George R.R. Martin: Some Fans have guessed ending to Game of Thrones
By WiC Staff on in Interview.

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George R.R. Martin may be the only person who truly knows how the A Song of Ice and Fire series will end, but the author has recently admitted that some fan theories have correctly predicted his endgame.

Speaking recently at the Edinburgh International Literary Festival, Martin confessed that he ceased reading online fan theories when he realized some fans had accurately guessed where the series is heading.

Said Martin:

So many readers were reading the books with so much attention that they were throwing up some theories and while some of those theories were amusing bullshitt and creative, some of the theories are right. At least one or two readers had put together the extremely subtle and obscure clues that I’d planted in the books and came to the right solution.

More, after the jump.

This shouldn’t come as much of a surprise to Martin or to fans. The already popular books have only become more so since the debut Game of Thrones on HBO. With a fan base this rabid and one in which thousands of theories are exchanged daily on the web, someone was bound to follow enough of Martin’s breadcrumbs to a correct guess.

The good news is that Martin doesn’t plan to change course simply to keep fans off the trail.

Again, Martin:

So what do I do then? Do I change it? I wrestled with that issue and I came to the conclusion that changing it would be a disaster, because the clues were there,” he said. “You can’t do that, so I’m just going to go ahead.

Here at WIC, we’re glad George is sticking to his guns. Both sullied and unsullied fans deserve to see things play out as Martin always intended. Besides, while the ending will certainly be thrilling, the journey is so much fun, we’re in no hurry to turn the final page.

(h/t People)


30 Comments

  1. Jenkins
    Posted August 17, 2014 at 8:25 pm | Permalink

    Quentyn Martell!

  2. Jordan
    Posted August 17, 2014 at 8:43 pm | Permalink

    R + L = J

    ….said it 18 years ago

  3. The Eighth God
    Posted August 17, 2014 at 9:03 pm | Permalink

    Time to avoid reading those fan theories then!

    Something that has been bothering me on a related note, regarding the omission of certain characters from the show, even though they have decent roles so far in the book…since the TV writers know the basic outline of ASOIAF right to the ending, aren’t they basically spoiling who is going to be most important later on? For example if Lady Stoneheart was going to play an extended role in the books, there’s no way they’d cut her from the show, so by ignoring her they’re infering her plotline hits a relatively inconsequential end? It also applies to characters they killed in the show who are still alive in the books (like Jojen); they’re pretty much saying he will die in the books

  4. BranSnow
    Posted August 17, 2014 at 9:39 pm | Permalink

    This article was on yahoo 3 days ago.

  5. Ser Osis of Liver
    Posted August 17, 2014 at 10:22 pm | Permalink

    The Eighth God:
    Time to avoid reading those fan theories then!

    Something that has been bothering me on a related note, regarding the omission of certain characters from the show, even though they have decent roles so far in the book…since the TV writers know the basic outline of ASOIAF right to the ending, aren’t they basically spoiling who is going to be most important later on? For example if Lady Stoneheart was going to play an extended role in the books, there’s no way they’d cut her from the show, so by ignoring her they’re infering her plotline hits a relatively inconsequential end? It also applies to characters they killed in the show who are still alive in the books (like Jojen); they’re pretty much saying he will die in the books

    I completely concur and this is quite maddening to someone who’s loved these books since about 1999 or 2000, when I first read AGoT. I’ve never thought Lady Stoneheart was going to go much beyond where we’ve seen, but my guess is that it will set up a duel between Jaime and Brienne, possibly to the death of one of them. If I’m right, it will be Stoneheart herself, and either Jaime or Brienne will go on to lead or play a major role in the BwB, which in turn will play an increasingly significant role in the series.

    Earlier this year I was somewhat hopeful that we’d see TWoW in late 2014 or early 2015, in time for Season 5 but the longer things go without an announcement it sure looks like it’ll be sometime between seasons 5 and 6, meaning we will surely know the ending from the TV series and not the novels, and that truly saddens me. In a way, I sort of envy a young person today who’s neither read the books nor watched the show, and who will one day be able to plough through all 7 (8? 9??) books in a row.

    One very positive note from earlier today: The Rains of Castamere won the Hugo award for Best Dramatic Presentation, Short Form at Worldcon in London. Dave and Dan were present to accept.

  6. spacechampion
    Posted August 17, 2014 at 10:50 pm | Permalink

    This article has a bad title. He never said fans guessed “the ending”, he said they guess solutions to one of the big mysteries.

  7. ArgonathofBraavos
    Posted August 17, 2014 at 11:24 pm | Permalink

    Who cares about knowing what’s going to happen? For me, a story is about how its told, not how it ends.

    I knew that the Ring would ultimately be destroyed at the start of LOTR, and that had absolutely no impact on the profound level of enjoyment I get from those books.

