Director Alex Graves details key scenes from the Season 4 finale
By Lightbringer on in Interview.

Game of Thrones showrunners David Benioff and Dan Weiss deliberately tasked Alex Graves with directing Season 4’s biggest moments. After tackling the Purple Wedding and its fallout, and the trial by combat that crushed viewer hearts around the world, Sunday’s finale proved to be the hardest task of all, packed with huge moments from start to finish. In a number of new interviews this week, Graves details the challenges of creating such important scenes, and the major turn we’ve taken in the story.

TV Guide teased us late last week with some quotes from their interview with Graves, and now we have the answers to which scene contained the best writing he’s even seen, which was the toughest to film, and which had been a decade in the making.

Was there anything tricky about that Tywin-Tyrion scene, such as the logistics of shooting in a confined space?
It was an extremely small set, and it was built on the second floor of another set, so we had to have elevated platforms to get close-ups and stuff. The entire thing was about Charles’ and Peter’s performances before the moment and really delivering a face-off that I’ve known about for over a year, Peter has known about it since he’s signed on to the show and [showrunners David Benioff and Dan Weiss] have been waiting to make it for something like a decade. And also for me personally, it was Charles Dance’s final scene in the show. I’ve loved all of them, loved working with him. I really wanted it to be something to be proud of. And it was easy because Charles was incredible, and Peter was too. It turned out incredibly well.

Similarly, Tyrion has an emotional scene with his ex-lover Shae (Sibel Kekilli). What was the key to that scene — the initial confrontation and of course his eventually killing her?
The key to that scene was capturing the unfolding panic that results in her death. Peter and I talked a lot about it. We’ve thought a lot about the fact that they had been so successful in portraying that love story, moreso than the [in] the books, that it was very hard. I was terrified of that scene. That was one of my toughest … much harder for me than Joffrey’s death by far. It was really making sure that we were with [Tyrion] in the moment of, “This can’t possibly be happening. It’s the most psychologically traumatic event that I could imagine, and she’s reaching for a knife — what do I do?” And it goes wrong fast, like everything else does that night. One thing leads to another.

Can you discuss the challenges of the Brienne-Hound fight and Arya and Brienne’s meeting?
It started with a just a meeting about the story of the fight. What happened and who’s winning and why are they winning this point? The other thing is that, you’re also taking two knights in a way that’s never been done on the show, pitting them against another knight, the likes of which they have never seen. You’ve got the Hound fighting a woman, and you’ve got Brienne fighting a guy who could kill her, and she’s not used to that. They were taken to a place that’s so primal, a place they’ve never been before, because each of them takes place in the fight with the thought that they’re going to get killed. There’s a little buildup, there’s a huge rise and fall to it that has to do with people who have beat the odds and also has to do with who has any strength left internally. They’ve both been through so much. Who’s more determined to save a little girl who they don’t realize yet is too old to be saved?

The thing with Brienne where she finds Arya (Maisie Williams) and they chitchat until the Hound comes out was possibly my favorite. It was one of those scenes when I read it that I thought about every day until I directed it. I couldn’t wait to direct it because it’s four people coming together at exactly the wrong moment and everything going wrong. The more they try to make everything right, the more everything’s going wrong. It’s some of the best writing I’ve ever seen.

 

In an interview with Variety, Graves shares his insight on David and Dan’s decision to accelerate Bran Stark’s storyline and have it peak in the season’s final episode, and details how the complicated skeleton battle came together.

“One of the brilliant moves that David [Benioff] and Dan [Weiss] did … is they pulled this crescendo in Brandon Stark’s story up and put it into this episode. In other words, they almost jumped forward a year in what happens to Bran, because let’s face it, we’re tired of him being carried across the continent by Hodor. When I read the outline, I called David and Dan, I went straight to Hollywood and met them and I said, ‘Are we talking about the zombie guys that we’ve been doing or could these guys be viciously dangerous?’ They said, ‘Oh, yeah, that would be great.’ So they go across this snow plain and skeletons start to come out of the snow, à la Ray Harryhausen, who we sort of privately dedicated the sequence to. They come out of the snow at 90 miles per hour, and they are there to kill Brandon and Jojen before they get there, and they’ve been waiting for like a thousand years. Nobody knew about the sequence and it [wasn't] in any of the marketing, which is the most brilliant marketing move I’ve seen.”

“The logistics were that it was far too complex to shoot in Iceland in six hours of daylight and ten below weather. So we had a couple meetings about it, and I was really worried about needing to film it where the backgrounds were neutral in case whatever we did with skeletons needed to be manipulated dramatically with green screen. Chris Newman, who is one of the great producers on the show, had found this French film where they created these skeletons using guys with a certain technical approach. It was a poor man’s motion control but it worked really well. We needed to do something like that, because it was such a fast-paced action sequence … I storyboarded that sequence on napkins at a restaurant on my third day on the job, because we had to get going on it. To tell you the truth, we started working on it last May, and they finished it about two weeks ago. So it was a combination of, we’ve got to shoot at night; we have to create a gigantic set of ice plain in a rock quarry in Northern Ireland; we’re going to have stuntmen who are almost anorexic, wearing skeletal costumes over green leotards; choreograph the shots — we actually pre-shot it on my little camera and cut it together. That was when we started to get excited and when we started to go, ‘Yeah, we can do this.’ It was very complicated.”

&nsbp;

Graves spoke with The Hollywood Reporter about creating the final scene, and the major turning points that were laid out in the episode. He also reveals that Sansa’s transformation scene was originally slated to be in the finale.

That last shot was gorgeous. Where did you shoot the final scene?
There is a ship they use for a lot of the ships. We shot it in a parking lot in Ireland where they have the ship. It was at a point in the season where there is no money left. But I thought “The hell with it. I’m going to draw it the way I think it should go,” and I drew that huge shot. I went in the next day and I got looks like, “Why are you doing this to us? We hate you.” Then as is always the case with the producers on the show, they turned around and said, “This is the final moment. We think it’s great and we have to do it.” They figured out a way to move the money around and make it happen, and I’m very grateful for that.

This episode had big turning points for most of the characters.
Don’t forget the dual meaning of the title. Is the title about the children of the forest, or is the title about the Stark children? You’re watching the Starks have major turns in the story, including Sansa [Sophie Turner] in episode eight where she is becoming the Lady of the Eyrie. That scene was originally in the finale. Last season ended with the Starks being wiped out. This season is ending with the Lannister family being wiped out.

You’ll be taking time off from Game of Thrones next year. You’ve set up so many great storylines for season five — is there one in particular you are looking forward to seeing or wish you’d be able to direct?
Besides all of them, I will say Cersei. Lena is such a brilliant actor that I’m really into seeing what she’s going to do next. But also, you saw the finale last night. What do you think is going to happen when Cersei wakes up? Jaime set Tyrion free and he killed her father on the way out. She is going to be really pissed off. I don’t think I’m giving up anything if you think about what Cersei wakes up to in the morning.

