and Sam on a ship with Oldtown in the background) as Bloodraven gives Bran a speech of how everybody will be fucked when the Others attack- during this montage Winter will finally come with Snow in surprising places. Oh, I almost forgot- Brienne meets Stoneheart and gets hanged, only to shout “sword” to which Stoneheart will smile.

    WOW. That took a while. I feel like Ser Tahu. Anyway, it would make for an awesome season IMO.

  328. Jordan
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:54 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Loras logic:

    Catelyn arguably had a motive but had no means to kill Renly and wouldn’t have killed someone during a parlay.

    Brienne had means and opportunity, but no motive.

    Therefore, Stannis.

    Now, the fact Brienne joined up with Catelyn afterward does look suspicious…

  329. Turri
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:59 am | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,
    Yeah, if you assume the Greyjoys (10 chapters) and Martells (9) won’t play much of a role, you’ll definitely get to TWOW early in S6. Which means there’s about 14 months left for George to finish it, ideally.

  330. Ragman's Harbor
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 12:17 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    There just ain’t no battle at Hardome. I’ll be vague cause I don’t know if my spoilertags will work. But what happens in Jon’s storyline happens before Hardome.

    But otherwise your season 5 makes sense.

  331. kevin
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 12:47 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    kevin,

    One thing is certain, they will make three seasons out of three books (ADWD, AFFC and TWOW). D&D have said before that they hope this will be an 80 hour saga, which translates to 8 seasons (actually, it would need a few more episodes to reach 80- hopefully the last season will be extended like BB). The question is, really- how much of those three will be from books 4&5? Would they give TWOW+ a little ADOS two full seasons? It does seem like TWOW is going to pack a lot of plot development, unlike the last two books…

    I like to think and hope that it will be a season and a half (averagely, as some arcs will last nearly two seasons while others will barely last one season) of ADWD and AFFC and another season and a half of TWOW, with season 6 making an awkward mesh of TWOW and ADWD (because I don’t think AFFC material will ever outlast season 5- there just isn’t enough). That way, season 7 will be mostly if not wholly TWOW, and GRRM will only have to worry before season 8.

    Either way, if he doesn’t get book 6 out before season 5, he is fucked. And it will be his fault, too.

    I didn’t say that those 2 books will contain 2 seasons. Personally I think that some will end at the end of season 5. Most will end midway (around episode 6×04 6×05) and I think that only one storyline will last whole season 6. That means that avarage I think that those 2 books will last about 13 to 15 episodes. Than the remaining of season 6 can be the parts that were intended to end DwD. That means that 1/3 of WoW can end in season 6. Season 7 will contain the remaining of WoW and season 8 will be DoS. (something like that). So still I think it will be 8 seasons of material but I don’t think season 4 needs to have a lot of material for those 2 books needed, because they can easily be translate into 13/15 episodes (means 25/27 episodes for the other 2 books).

  332. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 12:57 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    60 chapters for the main characters sounds about accurate, Tyrion’s travelogue can be mostly cut, and focus on Illyrio&Varys, Aegon & JonCon, and Moqorro a lot more. Jaime’s story is pretty redundant other than his relationship with Cersei and then owning everybody at Riverrun, Standing vigil, Meeting Daven, Castle Darry & Raventree are all unnecessary. The same goes for Brienne before Quiet Isle. Sam’s travelogue can be cut too, focusing more on Gilly, Arya&Pyp in Braavos, Aemon dying and then Oldtown. I think with added Bran, Sansa, Davos and Stannis compared to the books… and maybe cut Dorne (but not the characters), it’d be a really good pace

  333. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:00 pm | Permalink

    kevin,

    The problem with making Dany’s storyline last two seasons and no one else’s, is that she’ll still have a lot of chapters in tWoW, and probably a lot more plot. It’s either condense now with material that won’t satisfy the audience as much, or condense later

  334. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:09 pm | Permalink

    Ragman’s Harbor,

    Yeah, I know. I added it. It’s my solution to the lack of a big episode 9 moment that season.
    EDIT: It also sets up the threat of the White Walkers that would otherwise be forgotten in the books and it doesn’t really change anything because everything will be the same as the book again after the episode. The WWs would still be there and Jon and Tormund will be at Castle Black, setting up that relationship for season 6 which will focus on that and on Jon’s downfall.

  335. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:10 pm | Permalink

    kevin,

    And I agree completely.

  336. The Spider
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:14 pm | Permalink

    Preety epic stuff. All i need un the full trailer is one thing…Dragons

  337. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:43 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    Dany’s story will never last two seasons- the second she leaves Meereen she is pretty much out of material (except for 1 episode’s worth of scenes in her last chapter). A season and a half is more like it. Meereen on the other hand, can last almost two seasons (if they include the battle and the aftermath, taken from TWOW).

  338. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 1:47 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    You think she can do whatever it is with the Dothraki to make the crones bow to her, get back to the Battle of Meereen, deal with Volantis, get to Westeros (if nothing happens with Pentos) and battle Aegon to take the entirety of Westeros in less than two seasons? There’s going to be so much plot to fit in that if anything should be shortened it should be Meereen

  339. Uther Greenshirt
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 2:12 pm | Permalink

    people just want to cut things they think are boring nothing more, the show can expand and foreshadow more than the printed word….

  340. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 2:18 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    Well, she would be done with the Dothraki in season 6, which leaves unknown material for seasons 7 and 8. I would guess that season 7 will be about her return to Westeros (after passing through Volantis and maybe Pentos) and her first interactions with Aegon, while season 8 will be about the war with Aegon and then the war against the others, in an extended season. I can’t tell you if it’s possible to fit all that into the remaining seasons because we really don’t know what will happen, but I can say that if GRRM intends to finish the story in two books, it can be done in the series in two and a half seasons (and possibly even 3, if the final season is extended as I suspect). Also, keep in mind this is only one storyline out of many. While Dany lingers in Essos, all the other characters will be far into their respective storylines, which leaves room for “catching up” episodes that focus on Dany- with only few scenes from other characters- and blast her story forward (since the others are so far ahead).

    Now I’ll say why I think this is necessary- with seasons 5 & 6, D&D will get into the same Meereenese Knor that drove GRRM crazy. This means they have to get three (or two- if Quentin gets cut, which isn’t unlikely) characters all the way to Dany in very specific time frames. Fitting Tyrion’s whole journey into one season seems crazy to me, as is expecting Victarion to get around the world in a half a season (considering he leaves late in book 4). If it is possible, it’s only possible by having lots and lots of Tyrion- in a way that will hurt the season as a whole, considering it is so packed with storylines that need attention.

    I’m not saying it’s impossible to release a good season 5 while shoving all the Meereen buisness into one season, but I do think it’s improbable. I think it creates more problems than it solves.

  341. Mariya Martell
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 2:26 pm | Permalink
  342. Annara Snow
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 2:33 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Yara as the fake Arya is the worst idea ever, for so many reasons that I don’t even know where to begin.

  343. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 3:16 pm | Permalink

    Annara Snow:
    Hodor’s Bastard,
    Yara as the fake Arya is the worst idea ever, for so many reasons that I don’t even know where to begin.

    Yes, I do agree. Please don’t take my somewhat facetious retort to King Tommen’s comment as too serious. But as you can tell from the subsequent discussion, a few are trying to figure out her journey to the Dreadfort and its ramifications. I personally don’t think she will be successful in her Theon rescue attempt (how could she?) but somehow she has to end up near Winterfell to align with other storylines. As others have pontificated, will she do that via the Kingsmoot/Deepwood Motte (which makes her Dreadfort journey somewhat ridiculous) or will she do that by shadowing the Boltons (NOT as a prisoner!)?