  8. Michael first of his Name
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 12:23 am | Permalink

    The show is the show, the books are the books. Some plots may stay the same. If u only watch the show u get maybe 30% of what George has written, and u totally don’t get any historical background . They already said that the Endings might be different
    So it really doesn’t matter ?!

  9. BlackTalon
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 1:15 am | Permalink

    I strongly doubt that Martin was referring to R+L=J

    The clues for that one are not exactly subtle, although Martin does obscure it somewhat when Arya meets Edric Dayne.

  10. King Stannis
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 1:50 am | Permalink

    Stannis will become Sauron while Sam goes to the citadel, reads a scroll and becomes Saruman. Littlefinger sits on the iron throne and has the most powerful army in westeros. Meanwhile Jon Travels through the wilderness and finds a mysterious man by the name of Howland Reed and tells him that his father is Arthur Dayne. Case solved.

  11. Hoyti_Von_Totiy
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 2:44 am | Permalink

    So what do I do then? Do I change it? I wrestled with that issue and I came to the conclusion that changing it would be a disaster, because the clues were there,” he said. “You can’t do that, so I’m just going to go ahead.

    The fact that he even considered changing the ending because “2-3 people have figured it out” is irresponsible and childish to me.

  12. King Varys
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 4:18 am | Permalink

    Hoyti_Von_Totiy: The fact that he even considered changing the ending because “2-3 people have figured it out” is irresponsible and childish to me.

    Some people will use any Martin quote to criticize the guy … If he hadn’t given it some thought, that would be just as strange – why would he not hesitate? So many people would be relieved if some fan theories were not true, so why should the fact that he considered alternatives be irresponsible? And to use to world childish for this is probably more childish than anything Martin has ever said or done …

  13. Red Comet
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 5:21 am | Permalink

    Hoyti_Von_Totiy: The fact that he even considered changing the ending because “2-3 people have figured it out” is irresponsible and childish to me.

    So he’s writing like a 10,000 page story with many mysteries and subtle clues, then finds out that multiple people have seen through all the misdirects and red-herrings and called his big ending… Yeah… How could he not question himself for a hot minute at least?? I bet he had a gun in his mouth for 5 minutes when he read that before realizing it’s just the internet being the internet and it’s the journey and how you tell it that counts more than what happened in the end. But it still must have been a massive ego-blow… I can’t even imagine. Also every writer questions themselves. Usually many, many times. How do you think they ultimately decide what happens, just pull it out of their ass?

  14. Nearly Headless Ned
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 6:22 am | Permalink

    Hoyti_Von_Totiy: The fact that he even considered changing the ending because “2-3 people have figured it out” is irresponsible and childish to me.

    I’d say it’s a good job you’re not being at all pompous.

  15. FreyJoy
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 6:25 am | Permalink

    Ser Osis of Liver,

    All this casting news does make me wonder why the Meereenese knot was so important. I guess while the book story is growing in the telling, the tv series is getting cut in the telling for the most part. But hey, I am enjoying both. And george not dan and David are no bitches of mine. And wanting to enjoy both, these are just drawbacks of wanting to digest both the moment they come out.

  16. yolkboy
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 8:38 am | Permalink

    Where in the quote does grrm say he’s talking specifically about the ending?

    I think this might be a confused report and he was talking about a certain major theory. IIRC it came from the Times or Telegraph, and perhaps the reporter assumed it was the ending grrm was alluding to.

    To my knowledge, grrm has never actually been quoted as saying he was talking of the ending, so this story has major potential to grossly mislead us.

  17. Hodorable
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 9:20 am | Permalink

    yolkboy,

    Agreed.

  18. A Man Grown
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 9:38 am | Permalink

    Is it deja vu, or did we already have an article about this before? I could swear I remember Hoyti von Totiy making a very similar comment on a very similar article recently.

  19. BlueDragon
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 9:39 am | Permalink

    R+L=J is hardly a solution one or two fans deduced. But then he may be downplaying the whole thing.

  20. House_Tully
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 10:55 am | Permalink

    At the point when GRRM initially claimed he had stopped reading fan theories because he was concerned it would affect his decisions, that theory was not as big and prevalent as it is now. This wasn’t a recent event folks. He is talking about something that happened much earlier in the publishing timeline.

  21. RosanaZugey
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 11:10 am | Permalink

    If people had already guessed major plot point and/or “the ending” that early in his work…then perhaps its true that none of the new characters of Feast and Dance will ultimately matter in the end (which is why they’re not included in the show).

  22. Matt
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 11:32 am | Permalink

    It just sucks that characters being omitted from the show, like Lady Stoneheart, just goes to show how utterly insignificant they will be in future books. Hell most story lines that have been dropped, including major historical arcs and all those prophecies basically mean fucking nothing now. Which really sucks.

  23. House_Tully
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 2:35 pm | Permalink

    This is not remotely new infomation. GRRM spoke years ago about people picking up clues and one of the myriad theories being correct.