 

Be sure to click through to all of the interviews to read all that Graves had to say about the finale episode. His talent and dedication to the story will certainly be missed in Season 5.

 


Game of Thrones Season Four Finale Power Rankings by winteriscoming

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92 Comments

  1. 123
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:17 pm | Permalink

    bewbz, teehee…

  2. Carne
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:24 pm | Permalink

    I’m guessing the tight schedule/budget might be the reason why they didn’t make the Children and Bloodraven look too fantastical. Wouldn’t mind some changes in looks for season 5.

  3. That boy Ramsey
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:25 pm | Permalink

    Great director and great interview. I too was disappointed by the lack of LS but in the harsh cold light of day you can’t argue with what Graves has done for GOT barring controversial Rapish scenes lol. We’ll all miss him season 5.

  4. Turncloak
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:28 pm | Permalink

    There’s a new article on EW that has an interview with D&D on what to expect for season 5.

    1) there will be Dorne
    2) Jaime gets a “jetpack” according to D&D

  5. Turncloak
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:31 pm | Permalink

    PS: I’m eating lemon cake right now. Eat your heart out Sansa :p

  6. That boy Ramsey
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:32 pm | Permalink

    Where are my ……..posts? Lol pun! Seriously though.

  7. That boy Ramsey
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:34 pm | Permalink

    Great interview from Graves… We’ll all miss him next season. Controversial Rapish scenes n’all. You can’t argue with what he did for GOT even though a lot of ppl and me included where disappointed there was no LS in the finale.

  8. Sheriff Bullock
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:45 pm | Permalink

    The Brienne vs. Hound fight was ruined for me, far too many fast cuts left me wondering what the hell was going on. I hate how directors today don’t let the action flow and insist on disrupting the scene with ridiculous cuts to different angles.

    If only Neil Marshall could direct every duel. His duel with Throne and Tormund was the best of the season.

  9. A Thousand Eyes and Two
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:45 pm | Permalink

    They figured out a way to move the money around and make it happen, and I’m very grateful for that.

    Well I guess we know why Bloodraven looks like crap now.

  10. Luka Nieto Garay
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:51 pm | Permalink

    Great new D&D interview about season 5 and the future of the show:

    http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/06/18/game-of-thrones-season-5/

    Seven seasons total again is cited as the stated goal, for those that didn’t want to believe it. It is even stated at two different points of the interview, which were conducted months apart. Also, they don’t deny the interviewer’s guess that season 5 will deal with most or even all of AFFC and ADWD. Although they don’t confirm it, later in the interview they say “We’ll be drawing heavily from Feast and Dance in season 5.”

    There’s other stuff too. They will move ahead whether they catch up to GRRM or not. There will be Dorne, as we already knew. They will continue to shrink the cast by killing characters still alive in the books.

  11. Lyn
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:53 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    The entire interview is very interesting. It’s great that they think the way the story ends is fantastic and I found really interesting the part where they say that some characters we don’t expect to be killed will die. And Spain is finally confirmed as being Dorne yay!

  12. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:55 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak:
    2) Jaime gets a “jetpack” according to D&D

    Hopefully, it is a better improvised “jetpack” scenario than

    1) Yara – Dreadfort
    2) Jon/Locke – Craster’s Keep

    Initially, I thought Locke’s improvised scenario at the Wall was a good tension-filled addition, but his actions at Crasters were surprisingly unconvincing.

    Hopefully, S5 has some good surprises in store for us.

  13. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:57 pm | Permalink

    It might just be me, but I thought the skeletons were awesome. And in a sense, if they’ve been there for thousands of years, maybe they decay to that point, but I have no interest in rationalizing it – its a Ray Harryhausen tribute with fucking crazy-ass skeletons!!

  14. jwal
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:58 pm | Permalink

    I think the census is that the love story between Shae and Tyrion DIDN’t work…

    EVerything they tried to do to change the Shae character failed. Especially toward the end.
    What happened to that feisty, defiant woman from season 1 & 2 ? should have changed her motivation completely if they were going to change her essence from a stereotypical money loving mistress/whore from the book to this whore with a mysterious background. They knew they didn’t have time to develop that, so why change it so dramatically?
    I wish they would have maybe changed it so that she belonged to Littlefinger from the beginning. They could have even have Littlefinger get to her after the Blackwater battle while Tyrion was unconscious and healing and after the trial have it revealed that Littlefinger orchestrated it. Because remember, Shae pronounced her love for Tyrion after he woke up from “coma”, so Petry could have gotten to her and have her do that. Even that conversation with Ros that Shae had could have been looked back on in a different light. It would also make sense because Shae as Sansa’s handmaiden could have been another ploy because Tyrion basically doesn’t consummate the marriage in part because of his love of Shae

  15. Turncloak
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 1:58 pm | Permalink

    Luka Nieto Garay,

    D&D actually do mention that by the end of the season they will have all or most of A Dance of Dragons wrapped up

  16. Luka Nieto Garay
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:03 pm | Permalink

    Turncloak,

    In the interview? I mean, I believe they will, but I don’t see a final confirmation there. They don’t correct the interviewer, and make the comment of “drawing heavily” from AFFC and ADWD. But I don’t see an actual specific confirmation that they will be done with most of the published material next season.

  17. Sheriff Bullock
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:04 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber:
    It might just be me, but I thought the skeletons were awesome. And in a sense, if they’ve been there for thousands of years, maybe they decay to that point, but I have no interest in rationalizing it – its a Ray Harryhausen tribute with fucking crazy-ass skeletons!!

    I am with you brother, I actually dug that scene. Reminded me of watching Jason and The Argonauts back in the day.

  18. mariamb
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:05 pm | Permalink

    From the ew.com article linked above:

    Varys claims to be concerned primarily with self preservation. At the end of the season, though, his actions prove otherwise. He throws away the entire life he’s built for himself in King’s Landing to save Tyrion’s life. Now what? … “Now what?” will become eminently clear in season 5.

    Confirmation of Young Griff and Varys’ role in getting him on the throne?

  19. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:08 pm | Permalink

    Sheriff Bullock,

    Greatjon of Slumber,

    I’ll make it a threesome. I liked the skeletons too. It was the fireballs that I could have done without.

  20. Luka Nieto Garay
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:10 pm | Permalink

    mariamb,

    It does look like it. At the very least, his relationship with Illyrio Mopatis will be explained and even expanded upon compared to the books, since Varys will arrive on Pentos with Tyrion and we’ll be able to see Varys and Illyrio interact again. But yes, I assume this also points to Aegon’s introduction.

  21. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:11 pm | Permalink

    A Thousand Eyes and Two,

    It was a quick scene. Casual fans won’t remember what he looked like. Please, D&D, at least remove one of his eyes. I can live with him not being an albino, but him having 2 eyes was really an oversight.