  344. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 3:37 pm | Permalink

    Jordan:
    Hodor’s Bastard,
    Loras logic:
    Catelyn arguably had a motive but had no means to kill Renly and wouldn’t have killed someone during a parlay.
    Brienne had means and opportunity, but no motive.
    Therefore, Stannis.
    Now, the fact Brienne joined up with Catelyn afterward does look suspicious…

    You didn’t mention Brienne’s reactive killing of two guards (instead of Loras killing them in his grief). Cat and Brienne gone, Renly dead….Loras doesn’t have to be a genius to jump to the obvious conclusion, yet he blurts out non-passionate nonsense to Margaery, who also loved Renly. You’d think he would immediately suspect Brienne, thinking she won the Bitterbridge tourney (at the same time Cat arrives) just to be close to Renly for nefarious purposes.

    Yes, I’m in absolute denial about this situation with show Loras. Folks can call it “Loras character assassination (literally and figuratively)” but on this issue, the show is nonsense and I can’t wait to discover what Cersei and Jaime (and Brienne) have in store for him (hopefully it involves sleeping with the fishes).

    Have I taken a strong enough position on this?

  345. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 3:48 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,
    Wow. Comparing your S5 predictions with Ser Tahu’s predictions, and others, will make for a fine afternoon with football in the background! Thx for putting it out there.

    Go NO, NE, SF, and DEN!!

  346. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:01 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak:
    Ser Tahu,

    I believe Loras is in 100% health. Cersei has not even seen his wounds. Cersei is so dumb that I don’t trust her point of view at all. Some good acting by Margaery when she yelled “dieing is not dead”. Cersei is getting played, hard.

    Agreed on this. With GoT, I don’t believe anyone is dead until certain benchmarks have been fulfilled, which are:

    1. Did GRRM say in interviews that the person is dead? If so, yes, they’re dead.
    2. Are they an unimportant minor character there as cannon fodder? Dead.
    3. Are they Ned Stark? Dead.
    4. Did we see them die and get buried, and no resurrection occurs in a few days time? Dead.
    5. Did White Walkers kill them? Dead.
    6. Are they Beric Dondarrian? Not dead.
    7. Is the offscreen death information coming from a verifiable source? Yes, then dead. Cersei? Not dead.

  347. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:03 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    idk I feel like aDwD Tyrion will hurt the show no matter what, More penny would be bad, more travelling would be bad, I guess I could go for extended time on the boat with Moqorro or extended life as a slave. That’d be interesting.
    But in my head it’s 5×01-02 Meet Varys and Illyrio, mushrooms, intentions, send to Daenerys
    5×03-5×06 Meet Griff and Young Griff, Aegon reveal, Stone Men, Cyvasse, Meet the Golden Company, Aegon wants to go to Westeros
    5×07-5×10 Meet Jorah, Get a boat to Meereen, Meet Moqorro, Captured as a Slave, Daznak’s pit, Gets out of Slavery. New noticable characters restricted to three + illyrio, fast plot but not too time consuming

  348. Varamyr 4 skins
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:05 pm | Permalink

    Throner,

    I completely agree, it adds up the white flag that would be a great sequence and your right about the dark atmosphere of the shot. Looks great
    Can’t wait I’ve got a raging throner and three months before I can satisfy it

  349. Greenjones
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

    What of this new footage can we assume is in each episode? The clip of the fire-breather at the out-door reception and the two sept of Baelor shots, we know to be ep. 2 from that callsheet. http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/41638612315945528407547705682000213020n.jpg From the same callsheet many of us assume the shot of Jon fighting is from ep. 4 at Craster’s dealing with the mutineers. The shot of Tormund and the Thenn running, the giant in the tunnel to Castle Black and of the Baratheon horsemen riding through the Haunted forest we know to be ep. nine. It also seems to fit that the Mountain RV business will go down in ep. 8, though there’s no actual 100 percent proof for that.

    Other than those do we have anything that we know for sure?

  350. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:10 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber,

    around a red priestess? Not dead
    Tyrion lannister’s plot armour? Not dead
    Trying to preserve peace in King’s Landing? So dead

  351. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:11 pm | Permalink

    Regarding Season 5, there are some obvious stopping points, and some ways to make the journeys more compelling. As I wrote in that guest post a few months ago, I have very high hopes because there are strong, compelling stories with a common theme that unites the 3 most important stories in those books: Daenerys, Jon and Cersei. There’s a common theme uniting the next group, which would be Arya, Sam, Brienne and Tyrion. 3 struggling to adapt to leadership roles, the next 4 on different journeys (Tyrion will get more time, because hey Peter Dinklage, but that’s ok).

    For me the cutting is mostly judicious, but you have to go with obvious stopping points, which for Season 5 are:
    –Danys taking off on Drogon’s back
    –Jon stabby-stabby
    –Cersei’s Walk of Shame

    That leaves the entire Barristan end of ADwD for Season 6, Tyrion signing up with the Second Sons for Season 6, and Victarion arriving in Slaver’s Bay to Season 6. And you could probably leave some of the reveal of Doran’s plot until then as well.

    This gives you 2 Dany in Meereen seasons – conquer/Jorah betrayal/dragons go nuts (Season 4), and “Stay and be a queen” (Season 5). It’s workable.

    All of this is workable. The prime spots for cuts, to me, then are this:

    –Any tertiary characters involved in the Kingsmoot/Yara storyline. Just introduce the uncles separately.
    –Brienne’s journey to Cracklaw Point. (Could expand her time with the man who becomes the High Sparrow, giving you insight to this person before he assumes the role he does in King’s Landing
    –Tyrion’s travels with the slavers has to perhaps be chipped away a bit. Keep it to the trip on the Rhone till mid-season, then he gets captured and ends in Meereen seeing the dragon fly off in Season 5.
    –Quentyn Martell. If there’s one digression that may have to go entirely, it’s this one.
    –Reduce extraneous King’s Landing characters (dump Harys Swift, Aurane Waters, Gyles Rosby)
    –Save the entire Griff plot for Season 6 and eliminate Harry Strickland.

  352. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:13 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber: Agreed on this. With GoT, I don’t believe anyone is dead until certain benchmarks have been fulfilled…

    Well, given that criteria…..Lysa Arryn might be alive!

  353. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    You shoved quite a lot of material into your last three episodes. That would be a lot of Tyrion screentime. What’s worse is that some people expect to actually add the battle of Meereen too. That is absolutely ridiculous considering how tight his arc is already, as represented in your overview- and I still think that’s too much Tyrion.

  354. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:15 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Have fun, lol. And do tell us who “won” :)

  355. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    Varamyr 4 skins,

    I agree, I love the idea that that is LS. I’m not sure if I believe it, but it would definitely be the perfect setting for that scene. All that’s missing is a nice tree.

  356. Chysko Ikana
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:53 pm | Permalink

    I don’t care about Yara/Asha, I just want Oberyn’s death & Stannis arrival to be a complete surprise for the unsullied. This trailer doesn’t help with that though.

  357. Jentario
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 4:58 pm | Permalink

    Chysko Ikana,

    You want that to be a complete surprise to the Unsullied, and yet you make no attempt to hide your spoilers.

  358. Chysko Ikana
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:02 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    Like my single post is going to ruin it for the unsullied :)
    Everyone who’s still a unsullied & uses this site knows he can’t read the comments.

  359. House Mormont
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:14 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber,

    I strongly agree with your view of Season 5,especially on the three leaders being the focus, but why save Aegon till season 6? season 5 is already so late to have this sudden new Targaryen

    Jentario,

    Yeah before I made the comment I wanted the whole trip from Volantis to Meereen to happen offscreen and for them to be seized as slaves when they get there, but idk how else to incorporate Moqorro, who I’m guessing will be important since he’s in Quaithe’s prophecy

    Chysko Ikana,
    Stannis’ arrival won’t be a surprise, he’s already revealed he’s going to the wall to fight in a battle in the snow

  360. Lef
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:21 pm | Permalink

    On another subject, I hope Oz will provide his thoughts on the first trailer?

  361. Greenjones
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:25 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    Yeah, but they ought to create some doubts that he will arrive. Maybe they could have Tycho Nestoris tempt him with Iron Bank funding and sellswords to take King’s Landing or have Davos have trouble negotiating with Saan or whoever. I don’t know, but they ought to make it seem like something other than a sure thing so that the moment is a better payoff. Particularly if that’s how they intend on ending ep. 9.

