Small Council: What Game of Thrones spinoffs do we want to see?

Last week, HBO announced that it was developing not one, not two, not three, but FOUR potential spinoffs for Game of Thrones. What do we want them to be about? The Small Council is in session.

DAN: I want to point something out at the outset: just because HBO is developing four potential spinoffs doesn’t mean that we’re actually getting four spinoffs. The network has retained four writers to develop ideas. Once those are all in, the execs may just choose the best one to actually produce.

Or they’ll make all four. What do I know?

Anyway, I’d like to see George R.R. Martin’s Dunk and Egg novellas adapted for TV. I’m partly thinking of the economics here. The Dunk and Egg stories are much shorter and smaller than A Song of Ice and Fire. There are no dragons or ice zombies. There aren’t even any major battles, although there are crowd scenes. Compared to Game of Thrones, it wouldn’t be nearly as hard on HBO’s bank.

And while special effects-driven epics are great, after eight years of Game of Thrones, it would be nice to watch something on a smaller scale. Dunk and Egg is mostly about a knight (Dunk) and his squire (Egg) wandering around Westeros and getting into misadventures. And because each novella is more-or-less independent of the others, a TV show adaptation wouldn’t have to be as serialized as GoT. That could help extend the life of the show beyond the three available novellas, which by themselves are maybe long enough to adapt as one-and-a-half seasons of television. There’s continuity in Dunk and Egg, but the overall story arc isn’t as important as it is to A Song of Ice and Fire. It’d be easier to slip original adventures in there for a more episode-by-episode kind of series.

Basically, I think it would be a mistake for HBO to follow up Game of Thrones with another grand epic. You’re just not gonna out-epic it that quickly, y’know? What do you guys think?

COREY: I wonder if HBO hasn’t already decided which spinoff it’s going to produce and is having four separate writers come up with treatments for the same era or arc. With the will they/won’t they status of current showrunners David Benioff and D.B. Weiss, it would make sense to get four different takes on the same material if HBO is looking for someone new to take the reins. Also consider that two of the writers, Jane Goldman and Carly Wray, will work alongside George R.R. Martin while developing their treatments.

Anyways, I would like to see Robert’s Rebellion developed next. The material is certainly exciting, with a plethora of battles and a cast of characters even casual fans would be familiar with. Ned Stark, Robert Baratheon and Tywin Lannister are just a few of the players fans would recognize. The biggest problem with any prequel series will be a lack of familiarity on the part of the casual fan. Sure, most of us here can name Daenerys’ great uncle on her mother’s side, but many casual fans can’t. That wouldn’t be as big of a problem for Robert’s Rebellion.

Ultimately what I’d like to see is HBO work its way sequentially backwards through George R.R. Martin’s invented history. Martin’s work is much like J.R.R. Tolkien’s in that Game of Thrones represents the culmination of thousands of years of fake history. The broad strokes of that history have been written by Martin, and it would be great to work our way backwards for the next 20 or 30 years. (Yes, I would love something from this universe to be on HBO for the rest of my life.)

The added bonus of this is that each series would feature younger versions of characters we meet in the previous series, which would make it easier for casual fans to pick up. Game of Thrones characters would appear in a Robert’s Rebellion series, who would appear in a series about the War of the Ninepenny Kings, who would appear in the Tales of Dunk and Egg, and so on and so forth. We would work our way backwards until the beginning of Westerosi history, and discover the origins the conflicts we are now reaching the conclusion of on Game of Thrones.

And please don’t get me started on a sequel series. I have no desire to watch the White Walkers return after being defeated, or to see Daenerys’ tax policies should she end up on the Iron Throne. Prequels or nothing.

RICHARD: Actually, my first spinoff two choices would be a Robert’s Rebellion prequel or the Dunk & Egg novellas, so I’m squarely in Dan and Corey’s ballparks. I’ll proffer a third option that I like: The Doom of Valyria. The Valyrian Freehold was the dominant power in Essos for five thousand years, collapsing about four-five hundred years before the War of the Five Kings.

With their legendary dragons, The Valyrians ruled about half of the known world, and their culture was famous for its pursuit of knowledge, spells and colossal architecture. That all ended in one day, known as “the Doom,” when a series of volcanoes called “the fourteen flames” erupted and destroyed Valyria and its surrounding territories in one massive cataclysm of lava and ash. Only the Targaryen family, sequestered at Dragonstone, survived, and they possessed the few remaining dragons.