  22. Valaquen
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:12 pm | Permalink

    mariamb:
    From the ew.com article linked above:

    He throws away the entire life he’s built for himself in King’s Landing to save Tyrion’s life.

    Eh, I always thought Varys was more Machiavellian than that. They cut out the fact that he was coerced by Jaime, and that he also -maybe- had a stake in Tywin’s death. In fact, he may have set the whole situation up.

    There was a glimpse of a very dark Varys in season 3, when he talks about his castration and revenge. His softness and effeminacy was always a cover for a darker, more brutal character. I hope they’re not doing away with that to make him appeal more to an audience. Conleth Hill could knock it out of the park if he had to

    Anyway, excited to see some characters converge in season 5. The Wall stuff was a glorious tease.

  23. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:14 pm | Permalink

    Luka Nieto Garay,

    I hope so. But they could just have Varys and Illyrio working to put Dany on the throne, instead. And that seems like something they would do to condense the story. But then, who would Dorne support? It sure seems like they will be supporting ‘Aegon’ in the books.

  24. Delta1212
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:15 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    Well clearly he was missing one of his thousand eyes in this version. They just didn’t have him say “nine hundred ninety-nine eyes and two” because it doesn’t sound as cool.

  25. Luka Nieto Garay
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:15 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    You should probably pay more attention. Yes, he doesn’t have an open eye socket, but one of his eyes is black. That’s enough, having a weird blind black eye. You don’t need to CGI an eye-socket to each of his scenes.

  26. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:17 pm | Permalink

    Based on that interview, if I had to predict I imagine we will see:

    –Jaime in Dorne as some speculation has hinted, and then the use of his “jetpack” comes from then getting to the Riverlands to complete the Brienne/Jaime story one way or another.

    –The full complement of the Dorne folk with modest changes, but just about the entirety of that story.

    –JonCon and Young Griff. (To quote interview: “As for Varys: Early in the season, when speaking with Tyrion, Varys claims to be concerned primarily with self preservation. At the end of the season, though, his actions prove otherwise. He throws away the entire life he’s built for himself in King’s Landing to save Tyrion’s life. Now what? … “Now what?” will become eminently clear in season 5.” Couple that with Varys/Oberyn conversation in “Laws of Gods and Men,” and that’s pretty firm lean toward that.)

    That’s a lot. Which means we’re likely to see – if we see them at all – the Greyjoys left for Season 6. I may be wrong here, or they’re going to be such a small part of the show as to be nearly ignored.

    Hodor’s Bastard: Hopefully, it is a better improvised “jetpack” scenario than

    1) Yara – Dreadfort
    2) Jon/Locke – Craster’s Keep

    I don’t consider the former a jetpack scenario. She leaves in Ep 3/10, arrives at Dreadfort in 4/6. Not a jetpack. The latter wasn’t either – they leave in 4/4, arrive one episode later on horses.

    The true jetpacks were Littlefinger (Stormlands in 2/5, Riverlands two episodes later) and Melisandre (Riverlands in 3/6, Blackwater Bay in 3/7).

  27. Sheriff Bullock
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:17 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    Honestly that didn’t bother me either. I’d rather them embrace the fantasy aspects then shy away from them.

    Although next time, give WETA a call maybe lol.

  28. James
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:18 pm | Permalink

    Seven seasons total again is cited as the stated goal

    You missed this part:

    [Note: The rest of this transcript comes from an interview conducted months ago via phone, with a couple of these answers previously reported....]

    So yes, it was stated again, but it in fact is just restating the same quote from months and months ago.

  29. LittleFlower
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:23 pm | Permalink

    jwal:
    I think the census is that the love story between Shae and Tyrion DIDN’t work…

    Please do not include me in that “census”.

  30. Luka Nieto Garay
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

    jwal,

    “Consensus” is the word you are looking for, not “census”. A significant portion or maybe even a majority of fans would probably agree the relationship doesn’t work, but I do not think it really is a “consensus.”

  31. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:28 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber:
    It might just be me, but I thought the skeletons were awesome. And in a sense, if they’ve been there for thousands of years, maybe they decay to that point, but I have no interest in rationalizing it – its a Ray Harryhausen tribute with fucking crazy-ass skeletons!!

    I’m just starting to warm up to them (an homage as you stated is a good interpretation)…but I don’t think I’ll ever be as enthused by them as you. I wish we knew what they actually were though. Were they indeed fleshless wights? A silly FanSided article from Monday called them White Walkers….No, just no.

    I also must admit that my expectations were way to high for the CotF and BR. The CotF are eerie, disturbing, ageless creatures with ominous overtones….not mini-wizards. BR’s diffs are too many to mention. As for BR’s lair, maybe this has already been mentioned, but did anyone notice the similarity between the True Detective bad guy evil branch/root lair and the BR rooty lair? Nifty.

    In any case, the show is the show, and the books are the books (I keep reminding myself).

  32. Pau Soriano
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:31 pm | Permalink

    jwal:
    I think the census is that the love story between Shae and Tyrion DIDN’t work…

    It DID work for me

    Luka Nieto Garay:
    Turncloak,

    In the interview? I mean, I believe they will, but I don’t see a final confirmation there. They don’t correct the interviewer, and make the comment of “drawing heavily” from AFFC and ADWD.

    This statement made me laugh…what books are they

    supposed to draw heavily from if not those 2? :P

    Sheriff Bullock: I am with you brother, I actually dug that scene. Reminded me of watching Jason and The Argonauts back in the day.

    It’s 4 of us then ;)

  33. Ser Florian
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:32 pm | Permalink

    LittleFlower,

    Me neither. I’ve been taking the changes to Shae, between book and show, as a sign that she’d be a Tysha substitute. Speaking to Unsullied family, after the finale, and describing the Tysha scenario from the books to them, they were able to see the parallels quite clearly. One even said it’s probably better that it was Shae, whom we saw and got to know, rather than Tysha who was essentially a memory… Tysha works on the page, Shae worked better on the screen.

    The only thing about it I think might be a major departure (and loss) from the books would be Tyrion and Jaime parting amicably… and even then, it’s only Tyrion’s attitude to Jaime that’s going to be missing or altered. Jaime can be soured on Tyrion because he killed their father, after Jaime freed him, thus making Jaime partly culpable.

    Also, I liked the Skeletons and didn’t mind the fireballs.

  34. Pau Soriano
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:33 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: I’m just starting to warm up to them (an homage as you stated is a good interpretation)…but I don’t think I’ll ever be as enthused by them as you. I wish we knew what they actually were though. Were they indeed fleshless wights? A silly FanSided article from Monday called them White Walkers….No, just no.