  362. Lex
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:25 pm | Permalink

    Am I the only one who thinks this stuff is WAY too spoilery? I’m shocked they’ve already shown that much of the RV/Mountain fight. I think I’m going to try to avoid even watching the trailer. Maybe just once, at most, then it’s the Brotherhood Without Previews for me. Last season I avoided most previews, and it made the show SO much better.

  363. Greenjones
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 5:47 pm | Permalink

    Lex,

    For all the Unsullied know though the RV V tM is a gladiator fight. They won’t know there’ll be a trial by combat until its established that there will be one. Maybe it will dawn on them eventually if they rewatch the trailer many times, but when the show’s airing, people will focus on that content rather than the trailer. Other than internet-savvy dedicated fans, who likely have mistakenly viewed spoilers already.

  364. Ragman's Harbor
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 6:09 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Ragman’s Harbor,

    Yeah, I know. I added it. It’s my solution to the lack of a big episode 9 moment that season.
    EDIT: It also sets up the threat of the White Walkers that would otherwise be forgotten in the books and it doesn’t really change anything because everything will be the same as the book again after the episode. The WWs would still be there and Jon and Tormund will be at Castle Black, setting up that relationship for season 6 which will focus on that and on Jon’s downfall.

    I think instead on inventing a batlle they will try moving one that is actually in the books. Batlles cost a lot. Battle of Mereen and Winterfell in one season (6)? Mereen will cost an arm and a leg with Victarion, Yunkai, Dragons, Barristan, Ships and maybe Volantis. It all depends on the Battle of Winterfell, there is nothing supernatural with that one except a lot of snow. If they can do that one pretty cheap but great looking, they might want to incorporate it in season 5.

    As for the White Walkers, I believe they can skip a season without them or write a brief appearance. If Hardhome isn’t that important in TWOW, they will probably do without. They got enough on their plates, I believe.

  365. Ser Habakuk
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:03 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont: Yeah before I made the comment I wanted the whole trip from Volantis to Meereen to happen offscreen and for them to be seized as slaves when they get there, but idk how else to incorporate Moqorro, who I’m guessing will be important since he’s in Quaithe’s prophecy

    I guess a lot of locations and thus money could be saved if all of Tyrion’s interactions with the Griffs took place at Pentos and Jorah would abduct Tyrion from Mopatis’ mansion. Add one or two episodes aboard the Whatshername with Moqorro. Storm. Slaver’s Bay. If there is need for Penny, they could meet her already in slavery.

  366. Sean C.
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:04 pm | Permalink

    As far as season 5 goes, I think that the presence of the Ironborn and the Dornish are both open questions. How essential are either, and would anything be compromised by them appearing in Season 6 or so when they’re actually needed? In Arianne’s case, that being arriving to meet Aegon; in Victarion’s, that would be the Ironborn fleet arriving at the battle (I could see that working very well, and in keeping with the show’s prioritizing surprise above buildup; have the Ironborn’s arrival be as big a surprise to the audience as it is to everybody else).

    On the latter score, if Victarion’s only real contribution is the naval action/transportation, then I think he gets the axe from the show for sure, because none of that is necessary for the show and cutting it would save money. There’s also the mystery around the dragonhorn, but that could probably be worked in some other way if need be.

  367. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:05 pm | Permalink

    kevin,
    I actually agree with this. For the most part I think anyone who didn’t have chapters in the second half of ADwD will finish their material in S5 (with the exception of Sam), and most will finish somewhere in the middle of S6. The three storylines I see going beyond that are Meereen in 6×08 for the battle in 6×09, YarAsha/Theon in 6×07 ahead of the battle in 6×09 (I don’t think that Stannis vs the Boltons will be a particularly large battle, so I think it could feasibly share the episode with the Brattleboro of Meereen) and Jon in 6×10, with his death closing out the season. Arya could also end later depending on how TWoW plays out for her (GRRM has said he could write a book about her adventures in Braavos, so I don’t think it would be hard for them to expand her stuff if they need to.

    House Mormont,
    Where did he specify Daenerys in that? And just for the record Meereen != Daenerys. I think the fighting pits will be in 5×09, so Daenerys would end her stuff in S5 (aside from her Dothraki sea chapter), while Meereen stuff would continue into S6.

    House Mormont,
    Why would Daenerys vs Aegon will be in S7 when it won’t be in TWoW? If you think that ADoS will be nothing but fighting the Others/WW, I think you will be mistaken. If that is the case then ADoS will be a very boring and repetitive book. I think the first half of ADoS will be the dance of the dragons while the North is decimated by the Others. The second half would then be the fight against the Others.

    Jentario,
    I don’t think the timing of Tyrion’s arrival is very important as long as he arrives before the battle. Only Quentyn (who I don’t think will be cut) and Victarion need to arrive at precise times.

    Hodor’s Bastard,
    Just for the record, I also have my S6 predictions up (as well as an alternate version that works in my TWoW theories (some of which will need to be changed because I was reminded above that Margaery elected a trial by faith over a trial by combat)). I just haven’t bothered advertising it yet. I plan to write up the rest of my TWoW theories in the form of S7 predictions as well. As for ADoS, I think I will just do that in a regular blog style post :P.

  368. Enfield
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:41 pm | Permalink

    This is slightly off-topic from the subject being discussed, but when do TV critics review the show early? I assume its sometime in the month prior to the premier?

  369. NickTargaryen
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:52 pm | Permalink

    The battle of Meereen will be the climax of season 5. There’s no way Dany will still be in Meereen for Season 6, that would leave two seasons of her in Westeros. There’s just no way that’s happening.

    I don’t know about you, but I’d prefer the conclusion of the series to have more room to breathe then dedicate more time to the Meerenese knot. If you disagree, please tell me why you would prefer 2 seasons for WoW and ADoS. I say two seasons because, to expect more than 8 seasons is not realistic in the slightest.

    The mother of Dragons will decide to head to Westeros in 5×10, it is known.

  370. Sean C.
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 8:59 pm | Permalink

    NickTargaryen:

    The mother of Dragons will decide to head to Westeros in 5×10, it is known.

    I generally support the idea that they will want to move through that material quickly, but I think it’s a stretch to say she’ll be leaving for Westeros that quickly. It seems to me like TWOW will allow the Westerosi plots to play out at least a while longer before she shows up.

  371. Abyss
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:10 pm | Permalink

    I would like to inform you, ladies and gentlemen, that the video clip linked above has now officially been viewed more than one million times.
    Thank you for your attention and always support the bottom.

  372. Greenjones
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:15 pm | Permalink

    Abyss,

    Half of that million was me.

  373. King Tommen
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:18 pm | Permalink

    Enfield:
    This is slightly off-topic from the subject being discussed, but when do TV critics review the show early? I assume its sometime in the month prior to the premier?

    HBO tends to send screeners of the first four episodes to critics a couple weeks prior to the airing of the season. They’re kind of embargoed in producing reviews of these episodes until more or less the week of the premiere. If you follow TV critics on twitter or their blogs, general impressions of what they saw will trickle out ahead of that time though.

  374. WildSeed
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:29 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Interesting, though I hope this doesn’t occur onscreen.

  375. WildSeed
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:32 pm | Permalink

    Lex:
    Am I the only one who thinks this stuff is WAY too spoilery? I’m shocked they’ve already shown that much of the RV/Mountain fight. I think I’m going to try to avoid even watching the trailer. Maybe just once, at most, then it’s the Brotherhood Without Previews for me. Last season I avoided most previews, and it made the show SO much better.

    same here, I like to be pleasantly surprised. Sure we’re a small group though. BWOP ! *>*

  376. Enfield
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:32 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Awesome. I was hoping for news earlier, but that’s probably being greedy. Thanks

  377. WildSeed
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:35 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber: Agreed on this. With GoT, I don’t believe anyone is dead until certain benchmarks have been fulfilled, which are:

    1. Did GRRM say in interviews that the person is dead? If so, yes, they’re dead.
    2. Are they an unimportant minor character there as cannon fodder? Dead.
    3. Are they Ned Stark? Dead.
    4. Did we see them die and get buried, and no resurrection occurs in a few days time? Dead.
    5. Did White Walkers kill them? Dead.
    6. Are they Beric Dondarrian? Not dead.
    7. Is the offscreen death information coming from a verifiable source? Yes, then dead. Cersei? Not dead.