GRRM himself has said the fate of Valyria is partially inspired by the real-life volcanic destruction of Roman Pompeii and Hernaculeum and the myths of Atlantis, and that the Valyrian Empire is roughly equivalent to the ancient Roman Empire. Lots of incredible and epic pre-Doom story fodder here, plus the writers would be bound to very few elements and characters established in either ASOIAF and Game of Thrones.

Martin gives a detailed, informative and FUN chat about Old Valyria, “The Doom” and the origins of House Targaryen below (recorded at a 92Y Event, linked from a 2015 Business Insider article).

KATIE: If a spinoff is to happen, I feel that Robert’s Rebellion is the natural choice. It includes characters and plot elements that fans are predisposed to care about, so an audience is guaranteed.

Of course, this is Game of Thrones we’re talking about, so an audience is probably guaranteed regardless of specifics. HBO has my interest piqued with the possibility, but then I remember how Harry Potter‘s recent spinoff ventures have let me down for a myriad of reasons. Now the whole idea just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

So let me propose something else, which Sarah and I have discussed at length: Game of Thrones: The Musical. The idea was, admittedly, born from our mutual desire to see Jon Snow spontaneously break out in song and dance. Based on his sword-fighting prowess, it’s clear that Jon is already the prima ballerina of the North, so why not?

We have somewhat expanded the possibility since: Every battle is a dance-off. Every time someone dies, the rest of the cast pops in for a rendition of “Another One Bites the Dust.” Picture Jon and Sansa’s reunion, but at virtually any point afterwards they sing a moving duet of “Nothing’s Gonna Stop Us Now.” The women of Thrones engage in their own “Cell Block Tango” (a proposition that is entirely Sarah’s, but which I enthusiastically support). At some point Jon leads a conga line along the Wall (again, credit to Sarah). The White Walkers are all “Thriller,” and Cersei just raps everything. Brienne’s appearance is preceded by Mulan‘s “I’ll Make a Man Out of You,” and Petyr Baelish’s by Radiohead’s “Creep.” As many fans have already joked, we could actually see Sansa do a little “Who Let the Dogs Out” ditty after Ramsay gets totally rekt. The Ironborn rock out “Under the Sea” during Euron’s coronation. There are a million opportunities for “Holding Out for a Hero” and “My Heart Will Go On.”

I could continue, but I’ll stop before I write the whole musical here and now.

Granted, it’s a silly idea, but personally I think Thrones fans could do with a nice, cheery palate cleanser once in a while. Regardless of realism, and aside from sheer absurdity and probably licensing issues, the possibilities are endless. Sarah and I are willing to sell, and are open to negotiations on the matter.

RAZOR: For me, the obvious answer is Robert’s Rebellion. However, I would add so much more to the story than just a raging Robert Baratheon attempting to usurp the Targaryen dynasty.

Any show about this topic would have to follow the current Game of Thrones method of storytelling. I want scenes of a young Ned Stark and young Robert Baratheon being trained in the art of war by their mentor Jon Arryn in the Vale. I want scenes in Aerys Targaryen’s court as the Mad King descended further into madness. I want to watch him burn his victims with wildfire. And as much as it would rip the heart from my chest, I want to see Rickard Stark (father to Ned) and his eldest son and heir to Winterfell, Brandon Stark, fight for their lives as Aerys gleefully watches them die.

I want to know, once and for all, if Rhaegar Targaryen actually kidnapped Lyanna Stark and absconded with her to the Tower of Joy, or if their’s was a story of true love, with Rhaegar having a Septon marry the two of them so that their unborn son would be a legitimate heir to the Iron Throne.

Robert’s Rebellion would have the signature HBO flare, as massive armies clash for supremacy. I want to get to know the legendary Kingsgaurd knights of that time. Warriors like Ser Barristan Selmy the Bold; Arthur Dayne the Sword of the Morning; Ser Gerold Hightower, known as The White Bull; and a young Jaime Lannister learning from these giants.

Finally, I want to see the sack of King’s Landing by the forces of House Lannister under the command of Lord Tywin Lannister. I want to see the Mountain scale the Red Keep and murder the royal family while Daenerys and Viserys, the children of the king, flee across the Narrow Sea. Robert’s Rebellion has so much to offer, and I think HBO will go with this particular story.

What Game of Thrones spinoff do you most want to see?