    I also must admit that my expectations were way to high for the CotF and BR. The CotF are eerie, disturbing, ageless creatures with ominous overtones….not mini-wizards. BR’s diffs are too many to mention. As for BR’s lair, maybe this has already been mentioned, but did anyone notice the similarity between the True Detective bad guy evil branch/root lair and the BR rooty lair? Nifty.

    In any case, the show is the show, and the books are the books (I keep reminding myself).

    “Do you know Carcosa too??”

  35. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:34 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: I’m just starting to warm up to them (an homage as you stated is a good interpretation)…but I don’t think I’ll ever be as enthused by them as you. I wish we knew what they actually were though. Were they indeed fleshless wights? A silly FanSided article from Monday called them White Walkers….No, just no.

    I assumed they were fleshless wights, as they were certainly not White Walkers.

    Tyrion Pimpslap:
    Sheriff Bullock,

    Greatjon of Slumber,

    I’ll make it a threesome. I liked the skeletons too. It was the fireballs that I could have done without.

    Yeah, I didn’t even mind those. In the book, Leaf goes around lighting those things on fire, so this isn’t much of a stretch. Either way once you’ve got skeletons with swords, you’ve kind of left behind reality, so I didn’t care. :)

  36. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:35 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber:
    I don’t consider the former a jetpack scenario. She leaves in Ep 3/10, arrives at Dreadfort in 4/6. Not a jetpack. The latter wasn’t either – they leave in 4/4, arrive one episode later on horses.

    The true jetpacks were Littlefinger (Stormlands in 2/5, Riverlands two episodes later) and Melisandre (Riverlands in 3/6, Blackwater Bay in 3/7).

    Ok…maybe instead of the term “jetpack” I should have used “ridiculously contrived with enough plotholes to fill Albert Hall” then. :)

  37. mariamb
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:36 pm | Permalink

    Luka Nieto Garay:
    mariamb,

    It does look like it. At the very least, his relationship with Illyrio Mopatis will be explained and even expanded upon compared to the books, since Varys will arrive on Pentos with Tyrion and we’ll be able to see Varys and Illyrio interact again. But yes, I assume this also points to Aegon’s introduction.

    This could be very interesting because Varys doesn’t travel with Tyrion in the books. This is a change that I wholeheartedly support – Varys and Illyrio with Tyrion. That’s gold!

    Valaquen:
    There was a glimpse of a very dark Varys in season 3, when he talks about his castration and revenge. His softness and effeminacy was always a cover for a darker, more brutal character. I hope they’re not doing away with that to make him appeal more to an audience. Conleth Hill could knock it out of the park if he had to

    Anyway, excited to see some characters converge in season 5. The Wall stuff was a glorious tease.

    Agree. I would love to see a darker Varys…the one that finally reveals himself at the end of ADWD. Its what is so intriguing about this character. And yes, more of Conleth is a treat.

    Watching some of these characters converge will be delightful. I look forward to Jon, Stannis, Davos, Mance and Melisandre together…plotting.

  38. Tommen, King of the North
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:36 pm | Permalink

    Delta1212:
    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    Well clearly he was missing one of his thousand eyes in this version. They just didn’t have him say “nine hundred ninety-nine eyes and two” because it doesn’t sound as cool.

    He’s also a 3 eyed raven which would lead to an odd number of eyes in the “thousand eyes and one”. Maybe he’s saying he had 999 spies and him.

  39. jwal
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:39 pm | Permalink

    Luka Nieto Garay:
    jwal,

    “Consensus” is the word you are looking for, not “census”. A significant portion or maybe even a majority of fans would probably agree the relationship doesn’t work, but I do not think it really is a “consensus.”

    LittleFlower,

    yeah,” consensus” does not mean everybody. So…I don’t see the problem with my use of that word (however mespellttt it was).

  40. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:40 pm | Permalink

    Pau Soriano: “Do you know Carcosa too??”

    That’s the term I was looking for! Carcosa! Thx! TD Bluray just came out. Time for a rewatch!

  41. mariamb
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:41 pm | Permalink

    Pau Soriano: It DID work for me

    Tyrion and Shae worked for me as well. And I was surprised by my initial reaction…I very much wanted to dislike Show Shae but I couldn’t.

  42. barak
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:45 pm | Permalink

    jwal: I think the census is that the love story between Shae and Tyrion DIDN’t work…
    EVerything they tried to do to change the Shae character failed. Especially toward the end.
    What happened to that feisty, defiant woman from season 1 & 2 ? should have changed her motivation completely if they were going to change her essence from a stereotypical money loving mistress/whore from the book to this whore with a mysterious background. They knew they didn’t have time to develop that, so why change it so dramatically?
    I wish they would have maybe changed it so that she belonged to Littlefinger from the beginning. They could have even have Littlefinger get to her after the Blackwater battle while Tyrion was unconscious and healing and after the trial have it revealed that Littlefinger orchestrated it. Because remember, Shae pronounced her love for Tyrion after he woke up from “coma”, so Petry could have gotten to her and have her do that. Even that conversation with Ros that Shae had could have been looked back on in a different light. It would also make sense because Shae as Sansa’s handmaiden could have been another ploy because Tyrion basically doesn’t consummate the marriage in part because of his love of Shae

    It didn’t work for YOU, maybe. It worked perfectly for me.

    “What happened to that feisty, defiant woman from season 1 & 2 ? ” – She was there, right there. She was feisty and defiant, that’s why she turned against Tyrion when Tyrion kept hurting and humiliating her. Because that’s what he did. Yes, he did it because he loved Shae and wanted her to be safe, but Shae made it clear that she didn’t want that. She loved him, that’s why his ultimate betrayal of her cut so deep that she felt she had to get revenge. And given the new and dangerous situation she was in, she tried to seduce Tywin in order to get the most out of the new position she was in. Sad and tragic? Yes. But it was all very much in-character for TV Shae. She tried to fuck her way out of trouble, and for once, it didn’t happen.

  43. TOIVA
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:46 pm | Permalink

    Ah, so the skeletons were a tribute. Well, it was far too obvious for my liking. Also I’d love to know why they though the skeletons needed to be more vicious then your regular wight.

  44. Sighmon
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:48 pm | Permalink

    “The other thing is that, you’re also taking two knights in a way that’s never been done on the show, pitting them against another knight”

    They’re not knights Graves… as explicitly said in the finale, by each of them. How is this guy directing actors to play characters when he doesn’t seem to know the stories himself? Astonishing.

  45. Hoyti Von Totiy
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:56 pm | Permalink

    Last shot of the season should have not been Arya on a ship.
    That was so underwhelming i couldnt belive they went for that one.

    Stannis or Sansa scene should have been the final shot of the season.

    p.s. Bryden Rivers a.k.a. 3-e-raven looks like crap in the show. He looks like a teenager compared to Pycelle.