    *smile* Obviously you don’t believe in the ” Drowned God “. Since I’m a non believer, I ‘m compelled to agree with you. ( :

  378. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 9:50 pm | Permalink

    NickTargaryen,
    Good luck with that prediction…

    And why is 9 out of the realms of possibility? HBO execs are on record saying they intend to find the show as long as there is still story to tell. As for D&D, they have only specifically ruled out 10, and although 8 is their target GRRM was once targeting 6 books. Targets aren’t set in stone. As for the actors: yes, the cost of actors will rise between 7 & 8, and again between 8 & 9, but what people often forget is that a lot of major characters are likely to die in seasons 6+, so the money that would have been spent on those actors would be freed up to counter the rising cost of actors whose characters are still alive. I think the show will likely be done in 8 seasons, but I don’t think we can rule out 9 completely.

    Ragman’s Harbor,
    For the battles, I don’t just think they will share a season; I think they will share an episode (6×09), and I think it would only be slightly more expensive than 4×09. Here’s what makes the battles expensive – actors, extras, costumes/props, sets and cgi. Let’s look at them all in turn:
    Actors – we can ignore this, as actors cost the same in every episode regardless of whether it is a battle or not.
    Extras – yes, the cost of having that many extras in two locations would be greater than the cost of having that many extras in one location. However, season 4 has proved that they can afford multiple giant spectacles in one season as far as extras are concerned (Joffrey’s wedding and the battle of the Wall). Aside from those battles, S6 would really have any other spectacles of that scale.
    Costumes/Props – Stannis vs the Boltons wouldn’t cost much, as they would still have a lot of props left over from Blackwater and 4×09. That just leaves Meereen, so it shouldn’t cost any more than the other battles in this area.
    Sets – the Meereen sets would already exist, and Stannis vs the Boltons likely wouldn’t need much in the way of sets, and the sets it would need would already exist for other scenes.
    CGI – both battles so far have had CGI for two things: 1) duplicating the soldiers to create an army. Depending on how they film it, 6×09 shouldn’t cost more than the other battles in this area. 2) special features. In Blackwater this is the wildfire explosion and in 4×09 it will be the giants and the Wall (and mammoths, if they are included in the show). Stannis vs the Boltons wouldn’t really have and special CGI features (with the possible exception of the weather). Meereen, on the other hand, would have the dragons and the trebuchets. So overall I don’t think it would cost any more than 4×09 in the CGI department.
    Overall, it would cost more than 4×09 because of the extras, but that would be balanced by the lack of other extra-heavy events in the rest of the season.

    Now the next question would be “how would they fit two battles into one episode?”. If you look at Blackwater (which was ~50 minutes in total), here is how they used their time:
    20 minutes of pre-battle scenes
    ~15-20 minutes of actual fighting
    ~10-15 minutes of drunk Cersei
    We also know that 4×09 is “bigger than Blackwater”, so I am expecting it to have ~30 minutes of fighting.
    Stannis vs the Boltons is looking closer to the battle of the Green Fork in scale, while Meereen is looking bigger than Blackwater. Assuming that the pre battle scenes are covered in the episodes leading up to 6×09, here’s how I think the episode would be divided time-wise (not necessarily in order):
    ~5-10 minutes of non-battle scenes in Meereen (Barristan’s speech and Tyrion’s cyvasse game with BBP/TTP (depending on whether those characters are combined or not)
    ~25-30 minutes of the battle of Meereen itself
    ~ 10-15 minutes of fighting in the North
    ~10-15 minutes of non-battle scenes in the North
    total: 35 minutes in Meereen, 25 minutes in the North, with the fallout from the battles in the finale with the rest of the scenes that finish the season. My more detailed breakdown of how I think the episode will play out is over at livejournal (just google tahu909 livejournal)
    .

  379. Sean C.
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 10:13 pm | Permalink

    Ser Tahu:
    As for D&D, they have only specifically ruled out 10, and although 8 is their target GRRM was once targeting 6 books. Targets aren’t set in stone.

    And yet they’ve given that target repeatedly, even with knowledge of the contents of AFFC/ADWD. If anything prompts the show to expand to nine seasons, it will be greater knowledge about the last two books, not stuff already published.

  380. tysnow
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:19 pm | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    So Ser Tahu, if D&D stick to 8 seasons, you prefer 2 1/2 seasons of AFfC/Dwd and 2 1/2 seasons of WoW/DoS? Yes Mereen is in the first chapters of WoW, so basically the second half of season 6 would start Winds, but WoW is so chalk full of battles, characters, events, I just cannot see Winds regulated to only a season and a half. The casual viewers want Dany over in Westeros sooner than later and they won’t appreciate the show dragging her arc in Essos till the second half or near the end of season 7. But……….I sometimes think that Dany is the Deux Machina of the books, normally in books the person being the Duex Machina is mentioned in passing throughout the story but doesn’t appear till the climatic battle. Perhaps GRRM decided to tell the story of the DM (Dany) which means she won’t appear in Westeros till the end of Winds and/or beginning of Spring. If this is GRRM intent from the outset then I agree that D&D need to hold her off till the end of season 7.

  381. tysnow
    Posted January 11, 2014 at 11:24 pm | Permalink

    BTW, I want to see Ser Barristan fight, I am soooooooooooo disappointed that D&D decided to have Daario fight the Champion instead of Ser Bold, I might even skip that episode in protest. My feeling is the casual viewers has heard so much of Barristan’s prowess they want to see him fight too.

  382. Cosca
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:15 am | Permalink

    tysnow,

    Casual viewers don’t even know Ser Barristan’s name. And why would you protest when we didn’t get to see him fight in the book either?

  383. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:19 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    I like your prediction for 609. But I’d like to stress again that I really doubt the battle at the Ice will be the big and final battle for Winterfell, so we’d still have some goodness for early season 7. We’ll see, I guess.

    Sean C.,

    Actually, they haven’t. They were originally quoted saying 70 hours and now they’re saying 80 hours. 9 seasons isn’t impossible, but I still think 8 is a rather firm target.

  384. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:21 am | Permalink

    tysnow,

    2 and a half? More like 1.5 seasons of ADWD+AFFC unless you expect a lot of surprises in season 4.

  385. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:22 am | Permalink

    Fuck the Patriots.

  386. Ragman's Harbor
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:23 am | Permalink

    Your point of view makes sense, it could easily be a double battle in 6×09 episode (a never seen before), except for 2 or 3 things.

    Storytelling: since Theon’s storyline started in season 3, his storyline is then stretched for 4 seasons. Yes, Theon’s storyline in season 3 is kind of made up… yes and no.

    In ADWD, Ramsay is introduced, torture is being done, mental is being broken. Season 3 established that. But after that? Do you really believe they will stretch ADWD and the beginning of TWOW for 4 seasons?

    Personnaly, I don’t see it. They’ve got to go through AFFC and ADWD relatively quickly cause they got 2 huge books, TWOW and ADOS, to bring to life after. And I got the feeling George is keeping the action and money for those 2 last ones. But we’ll see.

  387. Turncloak
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:28 am | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    The Patriots are the Lannisters of the NFL. Bill Belicheck is Tywin. Tom Brady is Jaime. Edelman is Tyrion

  388. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:29 am | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap:
    Fuck the Patriots.

    As if sending Indy to the AFC championship with Luck throwing 4 picks every game was an option. Pats proved it wasn’t just Brady.

  389. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:59 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Indy was a mediocre team ever since losing Wayne. I’m not saying the Pats didn’t deserve the win, just that they are a bunch of anal warts.

  390. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 1:17 am | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    How much $$ did you lose? Pats lost half their stars to trade or injury or jail and still they’re headed to the penultimate game. As Turncloak said, their coach is Tywin. Like him or not, the dude knows how to play the game.