    The showrunners decisions are not a good gauge of character importance. GRRM has spoken numeropus times about the ripple effects some of their changes will be causing down the line. This is an adaptation, not Cliff Notes. Stuff they ignored will be pretty important down the line.

    I’m pretty sure one scene in particular will not jibe with a character’s secrets later in the series. We shall see if I am correct.

  24. Renly's Peach
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 2:41 pm | Permalink

    Matt,

    How do you know that? What makes you think the show omitting them is the same as being irrelevant? GRRM is writing his story and D&D are piecing together theirs by chopping it down to fit their mold. What may or may not go into the show is bigger than their “significance” level. The show has completely cut out Kevan Lannister. Does that mean Kevan Lannister was insignificant in the books? What about the Ghost of High Heart? Or Vargo Hoat?

    Stoneheart is tied to the BwB, the Riverlands, the Freys, and (if some theories are to be believed) Jon Snow’s future — big elements the show seems to want to run away from for at least this season. Jaime is going to fucking Dorne..
    Only GRRM knows the full extent of what his characters will do, not HBO. I doubt he told them in detail everything he had planned for Stoneheart in one sitting. I respect both parties. If they want to keep some things out, that’s fine, but it’s asinine for people like you to jump the gun and start judging things based on what the show may or may not have cut.
    “Well, Willas Tyrell got cut, guess he’s irrelevant.. Oh wait–”

    I’m also starting to think the show may completely leave out some storylines to simplify things and not spoil book readers. Hence why I doubt Euron will be showing up at all.

  25. Ser Osis of Liver
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 2:46 pm | Permalink

    ArgonathofBraavos:
    Who cares about knowing what’s going to happen? For me, a story is about how its told, not how it ends.

    I knew that the Ring would ultimately be destroyed at the start of LOTR, and that had absolutely no impact on the profound level of enjoyment I get from those books.

    The details of the telling are what turns a great story into a magnificent story. I can serve you a steak dinner with a supermarket cut of Select grade beef, some mashed potatoes from a box and a glass of no-name wine for about $12. Or a USDA Prime steak, homemade garnish and a bottle of Chateauneuf du Pape and charge you $150 for it. Same three items but the details are vastly superior in one. I would rather savour all the details of the written story before watching a television adaptation of it.

    Sure, we knew in LoTR that Frodo would prevail and Sauron would be vanquished. But we didn’t get to see the scouring of the Shire, which was the whole point of the novels, truth be told. We got none of the songs and only a little of the nuance from the novels.

    Yes, it’s an adaptation. Yes, details will change. Yes, plots will be simplified for simple viewers who can’t handle complexity or subtelty. I do get it. But for me, I’d rather take the twisting scenic road the first time then fly the next time. It’s the journey for me, not the destination in this case.

  26. Joshua White
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 5:48 pm | Permalink

    Renly’s Peach,

    Wait until 2017 and come back to these questions once we see how it all plays out. The fair thing to do would be wait until 202X when the final book comes out, and compare and contrast when we have the full picture of both versions, but who knows if the final book will ever see the presses?

    And on Jamie in Dorne- why not take your own advice and wait to see how it unfolds before making assumptions?

  27. Renly's Peach
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 5:53 pm | Permalink

    Joshua White,

    Well that’s pretty much everything I said simplified, soo.. thanks? Thank you for reiterating my statement.

  28. Uncle Dutch
    Posted August 18, 2014 at 7:28 pm | Permalink

    I have my theories, and all of you must have some as well. Of course, I’m just as anxious as the next person to finally learn how this yarn plays out, but speculation based on tortured extrapolation between the novels vs. the film adaptation is a complete waste of time. But as speculation seems to be the preferred activity dejure, my gut tells me the Night’s King is a huge factor in the resolution of the tale. Just as long as somewhere along the line Arya sticks Melisandre with the pointy end. (Forgive me…the actress portraying her is a dead ringer for my ex-wife.)

  29. Jon
    Posted August 20, 2014 at 10:34 am | Permalink

    I still don’t think that we can really trust the TV show for book spoilers. At this point, they’re trying to make the best TV show they can make. Just because the HBO guys make a decision doesn’t mean it came from GRRM, was signed off on by GRRM, or has anything to do with the books whatsoever.

    They’ve been generally faithful to the source material so far, but the most popular books are behind them now. Would it surprise anybody to see them go their own way? Yes, they’ve met with GRRM and have some information as to how he plans to wrap everything up, but they’re not going to use every word he gave them and even if they did, they still don’t have all the information necessary to get there the same way.

    Point is, I don’t think that TV’s decision to cut Stoneheart has anything to do with her importance in the books. Same with Arianne Martell. I wouldn’t be surprised if they cut Aegon and some Greyjoys, and just focused on continuing the story with the pieces already in play. I consider them two completely different stories at this point.

  30. Jenny
    Posted August 21, 2014 at 7:49 am | Permalink

    I am convinced I am one of them who knows…. *evil laugh*


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