  46. Dame of Mercia
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 2:57 pm | Permalink

    Sheriff Bullock: Greatjon of Slumber:
    It might just be me, but I thought the skeletons were awesome. And in a sense, if they’ve been there for thousands of years, maybe they decay to that point, but I have no interest in rationalizing it – its a Ray Harryhausen tribute with fucking crazy-ass skeletons!!

    Sheriff Bullock: I am with you brother, I actually dug that scene. Reminded me of watching Jason and The Argonauts back in the day.

    Sheriff Bullock: I am with you brother, I actually dug that scene. Reminded me of watching Jason and The Argonauts back in the day.

    Sheriff Bullock: I am with you brother, I actually dug that scene. Reminded me of watching Jason and The Argonauts back in the day.

    Well, I certainly didn’t think the skeleton fighters were as bad as some people seem to have done. I know HBO have a lush budget but some folk seem to think it’s even lusher than it actually is. (Obviously not being on HBO’s payroll I have no idea what the budget is).

    Now Shire-Reeve B, ser, on another thread today you were less than enthusiastic about the casting choice made for Yara. I know it’s different strokes for different folks but I never had a problem with the choice myself. It is however a while since I read (well actually listened) to “A Clash of Kings” and though I got the impression that book Asha was attractive and charming I never developed the feeling that she was drop dead gorgeous. I’m not saying I can’t make a mistake, so could you point me in the direction of whereabouts in the book Yara’s description as a “hottie” is to be found; if I’m wrong I’ll admit it.

  47. Immi
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:02 pm | Permalink

    I said it in the Unsullied thread and I’ll say it again. The skeletons were badass awesome and I’m firmly on side with them. Loved the entire sequence, including Bloodraven/Brynden. That underground set was stunning.

  48. House Mormont
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:03 pm | Permalink

    People do know what a thousand eyes and ONE refers to is his third eye being connected with all the weirwoods right? He couldn’t watch them through his literal eye

  49. Hoyti Von Totiy
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:08 pm | Permalink

    House Mormont:
    People do know what a thousand eyes and ONE refers to is his third eye being connected with all the weirwoods right? He couldn’t watch them through his literal eye

    hmm no. The one eye he refers to is the one actual eye he has left since he lost the other one.

    The guy on the show playing 3-e-crow looks younger then the actor playing Bran.

  50. Don
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:11 pm | Permalink

    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    I know you’re joking but the actor who plays Bran still look about 12 outside of the show. In the show he looks older because of the wig and makeup.

  51. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    Yeah…hopefully BR grows a few more roots by S5.

    Regarding the last scene, I didn’t mind Arya’s “Valar Morghulis” (anything with Arya/Hound is great) to end the season but I thought, if they weren’t going with LS, then they could have suddenly switched to Pyke and showed Balon making his fateful fall…after being pushed by someone. If they would have showed the face of the attacker, known or unknown, that would have been the ultimate troll for all of us! Instead, we wait…and wait…

  52. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:19 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: Ok…maybe instead of the term “jetpack” I should have used “ridiculously contrived with enough plotholes to fill Albert Hall” then.:)

    I don’t think they were plot holes. You may have not enjoyed the execution, but curious what you mean by holes. Yara did hightail it outta there quick, but other than that, I’m not sure.

    Dame of Mercia: I know it’s different strokes for different folks but I never had a problem with the choice myself. It is however a while since I read (well actually listened) to “A Clash of Kings” and though I got the impression that book Asha was attractive and charming I never developed the feeling that she was drop dead gorgeous.

    I’d always pictured someone who was plain looking and a bit hard, pretty much how she looks on the show, and I’ve always been taken with the casting – and really would like to see more of her.

  53. Luka Nieto Garay
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:20 pm | Permalink

    jwal,

    Well, there is a different between “a lot of people” (or even “a majority”) and “the general agreement in the fandom”, which is what consensus means.

  54. Darquemode
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    Really?
    That was the shot I pictured they would end with before the season began. Even more so later into the season when various actors mentioned the season ending on a hopeful note. It just made sense to me.

  55. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:27 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard:
    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    Yeah…hopefully BR grows a few more roots by S5.

    Regarding the last scene, I didn’t mind Arya’s “Valar Morghulis” (anything with Arya/Hound is great) to end the season but I thought, if they weren’t going with LS, then they could have suddenly switched to Pyke and showed Balon making his fateful fall…after being pushed by someone. If they would have showed the face of the attacker, known or unknown, that would have been the ultimate troll for all of us! Instead, we wait…and wait…

    I’ll disagree with you here in that I get the idea of going with something poignant and thematic (and it makes more sense if the last Sansa scene is in the final, but no biggie on that). And unlike the close of Season 3 which was a weird, odd, jarring note, this one really spoke to me, particularly after we have Tyrion leaving in a box.

  56. Grynthaline
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:34 pm | Permalink

    Hah, I had always thought the “People die squatting over their chamber pots” line sounded very specific and wondered if it meant that this scene was supposed to be after the event, glad it got confirmed. It felt very season-endy scene and indeed it was, since we never saw LF and Sansa after that point. Still, it was a good decision to end it earlier, I think.

    And I hated the decisions about Tyrion’s storyline up until this point and this episode cemented it, I don’t care for the show-version of the character because he is not interesting. Tyrion in the books is gray, even though some fanboys of his try to argue his good-guyness a lot and that turned me off his character but I still found him interesting, now I don’t care for him at all.

    That knife-grabbing scene annoyed the hell out of me, and it enrages me to find people online pointing to that detail in particular for “justifying” (if that is even possible) for Shae’s murder.

  57. WeirwoodTreeHugger
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:39 pm | Permalink

    Ser Florian:
    LittleFlower,

    Me neither. I’ve been taking the changes to Shae, between book and show, as a sign that she’d be a Tysha substitute. Speaking to Unsullied family, after the finale, and describing the Tysha scenario from the books to them, they were able to see the parallels quite clearly. One even said it’s probably better that it was Shae, whom we saw and got to know, rather than Tysha who was essentially a memory… Tysha works on the page, Shae worked better on the screen.

    The only thing about it I think might be a major departure (and loss) from the books would be Tyrion and Jaime parting amicably… and even then, it’s only Tyrion’s attitude to Jaime that’s going to be missing or altered. Jaime can be soured on Tyrion because he killed their father, after Jaime freed him, thus making Jaime partly culpable.

    Also, I liked the Skeletons and didn’t mind the fireballs.

    I’ve been trying in vain to explain to people that this was their reasoning but people are too busy being pissed off to even consider it.

  58. Hoyti Von Totiy
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:41 pm | Permalink

    Darquemode:
    Hoyti Von Totiy,

    Really?
    That was the shot I pictured they would end with before the season began.Even more so later into the season when various actors mentioned the season ending on a hopeful note. It just made sense to me.

    “hopefull” would be Arya sailing north to the wall.

    Arya sailing to Braavos is … nothing.