  391. Arthur
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 1:20 am | Permalink

    Has anyone ever seen the movie ‘Killer Joe’ staring Mathew McConaughey?

    I just watched it, only because I wanted to see how McConaughey acted as a cop…

    I must say it was a very strange movie to say the least but his performance in it was amazing.

    If that’s any hint of how he will be in ‘True Detective’, we are in for a real treat.

  392. Ashara D
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 1:30 am | Permalink

    Arthur,

    Glad you’re ok. ; )

    I haven’t seen that movie, but have you seen Dallas Buyers’ Club? He doesn’t play a cop but I hear that he is fantastic in it. Really looking forward to seeing True Detective on Sunday. I’m hoping to have something meaty to fill the next couple of months. [crossing fingers]

  393. Sid
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 2:03 am | Permalink

    the trailer for the trailer four

  394. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:10 am | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    I’m not stupid enough to bet against Beli-Tywin at home with a bye vs a mediocre team. I’m not even a fan of the Colts, I just hold a grudge against the Pats for Spygate. I have no doubt it won them at least their first Super Bowl.

  395. sphinx is the riddle
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:19 am | Permalink

    AHHHHHHHH So excited!!! Do any of you think they will air on easter sunday also my birthday..it would be cruel to take away my favorite thing on my birthday!???????!!!!!!!!!!! I think I am most looking forward to the PW. I want to see if they do.. well book readers you know that epic moment the same. Finger nails in flesh. I also love how the first season they did the scene before any POV chapters in the story. I hope they do that again

  396. sphinx is the riddle
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:28 am | Permalink

    Arthur,

    I’ve seen killer joe. I think TD will be amazing both the leading actors Woody and Matt have no trouble finding work in movies. So I’m guessing they read they script and were like hell yeah ill do this. Plus the trailers I have seen look amazing.

  397. Ashara D
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:35 am | Permalink

    sphinx is the riddle,

    No worries. They have aired on Easter in previous seasons. A great reason to bug out on the inlaws…

  398. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:53 am | Permalink

    Tomorrrow. In less than 24 hours we will hear the Viper. We will finally learn what a Dornish accent is like in the show. American? We shall see.

  399. Greenjones
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:07 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    Are you a betting man? My guess is British, either that or exaggerated Spanish. What do we have to bet though…

    (The casting of Indira Varma and a British guy as Lord Blackmont lead me to believe British. Many fan expectations would point to Spanish. We shall see, come the dawn, we shall see.)

  400. Patchy Face
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:53 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    Do you really think we will get to hear RV speak in the trailer? Fingers crossed

  401. Bard
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 5:52 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu:

    And why is 9 out of the realms of possibility? HBO execs are on record saying they intend to find the show as long as there is still story to tell. As for D&D, they have only specifically ruled out 10, and although 8 is their target GRRM was once targeting 6 books. Targets aren’t set in stone. As for the actors: yes, the cost of actors will rise between 7 & 8, and again between 8 & 9, but what people often forget is that a lot of major characters are likely to die in seasons 6+, so the money that would have been spent on those actors would be freed up to counter the rising cost of actors whose characters are still alive. I think the show will likely be done in 8 seasons, but I don’t think we can rule out 9 completely.

    If neccessary they could also split up season 8 in two parts, season 8.1 in 2018 and season 8.2 in 2019. The last Harry Potter movie has been split in half, the same with the Hunger Games, season 5 of Breaking Bad etc. Why not GoT?

  402. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 5:59 am | Permalink

    Patchy Face,

    Wouldn’t it be cool if he was presenting a narrative of his quest for justice (which in the context of the show would probably be to Tyrion as it was in the books), then it leads into the fight and the other big action moments in the season?

  403. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 6:03 am | Permalink

    Patchy Face,

    I am certain. 99% sure. They said the trailer will introduce the new characters or something, which instantly means to me will will get some serious RV action, speech included.

  404. Patchy Face
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 6:24 am | Permalink

    Valyrian Plastic,

    Awesome…we can only hope they use our great ideas! ha

  405. House Mormont
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 7:10 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu: Why would Daenerys vs Aegon will be in S7 when it won’t be in TWoW? If you think that ADoS will be nothing but fighting the Others/WW

    You think Dany vs Aegon and Dorne + Littefinger + Whoever holds the North + The Tyrell’s can be resolved in a book? The War of Five Kings took 4! Plus Aegon already holds the Stormlands at this point and all Dany has to do is jump aboard Victarion’s ships and get to Westeros and the war will start. If tWoW doesn’t even get that far plotwise then I have lost faith in GRRM

  406. House Mormont
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 7:27 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    I CAN’T WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAIIIIT, I think this trailer will make me seriously pregnant, the only character I don’t want to see just yet is Bloodraven… ok maybe a little

    ps on the subject of how many seasons the show is predicted, I thought last season the HBO execs were still saying 7 and d&d were saying 8? I think 8 with an extended final season in possible, but in the words of Logen Ninefingers, you’ve got to be realistic about these things.

  407. cosca
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 7:47 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    I think the first lines will be:

    “Do you know who I am?”
    “Some dead man”

  408. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 8:26 am | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    HBO say the show can go on as long as people watch it and there’s still a story to tell. D&D say that they hope to tell an 80 hour long story, which roughly amounts to 8 seasons (though technically it’s more like 8.5-9, though I doubt they meant that). I would be totally up for the final season being an extended one, with around 12-16 episodes but it can’t be done without delaying the show by at least a couple of months or splitting it like Breaking Bad, which I would still definitely like.

    As for the trailer, I agree that we need to see the Viper explaining his mission. Awesomeness awaits, surely :)

  409. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 8:27 am | Permalink

    tysnow,
    Ideally I would want 1.5 seasons for AFfC/ADwD and 3.5 for TWoW/ADoS. As for TWoW, I think it will be full of twists and battles like ASoS, which is getting 2 seasons… 2 seasons that have to be padded with filler and material from other books to work. If you didn’t have the 10 episode season limit to worry about, I think ASoS would have been ~15-16 episodes. So yes, I do think that TWoW can be fit into 1.5 seasons (on average) VERY comfortably, with the first ~1/3 in S6 and the rest in S7.

    General thoughts on adapting AFfC/ADwD: a lot of people say that because a lot of the AFfC/ADwD material is made up of inner monologues it can be adapted more quickly. What they forget is that material provides the explanations for the actions of many characters. If some of the events take place like they did in the books then the intentions of those characters are lost and the viewers will misinterpret their motivations. Some examples: if Jon beheads Janos really quickly after his election like in the books he would seem like a complete dick. The viewers don’t have Jon’s thoughts, so the show will need more time to build up the reasons why Jon is beheading Janos so that Jon’s intentions aren’t lost along the way. The same goes for Barristan arresting Hizdahr. They will need more time in the show to display Hizdahr’s actions as king so that when Barristan starts scheming the viewer sees that he is at least trying to serve Daenerys, and that he isn’t just another power hungry person. In terms of the raw events of the books, I actually agree that they could get to the end of ADwD in S5. However, to do so would be to misrepresent so many of the characters in the series, causing irreparable harm to the show as a whole.

    Jentario,
    We won’t really know until the book comes out. My impression is that the Bolton forces will ride out from Winterfell to face Stannis in the field. They need ‘Arya’ to stabilise their hold on the North. She is too valuable a pawn to let Stannis or the Greyjoys hold her, and if her identity became public knowledge it would greatly weaken House Bolton in the eyes of the Northern Lords. Also, although Winterfell is a tactically advantageous position, they are starving within the walls. They can’t survive a drawn out siege, and the sooner the Boltons can dispose of Stannis and return the soldiers to their homes the better for them. So I am of the opinion that the battle of ice will, in fact, be the climactic battle of the North. But in the end all we can do is sit and wait for TWoW.