  59. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:46 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber: I don’t think they were plot holes. You may have not enjoyed the execution, but curious what you mean by holes. Yara did hightail it outta there quick, but other than that, I’m not sure.

    Ok…you’re not going to let me have those easy criticisms, for some reason. I won’t counter further. Just remember that out of so many amazing scenes this season, we got a few stinkers that are worth pointing out. Why defend those few “Cogman-written” stinkers? I bet those scenes pissed off more folks than they appeased. Unfortunately, those two scenes keep “Oathkeeper” and “The Laws of Gods and Men” from being in my top GoT episodes list. Truly a pity, imho.

  60. Dame of Mercia
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:49 pm | Permalink

    I don’t know whether it is just in the UK, but this site (when I try to post something) is going really slowly at the moment, so I did not realise that I had quoted Sherriff Bullock three times in my post a little way above.

    Now something I thought of on another topic – just me surmising and I might be wrong. The lack of Lady Stonehart. I can recall Michelle Fairley saying that her contract was for three years. Now when she was cast she was a familiar face to people in the UK even if they did not know her name, for example, she had had roles in “Morse” and “Lark Rise to Candleford” albeit not recurring roles. But she was not known internationally. Much of her work had been in the theatre. Having been in “Game of Thrones” she has become more well-known internationally and has been in another high profile series “24″ (both “Game of Thrones” and “24″ were series she was offered because other actresses had to drop out ironically). So I imagine she can ask a much larger salary now than when she was originally contracted to play Lady Stark. If the show-runners are really as constrained by budgetary concerns as they claim, could it be that Ms Fairley would cost them too much money now? Well that’s my two pennyworth (cents’ worth). This is just a thought I have had – I haven’t read anything mentioning such a theory.

  61. Joe Frost
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:51 pm | Permalink

    AM I the only person who is glad that Graves isn’t back next season? I thought his handling of some key scenes was poor and a lot of his changes were pointless and detracted from the source material for no logical reason.

  62. Veltigar
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:53 pm | Permalink

    Wait if this hack isn’t returning next season, then who’ll invent all those rape scenes this show clearly needs according to him.

    Oh, wait they’ll just rape the source material. After what they pulled last episode that’s hardly surprising.

    Do not cast MM as Euron. Seriously, what a waste of a great actor and a great character. Just throw in some unnecessary Dornish plotline in or give his lines to a featured extra

  63. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

    Greatjon of Slumber: I’ll disagree with you here in that I get the idea of going with something poignant and thematic (and it makes more sense if the last Sansa scene is in the final, but no biggie on that). And unlike the close of Season 3 which was a weird, odd, jarring note, this one really spoke to me, particularly after we have Tyrion leaving in a box.

    How are we disagreeing? I liked the Arya ending….I was just suggesting that if they wanted to end on a mystery that wasn’t LS, then maybe Balon…? Just a fun debatable suggestion…

  64. chamush
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:04 pm | Permalink

    Im not a jerk and feel bad saying this, but theyve spent all this time, effort and money into making the skeletons scene and the results is the worst and in my opinion an embrassing scene for GOT!

  65. Carne
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

    chamush,

    I think the skeletons looked really good for a TV budget.

  66. Illyrio Cheesemonger
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:11 pm | Permalink

    Good riddance to Alex Graves. His editing & blocking were horrendous, he got weaker performances out out actors, & his choices are generally poor and “off book” for no good reason & to bad effect. Also his explanations in interviews are utter hogwash. Cut ties w/ Alex Graves forever HBO.

  67. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:13 pm | Permalink

    Veltigar,

    That’s a bit harsh, man. This is the same “hack” that brought us “Kissed by Fire” and “The Lion and the Rose.” Some of his shots in ep8 & ep10 are epic. In any case, I do think that they should get some fresh directing blood in the mix for S5.

  68. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    Illyrio Cheesemonger,

    And yet, his first 3 episodes: ‘And Now His Watch Is Ended’,'Kissed By Fire’, and ‘The Lion And The Rose’ were all phenomenal episodes.

  69. Tyrion Pimpslap
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Veltigar has seemed to go full-purist. Never go full-purist, man.

  70. Hodor's Bastard
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:20 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap:
    Hodor’s Bastard,
    Veltigar has seemed to go full-purist. Never go full-purist, man.

    Yes…you are wise, ser. I have been riding that edge all season. Still having fun though! :)

  71. AnnaD
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:21 pm | Permalink

    jwal,

    most of my non-book reader friends hated Shae from the beginning, or didn’t care, I didn’t mind either way. I just think she was different in season 3 and 4 compared to how they did her. I just don’t get the reason that she betrayed him. Am I missing something, or did it just go over my head? She was in it for the money in the beginning? She felt betrayed by Tyrion?

  72. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: Ok…you’re not going to let me have those easy criticisms, for some reason. I won’t counter further. Just remember that out of so many amazing scenes this season, we got a few stinkers that are worth pointing out. Why defend those few “Cogman-written” stinkers? I bet those scenes pissed off more folks than they appeased. Unfortunately, those two scenes keep “Oathkeeper” and “The Laws of Gods and Men” from being in my top GoT episodes list. Truly a pity, imho.

    Yes, I’m being pedantic. In my nature. I think those scenes were fine, though the reasoning on the Craster attack a bit specious, and Yara gave up quickly. I agree the Yara conclusion wasn’t brilliant and I really do wish we see more of her in time, so I agree on that – I don’t consider them holes so much as lackluster execution, but I enjoyed it in general. However I do believe that these narrative cul-de-sacs are generally fine as things go, because the unsullied really don’t know what’s to happen, and anytime I’m confronted with a moment where I dont know the outcome, it’s a nice surprise – like the White Walker DayCare Center.

  73. Greatjon of Slumber
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:42 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard: How are we disagreeing? I liked the Arya ending….I was just suggesting that if they wanted to end on a mystery that wasn’t LS, then maybe Balon…?Just a fun debatable suggestion…

    Ah I see now. Yes, cool I’m with you. If we get that moment, it’s my hope that it eventually happens after we get Balon berating a few hapless underlings. Few people have a voice as bracing and cutting in its pitch than Patrick Malahide.

  74. B
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 4:47 pm | Permalink

    Joe Frost… You are not the only one.

    Joe Frost,

  75. Veltigar
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 5:01 pm | Permalink

    Hodor’s Bastard:
    Veltigar,

    That’s a bit harsh, man. This is the same “hack” that brought us “Kissed by Fire” and “The Lion and the Rose.” Some of his shots in ep8 & ep10 are epic. In any case, I do think that they should get some fresh directing blood in the mix for S5.

    One act of good does not make up for all the bad. And the bad acts are in the majority. Not even close.

    Tyrion Pimpslap:
    Hodor’s Bastard,

    Veltigar has seemed to go full-purist. Never go full-purist, man.