    Ragman’s Harbor,
    Well, strictly speaking Theon’s S3 stuff happened at the same time as ASoS in the books. Here’s how I think it will play out:
    S4: more filler, and based on the trailer snippet possibly the show version of Moat Cailin.
    S5: all of the Roose-Ramsay-Theon interactions and some of the early Winterfell stuff (like the wedding).
    S6: interacting with the various northern lords, bodies dropping, everyone accusing each other and Mance.
    Theon’s Winterfell is very compelling and has a lot of room for expansion/can easily be drawn out. I personally thought that Theon’s ADwD chapters were the best written in the entire series (that is on average, there are always those epic chapters in other arcs that can’t be topped).

    House Mormont,
    Daenerys doesn’t just need to jump on the ships. She need to deal with the Dothraki, wrap up her stuff in Meereen and then travel to Westeros (which has been established to take ~half a book). So I think that the furthest TWoW might possibly get is the declaration of war between the two. And yes, I think that stuff can be wrapped up rather quickly. What you forget is that all but ~2-3 of the PoV’s will almost certainly be directly involved in the war, unlike with the war of five kings, so things are likely to move very quickly. My theory for ADoS is that the only PoV’s that won’t be directly involved in the conflict will be Jon and Bran, who are busy witnessing the North get absolutely destroyed by the Others. The war will end ~1/2 way through the book, at which point Jon and the survivors from the North will finally be pushed back south of the neck. It is then that everyone else will realise the true danger. And just for the record I also think that Melisandre, Davos, Barristan, Jaime and Cersei will not live to see the end of TWoW.

    House Mormont,
    The HBO exec said something along the lines of “get through 7 seasons.” However, it was in the context of talking about discussions between HBO and D&D about how many seasons they are aiming for. Because of the way the article was structured and the quote was worded, it seemed to me that it was meant to imply that GoT will have at least 7 seasons. Also, a different HBO exec said later last year that HBO is willing to find the show for as long as there is story to tell, so there is that.

    As for the 8 season vs 9 season debate: I think that, regardless of how they adapt AFfC/ADwD, season 7 will end at roughly the same place that TWoW does. I think that whether there are 8 or 9 seasons will depend solely on how ADoS plays out. As I mention above I think that the first half of the book will focus almost exclusively on the dance of the dragons, while the second half will focus entirely on the final conflict with the Others, and that overall it will be . Assuming that I am correct in those broad theories I think ADoS could potentially be done in one very fast paced season, but at the same time I think it will have a naturally midpoint and could easily be split into two seasons. There is also the possibility that GRRM will need 8 books, in which case I think that a 9th season would be a necessity.

    And just for the record I think that, if he does need 8 books, the last two will be closer to AGoT/ACoK length than ASoS/ADwD length, and that it would be a chronological split instead of a geographical one. I also don’t think it would be the difference between the show catching up or not. I think that in such a situation where a hypothetical 8 book is needed, he would be very close (within a few hundred pages) of the end when he realises he needs to split it in two, so book 8 could easily come out just one year after book 7. So in such a situation, if he is still ahead of the show when book 7 is released he should be in the clear.

    Wow, that was one giant tangent, but it was a fun tangent :P

  410. adense
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 8:52 am | Permalink

    I really like the scene with the horses riding through the forest. But isn’t there too few of them? :( In the vine video, there’s one rider cutting down a wildling, and you can see the forest behind the horse, and there’s nothing there. No other riders and no foot soldiers. If this is indeed Stannis charge, shouldn’t he has at least a slightly big army? Or is it possible they didn’t include all background CGI in the trailer?

  411. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 8:52 am | Permalink

    ELIA OF DORNE! Episode 8 will be fantastic.
    The only thing I fear for in season 4 is the mid-season, which is a complete mystery in terms of the Yara/Theon (assuming they do meet, even briefly), Jon/Sam, Bran and King’s Landing stories. A lot of deviations can kick in at any given point- hopefully those deviations will be good ones, at least (the Gendric Storm deviation was great in season 3) rather than a Jon-season2-type of deviations.

  412. Ser Tahu
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 9:01 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu:

    As for the 8 season vs 9 season debate: I think that, regardless of how they adapt AFfC/ADwD, season 7 will end at roughly the same place that TWoW does. I think that whether there are 8 or 9 seasons will depend solely on how ADoS plays out. –> As I mention above I think that the first half of the book will focus almost exclusively on the dance of the dragons, while the second half will focus entirely on the final conflict with the Others, and that overall it will be . <– Assuming that I am correctin those broad theories I think ADoS could potentially be done in one very fast paced season, but at the same time I think it will have a naturally midpoint and could easily be split into two seasons. There is also the possibility that GRRM will need 8 books, in which case I think that a 9th season would be a necessity.

    Lol, let me try that again:
    “As I mentioned above I think that the first half of the book will focus almost exclusively on the dance of the dragons, while the second half will focus entirely on the final conflict with the Others, and that overall it will be a very fast paced book.”
    Silly iPhone :P. Seriously, doing huge posts from an iPhone is the most difficult thing ever. I can’t wait to get my laptop back…

    House Mormont,
    Oh, and I just thought I should add: the war of five kings didn’t take four books. It started late in book 1 and was, for the most part, over by mid book 3. That’s two books at most

  413. cosca
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 9:27 am | Permalink

    Jentario,

    This is why I think Joffrey’s Wedding being in episode 2 is a mistake pacing wise. It’s a high that will overshadow most of the middle section of the season, show watchers will find the material lack lustre until maybe episode 7

  414. UnbowdUnbentedUnhodor
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 9:31 am | Permalink

    Soon! Can’t wait. Goodnight everyone:)

  415. House Mormont
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 9:44 am | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    The battle on the Golden Tooth and Jamie taking Riverrun happened midway through aGoT, albeit offscreen, and Riverrun and Dragonstone fall around 3/4 of the way through aFfC, not four books, but not “two books at most”

    soooo… I wonder if they’ll keep the original choreography of the Reek vs Rat duel?

  416. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 9:47 am | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    I hope so. I also want to see him become Ramsay’s bitch, literally, like in the book

  417. Hounded
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 10:38 am | Permalink

    Getting very excited now. I wanna see a poster and some episode names!!!!!

    Something I really hope they include in the show is that Tywin, Mace and Oberyn are sat beside each other during Tyrion’s trial. I don’t know why but I just really liked the image of these three very different men sat side by side. And there’s a line that goes something like “Two extraordinary men and one very ordinary”. Haha poor old Mace!

  418. Rygar
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 11:12 am | Permalink

    Very excited for TD and Girls tonight in addition to the sneak peak.

    I hope we get a glimpse of more torture porn.

  419. Turncloak
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 11:30 am | Permalink

    Greenjones:
    Jentario,

    Are you a betting man? My guess is British, either that or exaggerated Spanish. What do we have to bet though…

    (The casting of Indira Varma and a British guy as Lord Blackmont lead me to believe British. Many fan expectations would point to Spanish. We shall see, come the dawn, we shall see.)

    Look to your sins Lord Renly. The night is dark and full of terrors

  420. GeekFurious
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 11:40 am | Permalink

    cosca:
    Jentario,

    This is why I think Joffrey’s Wedding being in episode 2 is a mistake pacing wise. It’s a high that will overshadow most of the middle section of the season, show watchers will find the material lack lustre until maybe episode 7

    We are fortunate to have your expert analysis.

  421. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 11:56 am | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    Well Dorne is a mix of Spain (climate) and Wales (rural in-hospitality), but I’m hoping the accents won’t be a hybrid of those particular styles of speaking. Now that would be awkward. I always imagined a voice similar to Kraznys’ when reading Oberyn’s lines and it could take a day or it could be nearly 3 months before I know for sure.

  422. cosca
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 11:57 am | Permalink

    GeekFurious: We are fortunate to have your expert analysis.

    Seems fairly uncalled for. I just gave my opinion, I make no pretension of being an expert, you can rebut it if you want. It’s a website comment section for christ sake.

    Instead of making a childish comment, perhaps actually engaging in discussion, showing me where I am at fault, would be a good idea?

  423. sjwenings
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:03 pm | Permalink

    In how many hours will the trailer air? (I’m wondering, I’m sure on behalf of many of us people in different timezones.)

  424. Rygar
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:09 pm | Permalink

    cosca,

    Don’t bother. Engaging discussion from that tool bag is like a post from me without cock references. It is a rarity.

  425. cosca
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:09 pm | Permalink

    sjwenings,

    Seven hours I believe. But will HBO put it up on the site as soon as it airs?

  426. facelessarya
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:21 pm | Permalink

    Arthur,

    That whole movie was brilliantly acted but disturbing as fuck. My mom and I were jaw-dropped at the ending. Matthew McConaughey was really good, though.

  427. House Mormont
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:25 pm | Permalink

    Yo does anybody know if trailer will be on British TV (Sky Atlantic)… like ever?

    Us not having HBO is the real problem with this country

  428. Balerion
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:27 pm | Permalink

    sjwenings,

    Around 9 hours and a half I think.

    The trailer will air at 7am for me and I will be at school then, so I will have to wait another 7 hours to actually see it. I could watch it on my phone but I would much rather see it on a big screen first. Tomorrow will be a long day for me…

  429. Arthur
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:36 pm | Permalink

    facelessarya,

    Yeah it definitely was a “different” type of movie. I liked it though, I like strange weird things like that. McConaughey was really good at playing that demented character, I suspect from HBO ‘True Detective’ trailers he will be playing a very similar role. That’s why I watched ‘Killer Joe’, just to see him in that mindset and it was a very whackedout movie but he was amazing in it =]

  430. ebevan91
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:36 pm | Permalink

    cosca:
    sjwenings,

    Seven hours I believe. But will HBO put it up on the site as soon as it airs?

    It’ll probably be on Youtube within minutes of it airing.

  431. Arthur
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 12:48 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    New season of Shameless starts tonight also (which ill be DVRing), not sure if that series is everyone’s cup of tea but I get a kick out of it and look forward to its new season.

  432. Arthur
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 1:03 pm | Permalink

    Hounded,

    Oh man good idea…

    I want to see a poster of the Red Viper with that spear!

    Also I was hoping that they would bring that cool UK light show thing they did last season to the states for season 4 promo. Remember the light and sound projector when they made it look like a dragon was destroying a building?

    That would be so cool to do in a couple cities here in the states…

  433. Family, Duty, Hodor
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 1:19 pm | Permalink

    Interesting discussion guys. Would love to contribute but a bit busy atm. Was just checking in though and saw that Falcool on the other topic has spotted something pretty awesome:

    http://static2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130611182214/gameofthrones/images/c/c4/IllyriomopatisHD.png
    http://s9.postimg.org/5ti0mwdgf/Uten_navnads.png

    It seems like Illyrio is at King’s Landing! Anyone got any speculation on that?

    EDIT: It seems like that same costume is reused a lot. So it may not mean anything.

  434. Rygar
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 1:28 pm | Permalink

    Arthur,

    Don’t have Showtime but I do love William H Macy.

  435. Lef
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 1:56 pm | Permalink

    cosca: showing me where I am at fault, would be a good idea?

    Joffrey’s death is the event that kickstarts the KL plot. Where would you put it if not at the beginning?

  436. Greenjones
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 2:00 pm | Permalink

    Valyrian Plastic,

    Well I hope they don’t try Welsh accents. While the English-accented actors cast as Dornish could probably do one, I doubt the American accented Pedro would do too well at it. My hope is that he’ll speak in received pronunciation. That accent is easiest for Americans to do than regional ones.

    ebevan91,

    How will this play out in different time zones?

  437. Greenjones
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 2:04 pm | Permalink

    A cool parallel to that fan art that a lot of sullied like.

    http://imgur.com/a/LaRAv

  438. Arthur
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 2:21 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    That is fucking awesome!

    That has always been my favorite picture and I have to say I don’t think it’s a coincidence that the TV version looks the same as that picture.

    I think it’s such a huge benefit to the show and therefor to all of us that D&D are huge fans of the books and these scenes as much as we are. They are well aware of all the awesome fan art out there and I’m sure they have seen that picture before.

    Basically what I’m trying to say is either consciously or subconsciously D&D have been using a lot of fan stuff to create the images for this series and I find that amazing and I think it’s a huge advantage.

    If some other producers ran the show I doubt we’d get such epic visuals.

  439. Annara Snow
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 2:49 pm | Permalink

    King Tommen,

    Except for the fact that Jeyne was mentioned by Sansa in season 1.

  440. Turncloak
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 2:50 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    The Dornish have a Brooklyn accent. It is known. Obery Martell: where my sneakazz at? Gimme some wadah

  441. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 2:59 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    Oh god, you just made me imagine Arianne being cast as an sassy, overweight African-American lady XD

  442. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:03 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    Youses Moidered her!

  443. Rygar
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:09 pm | Permalink

    Jentario:
    Turncloak,

    Oh god, you just made me imagine Arianne being cast as an sassy, overweight African-American lady XD

    Aunt Lou from Deadwood would be perfect

  444. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:14 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    At least the people who complained about the Dornish not being black would be happy.
    EDIT: Your Aunt Lou would be a perfect Strong Belwas! Or better yet, fake Arya.

  445. ebevan91
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:16 pm | Permalink

    So this thread has almost 450 posts, and that’s just from a short 15 second teaser. Imagine how big the thread will get tonight once the full trailer airs… it might hit 1,000 within the first couple of days.

  446. efefef
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:18 pm | Permalink

    Lef, basically, a LOT of talking. wedding should’ve not been rushed.

  447. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:27 pm | Permalink

    ebevan91,

    “What happens when 1000 comments are made on this forum?”

    {Glances at monitor}

    “One for the moderators.”

  448. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:31 pm | Permalink

    Lef,

    The problem with putting it in episode 2 is that there is too much set up to be done with many characters across KL before the wedding can officially begin. That being, ALL of the Sansa+Dontos scenes, which will have to be more than one, the introductions of Mace and Oberyn, Jamie and Brienne’s arrival- which will no doubt give us many scenes where they meet many characters (Tywin, Joffrey, the Tyrells- which IIRC is confirmed- Tyrion and maybe even the continuation of Jamie and Cersei from season 3), catching up with the soon-to-be-married couple and a pre-wedding council meeting. That’s an awful lot of KL to put into one episode, and since the premiere will likely catch up with a lot of storylines- there isn’t much time to do that. Which brings me to the sad conclusion- a lot of these necessary scenes will be cut, rushed or combined. The wedding would have had much more time to breathe had it been in episode 3 or 4. And also, stretching Tyrion’s trial over 7 episodes seems like overkill to me.

    That’s just my humble, non-expert opinion.

  449. Annara Snow
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:32 pm | Permalink

    Family, Duty, Hodor,

    I couldn’t disagree more about Tyrion’s arc. It’s brilliant – showing him at his lowest, full of self-loathing and resentment, finally believing himself to be the monster people have seen him as, and starting to behave like one; it’s a sad consequence of a lifetime of prejudice and abuse. And meeting Penny is a crucial part of it; he meets another dwarf for the first time and gets to learn what life it like for dwarves who are not born to noble families; but she also makes him stop wallowing in self-pity and self-loathing and makes him care about someone again, since he wants to protect her despite being frustrated with her naivete.

    Plus, I admit I just can’t wait to see the reaction of fans who indulge in a particularly bizarre version of Nice Guy (TM) blaming of Sansa for not being attracted to Tyrion because he’s a dwarf, when Tyrion gets to meet a super-nice female dwarf (who doesn’t belong to a family who’s done him harm, didn’t marry him against his will and is genuinely romantically interested in him) and isn’t attracted to her. Will they show their double standard, or will they be consistent and start saying that Tyrion needs to “mature” and starts finding Penny hot/just agree to be involved with a woman he isn’t attracted to? Mu ha ha ;)

  450. Rygar
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:34 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    LMAO. Belwas. Winner.

  451. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:43 pm | Permalink

    Rygar,

    I imagine her smearing poo on the champion’s tokar and it just feels right.