    Oh, you’re adorable you, I have refuted this ridiculous assertion time and time again. But keep on trying, one day you might write something that has merit. After all, even a blind chicken finds a kernel of corn every once in a while.

    Stay away from MM

  76. clk
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 5:31 pm | Permalink

    I don’t understand why some people even think of season 5 being weak. Personally, Iloved books 4 and 5 and hope they make and awesome season, focusing more in politcs and all good moments.
    I really like predicting how will be adapted (or sharing how I hope will be adapted) so here is what I think will happen in the North:


    The Wall:
    1 ep: Stannis offers Winterfell to Jon, LC election (Alliser vs Slynt vs Jon), Jon wins with Alliser suport thanks to Sam(episode ends here)
    2 ep: Stannis makes his speech to the wildlings prisioners. Stannis talks with Mance,say know that some wildlings escaped at the Battle and are being led by the skinchange Varamyr. Stannis talks with Jon that none of the northern houses had sworn allegiance. Jon talks with Melisandre.
    3 ep: Stannis “burns” Mace, but is another man. Jon talks with Sam, Alisser, Edd, Aemon and Slynt his estrategies (he needs to occupy others NW castles and want to establish the free folk on the Gift), with Alliser saying that they need more food and money.
    4 ep: Stannis sends Davos to treat with the Manderlys. Sam, Gilly and Aemon departs for Braavos (to get money for the NW from the IB and to go to Oldtown). Jon send Slynt to one of the NW castle, he refuses and gets beheaded.
    5 ep: Jon helps Stannis in how to conquer the North (treat with the mountain clans and invade Winterfell to get northern support). Stannis talks with Selyse and Melisandre and leaves. Tormund gets afraid with Shirren’s greyscale. He leaves to speak with Varamyr and bring the wildlings to the Wall.
    6 ep: Melisandre say to Jon that Mance wasn’t burn as a request of her for Stannis, because she knew he could be important. She sends him to rescue “Arya”.
    7 ep: Tormund returns with 10 000 wildlings, but says that are other 10 000 including Varamyr in Hardhome surrounded by WW. Alliser and Selyse oppose to the passage of the wildlings to the south of the Wall, but they pass.
    8 ep: Tormund speaks with Jon and both decide to lead the rescue on Hardhome. Alliser hears it, irate.
    9 ep: NONE
    10 ep: Jon and Tormund are discussing the final preparations for the rescue when Edd comes with a letter from Ramsay Bolton. Purple Letter. Jon says to the NW that he will attack Winterfell and that Stannis is dead. Melisandre,Selyse and Shirren leaves to their chambers chocked. Jon is stabbed 4 times by Alliser.
    NEW CHARACTERS: NONE

    North of the Wall
    1 ep: NONE
    2 ep: Bran conforts Meera of her lost. 3 Eyed Raven explains to Bran what it is to be have the greensight.
    3 ep: Leaf and others COTF explains to Bran about their race and how they became almost extinct.
    4 ep: NONE
    5 ep: Leaf gives Bran a weirwood paste and he eats it. He sees Winterfell 100 years ago and then Ned asking for the old goods for Jon and Robb be safe.
    6 ep: Varamyr, a warg, is in Hardhome, a goslty village, with 10 000 of sick and hungry wildlings in a deplorable state. He wargs in a dog and it runs throw the wood searching for someone. It encounters Tormund, and it asks for him follow it. Tormund sees alofe the village and then notice that it is surrounded by WWs. He runs. A WW encounters the dog and kill it (episode ends here).
    7 ep: NONE
    8 ep: 3ER explains to Bran his history (that he was a Targaryen bastard and LC of NW). Bran says to 3ER about Theon and how him too never had a house. He says he saw him and that he pardons him.
    9 ep: NONE
    10 ep: 3ER says to Bran that Bran needs to discover some mysteries. He eats the weirwood paste and sees Jon Snow face.
    NEW CHARACTERS: Varamyr

    The North:
    1 ep: NONE
    2 ep: Roose says to Ramsay that he needs the support of others northern houses and that he isn’t worried about Stannis. He presents to Ramsay his future wife, Arya Stark, that is actualy Jeyne Poole.
    3 ep: Jeyne ask for help from Reek, who already knew her. Ramsay and Jeyne marry. Ramsay bed her. Roose speaks with Reek about Ramsay.
    4 ep: NONE
    5 ep: Davos requires that Manderly supports Stannis. Wyman is with some Freys, including Lothar Frey. He demands that Davos return to the dungeons and that he loses his head.
    6 ep: Wyman speaks with Davos and says that he will support Stannis if Davos rescue Rickon, who was last seen going to Skaagos.
    7 ep: Wyman arrives at Winterfell with Lothar and they argue. Mance speaks with Theon, without revealing himself. Stannis, after gaining support of the mountain clains, sees Yara and some ironmen while marching at Winterfell, kill the ironmen and apprehend Yara.
    8 ep: Some Bolton guards are murdered inside Winterfell. Roose suspects the Manderly. Mance says to Reek who he are and that he needs he’s help. Reek ask for help to the weirwood tree in Winterfell and says he is sorry for killing the farmer childrens. He hears Bran’s voice saying “Theon”. Stannis says to Yara that she is his prize and they held camp outside the walls of Winterfell.
    9 ep: Theon rescue Jeyne, jumping outside the walls, but Mance is captured. Roose and Ramsay get desperate and send Manderly and Frey troops to deal with Stannis. Begginig of the batle, but we don’t see if Stannis wins or dies and the end of the battle(this is takes only 15 minutes of the episode).
    10 ep: NONE
    NEW CHARACTERS: Jeyne Poole, Wyman Manderly

    I hope you people comment about my predictions. The South and the East I will do later.
    And I think would be cool if the site made a space where we can discuss and predict season 5.

  77. Jim Stark
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 6:21 pm | Permalink

    Are people serious when they blame Graves for deviations from the source material? C’mon… It’s the FUCKING WRITERS.
    Also I’ve never seen a show so good be so consistently criticized. You get weirdos saying ‘I could have done with blah blah blah’ , well we could a have done without you ever watching the show so eat a dick

  78. Joe Frost
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 6:31 pm | Permalink

    B,

    We are union!

  79. Joe Frost
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 6:32 pm | Permalink

    Jim Stark,

    Is that you Alex?!

  80. Jackol
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 6:48 pm | Permalink

    Have to agree with ultimately hating the changes to Shae.

    I was very worried about how the ending would play out because of the “love story” they made Tyrion/Shae into.

    Tyrion loved Shae in the books, no doubt.
    Shae thought very little of Tyrion in the books, but Tyrion fails to see it.

    Not a love story at all.

    So:

    We’ve thought a lot about the fact that they had been so successful in portraying that love story, moreso than the [in] the books

    This shows a complete lack of understanding deep in the heart of the writing/directing team about wtf is going on in the books.

    And I wouldn’t have minded the change to make Tyrion/Shae a real love story if they had adjusted the final scene. That might have even meant leaving Shae out of the scene entirely, and it would all have made a lot more sense – the scene would just have been Tyrion confronting Tywin (and there were enough reasons for him to do that, although properly introducing the Tysha reveal from Jamie would have made it all make a lot more sense, with a few more minutes of screen time).

    Tywin’s death at the hands of Tyrion is more than enough to seal Tyrion’s future direction. Shae being included with motivations that just don’t work simply detracts from the integrity of the storytelling.

    This car crash was coming for a long time and they had plenty of time to correct course.

    They didn’t.

    And I’m no book purist.

  81. Sam
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    Ser Florian:
    LittleFlower,

    Me neither. I’ve been taking the changes to Shae, between book and show, as a sign that she’d be a Tysha substitute. Speaking to Unsullied family, after the finale, and describing the Tysha scenario from the books to them, they were able to see the parallels quite clearly. One even said it’s probably better that it was Shae, whom we saw and got to know, rather than Tysha who was essentially a memory… Tysha works on the page, Shae worked better on the screen.

    On one hand, that really works. On the other, it doesn’t. I feel if they were going to go that road, they would have cut the Tysha story season one, and even Bronn referenced it last season. That felt like the story would be brought up in the this scene, but it wasn’t.

    Perhaps it was their intention for a while that D&D would do it, until they started this season and changed their mind. Now it feels like they tried to both, but since they only did both half way, it fell flat. Especially with the way Shae was killed. It is now just embarrassing that people are saying what Tyrion did to her was self-defense, which it clearly wasn’t. It was just murder.

  82. Turncloak
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 8:32 pm | Permalink

    Tyrion Pimpslap,

    I’ve gone full purist a few times lol. But it’s because sometimes it’s hard to have these scenes built in your head in such a way that makes them epic and then watch the show and have the scene not live to your expectations. I think it’s also easier to digest changes when you expect them coming. Probably why I was such a huge fan of Brienne vs The Hound and why i wasn’t upset about the lack of Lady Stoneheart. I’m also looking forward to Jaime and Bronn in Dorne. Only thing that worries me is Tyene’s casting because the audition leak had an awful performance lol. Hopefully they find a great actor for her

  83. David
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 9:09 pm | Permalink

    They must have taken budget away from making the Three Eyed Crow look more like he’s described in the books. I would have loved to see him look more skeletal and with the roots growing through him. Minor nit pick but it would have looked better.

  84. Steve
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 10:24 pm | Permalink

    Thank god he is gone from season 5. I have an issue with at least one thing in every episode this guy directs. Extremely overrated for the amount of episodes he gets to direct.

    Also, this guy really, really hates the books. Sorry, but he does. He has something negative to say about them in literally every interview of his I’ve ever read.

  85. thisone
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 10:56 pm | Permalink

    Regarding the fireballs:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=uM7clLfP5hU#t=2342

    “I don’t really want to see that in Game of Thrones.”

    (WhatTheFlick show, 39:00)

  86. ArgonathofBraavos
    Posted June 18, 2014 at 11:34 pm | Permalink

    Grynthaline,

    Does everyone have to be a dark shade of grey? Why can’t Tyrion be a lighter shade? There are, in fact, moral people in the world, and I think it is more realistic to show that than to portray everything and everyone as morally ambiguous and leaning dark. I prefer lighter shade of grey Tyrion from the TV show, and find him just as interesting (if not more interesting) than his book counterpart. If played with nuance and skill, goodness can be just as interesting as wickedness, IMO. I like a more compassionate Tyrion AND find that aspect of his character, given the harships he has faced, very interesting (and encouraging).

  87. Eljuma
    Posted June 19, 2014 at 5:25 am | Permalink

    So the skeleton fight is this year’s ‘Yara goes around Westeros’, right? The one event randomly seized and declared mind-blowingly impossible and cheesy for no reason?

    Pray tell, what’s the issue with live skeletons?

    “Are they wights?” – Well of fucking course they are. The White Walkers are rising up the dead. That’s their entire stick. That was established already in the first scene ever of the show.

    “They should be fleshed, more recent wights” – WHY? Since when is the WW’s power limited by that? When do you think was the last time wildlings and NW were up there (fighting a battle with each other from the looks of it)? You leave a corpse for thousands of years in a glacier, it ends looking like Otzi the Iceman, not Lenin’s Mummy. The WW only woke up again recently, so people wouldn’t have a reason to burn their dead hundreds or thousands of years ago which is when these guys died. Or do you think the WW are picky choosers? Like, they would only rise recent corpses because… no, really, because no reason? Most mindless case of arbitrary skepticism I’ve ever seen.

    “But, they didn’t have blue eyes!” – Well, of course. They didn’t have eyes at all. Having eyes is not a requirement to rise as a wight. We have already seen a reanimated SEVERED HAND, remember? The horse wight in 4×04 lacked at least an eye and was pretty skeletal looking too. Eyes turning blue is evidence of wight-dom, NOT a condition to become a wight. If it was, people would have no reason to burn their dead. Plug their eyes out, or just stab them after death, and everything should be fine, right?

  88. Tatters
    Posted June 19, 2014 at 5:36 am | Permalink

    ArgonathofBraavos,

    He is richer in the book

  89. Caravaggio
    Posted June 19, 2014 at 9:54 am | Permalink

    I love the directing eye that Alex Graves brought to GoT. On a technical level, he’s one of my favorite GoT directors next to Michelle MacLaren and Alan Taylor. It’s too bad about his problematic statements about the sept scene, which was a blunder on D&D’s part to begin with.

  90. Greatness Arrisessss
    Posted June 19, 2014 at 5:37 pm | Permalink

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx8EZ4ADS58 guys here is my review of game of thrones’ newest season. i like this show so much so i share my review of what i thought of this years season

  91. Lex
    Posted June 19, 2014 at 8:54 pm | Permalink

    Sigh… once again, Alex Graves talking about how amazing one of his scenes was, which myself (and maybe others) did not enjoy. I’m talking about the skeletons.

    I LOVE Ray Harryhausen, I love Army of Darkness… but the skeleton warriors just do not fit in the GoT/ASOIAF universe for me. It took me completely out of the episode… even on the re-watch. I’d say the Bran scenes were the only disappointing thing in the episode.

    In my view, the skeletons should have been regular wights… the Child of the Forest should not have been throwing fireball grenades, and Bloodraven should have looked about 50% cooler.

    Otherwise, amazing finale. But Alex Graves seems to have a knack for delivering amazing episodes with one or two glaring flaws.

  92. Markus44
    Posted June 19, 2014 at 10:26 pm | Permalink

    Joe Frost,

    I agree completely. Not a fan of alot of his shots, especially the whole shaky cam aspect. Took away from the scenes and the angles were off. His episode flow just feels lackluster to me.


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