  452. Jaime Saltcliffe
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:54 pm | Permalink

    Lef,

    How about scenes of all the Lannisters reuniting? I foresee a lot of original scenes that will bring Kings Landing characters together long before joffreys death.

  453. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:55 pm | Permalink

    Jaime Saltcliffe,

    Spoiler tags, quickly!

  454. Patchy Face
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:55 pm | Permalink

    Jaime Saltcliffe,

    spoiler tags please!

  455. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

    Annara Snow:
    Family, Duty, Hodor,
    Will they show their double standard, or will they be consistent and start saying that Tyrion needs to “mature” and starts finding Penny hot/just agree to be involved with a woman he isn’t attracted to? Mu ha ha ;)

    I’m also greatly looking forward to Tyrion’s heart of darkness period. In fact, there are several dark journeys that I am anticipating (including Dany, Arya, etc.) Bring it on, S5!

    Also, Penny “hot”? That’s a first. :) She is quite endearing for Tyrion and good for his dark soul-searching period before he meets Dany and Vic and various sellswords. Hopefully, she turns out to be a decent confidante for Tyrion but she may be a tragic character as well as the Meereen battle heats up. Once I had a funny vision seeing Tyrion and Penny riding Viserion. :)

  456. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 3:59 pm | Permalink

    Jaime Saltcliffe,

    And we won’t be savouring any Singer’s Stew either :(

  457. Greenjones
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:02 pm | Permalink

    This issue of getting the PW buildup right is why many of us hope that ep. 2 will be entirely set in King’s Landing. Its more likely though that ep. 2 will still be introducing storylines, as they probably won’t be able to fit all of them into the premier. Still, it’s likely that it will spend more time in KL than many other episodes do.

  458. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    I would love a King’s Landing only episode again after Blackwater, but like that episode, the producers may feel it necessary to feature a little of everyone in the first episode which is why some weren’t satisfied by The Prince of Winterfell cutting to all the characters just so no one would care they’d be absent for the follow-up. Let’s hope they steer clear of that course this time though, same with the big 9 this season.

  459. ebevan91
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    I do hope we’ll get some more episodes like 8 and 9 of last season where the focus was only on a certain few characters.

  460. Greenjones
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    Valyrian Plastic,

    Ep. nine being all the battle at the Wall is pretty much confirmed. As for ep. 2, I think it’s likely it will focus on three or four locations (a la Second Sons or tRoC) but most strongly on KL. I hope they show Balon dying in it. If he died in the premier that would make Joffrey’s death seem too inevitable.

    Edit: ebevan91 beat me to the draw in bringing up 3.8 and 3.9

  461. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:17 pm | Permalink

    ebevan91,

    This. Especially when we get to season 5, where there’ll be a fuckton of standalone storylines. It’s best to have some characters take a break so others can get a chance to shine.

  462. Valyrian Plastic
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:20 pm | Permalink

    Greenjones,

    Tried to edit that last comment but wasn’t permitted to. In short: they should feel okay with starting a new story arc off in episode 3, rather than rush into it early and have to stretch the material out over a season. Just look at Theon for example, 3 episodes of escaping, being caught and returning to the Dreadfort, urgh.

    Edit: I suppose the advantage of bringing Jaime to the capital early is he can now be part of the action and that should free up some space in the show, almost like they’re untangling the King’s Landing Knot, so to speak.

  463. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:26 pm | Permalink

    ebevan91,

    Bryan Cogman pretty much confirmed that there would be more episodes that focused on fewer story lines again this season. Episodes 2 and 9 are likely to focus entirely on 1 location.

  464. Lef
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

    Jentario,

    You don’t need 4 hours to establish characters. A lot of this can be done in episodes 1 and 2 with small effective scenes.

  465. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 4:42 pm | Permalink

    Lef,

    Plus, there are fewer new characters to introduce, as well as two locations where multiple story lines have converged.

  466. Jentario
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 5:07 pm | Permalink

    Lef,

    Not 4 hours. You have to consider that KL is only one of many storylines in the season that deserve significant screentime.

  467. nicholas
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 7:57 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    yes sir i agree

  468. Rogue
    Posted January 12, 2014 at 8:38 pm | Permalink

    growingstrong:
    House Mormont,

    Hah!I actually kind of liked the popcorn dress.The hair is growing on me, though…

    Hair kinda grows on everyone.

  469. Boris
    Posted January 13, 2014 at 3:46 am | Permalink

    Tom Hilton,

    Which one ?

  470. jentario
    Posted January 13, 2014 at 8:42 am | Permalink

    Rogue,

    Nice one. Keep ‘em coming.

  471. Tom Hilton
    Posted January 13, 2014 at 5:22 pm | Permalink

    Boris,

    Feral Love, from the Pain Is Beauty album.

  472. sphinx is the riddle
    Posted January 14, 2014 at 5:44 am | Permalink

    Ashara D,

    Thank you so much!!! Its my birthday and I crave it so I will be able to watch my favorite show ever on my birthday and get wasted!!!!! YAY, anyone know where to get the game of thrones beer ive been trying to get it forever!! No luck

  473. sphinx is the riddle
    Posted January 14, 2014 at 5:47 am | Permalink

    Aldi_A,

    I thought that was what is what was, thanks for the confirmation

  474. Annara Snow
    Posted January 14, 2014 at 1:11 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: Penny

    Heh. Well that’s the point – Penny isn’t “hot” and Tyrion doesn’t find her attractive, just like Sansa doesn’t find Tyrion attractive, but nobody is blaming him for it or saying that he should “give her a chance” and that it would show how “mature” he is.

    Naturally, nobody is obliged to find anyone attractive, and should not be obliged to have sex with people they’re not attracted to. I just wish people would recognize that and extend the courtesy of allowing female characters, too, to be attracted to whoever they are attracted to, and reject the men they are not attracted to.

  475. kevin
    Posted January 15, 2014 at 4:27 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont,

    I didn’t say that it was Dany’s story. I meant of course Jon. Season 5 will be Stannis leaving. Him being a leader (if that’s in season 4 else this story is season 5). Wildlings watch merging. Season 6 the rest (Val leaving, him getting stabbed at the end of season 6 just after the big battle of winterfel). Dany will end in season 5 around the time that she’s going to marry Hizdahr. And maybe even the fighting pit scenes. season 6 will contain at least her last chapter of DwD (why having more actors for season 5 when the dothraki can wait a season). Season 6 contains the story of Baristan and Tyrion in Mereen.

  476. kevin
    Posted January 15, 2014 at 4:29 pm | Permalink

    Ser Tahu,

    This is what I mean

  477. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted January 15, 2014 at 4:56 pm | Permalink

    Annara Snow: Heh. Well that’s the point – Penny isn’t “hot” and Tyrion doesn’t find her attractive, just like Sansa doesn’t find Tyrion attractive, but nobody is blaming him for it or saying that he should “give her a chance” and that it would show how “mature” he is.

    Naturally, nobody is obliged to find anyone attractive, and should not be obliged to have sex with people they’re not attracted to. I just wish people would recognize that and extend the courtesy of allowing female characters, too, to be attracted to whoever they are attracted to, and reject the men they are not attracted to.

    I don’t quite understand why all of that is spoiler-tagged, but I won’t undo it. The obvious response to your 2nd paragraph is “of course” and good books with mega-headstrong female characters are much more interesting. From Cat to Mel to Arya to Val, you’ve got to respect the outline of their mindsets and characterizations. Sansa and her ultimate endeavors in the Vale and beyond may yet prove all of us fools. Even Cersei is headstrong….to a fault….and Dany is learning to be headstrong, and eventually she will literally rise above the mosh pit and attempt to control her own destiny. Fuck yeah!

    Penny…dear Penny…as others have mentioned, she is a reflection of Tyrion without the wealth and status and pompous/self-serving attitude (which is a survival technique). She is almost tragic. Although she probably has only a low probability of ultimate survival, one can only hope that she isn’t wasted by the oncoming chaos and does make a difference in Tyrion’s dark journey…perhaps maybe even helping him come into some sort of acceptance of Tysha’s fate and the whole “wherever whore’s go” mantra.


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